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Protesting against cloned meat or uncloned meat will certainly not be something I'm going to waste any time about.<br><br><br><br>
The only thing that concerns me is the ABOLITION of meat.<br><br><br><br>
We're never going to get anywhere with a welfarist attitude.<br><br><br><br>
During the anti-slavery struggle, the emphasis was on the ABOLITION of slavery. And that is what needs to be emphasised in the struggle against meat. The ABOLITION of meat.<br><br><br><br>
All the rest is just putting jam on the shi*t to cover its smell. But you know what? Flies are attracted to shi*t AND jam.
 

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Diana, I think part of the reason that abolition of slavery worked is because the world was ready for it when it happened. People were ready to accept that slaves were people and people need to have the right not to be others' slaves. I see no indication that that's the case with animals right now. In order for that to happen with animals, people need to see animals as worthwhile in their own right. For the time being, they don't tend to.<br><br><br><br>
As to the supposed health risk for consuming cloned meat, even if we assume that there's no proof it isn't harmful (and I'm not aware that there isn't evidence to that effect) that doesn't mean that it *is* harmful. We know that eating animals is not immediately harmful to our health (I know that will be debated here, but since most people eat meat and they're not generally dropping dead on sidewalks that's the position I'm going with), so since a cloned animal is as much an animal as any other, it does not logically follow that cloned meat would be any different.<br><br><br><br>
The rapid aging of cloned animals is thought to have to do with the aged DNA of the original animal being passed on to the new animal. Any aging "defects" in that DNA would cause the new animal to age faster and any age-related infirmities to pop up sooner. This is not likely to affect its flesh's safety as a food.<br><br><br><br>
That being said, I'm certainly not gonna be eating any cloned meat--or any meat in general, for completely seperate means. I don't much see its introducton into the food supply as anything particularly positive or negative compared to what we have right now. If it could help lead to the acceptance of cloned muscle tissue as food, then it's -- if not a good thing in its own right-- at least a step in the right direction.
 

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Would that make them all twins? Being a twin personally, seeing or knowing my sister is in pain/danger makes me physically ill and I couldn't imagine if I had to see her go through what the cows go through.<br><br><br><br>
I don't know what to think. Hopefully omni's will be so paranoid that they will avoid meat and will go for other options. Or they may start eating other animals. o_O
 

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<div class="quote-container"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by <strong>Astarte</strong> <a href="/forum/post/0"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style=""></a><br><br>
Diana, I think part of the reason that abolition of slavery worked is because the world was ready for it when it happened. People were ready to accept that slaves were people and people need to have the right not to be others' slaves. I see no indication that that's the case with animals right now. In order for that to happen with animals, people need to see animals as worthwhile in their own right. For the time being, they don't tend to.<br><br><br></div>
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I do not think the world was ready for it when the idea was first spoken aloud and started to spread. Or rather: Yes, the world WAS ready, but it took time for the word to spread.<br><br><br><br>
Can someone recommmend a couple of THOROUGH and OBJECTIVE books about the anti-slavery movement????<br><br><br><br>
It is important for people to know what the end-goal is. It is not only important for the non human animals, but for the human animals too. It helps to restore their dignity and humanity (for they have lost it by murdering animals for their nourishment). Explaining to people that the exploitation of animals is not only a crime against the animal kingdom, but also a crime against humanity is important.<br><br><br><br>
I have thought for nights and nights without sleeping sometimes about the welfarist / abolition positions. And I have reached the conclusion that the abolitionist position is absolutely ESSENTIAL for the cause. Without it, we are only making bigger cages.
 

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<img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/images/smilies/sunny.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title=":sunny:"> Hi.........too young to post url's yet but just read an article that in a couple of years dentists will be able to use cloned bone to replace jawbone when doing dental implants<br><br>
I believe its already used in knee surgery<br><br><br><br>
I know this is a veggie site but we are seeing that the government (BIG Business) is trying to deal with the non-veggie food supply and bring more animal protein to the market........faster. An example would be chicken eggs........several hundred years ago they would only produce several a month.......but now through selective breeding several a day in some cases.<br><br><br><br>
How soon before Billionaires start cloning their "perfect " replacements?<br><br><br><br>
Being new to this forum I can tell you one thing already and that is a healthy body usually has a strong correlation to a higher IQ .....Some very incisive comments here.<br><br>
I am looking forward to the exchange.
 

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A clone is just an twin made in a lab. If you are against clones, then you re again t multiple births. Just because ones natural and one is not doesn't make it wrong.
 

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<div class="quote-container"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by <strong>Eclipse</strong> <a href="/forum/post/0"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style=""></a><br><br>
A clone is just an twin made in a lab. If you are against clones, then you re again t multiple births. Just because ones natural and one is not doesn't make it wrong.</div>
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There are <i>big</i> differences between a clone and a twin.
 

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I don't want to gloss over some of the wefare issues - like, the animals will be selected for what amounts to the greatest deformities - for turkeys, the largest breasts, which makes them even less able to move, makes their feet crack, etc., for cows, the largest udders, which hurts their bodies. But their lives are miserable on these farms no matter what, so I don't know that the extra amount of misery is worth diverting energy from abolitonist goals. And if the health issue scares some omnis away from animal products, I have no problem with that.
 
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