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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
A week or two my mom suggested that I relocate to Germany in the future, because their employment system is better.

Here's why:

I have a cousin who is disabled with a genetic disease with brain damage and she has none of the struggles that I do despite being basically worse off then I am. She has never had to fight for a job like I have. She never been fired or laid off multiple times. In fact she HAS a job because the goverment helps people get jobs over there. Unlike the survival of the fittest mentality that exists here.

Next if you get unemployed anyways, unemployment care is much better over there. So the safety net if much better then here. Currently she is in touch with two people who are unemployed in Germany.

Ok my cousin got employed...but she's German.. Despite her brain damage, she speaks German and fits in a lot better there then I do.

Would they employ an English speaking foreigner whose only claim to being German is genetic?...When I went there, I got pointed out as the American before I even opened my mouth. So for better or worse, I'd always be the American. This could be bad for employment as Germans have a negative view of us Americans due to our goverment and the iraq war.

For various complicated reasons I was unable to become a duel ctizen despite that my mom is legally German. She is a legal "alien" to this day and has a green card she renews. This is really a bummer for me, but what you can besides maybe rant about on it.

if you have an illness or disability that interferes with your ability to work normally or get employment, would you consider moving permanently to another country that had a better job system so you would not have to fight as hard?.

How about a country that is less veg*n friendly?.

You have to learn a new (or relearn in my case) another language?

You'll always be an outsider?.

You might be unpopular because people don't like "your" country?.

I love the idea of moving part time to Germany, however there's the plane tickets to buy ( how to raise money for that too, when I have trouble paying bills and need money for my portfolio work until that starts bringing in money hopefully)

Then one has to work full time because you cannot support yourself with part time work and in order to get the unemployment benifits I mentioned earlier, you have to move there permanently.
 
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i think realistically, if you wanted to stay in germany, you'd need to be really serious about it, and fit their criteria. german immigration would look at your circumstances- like any other immigration system does, and base whether you'd make a good addition to their country (and they'd let you stay there) on this.

if you've got no special skills, don't speak the language, and have long term health problems, you'd struggle to get in, i reckon- no offence, but seriously, why would they want you? of what benefit would you be to their country?

anyway, you'd probably have about 3 routes, if you can't get german citizenship through your mum:

-apply for entry as a student, then request to stay when you'd done your studying (if you met a man/woman and fell in love, or someone offered you a job)

-apply as someones long term partner/wife (either from in germany, or from your home)

-apply for a job, get it, and then get a work permit (you'd need a special skill, and be able to do a job that a german already in germany, couldnt)

-apply to emigrate (you'd need a practiced skill/big degree/job offer and lots of money to support yourself when you got there)

things like having a high level of education and/or having a skilled trade and experience in working in it, being in good health generally, not beign old or sick, and having at least a basic understanding of the language, would be of benefit if you were going through the immigration proceedure, whatever route you took. you could probably even look at this online, somewhere like this:

http://www.workpermit.com/germany/employer.htm

from what i know, most immigration systems are points based, and you get points for things like those above. i'd assume that germany wouldn't accept you as an immigrant if they thought you'd be claiming benefits, or that they'd have to support you a lot, long term, when you were there - they'd want you to already have a job offer, and to have cash to support yourself, or have someone sign to sponsor you. if my canadian bf was to sponsor me as his wife/partner, so i could stay here (i'm a brit in canada) he'd actually have to sign a legal document to say that he'd feed and clothe me for my first three years here, if i couldn't do so myself, so i didn't just sign on for benefits- and if he didn't do it, and i claimed benefits, they'd sue him to claim their benefits money back.

i'd also worry about being ill in a country that i wasn't familiar with. simple things like visiting a doctor and making myself understood, or struggling with cultural differences, while far from home, away from close family, while feeling pretty sick, would be a big burden. but if i was young and healthy, i'd probably say go for it!

you might be able to find a system like BUNAC, that works within germany, which'd allow you to go over there as a young person and work there for a year- sort of as a trial run. BUNAC itself doesn't cover Germany, but its a nice idea in theory, if you wanted to go live somewhere else for a year, and see how things were better/worse/different, with a veiw to emmigrating at a later point.

http://www.bunac.org/usa/
 

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try to get into a german based company here in the US to be transferred to Germany so you can be stable.

Or find a company that is based in US but have companies in Germany. Thats what my friend did.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Did your friend move to Germany part time or relocate permanently?.

My massage instructor lives in three places, he's got a home in the UK, a home here in the US and a more temp place to stay in Portugal sp?. He's going to move back to Portugal soon for a while.

Unfortunatly this puts a lot of pressure on me to get well ASAP so I can pass a test or I won't be able to pass again for a few monthes.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eclipse View Post

A week or two my mom suggested that I relocate to Germany in the future, because their employment system is better.
It depends on how you define "better". Their unemployment rate is about twice what it is in the United States.

Quote:
Here's why:

I have a cousin who is disabled with a genetic disease with brain damage and she has none of the struggles that I do despite being basically worse off then I am. She has never had to fight for a job like I have. She never been fired or laid off multiple times. In fact she HAS a job because the goverment helps people get jobs over there. Unlike the survival of the fittest mentality that exists here.
You can't even compare your situation to hers. There are many, MANY government & private organizations in the US that help mentally & physically disabled/challenged individuals find & keep work. Just because she's getting stable work doesn't mean you will.

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Next if you get unemployed anyways, unemployment care is much better over there. So the safety net if much better then here. Currently she is in touch with two people who are unemployed in Germany.
Unemployment is relatively high in Germany, and it is a better program than the one in the states. But their taxes are also phenomenally higher.

Quote:
Ok my cousin got employed...but she's German.. Despite her brain damage, she speaks German and fits in a lot better there then I do.

Would they employ an English speaking foreigner whose only claim to being German is genetic?...
They don't give a crap about your heritage - only if you're able to work. And you will find it very difficult to find a job in Germany if you don't speak German.

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When I went there, I got pointed out as the American before I even opened my mouth. So for better or worse, I'd always be the American. This could be bad for employment as Germans have a negative view of us Americans due to our goverment and the iraq war.
This shouldn't even figure into your decision. I got on fine with Germans when I lived there, but it was probably because I spoke German. I did get some discrimination, but it was likely because I lived in a city with a large American population and there was some general dislike of Americans as a result. But that was about 1% of my experience there.

Quote:
For various complicated reasons I was unable to become a duel ctizen despite that my mom is legally German. She is a legal "alien" to this day and has a green card she renews. This is really a bummer for me, but what you can besides maybe rant about on it.
you don't have to be a citizen to work in germany

Quote:
if you have an illness or disability that interferes with your ability to work normally or get employment, would you consider moving permanently to another country that had a better job system so you would not have to fight as hard?.
um. No. Like I said, the US has plenty of programs for those with qualities that require special assistance or consideration. Not to mention the ADA.

Quote:
How about a country that is less veg*n friendly?.

You have to learn a new (or relearn in my case) another language?

You'll always be an outsider?.

You might be unpopular because people don't like "your" country?.
Germany is pretty veg-friendly

I'd recommend learning German. You'll likely be treated with more respect if you can speak it.

You won't always be an outsider

If you act like an ass, you'll be unpopular. If you act opposite to what people expect, you'll show others that Americans can be friendly, enjoyable people.

Quote:
I love the idea of moving part time to Germany, however there's the plane tickets to buy ( how to raise money for that too, when I have trouble paying bills and need money for my portfolio work until that starts bringing in money hopefully)

Then one has to work full time because you cannot support yourself with part time work and in order to get the unemployment benifits I mentioned earlier, you have to move there permanently.
Yeah. And a bunch of other things.

I really think you need to do some thinking if you're looking to go to Germany just because you want unemployment.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
"I really think you need to do some thinking if you're looking to go to Germany just because you want unemployment."

*cough cough* I never said I was trying to live on unemployment all the time, just part time.

Here's the thing: You cannot earn a living on part time work.

Living costs everywhere are too high for that.

So unless I get very lucky and find a job that pays extremly well, then I have to be realistic about how much income to expect and plan accordingly.

Most of the high paid jobs are taken already and rarely available because everyone wants a high paid job.

No, my point was that it was easier to get a job. You said that unemployment rates are double the rates in the US so I may be misinformed.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eclipse View Post

Did your friend move to Germany part time or relocate permanently?.
Part-time. She wanted to go back to school for a 2nd degree. Yet, she still wants to move back to Germany in the near future.
 
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I never said I was trying to live on unemployment all the time, just part time.
no country in their right mind will let someone live there who has any intention of utilising them for their benefits system- even part time. you're there to add to their economy/society, not to take from it. you'd probably be expected to sign a form saying you'd do everything within your power to support yourself fully- to even get in- and you'd need a damn good reason to do otherwise, or i bet you'd be back out of the door before you could say 'handout'.

Quote:
Here's the thing: You cannot earn a living on part time work. Living costs everywhere are too high for that.
you can, if you have the education and skills that enable you to make a very good wage, and low enough overheads. i know people who do it without a problem, and without subsidies.

Quote:
So unless I get very lucky and find a job that pays extremly well, then I have to be realistic about how much income to expect and plan accordingly.
i think your best bet would be to get yourself into a state where you can mentally and physically work 'normally', but get educated enough that you also can make enough money that should you choose, you could perhaps work a 30 hour week, or 20 hour week, and still survive. thats what i'm aiming to do. i think its not about luck, so much as its about planning, motivation, and hard work.

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Most of the high paid jobs are taken already and rarely available because everyone wants a high paid job
i don't know how accurate this is. i've you've got the skills and personality and drive to get and hold down a high paid job, and are better suited to it than someone already doing that job, and there is a need for someone to do that job, why can't you get the job, or one like it, somewhere? lots of high end jobs are contractual, so you can apply for someones job when their contract comes up for renewal... you could become self employed, start a business, and make your own job, you could look into a growth industry... etc. people with high end jobs do retire, die, move to other jobs, and/or quit, just like people with any kind of job do- you just have to be better than the other candidates applying for it, and have the right links/networks, to get it, when they do, right?
 

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Eclipse-

Things in Germany have deteriorated rapidly in the last 10 years. The work situation in Germany is very poor. The social safety net is a ghost of its former self. The outlook is not good, imho. I know from this and other posts that you have direct relations from Germany, but I think they are telling you about a Germany that no longer exists.

My sincere hope is that you research it thoroughly first. Perhaps speak with some German vegans?

http://www.vegan.de/foren/

Hoodedclawjen: Agreed down the line.
 

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One of my friends lives in Germany. She met her DH in the states, where he was working for a German company and after a few years they moved to Germany for his work. She's had some challenges. First, she doesn't know the language well at all. She gets along OK with most things, as long as it doesn't involve writing. If the kids need a note to the teacher, her DH has to write it. When she does her banking, she finds someone who can speak English. Their kids also go to school only in the mornings (the twins are 8) and so she COULDN'T work, even if she wanted to, because the German system is basically set up assuming that most mothers will be Hausfrauen. She has some part-time work teaching English, but her best options are to find a job where her English skills are needed. Housing prices are also very high, even in the small village where they live. I think she's kept her US Citizenship. They moved to Germany because her DH would give up a lot of benefits of the German social security system if he took a job in the states. I don't know all the details. But basically, the transition has been a tough one, even though she was moving there with her family.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
"no country in their right mind will let someone live there who has any intention of utilising them for their benefits system- even part time. "

Absolutly and I had mentioned this same issue myself and think I did in this thread too?, but you know she was just trying to be helpful about things.

VeggieFrank: if you are in Germany, you'd probably know more then my mom coresponding to people in Germany.

As for research, this is an idea my mom gave me and isn't a serious project at that momment.

When and if I have plane ticket money and some extra money to support myself for say a month while working part time there, then it may became a serious thing to consider.

Now on employment in general, I stick to what I said. Nobody around here pays you more just because you are educated. My former employer who promised, but did not pay me legal min. wage certainly didn't care nor ever offer to pay me a higher salary because I 'm college educated.

Oh and I worked FULL TIME at that time and still was unable to do squat but eventually fall onto the unemployment system. Even if my employer had not cheated me out wages, I would have still needed more to pay bills, rent and feed myself well.

In fact most of the available jobs that I have applied to do not require my level of education, I say most because I cannot be expected to hold skills for every job advertised everywhere, though I have to say I call myself a "Jill of all trades". I have applied myself to a variety of different jobs after nothing in my field of education panned out, mostly because that field is "dead" overall and is very difficult to get into.

Yeah you could say why did you go into a field of study that had very little demand and you had to fight tooth and nail to get a job. Oh well that because I was deluded into thinking you need a job in your area of interest.

Keep in mind, I was constantly being lead in this direction in college.

So I eventually moved in a field that I basically do not like anymore and am doing just for money and because there's where the demand is ( That field would be the health care system basically). And what did people tell me about this type of job?. It's wrong to do a job you dislike for money. You should something you enjoy, which is exactly what got me into my situation in the first place.

I did land well paid jobs before after intense jobbing efforts which tended to reduce my life to eating, sleeping and applying for jobs, only to get laid off before I was ever able to start them. I cried a lot....but eventually after having my life ruined...I was forced to move on. Every time I got laid off, I lowerest my expectations some more.

My parents kept telling me do you want a job or are you going to sit around being idealistic demanding a high paid job?. I wasted a lot of time demanding a high paid job because "I needed it" and " I was too well educated for the jobs that were actually available".

"you could become self employed, start a business, and make your own job, you could look into a growth industry... etc. people with high end jobs do retire, die, move to other jobs, and/or quit, just like people with any kind of job do- you just have to be better than the other candidates applying for it, and have the right links/networks, to get it, when they do, right?"

Because I have become so sick and tired of fighting for jobs all the time that is exactly what I went back to doing and that was what I was doing when I got too sick to work again.

My business plan has focused heavily on trying to sell myself ( which as youy might know had two big setbacks involving theft and non working equpiment). After that, I would go with a business loan because it

takes far too long to build a business on unemployment benifits.

If it turns into a dud, then I'll have no choice but either re-enter the outside world force, which means a few monthes of applying and hopefully landing a min wage job or finding another idea to base a home based business on.

It's very difficult to get a good idea to use as a home based business and you keep having doubts. Will it sell?, I am good enough? Can I compete with Walmart and products made in China?, what if I made the products and nobody buys them?...What if I put all this money, energy and time into this business and it fails?.
 

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If I were moving to a foreign country to collect benefits, I'd be moving to the Netherlands! Then again, citizenship there is extremely difficult to get, and thus so are the benefits, since they are so rockin'.

Are you able to get yourself legally declared disabled in the US? There are programs here for the disabled.
 

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i have faith in you eclipse. i know you can take control and turn your situation around.

i like your idea about checking it out first. it would be a terrific experience, no matter which way you ultimately decided to go.
 

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You can't just up and move to another country. All countries have immigration laws and most people simply will not qualify for a work permit. Its very difficult, can be very expensive and takes a long time if its even possible. Immigration is a very political situation in Germany and the immigration laws are changing because of it. Just think of the issues around Mexicans entering the USA. You would be similar situation to those Mexicans as an american in Germany.

And, I've found Germany to be more veggie friendly than most of the USA. Health food shops are everywhere and veggie food is easily available. I always eat much better in Germany than I do in the US.
 

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Why do you have to work part time? Are you a student?

Employers don't just hand out well-paying jobs. You have to work for them, for years & years. People graduating from university and making $60,000/year are a small minority. And then their career growth is often limited.

If you have a disability, you should find out what is available in your area, in terms of assistance.
 

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Why do you have to work part time? Are you a student?

Employers don't just hand out well-paying jobs. You have to work for them, for years & years. People graduating from university and making $60,000/year are a small minority. And then their career growth is often limited.

If you have a disability, you should find out what is available in your area, in terms of assistance.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
In order to control health problems, I need extra sleep and calories ( extra meals). Most/all? jobs would not allow me to stop and snack to meet high calories needs that I would have in order to have energy to work.

If I don't get the extra sleep and calories, then I can't work at all.

So it is simply physical neccesity that I must work part time.

While it is not fully neccessery, time for hobbies really helps with my mental sanity. So it is also preferable that I have some time leftover for hobbies. I'm very good at forfeiting other mental needs such having a social life already.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eclipse View Post

In order to control health problems, I need extra sleep and calories ( extra meals). Most/all? jobs would not allow me to stop and snack to meet high calories needs that I would have in order to have energy to work.

If I don't get the extra sleep and calories, then I can't work at all.

So it is simply physical neccesity that I must work part time.

While it is not fully neccessery, time for hobbies really helps with my mental sanity. So it is also preferable that I have some time leftover for hobbies. I'm very good at forfeiting other mental needs such having a social life already.
I haven't had a job yet where anyone would care if I snacked all day long. I have never worked in food service, where that might be frowned upon. Mostly, I've done administrative and human service type jobs (and internships) and no one cares if I eat at my desk, as long as I get my work done.

Most full time jobs you work for 8 hrs. Lets tack on an hour at the beginning and end of those 8 hrs for getting ready and transportation. That's 10 hrs a day for work related things. Let's say after work for 2 hrs you enjoy your hobbies, etc.. that would still leave you 12 hrs a night to sleep. You also have all day Saturday and Sunday to enjoy your hobbies and sleep as much as you like.

I also am happiest on more than the "normal" amount of sleep. I do best with 9-10 hrs. I don't have a problem getting that in with the rest of my hectic work/school schedule (nor did I when I worked FT and wasn't in school). I also have health issues that can be 'distracting' in terms of work, but unfortunately, life isn't always ideal, and part of being an adult is sucking it up and taking care of business.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
I guess you got lucky then.

Part of working around here is that you have to be there...working.

I don't think leaning on a chair while you food load until you get enough energy to do stuff would be acceptabl;e behavior.

That'd be what I'm doing right now, food loading for energy.

You made up scedule also doesn't allow for things like unexpected events, apointments, cleaning, grooming such as washing your hair, shopping/errands and exercise.

And around here there is the added care taking commute trips, or at least until certain animals come to live with me or are euthanized. I realize this would occur if I moved overseas as well since who would drive over and take care of them.
 
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