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Discussion Starter #1
I recieved the following mail:<br><br><br><br><span style="font-size:xx-small;">Here's some interesting news from Italy:<br><br><br><br>
december 1: Milano- Explosion shatters Marsh offices<br><br>
windows for HLS birthday.<br><br><br><br>
January 10: Ivrea (TO)- fire burns at the entrance of<br><br>
RBM, contract animal testing lab. On the 24th of<br><br>
january 400 people protested in front of this lab,<br><br>
under a campaign of continous protests.<br><br>
The action has been claimed by the ALF.<br><br><br><br>
January 19: Abetone, Pistoia: During the night a fire<br><br>
devastates the chairlift of a notorious skiing resort.<br><br>
Almost 90 cabins burned. Damages estimated around 7<br><br>
billions euros!<br><br>
On site a slogan was spraypainted: "fire to<br><br>
destructors - free marco!".<br><br>
A communique sent to news agencies claims the action<br><br>
in defence of the mountains and in solidarity with<br><br>
eco-defence prisoner Marco Camenisch, now on hunger<br><br>
strike in his jail cell in Switzerland.<br><br>
Marco camenisch has been jailed for blast attacks<br><br>
against the nuclear industry in Switzerland, then<br><br>
escaped and has been caught in Italy after several<br><br>
years and accused of more actions against electricity<br><br>
lines. Now he is back in Swiss jails to finish his<br><br>
years of imprisonment and waiting a trial for the<br><br>
murder of a border guard (for which they have no clue<br><br>
and he is innocent).<br><br>
On the same night two more actions, a bomb at a TV<br><br>
Antenna and the torching of a mobile phone mast, have<br><br>
been claimed in solidarity with Marco.<br><br><br><br>
february 1: Capralbio, Cremona - the ALF enters a mink<br><br>
farm, cut fences and liberates 2.000 breeding minks.<br><br>
TV said at least 700 minks are still free, while many<br><br>
have been unfortunately killed by cars on a nearby<br><br>
road.<br><br>
As usual this action has been condemned by the media,<br><br>
saying animal liberationists killed the minks... as if<br><br>
they weren't meant to be killed by the farmer humself!<br><br></span>
 

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I think he could have found a better way to liberate the minks and get them to a better place. I don't like it when people think they are doing a good thing and then the animals die of getting hit by cars, etc. It's irresponsible. I don't support the mink farmer either or what they do.
 

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The major problem with suddenly releasing a bunch of formerly captive minks is that if they do survive they can screw up the ecosystem's balance. Kind of the deal with species going extinct because a certain new predator arrived from another country on a ship and took over.
 

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"As usual this action has been condemned by the media,<br><br>
saying animal liberationists killed the minks... as if<br><br>
they weren't meant to be killed by the farmer humself!"<br><br><br><br>
when a group decides which death for an animal is perferrable- ie. starving to death or getting hit by a car vs. carbon dioxide poisioning in the case of the mink- instead of trying to save them from any death, do they not cease to be a true animal rights organization, since animal rights is not about what is humane, it's about not using or killing animals at all?<br><br><br><br>
they are basically saying it's fine that these animals died, as long as the farmer doesn't kill them, and therefore profit from their deaths. so, they don't have the animal's best interests in mind, they only really want to try and harm a human because what he or she does for a living doesn't fit into what they deem as acceptable.<br><br><br><br>
and to me, that seems bass ackward.... <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/images/smilies/wink3.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title=";)">
 

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I disagree with you VP, AR isnt about welfare of animals, it is about FREEDOM of animals. Once you agree to take away their freedom in exchange for letting them live a nice happy life you cease to be pro-AR. And yes it is fine that these animals died of causes other than a farmer killing them, because you know what? animals ****ing die in the real world. and you know what i resent that you think they just want to harm a human because they dont agree with what they are doing for a living, i think is bass ackward that one would put quality of life above freedom of life, especially if that someone is in the United States, sounds ****ing hypocritical to me.
 

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i'm going to respect the no debate policy of this section, but i think you possibly misunderstood my original post....<br><br><br><br>
no need to get all riled up- or laugh at me!<br><br><br><br>
(which is always so nice!)
 

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Discussion Starter #9
These animal liberators choose to free as much animals as they can.<br><br>
Its very strange that a farmer that was going to kill a few thousand, suddenly complains about a couple of hundred being hit by cars.<br><br><br><br>
Are you aware how the animals are kept?<br><br><br><br><a href="http://worldanimal.net/mink.html" target="_blank">http://worldanimal.net/mink.html</a><br><br><br><br><a href="http://www.boycottmacys.com/photolib.shtml" target="_blank">www.boycottmacys.com/photolib.shtml</a><br><br><br><br>
Its also like war: what if England had said were not going to free Europe because we would kill some people while trying to free everyone ?<br><br><br><br>
In the long run these actions work.<br><br>
Even if the animals get caught again, the farmer cannot identify the animals he selected for the breeding.<br><br>
In Sweden, several fur-farms have closed because of the alf actions.<br><br><br><br>
For me its simple: 2,6 million are killed in my country. (a year).<br><br>
Every release is a good one.
 

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personally, i think the ALF and their tactics are deplorable. they are both harmful to animals and to humans and have very little to do with compassion or freedom.<br><br><br><br>
They terrify people and animals, which takes away their freedoms. And i have a problem with mink taking over ecosystems or being hit by cars when it was entirely unnecessary for them to die in this manner. There are potentially other ways to "liberate" mink, etc, and i personally think that ti is better that they are well-reared and die in a humane manner rather than an inhumane manner.<br><br><br><br>
i also think that there are more effective ways to protest that don't involve the destruction of property.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Harmful to people ?<br><br><br><br>
There been several mink liberations, but still no sign of them taking over the eco-system.
 

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1 vegan:<br><br><br><br>
apparently, you aren't reading the right articles. There was a horrible problem in england and here in new england when a few mink farms were hit. Even to the point where children and animals, other farms, and so on were destroyed by mink. they're really destructive buggers.<br><br><br><br>
like cats allowed out of the house to hunt, the mink go after native birds and so on. this is how they "destroy" ecosystems. There are other incidents of animals destroying ecosystems when introduced (either purposefully or accidently), you just ahve to look up the information.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
The only way I can think of is to make fur socially unwanted.<br><br><br><br>
But the fur industry has managed to make fur "hot" again.<br><br><br><br>
(fur edges on coats and so on)<br><br>
Some of that "popular" fur even comes from cats or dogs.<br><br>
This kind of fur is often sold as rabbit fur.
 

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Yes and It's only a matter of time before for instance Vivisection is abolished, before fur is finished, and eventually " the time will come when people will look upon the murder of animals as they now look upon the murder of human beings." (Leonardo Da Vinci)<br><br><br><br>
That however is of little comfort to the animal suffering at this instant and when all legal means have been exhuasted, all legal channels blocked and when the people don't want to listen we are left with direct action. We owe much material and information otherwise kept private regarding animal exploitation to the ALF.<br><br><br><br><div class="quote-container"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block">On the night of Monday 28 May 1984, five members of the Animal Liberation Front swooped on the underground laboratory of the University of Pennsylvania Medical Center and with pick-axes wrecked hundreds of thousands of dollars-worth of torture equipment. In the process they removed Gennarelli's prized collection of video tapes . These tapes subsequently emblazoned on television to an incredulous and horrified American public the University's million dollar "research programme" in which fully conscious baboons are battered to death to simulate traumatic head injuries.</div>
</div>
<br>
- <a href="http://www.nzavs.org.nz/11page2.html" target="_blank">source</a><br><br><br><br><div class="quote-container"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block">..To sum it up, the ALF campaign is one of animal rescue and economic sabotage."</div>
</div>
<br>
(This is the A.L.F., Issue #2)<br><br><br><br><b>Anyone</b> though can carry out an action and claim ALF. Please do not critizise or label them. For while you've spent the day protesting they have taken action to save the animals right now putting alot more on the line.<br><br><br><br><div class="quote-container"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block">"i also think that there are more effective ways to protest that don't involve the destruction of property."</div>
</div>
<br><br><br>
That would be the mostly unseen, unheard, unreported & ignored.<br><br>
It's not about so much about 'protest', that is the point i thought.<br><br><br><br>
In 1984... The combined animal liberation groups averaged seven raids a day<br><br>
In 1984... In Great Britain alone 250 attacks on laboratories took place between may and september<br><br>
In 1984... The animal liberation front saved the lives of 175 animals every day of the year.<br><br><br><br>
- <a href="http://www.nzavs.org.nz/11page2.html" target="_blank">source</a><br><br>
(next few pages are interesting)
 
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