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I think the point is, do you eat products manufactured on shared equipment? Sometimes the ingredients listed are all vegan but then there is the fine print "manufactured on shared equipment with milk products or manufactured in a facility that produces products containing milk. I personally will eat these products. I am assuming that the equipment was cleaned between products. Where do you draw the line? I think it is all absurd. To some people you can never be vegan enough. Am I not vegan because my spouse and children are not vegan and we live in the same house? Or use the same dishes? I think we should stop trying to pick at each other. Veganism is a lifestyle choice, it is not a competition.
 

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Yeah, not a vegan if you eat dairy/gelatin/eggs a couple times a month. I don't even consider gelatin vegetarian, but that's just me...

And like JC said at the very beginning of the thread, who cares what other people call you? You are what you are.
 

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I do not think you a vegan, if you eat milk, eggs, honey,etc. The point I was trying to make, which I did not seem to get across is that- there are people who think that you are not vegan enough - eating things with all vegan ingredients produced on shared equipment or shared factories etc. When I was vegetarian, I was sometimes served fish at friend's homes. I had to explain to them that fish was in the same category as meat.Please note that I did not eat the fish! There is a whole group of fish eaters who consider themselves vegetarian.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yogacalypso View Post

When I was vegetarian, I was sometimes served fish at friend's homes. I had to explain to them that fish was in the same category as meat.Please note that I did not eat the fish! There is a whole group of fish eaters who consider themselves vegetarian.
Although this has been hashed, rehashed, rehashed rehashed...and so on to infinity... that's what makes it hard for those who actually are vegan when someone mislabels themselves as vegan when they are not.
 

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My opinion is that if you want to *call* yourself vegan then no one's stopping you but if you want to *be* vegan then you are going to have to cut out consuming all animal products. There's nothing wrong with being just a vegetarian. We all do what we can to make our lives and the lives of others better. If being "almost vegan" is what you can do right now (or forever) then be proud of that. But if you can/want to do more, then do more.

I guess for some people, wearing a certain title or label is more important that actually being and doing. Only you can decide what is right for you. Only you will truly know if you live the labels you give yourself.

If you are finding it tricky to order meals when dining out, it might serve you better to be more specific about what food items you don't want to eat, rather than just asking for vegetarian/vegan fare. I rarely eat out at restaurants but I know how small the vegan selections can be.

Hang~Ten
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hang~Ten~Honey View Post

My opinion is that if you want to *call* yourself vegan then no one's stopping you but if you want to *be* vegan then you are going to have to cut out consuming all animal products. There's nothing wrong with being just a vegetarian.
A fantastic way to put it.
 

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Why on earth would being called a vegetarian be insulting?

I would call it a spot on observation.

I am a lacto/ovo and some people might wonder why I call myself that when eggs are an extreamly rare thing for me and for my cereal and such I have almond milk.

I choose to call myself a vegetarian because I DO on occasion have dairy or eggs, if it be in the form of cheese or a bakery muffin.

It does not matter if that is a rare event it still happens.

I mean you can call yourself a vegan but if you eat dairy or eggs your pretty much doing the same thing that people who eat chicken and call themselves vegetarian are doing.
 

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I've always found it a bit frustrating that the main terms we use to describe vegetarian diets are defined in all-or-nothing terms, when there are really two dimensions involved: 1) what one chooses to eat and 2) how scrupulous one is in avoiding the other things. I would think of you as "a vegan who makes a few particular exceptions to a strictly vegan diet", and shorten that to "vegan" if you need one word to communicate to someone what you prefer to eat.

Although I understand the concerns some people have about the words being watered down (my sister thinks some vegetarians routinely eat fish and chicken, despite my having explained it clearly), I also think these all-or-nothing labels that don't acknowledge degrees of scrupulousness can be misleading rather than helpful. We are all individuals, and there are countless variations and gradations; it would make more sense to me if we described ourselves by the term that most nearly describes our usual diet.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by organica View Post

when I call myself "vegetarian", I always get served fish, eggs & cheese dishes
like kpickell said, order specific things.

I have never gone to a restaurant and said, "I'd like something vegetarian, please." That's ridiculous - they give you a menu for a reason.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeezycreezy View Post

I wonder if there's a millionaire's forum somewhere where some guy has $999,999 and is insulted when the other millionaires only call him rich.
Or whether Bill Gates is insulted in Europe (outside the UK) when he is called a milliardaire instead of a billionaire.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by organica View Post

If someone calls someone who eats no animal products except occasional/rare trace ingredients of dairy/gelatin/eggs/honey in other products a "lacto-ovo vegetarian" or "strict vegetarian", as opposed to "vegan", is this really accurate or is it an insult?

Personally, I consider this not harmful to animals & thus consider such a person, such as myself, vegan for all intents & purposes.

What are your thoughts?
My thoughts: Strict vegetarian..definitely not vegan.
 

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I try to eat as vegan as possible, but I classify myself as a strict vegetarian. Sometimes I don't know what some of the weird chemicals in my food are from. I try to eat fresh mostly, so I don't have to worry about that. But, I bet I eat animal byproducts somehow in my food. I mean, it's in almost everything. Some Peanutbutter crackers at my school (thinking.. Ooooh PB crackers!) they had cheese in them.
I didn't eat them. But, I never thought cheese would be an ingredient. O_O

I like to be a strict vegetarian, that way... I fit the description better. I take it as ACCURATE.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by organica View Post

It seems many people on here are concerned with definitions, as they are certainly bandied about a lot...

I have been mulling over this issue because it bothers me that when I call myself "vegetarian", I always get served fish, eggs & cheese dishes, but when I call myself "vegan", people on here say I should really call myself "vegetarian", which means I get served fish, etc....

Sometimes you just can't win I guess...

I guess I should say "shmegan"!!
Well unfortunately people rely a lot on labels. By them thinking you eat fish, eggs, and cheese because you say you're vegetarian means a lot of people are confused by the labels because they constantly get misused. The same would happen if a lacto/ovo vegetarian used the term vegan to describe themselves and still ate dairy/eggs and it would lead to more and more confusion with the omnis.

When do you eat these traces of dairy/eggs/etc? Why not avoid them completely if you are only rarely consuming traces of them?
 

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I think it kinda depends on the situation.

If you genuinely don't realise, it doesn't count.

If it's for medication, doesn't count either.

Ditto wearing old wool/leather you bought before the change till you replace it with an alternative...you're still a veg*n!

However... conciously consuming something you know is insulting to those who are *real* veg*ns and stick to the book!

The vegetarians who sometimes eat fish- you're not a vegetarian, you're a pescatarian. (Don't even start me on the ones who eat chicken...).

If you eat jelly babies in the full knowledge they contain gelatin, you're not a vegetarian(let alone a vegan!)..(oh -and check out some of the vegan shopping sites on the ads at the top of this page here for vegan alternatives!)

If you eat only genuinely free range eggs, even from a rescue centre, but not milk, you're not a vegan but an ovo-vegetarian(Which btw I don't think there's anything wrong with and would consider doing myself if I found a kind supplier)

Vegans DON'T eat honey!

If you continue to buy and wear leather, fur, feathers or wool, you're not a vegan - even if you stick 100% to the diet for health reasons or whatever.

The vegetarian and vegan societies make a lot of effort to promote their way of living, and their label, so I think it's unfair on them to sully it by saying you are something you're not, especially as it causes confusion and leads to fish being the vegetarian dish of the day on menus etc.
 
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