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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I was led to believe that you needed to get it through either suppliments or animal products. This is crazy if you can get it from plant sources why then do people keep saying where will you get your nutrients from??? Plant based foods seem to have everything? Any advice from anyone? I want to become full vegan so was wondering what the deal was.
 

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B12 is produced by microorganisms.<br><br>
Some nutritional yeast has b12, as does kombucha tea and some seaweeds (laver, nori, etc).<br><br>
Cows eat grass and consume some of these microorganisms in the process, acquire the b12, which humans then acquire from the cow's muscle tissue.
 

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Supplements are still a good idea in regards to b12, however. Unless you plan on drinking kombucha every day or eating seaweed on a regular basis.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
The online article said it is present in things like brocolli and asparags etc which is why i am confused
 

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From what I've read a year or two ago, vegans, vegetarians and omnivores are all at risk for B12 deficiency. Basically, it's finicky as cooking removes some of it from sources or certain minerals inhibit is absorption etc. I take a vegan multiamin everyday and am pretty healthy. If you don't wish to take vitamins, eating fresh sources of B12 should work well too. But I'm a programmer, not a doctor. :p<br><br>
Anyway, check out the <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vitamin_B12" target="_blank">wikipedia</a> article for more information, it covers what I've said except in greater depth.
 

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You cannot get vitamin B12 from plant sources, except from some bacteria (which are really an even simpler life form than plants, actually). Vegan B-12 supplements are available, so there's no need to risk a deficiency.<br><br>
Some plants such as certain seaweeds were thought to have B-12, but it turns out that this was something similar which gave a positive result in chemical assays for the real B-12. However, this substance was not biologically active and those relying on sea vegetables for their B-12 intake suffered deficiencies.
 

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<a href="http://www.veganhealth.org/articles/everyvegan" target="_blank">http://www.veganhealth.org/articles/everyvegan</a><br><br>
I get B12 from soymilk, cereal, Stride spark gum, nut. yeast. I still take a Deva tiny tablet multivitamin 3-4 times a week. I feel some forms may not as well absorbed as others.<br><br>
What about Deva's vegan B12? It says it's not animal sourced, but doesn't specify-<br><a href="http://www.devanutrition.com/vitamin_b12.html" target="_blank">http://www.devanutrition.com/vitamin_b12.html</a>
 

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<div class="quote-container"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by <strong>silva</strong> <a href="/forum/post/2978287"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style=""></a><br><br><a href="http://www.veganhealth.org/articles/everyvegan" target="_blank">http://www.veganhealth.org/articles/everyvegan</a><br><br>
I get B12 from soymilk, cereal, Stride spark gum, nut. yeast. I still take a Deva tiny tablet multivitamin 3-4 times a week. I feel some forms may not as well absorbed as others.<br><br>
What about Deva's vegan B12? It says it's not animal sourced, but doesn't specify-<br><a href="http://www.devanutrition.com/vitamin_b12.html" target="_blank">http://www.devanutrition.com/vitamin_b12.html</a></div>
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To make it clear, these and the other vegan foods mentioned above (including nutritional yeast) are <i>fortified</i> to have B12. They do not have B12 naturally. The only way for a vegan to get sufficient B12 is to eat food specifically fortified, or more reliably as Tom says, through supplements (sublingual types have much higher absorption rates).
 

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<div class="quote-container"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by <strong>Kindred</strong> <a href="/forum/post/2978238"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style=""></a><br><br>
The online article said it is present in things like brocolli and asparags etc which is why i am confused</div>
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What online source? Is it reliable and backed up or just an opinion piece?
 

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<div class="quote-container"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by <strong>paperhanger</strong> <a href="/forum/post/2978300"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style=""></a><br><br>
To make it clear, these and the other vegan foods mentioned above (including nutritional yeast) are <i>fortified</i> to have B12. They do not have B12 naturally. The only way for a vegan to get sufficient B12 is to eat food specifically fortified, or more reliably as Tom says, through supplements (sublingual types have much higher absorption rates).</div>
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But Deva's website states it's B12 is 100% animal-free:<br>
"DEVA Vegan Sublingual B-12 is 100% animal free, and guaranteed for purity, freshness and labeled potency. Remember all DEVA Products are 100% vegan, vegetarian and are certified by the Vegan Society, the non-profit organization that actually invented the word "vegan". "<br><br>
I'll get it any way, I'm just curious since B12 is a bacteria that grows on plants, gets formulated through the digestion of herbivours and pooped back in the soil. So we can get from animal meat or from unwashed plants that grow in manured soil?<br>
"
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
<a href="http://www.mushroomsforlife.net/science-of-mushrooms-health-s102/vitamin-b12-s118/" target="_blank">http://www.mushroomsforlife.net/scie...amin-b12-s118/</a><br><br>
says that mushrooms have vitamin b12 so i may start eating them. I dont like the idea of consuming suppliments.
 

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<div class="quote-container"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by <strong>Kindred</strong> <a href="/forum/post/2978314"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style=""></a><br><br><a href="http://www.mushroomsforlife.net/science-of-mushrooms-health-s102/vitamin-b12-s118/" target="_blank">http://www.mushroomsforlife.net/scie...amin-b12-s118/</a><br><br>
says that mushrooms have vitamin b12 so i may start eating them.</div>
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I think it'd be better to verify this rather than rely on a website for that information. Supplementation is easy. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/images/smilies/smiley.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title=":)"><br><br><div class="quote-container"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by <strong>Kindred</strong> <a href="/forum/post/2978314"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style=""></a><br><br>
I dont like the idea of consuming suppliments.</div>
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Why? Do you consume any fortified foods (any flour based products, plant based milks, etc?)?
 

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<div class="quote-container"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by <strong>silva</strong> <a href="/forum/post/2978310"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style=""></a><br><br>
I'll get it any way, I'm just curious since B12 is a bacteria that grows on plants, gets formulated through the digestion of herbivours and pooped back in the soil. So we can get from animal meat or from unwashed plants that grow in manured soil?</div>
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B12 is not bacteria. B12 is a vitamin produced by particular types of bacteria. Some people have claimed you can get B12 from unwashed produce, but this is not a reliable source since you don't know whether or not any herbivores may have pooped on your veggies and how often... Eating poop is not that appetizing anyway -- I'd rather give my veggies a good wash.<br><br>
Fortified foods or supplements are the only reliable sources of B12, and the source of B12 for those is generally from bacteria.
 

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<div class="quote-container"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by <strong>Kindred</strong> <a href="/forum/post/2978314"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style=""></a><br><br><a href="http://www.mushroomsforlife.net/science-of-mushrooms-health-s102/vitamin-b12-s118/" target="_blank">http://www.mushroomsforlife.net/scie...amin-b12-s118/</a><br><br>
says that mushrooms have vitamin b12 so i may start eating them. I dont like the idea of consuming suppliments.</div>
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You're against fortified foods?<br>
I can appreciate that, but B12 stays in your body for a number of years, so if you've had enough B12 from being a meat eater, or lacto/ovo veg, or just from previously eating fortified foods, it could be a long time in those stores being depleted. I mean, a deficiency won't show up for some time, and you'll think you're okay.<br>
B12 deficiency is a <i>very</i> serious matter! It could be irreversable. I haven't seen enough to verify mushrooms as a reliable source.
 

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Taken from Veganhealth.org, Jack Norris and Ginny Messina--<br><br>
To be truly healthful, a diet must be best not just for individuals in isolation but must allow all six billion people to thrive and achieve a sustainable coexistence with the many other species that form the “living earth.” From this standpoint the natural adaptation for most (possibly all) humans in the modern world is a vegan diet. There is nothing natural about the abomination of modern factory farming and its attempt to reduce living, feeling beings to machines. In choosing to use fortified foods or B12 supplements, vegans are taking their B12 from the same source as every other animal on the planet – micro-organisms – without causing suffering to any sentient being or causing environmental damage.<br><br>
Vegans using adequate amounts of fortified foods or B12 supplements are much less likely to suffer from B12 deficiency than the typical meat eater. The Institute of Medicine, in setting the US recommended intakes for B12 makes this very clear. “Because 10 to 30 percent of older people may be unable to absorb naturally occurring vitamin B12, it is advisable for those older than 50 years to meet their RDA mainly by consuming foods fortified with vitamin B12 or a vitamin B12-containing supplement.” Vegans should take this advice about 50 years younger, to the benefit of both themselves and the animals. B12 need never be a problem for well-informed vegans.<br><br>
Good information supports vegan health, pass it around.
 

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I take a vitamin B12 supplement sporadically, when I think of it. My vitamin B12 was checked recently and was fine.
 

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<div class="quote-container"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by <strong>silva</strong> <a href="/forum/post/2978310"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style=""></a><br><br>
But Deva's website states it's B12 is 100% animal-free:<br>
"DEVA Vegan Sublingual B-12 is 100% animal free, and guaranteed for purity, freshness and labeled potency. Remember all DEVA Products are 100% vegan, vegetarian and are certified by the Vegan Society, the non-profit organization that actually invented the word "vegan". "</div>
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I didn't suggest otherwise. I just wanted to clear up the false belief that vegan foods have B12 in them naturally. They are fortified to be that way, so if you rely on soy milk for your B12, for example, you need to make sure it is fortified with B12.
 

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<div class="quote-container"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by <strong>silva</strong> <a href="/forum/post/2978320"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style=""></a><br><br>
B12 deficiency is a <i>very</i> serious matter! It could be irreversable. I haven't seen enough to verify mushrooms as a reliable source.</div>
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Absolutely. The best-known symptom of B-12 deficiency is a type of anemia, but a lack of B-12 can also cause neurological damage- which is irreversible by the time clinical signs of disease show up.<br><br>
Kindred, please consult a reputable printed source if you want to research this. False "information" is all too common, especially on the Internet.
 

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<div class="quote-container"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by <strong>Kindred</strong> <a href="/forum/post/2978314"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style=""></a><br><br><a href="http://www.mushroomsforlife.net/science-of-mushrooms-health-s102/vitamin-b12-s118/" target="_blank">http://www.mushroomsforlife.net/scie...amin-b12-s118/</a></div>
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This appears to be the study they mention:<br><a href="http://pubs.acs.org/doi/abs/10.1021/jf9010966" target="_blank">http://pubs.acs.org/doi/abs/10.1021/jf9010966</a><br><br><div class="quote-container"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block">says that mushrooms have vitamin b12 so i may start eating them. I dont like the idea of consuming suppliments.</div>
</div>
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It seems there are very small amounts though (5% of RDI was mentioned), so you won't get enough B12 this way. Also, the study looked at a very specific type of mushrooms (freshly harvested white button mushrooms (Agaricus bisporus)), so it's not clear whether other mushrooms have B12. Mushrooms are interesting though, since they belong to a separate kingdom from plants, animals and bacteria, namely fungus.<br><br>
Some vegans don't like the idea of supplementing because they feel that admitting the un-fortified vegan diet lacks certain nutrients would be like admitting that veganism is flawed and/or because they feel it should be possible to be healthy on a 100% "natural" vegan diet because they have come to believe that all synthetic / "unnatural" additives are bad for us.<br><br>
Personally, I feel that this is throwing the baby out with the bathwater. Yes, some lab-produced additives are definitely bad for us. But B12 produced by bacteria in a lab is not. Also, for me the point of veganism is not to live 100% "naturally", but about respecting my fellow animal brothers and sisters, and limiting my contribution to unnecessary suffering. Furthermore, the whole concept of "natural" is incredibly diffuse when you start thinking about it. What exactly does it mean anyway?<br><br>
/end rant
 

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<div class="quote-container"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by <strong>ColossalCupcakes</strong> <a href="/forum/post/2978242"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style=""></a><br><br>
From what I've read a year or two ago, vegans, vegetarians and omnivores are all at risk for B12 deficiency. Basically, it's finicky as cooking removes some of it from sources or certain minerals inhibit is absorption etc. I take a vegan multiamin everyday and am pretty healthy. If you don't wish to take vitamins, eating fresh sources of B12 should work well too. But I'm a programmer, not a doctor. :p<br><br>
Anyway, check out the <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vitamin_B12" target="_blank">wikipedia</a> article for more information, it covers what I've said except in greater depth.</div>
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I was b12 deficent as an omni and know many women who are omni and are b12 deficient. It is hard for everyone to get enough of.
 
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