[gas4]

Tova suggested that we have a thread on alternative techniques and I agree so here it is.

Here's a bunch of techniques that people who don't smack/spank/hit their kids told me they've used:

Time-out

Withdrawal of privileges

Positive reinforcement

Discussion and contextualisation

Distraction

Ignoring unwanted behaviour

Naughty/quiet spot

Suggesting or modelling desired behaviour

Removing the child from the situation

Anticipating problems

Growling

Logical consequences

Counting

Grounding

Writing lines or essays

The stand and think technique

Giving the child a choice

Obviously they apply to different children, situations, and ages. The most interesting thing they said was that it wasn't so much what you did, but how you did it when it comes to alternative techniques. For example you have to be consistent, across time and across children.

 

[Tova]

As I said in the other thread I think distraction is a vital method when the child is young and cannot respond to reason.

When they get older, I think it's important to explain the reasons why you don't want them to do things. If the child does it any way they will experience a natural consequence and then understand the reasons why they were initially not asked to do it.

I think compromise is good too.

 

[colorful]

Has anybody read Unconditional Parenting by Alfie Kohn? I read it several months ago and it has really challenged my ideas about discipline. He doesn't believe it is respectful to reward or punish kids in any way, whether it be isolation in time-out or withdrawal of privileges, or reward stickers, charts, etc. I'm not sure what I think of this, overall he makes some really good points, but it also kind of leaves me at a loss for how to handle certain situations, especially as my kids are too young to reason with (3 and 1).

For me, putting my 3-year-old in his room for a time-out is indispensible to me. I don't make him stay there for any length of time, I just tell him to come out when he can be calm and respectful. If he comes out and is still screaming, whining, hitting, or kicking, I escort him back to his room again. I feel like I have a recourse for unacceptable behaviour, yet I don't feel I am really punishing him because I am not locking him in there and he can come out, so he isn't sitting in there feeling afraid. Often after I put him in time-out, he will quiet down quickly and I'll go in after awhile to check on him and he is sitting on his bed looking at books or something. When that happens I really think time-out worked as a way of teaching him to take a breather and calm down, rather than as a punishment. The biggest perk of time-out is that it allows me to calm down too, giving me space from him when I am feeling angry.

With my 1-year-old, discipline is as simple as a gentle "off-limits" or "sit down" or whatever, followed by some physical redirection (i.e. helping him sit down, moving him away from the off-limits item) and then distraction with something else.

One other technique we use is putting a toy away if the kids are fighting over it. I'm not going to play referee constantly, and I definitely don't want to take sides, so if they can't share a toy, it goes up for awhile.

 

[gas4]

Sounds like you're using time-out like the stand and think technique someone described to me. She said that it wasn't supposed to be a punishment. The kid was just told to stand somewhere and think about it for a little while, it served to calm them down and to get them to think about their behaviour.

 

[IamJen]

I was so going to suggest this book! I stayed out of the spanking thread, but since this one was already about non-physical discipline, I planned to chime in.

I highly recommend any of Alfie's books. I think I've read them all except his most recent one. He does a good job explaining the psychological reasoning behind his philosophy.

Also, you hit the nail on the head wrt "time out", etc. When most effective, it's not a punishment, it's time for the child (and maybe the parent/teacher/caregiver too) to have some time alone and *chill*. The goal is not to make the child feel bad (punish them), but to give them a tool to help them regain control.

Quote:

Originally Posted by colorful

Has anybody read Unconditional Parenting by Alfie Kohn? I read it several months ago and it has really challenged my ideas about discipline. He doesn't believe it is respectful to reward or punish kids in any way, whether it be isolation in time-out or withdrawal of privileges, or reward stickers, charts, etc. I'm not sure what I think of this, overall he makes some really good points, but it also kind of leaves me at a loss for how to handle certain situations, especially as my kids are too young to reason with (3 and 1).

For me, putting my 3-year-old in his room for a time-out is indispensible to me. I don't make him stay there for any length of time, I just tell him to come out when he can be calm and respectful. If he comes out and is still screaming, whining, hitting, or kicking, I escort him back to his room again. I feel like I have a recourse for unacceptable behaviour, yet I don't feel I am really punishing him because I am not locking him in there and he can come out, so he isn't sitting in there feeling afraid. Often after I put him in time-out, he will quiet down quickly and I'll go in after awhile to check on him and he is sitting on his bed looking at books or something. When that happens I really think time-out worked as a way of teaching him to take a breather and calm down, rather than as a punishment. The biggest perk of time-out is that it allows me to calm down too, giving me space from him when I am feeling angry.

With my 1-year-old, discipline is as simple as a gentle "off-limits" or "sit down" or whatever, followed by some physical redirection (i.e. helping him sit down, moving him away from the off-limits item) and then distraction with something else.

One other technique we use is putting a toy away if the kids are fighting over it. I'm not going to play referee constantly, and I definitely don't want to take sides, so if they can't share a toy, it goes up for awhile.

 

[Tame]

Quote:

Originally Posted by IamJen

I highly recommend any of Alfie's books. I think I've read them all except his most recent one. He does a good job explaining the psychological reasoning behind his philosophy.

You really recommend his books?

Wow.

Really?

 

[gas4]

Quote:

Originally Posted by IamJen

Also, you hit the nail on the head wrt "time out", etc. When most effective, it's not a punishment, it's time for the child (and maybe the parent/teacher/caregiver too) to have some time alone and *chill*. The goal is not to make the child feel bad (punish them), but to give them a tool to help them regain control.

That was another thing that the parents I spoke to said: parental time out can be a good thing. When their kids were going nuts, or if they really felt like hitting them, they'd go outside for a minute, or lock themselves in a room for a few minutes to calm down. Then they could go back out and deal with the situation calmly.

 

[pixiexxs]

When they're younger redirection works well. Basically steer them away from what ever negative thing they're doing to something positive. When they can understand you better you can add something such as "That's dangerous, etc..." to let them know why that is not okay. There are so many different situations that could arise where a child needs some type of redirection as they get older, so it's impossible to list all ways to curb those behaviors. However, when you want to give a child consequences for certain actions, try to make sure it relates with the misdeed. My boy can throw some pretty mean fits where there is no talking to him or anything. He needs to go to his room so he can be alone until he's ready to talk. This way he can scream, punch his pillow, whatever he needs without disrupting the other 4 people in the house.

Also, I'm sorry but I have to say that children do need to see there are negative consequences to negative actions. If you want to call it punishment, then so be it. We as adults know that we cannot do certain things in life without being held accountable. Children need to learn the same. Obviously, it goes without saying no mental or physical abuse is ever okay.

 

[IamJen]

In many cases though, pixie, you can implement negative consquences that are logical, rather than just "punishment". You color on the walls...you have to clean it up. You run when walking down the street...you have to hold mom's hand (and thus, be a bit restrained). You break your toys...they're taken away (or perhaps you don't get new ones). etc.

 

[colorful]

The whole idea behind the no rewards/punishments concept is to teach kids to be internally motivated, rather than externally motivated. Teach them not to be kind to their friends just because it's the nice thing to do, not because they are afraid of a punishment. Teach them to do their chores because everybody helps out in the family, not because they are going to get a treat for doing so. I think the danger of rewards/punishments is that they can get kids to behave when they are being watched, but they might misbehave any time an adult's back is turned.

Also, I think a lot of reward/punishment type discipline puts the focus on the child and not on the others he shares his world with. I don't want my 3 year old to refrain from hitting his little brother because he's worried about what punishment I will dole out. I want him to refrain from hitting because he sees that hitting hurts his little brother. I'm hoping he will learn to be more altruistic and less selfish this way.

 

[IamJen]

Exactly.

 

[pixiexxs]

Quote:

Originally Posted by IamJen

In many cases though, pixie, you can implement negative consquences that are logical, rather than just "punishment". You color on the walls...you have to clean it up. You run when walking down the street...you have to hold mom's hand (and thus, be a bit restrained). You break your toys...they're taken away (or perhaps you don't get new ones). etc.

Exactly...that is exactly what I meant. Thank you for understanding what I meant to say. The "punishment" or parental action following the event (whatever you want to call it) needs to fit what it was the child did that is not acceptable behavior. And I'm sorry, but in a perfect world, yes, a child will do something, or not do it, simply because it was the right thing to do. However, in the real world, children will sometimes do things just to see if they can get away with it and will be influenced by other people and sources other than us parents. I have three children who are active in school, non-school club, love spending time with friends and relatives and they pick things up I never have taught them. That's why it's important for us parents to do our job.

I think it's great that the parents (and parents one day) on this board are so active in their children's lives and truly and honestly care to do a great job. We also have to remember that other parents out there are not the same. They're just going through the motions. This is why we need to lead through example.

 

[gas4]

This is great, between the research I've been doing this year, and all the advice I'm getting here I'm going to be all clued up when I have my own kids.

 

[IamJen]

*chuckle*

 

[Skylark]

Quote:

Originally Posted by gas4

This is great, between the research I've been doing this year, and all the advice I'm getting here I'm going to be all clued up when I have my own kids.

I suspect, though I do not know from personal experience because I cannot be all people, that no one can ever be "all clued up" on being a parent.

 

[thebelovedtree]

Quote:

Originally Posted by skylark

I suspect, though I do not know from personal experience because I cannot be all people, that no one can ever be "all clued up" on being a parent.

While I agree, years of picking up tidbits is probably closer than the "on ****, it's here and it's gonna want me to do stuff" so many people do.

 

[gas4]

Ok, well at least I'll have a bunch of good diciplinary strategies.

 

[barefeet48066]

I am pro-spanking but there are plenty of other options: grounding (either to the house or the kid's room), extra chores, early bedtime, standing in the corner, writing lines, withdrawal of allowance, etc.

 

[rincaro]

We do timeouts and take away privileges. It works well for my boys. Of course they only get a small amount of Lego Star Wars time per week, so they are loathe to do anything to lose it. But also, I guess I am fortunate that the boys really do have a good sense of right and wrong, and seem to want to do the good and kind thing most of the time.

 

[Tova]

Quote:

grounding (either to the house or the kid's room), extra chores, early bedtime, standing in the corner, writing lines, withdrawal of allowance

But none of those teach the child why they shouldn't do something. These punishments abuse a parent's power and the child only feels anger and resentment. They also humiliate and embarrass the child.

Barbara Coloroso states in her book that discipline rather than punishment:

1. Shows kids what they have done

2. Gives them ownership to the problem

3. Gives them options to solving the problem

4. Leaves their dignity intact

Here are some examples of natural or reasonable consequences from her book:

If a child puts her shoes on the wrong feet, her feet hurt

If a child goes outside on a chilly day without a coat, he will get cold

If a teenager wrecks the car, she may use the car as soon as she has a plan for getting it repaired

If a twelve yr old borrows your clothes and returns them torn, he needs to get them repaired

If he continues to ruin things he borrows, soon noone will loan him anymore clothes.

Coming home late for dinner may mean the child eats a cold supper or can heat it up.

I wanted to put up this quote which I really like. It's nice because it makes us remember that our children do not belong to us. We can not make them do anything. I think all parents should remember that.

"Your children are not your children.

They are the sons and daughters of Life's longing for itself.

They come through you but not from you,

and though they are with you yet they belong not to you.

You may give them your love but not your thoughts,

For they have their own thoughts.

You may house their bodies but not their souls,

For their souls dwell in the house of tomorrow, which you cannot visit, not even in your dreams."

-Kahlil Gibran

Quote:

I suspect, though I do not know from personal experience because I cannot be all people, that no one can ever be "all clued up" on being a parent.

No you can't but gas4-try to ignore the negative. People have so much negative to say in regards to parenting and really everything in life I guess.

My sister just gave birth to a girl and when she was pregnant people just kept going on and on about how hard it is having a child especially a newborn.

Now that she has her baby she is like, "I'm still waiting for the awful part". She absolutely loves being a mom and it's so wonderful to see such a positive parent!!

I think it's great that you are prepared. More parents should prepare so they know there are other options than spanking.