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Hm. I didn't think that article was so great.

But anyway, she said something about a lack of B-12 making her tired all the time. Is that a true symptom??
 

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lack of B 12 can lead to problems with neurological function, btu i don't believe that it has a "tiredness" factor. That could come from any other factor such as not getting enough sleep, not getting enough exercise, nt getting enough to eat, not getting enough variety in what she eats, and too much stress.

so, she may be blaming it on something that doesn't have much to do with it.
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by Kurmudgeon

Tiredness factor? I thought that was due to the constant crap from many omnivores..... that sure makes me tired.
Krum, you're thinking of BS overload. Excesses of BS will make a person tired, cranky and often want to pinch the head off of the next @#$% that makes a "cute" comment about getting enough protien or how fish is a vegetable...


About the B12 thing, she actually admits that she had a [email protected] diet.

"I used to not eat properly; I'd skip breakfast, eat crap for lunch, come home after school and pig out, then not eat dinner. And because of it I got a B12 deficiency. I could sleep 12 hours a day and still be tired. I was never ever hungry." Somehow, she admits that she's trying to eat better, but doesn't say how or what she's doing differently. It's just "I now at leat attempt to eat more healthily"

Other quotes that I wonder about (along with my responses):

...Seriously, the only way I would ever eat meat again was if I was endangering my own life or if I had to eat meat during a pregnancy (although my mom didn't eat meat at all when she was pregnant with me and I had no weird birth defects, I was actually a pretty fat and healthy baby)... The only "weird birth defect" she has is that she was born an air-head but it's not fatal (although I certainly wouldn't try to procreate with it because it might spread to the child, too.)

...And maybe they'll stop and think about the fact that meat-eaters probably don't get vitamin deficiencies so bad that people think they have cancer. Naw... no one thinks that meat-eaters get vitamin deficiencies that make people think they have cancer. That's because most really do get cancer. And heart disease, and diabeties, and bone and joint troubles, and.....

The whole article seems like she's trying to convince herself that this is maybe good but she seems to go from one side of the fence to the other and back again.
 

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You wouldn't get a B12 deficiency being ovo-lacto, would you? I thought that was only an issue for vegans. And anyway, couldn't she just have taken a vitamin tablet?

I didn't like her rant on fake meats, either. I realize that they're not for everyone, and that moral reasons are not everyone's motive for being veg. But for some people morals are the reason, and therefore fake meats are fine for them. (Also, the writer said that she "wasn't trying to impose her eating choices on anyone.")

She says the "yuckiness" of meat is her main reason for giving it up, and yet also that bacon and burgers still smell good to her sometimes. If "yuckiness" were my only problem with meat, then I guess I'd go ahead and eat the bacon.

 

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Vitamin B12 deficiency can be caused by either a lack of food containing B12 or a lack of intrinsic factor, a substance which is produced by the stomach and helps the body to absorb B12 from the diet. There has also been some suggestion that it can be caused by Nitrous Oxide emissions from cars but that hasn't been researched widely as yet.

Tiredness and generalized weakness almost certainly is an early stage symptom of B12 deficiency. And it can lead to Pernicious Anemia. Other symptoms include

* shortness of breath

* dizziness

* paresthesias (pins and needles in hands and feet

* pains in legs

* chest pains

* headache

* red, shiny or sore tongue

* reduced sense of taste and touch

* depression

* difficulty walking

Catching B12 deficiency in it's early stages is advisable as it can do some serious long-term neurological damage if left untreated. So if you do have unexplained tiredness, doesn't matter if you're vegetarian or vegan, go see your doctor. It's better to err on the side of caution.

Even if you take a B12 supplement get your B12 level checked regularly as it is not always easily absorbed from a tablet.
 

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Pixelle: supplementation works as a rule. If you have one or two sources including supplementation and don´t suffer from pernicious anemia, I wouldn´t worry to much and skip regular checks.
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by Lothar M Kirsch

Pixelle: supplementation works as a rule. If you have one or two sources including supplementation and don´t suffer from pernicious anemia, I wouldn´t worry to much and skip regular checks.
Yes supplementation does work as a general rule. But unfortunately not everyone supplements as they perhaps should, and not everybody eats perfectly all the time.

In addition, if you're not supplementing or you are lacking 'intrinsic factor', B12 deficiency can creep up on you so slowly (over about 7 years) that you may barely notice at first that you have it. Therefore it's advisable to have a regular blood test (this can mean once a year!) to check your level.

Having a regular blood check eliminates guess work and is a sensible way of keeping an eye on most things that are going on in your body, not just B12. This applies whether you're young, old, vegan or omnivore. By doing this, you can also check that you're not over-supplementing. One of my tests once revealed that my iron levels were very high and I was wasting money on supplements that I didn't need.
 

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sunnyk

Quote:
You wouldn't get a B12 deficiency being ovo-lacto, would you? I thought that was only an issue for vegans.
It can also be an issue for ovo-lacto vegetarians. A vegetarian that eats substatial amounts of dairy products several times a day will probably be OK. But not all ovo-lacto vegetarians do that. The recommendation is 2.4 mcgs of B12 consumed in small amounts spread out over the day. In small amounts (less than 1 mcg) it's absorbed more efficiently.
 

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actually anemia due to a B-12 deficiency will cause extreme tiredness.. mine was really bad as an omni, but under control as a vegan.
 

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Lack of B12 can lead to tiredness and irritablility too. I have a friend who, although she's omni, has a defect in her digestive system that makes her unable to absorb the vitamin (even from suppliments). She needs to get a shot for it every 4 weeks. I lived with her at school this year and when it came time for her shot, she would do nothing but sleep. Usually she had to take a cab to the doctor's office (a ten minute walk) because she was so tired.

I've never seen this in a person who had a normal digestive system. I know I've never had it. I doubt the argument for b12 holds much water unless you personally have trouble absorbing it.
 

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Thank you all for the information on B12 -- I learned a bit there. I guess what I meant (perhaps not very clearly) by my original statement, was that while anybody might get a B12 deficiency, only a vegan will definitely get a deficiency without supplementation. In other words, the author's deficiency was not necessarily correlated with her vegetarianism....
 

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i do not take a supplement i only get B-12 from foods that are fortified and eat a strict vegan diet.. i do sometimes have issues with my b-12, but nothing like when i was omni.
 

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But fortified foods fall under the definition of "supplementation," right? I do the same thing, with my fortified soymilk for example.
 

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Is B12 strictly an animal product? I know you can get it from yeast, but it has to be fortified with B12.

If animals can eat grass and grain and they have B12 in their flesh, why can't we eat grass and grain and get B12?

Mmmmm. Grass.
 

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B12 is not strictly an animal product. The B12 you see in vegetarian foods is not from animals, which is why they can be called vegetarian. I'm honestly not sure the source, but it's probably some lab.
 

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Now I'm really curious for more info on B12 -- although this is really not the right thread. All I know is that I read it was the one nutrient that could not be obtained on a vegan diet without supplements / fortified foods.
 
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