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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I know that a lot of people people here probably wouldn't even eat cultured (lab-grown) meats, but one possible use for them, besides food for omnis who can't imagine giving up meat, is to feed carnivorous pets.

After all, a lot of people here dislike having to buy foods with meats in them for their cat/dog/ferret, but at the same time won't do otherwise because it could risk the animal's health. If cultured meat becomes popular, it would also give vegans a chance to feed their pets/companion animals/whatever healthy diets without having to comprimise their ethics in the process.

Just a thought.
 

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I've considered this, and I think it would be a great solution, although I don't know all that much about it.
 

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My dogs are perfectly healthy on a nutritionally complete Vegan Diet. I doubt that I would switch to feed my animals frankenfood. But then dogs are omnivores, not carnivores, so feeding them Vegan isn't a problem.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
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Originally Posted by SARC View Post

My dogs are also vegan, and so is my ferret and they are all perfectly healthy!
Personally, I'd never try to put a carnivorous animal on a completely vegan diet. I know it works for some of them, but I wouldn't want take any chances.
 

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Of course, the most ideal situation would be to not breed any pets, carnivorous or not, and so the need to feed them would vanish.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
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Originally Posted by Sevenseas View Post

Of course, the most ideal situation would be to not breed any pets, carnivorous or not, and so the need to feed them would vanish.
I don't see this happening any time in the near future.

As for the "frankenfood" remarks, I think some people are too obsessed with the idea that "natural = healthy." As long as the cultured meat in question is safe for consumption, I honestly don't see the big deal.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
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Originally Posted by Sevenseas View Post

Of course, the most ideal situation would be to not breed any pets, carnivorous or not, and so the need to feed them would vanish.
Forget "ideal situations", it's not as if this is going to be happening any time in the near future.

As for the "frankenfood" remarks, I think some people are too obsessed with the idea that "natural = healthy." As long as the cultured meat in question is safe for consumption, I honestly don't see the big deal.
 

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By the same logic, do you see the consumption of artificial dyes, food flavorings created in laboratories, and chemicals that Dr. Frankenstien didn't even have the knowledge to make healthy?

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According to recent studies, it isn't.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
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Originally Posted by Aussyj View Post

By the same logic, do you see the consumption of artificial dyes, food flavorings created in laboratories, and chemicals that Dr. Frankenstien didn't even have the knowledge to make healthy?

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According to recent studies, it isn't.
We're talking about meats and organs cloned from DNA in labs, not artificial dyes or flavors.

Quite frankly, this would probably be healthy compared to what most cats and dogs are fed nowadays. Or what most humans are fed, for that matter.

And I still stand by my opinion that the whole natural being equivalent to healthy idea is silly. No, hydrogenated oil isn't good for you, and neither are a lot of dyes. That doesn't mean that something being "artificial" makes it unhealthy, and that being "natural" is healthy. Fortified foods are "unnatural", and so are a lot of the ingredients in multivitamins, but doesn't make them unhealthy. You could probably bottle turtle piss and people would still guzzle it down if you put "organic" or "natural" on the label.
 

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For the most part, I would agree with you, but not so much on the DNA replicated meat.

First of all, if we decide as a people that cloning is wrong, but the replication of meat products by DNA is ok, what kind of a message are we really putting out? Are we saying that cloning is just fine, as long as it is good for the economy?

(Personally, I could care less if cloning was perceived as ok, but most of the population would differ on that issue, and I personally do not believe - as a Vegan - that preaching one thing for humans and another for animals is right ethically, morally, or intelligently. The issue is not so much whether lab-created meat is healthy, but why is would be ok to create it for consumption in the first place using methods that so many have voted against.)
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
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Originally Posted by Aussyj View Post

First of all, if we decide as a people that cloning is wrong, but the replication of meat products by DNA is ok, what kind of a message are we really putting out? Are we saying that cloning is just fine, as long as it is good for the economy?

(Personally, I could care less if cloning was perceived as ok, but most of the population would differ on that issue, and I personally do not believe - as a Vegan - that preaching one thing for humans and another for animals is right ethically, morally, or intelligently. The issue is not so much whether lab-created meat is healthy, but why is would be ok to create it for consumption in the first place using methods that so many have voted against.)
But this is essentially the same as creating individual organs for transplants, something that a lot of people would agree to be beneficial, even if they don't agree with human cloning. If this becomes a viable option in the near future (which I hope it does), then cultured meat ought to be considered ethically sound as well.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dreaded Candiru View Post

We're talking about meats and organs cloned from DNA in labs, not artificial dyes or flavors.
One thing I haven't yet read wrt cultured meats is as to what sort of medium they're grown on. If they're grown on something like hydrolyzed animal protein from rendering plants, then there will still be ethical and safety issues. My snakes need whole animals for complete nutrition, alas, so cultured muscle tissue wouldn't meet their needs. I certainly won't breed them as pets again, though.

Quote:
Quite frankly, this would probably be healthy compared to what most cats and dogs are fed nowadays. Or what most humans are fed, for that matter.
In some ways. Some dog foods are loaded with red dyes, for example, which can't be all that great for their livers and kidneys. The average commercial dog food is more grain than anything else, though.

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And I still stand by my opinion that the whole natural being equivalent to healthy idea is silly.]
True. Orpiment is plenty natural but I'm not about to eat it.

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Fortified foods are "unnatural", and so are a lot of the ingredients in multivitamins, but doesn't make them unhealthy.
Some multivitamins have levels of vitamin A that are arguably not good, though many multis have fairly low overall bioavailability.

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You could probably bottle turtle piss and people would still guzzle it down if you put "organic" or "natural" on the label.
I don't doubt that I could find turtle piss down in the International District if I spoke Cantonese.
 

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I guess that my real problem with this whole issue is that I simply do not see meat as morally nor ethically correct not matter in which way it is produced. I would not eat animal flesh nor buy animal skin or fur if an animal were humanely killed or passed away naturally. The same rules apply to the DNA created meat you speak of: It would have to originate from meat itself, and would therefor be considered a byproduct of the meat industry. I would support it no more than I would support veal itself.

Now, as for the issue of pets, I also do not agree that someone whom sees the meat industry and killing of animals as wrong should buy animal products as dog food. While I applaud that people are worried of imposing their beliefs upon their pets, I believe that if you are vegetarian - or vegan for that matter- animal based pet food is not something you should support. For this reason, I would not purchase lab produced meat even if they were able to make it as healthy as vegetable are, just like I will not buy eggs simply because they have found ways to increase the omega 3 content within them.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
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Originally Posted by Aussyj View Post

I guess that my real problem with this whole issue is that I simply do not see meat as morally nor ethically correct not matter in which way it is produced. I would not eat animal flesh nor buy animal skin or fur if an animal were humanely killed or passed away naturally. The same rules apply to the DNA created meat you speak of: It would have to originate from meat itself, and would therefor be considered a byproduct of the meat industry. I would support it no more than I would support veal itself.
I'm not quite so extreme on the matter.


I suppose it was like the argument over sterilizing deer instead of hunting them. I'm all for it, but because the contraceptive used a slaughterhouse byproduct (pig's ovaries), some vegans were still opposed to the idea. Never mind that the pigs were going to be killed anyway (unfortunately) and it would help save animal lives.

Honestly, I can't see how some people can be so viciously anti-meat while still loving animals that eat it to survive. Just because you don't eat it and oppose the industry doesn't make it pure, concentrated evil.

To Anthony11: a lot of dog foods contain much nastier things than red dyes, including ground-up chicken feathers, sawdust, and the slaughterhouse floor-scrapings that were too nasty even to be made into hot dogs.

Personally, I have no idea how you could feed snakes without using a whole animal, but then again, I imagine that vegans who keep them as pets are minority!
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dreaded Candiru View Post

Forget "ideal situations", it's not as if this is going to be happening any time in the near future.
Cultured meat may be just as unlikely to happen or as far in the future.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
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Originally Posted by Sevenseas View Post

Cultured meat may be just as unlikely to happen or as far in the future.
Not quite, there have already beenexperiments in creating in vitro meat, and industrial production of it would be cheaper than farming actual animals. A lot of companies and restaurants might be start using cultured meat simply for economic reasons.

On the other hand, there's a huge population of pets filling up every animal shelter in the country, and they're not going away any time soon. Plus, not everyone considers having a dog or cat as a member of the family to be slavery or exploitation.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dreaded Candiru View Post

Personally, I'd never try to put a carnivorous animal on a completely vegan diet. I know it works for some of them, but I wouldn't want take any chances.
Dogs are omnivorous. Not carnivorous.
(BTW, interesting side note: dogs don't digest gluten. The animal poisoning was due to contaminated gluten, which really should not have been used in dog "food" anyway. It's like having us eat wax and considering it nutritious.

Also, a popular brand of dog food pictures grapes on its bag. I picked up the bag and read the ingredients to make sure grapes weren't in there. Obviously, they weren't. But thank God nonetheless.)

Cats need taurine and it has not been determined that synthetic taurine fills this need, so I would not try to make a cat vegan.

Ferrets are more similar to cats than dogs. However, I know little about their nutritional needs.

I am way off topic.

Yes, I would feed my pets cultured meat if that were an option. As it is, my pets do not eat cruelty free.
 
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