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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Ok, I've been having this argument with my best friend for a looong time.<br>
She thinks bugs and insects are more like plants than animals, because of what they look like. I have explained to her that if she actually did research on their biology, she would find out that they were animals. She says that she has told her friends at college about me and apparently they all think I'm crazy. I know it may seem stupid that I am so frustrated about bugs and insects, but to be frank. I don't care.<br><br>
Argh, I don't know what to say to her. She's the kind of person who refuses to even believe facts if it doesn't suit her. She has hardly any idea about animals and the healthiness of a vegeterian diet. Yet she tells me "Vegeterian food is full of artificial flavours" or "I'm almost a vegeterian" yet she eats meat more than anything else. She seems to think people who are older are always right, her parents.<br>
They say I must be weak. That vegetarians are unhealthy etc.....<br>
She believes every word they say. Yet I'm the one who has books on animal rights, I'm the one who has been vegetarian for 6 years!
 

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I am a biologist and to answer your question:<br>
all bugs are a type of insect<br>
all insects are a type of animal<br><br>
As far as needing to prove it to her, keep in mind that some people enjoy being ignorant. I don't know if she fits this description. But my experience in working with people who flaunt their ignorance, is that it is a wasted effort to do anything more than just get through the moment and with lots of "oh really" "I wasn't aware of that" "your information is an interesting contrast to what I have previously learned" "Your knowledge truly surprises me". To attempt to provide them with real facts and truthful information is futile and only makes them try harder to convince you that they are right. The only time I will argue, is if they are misinforming others who are believing their information to be fact. In those cases I also evaluate if the receiving parties really care and are open/interested in the truth. If I think it would make a difference then I will provide them with truthful information and let the blissfully ignorant person continue to think the way they want.<br><br>
Stand firm in who you are and what you know, but also be compassionate to those who lack the ability/desire to be open to different information, even when it is the truth.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Yes, she is very ignorant. Thanks, I think I will talk to her friends on this subject. As she does seem to be misinforming all of them! Would it be ok if I mentioned you? I will only say that you, as a biologist say insects are animals. I guess it would be better not to argue with her, but it's always her that brings it up.<br><br>
Thanks for your advice.<br><img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/images/smilies/smiley.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title=":)">
 

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It really sounds like she's just trying to push your buttons. If she's not listening to your factual arguments, I would drop it. Depending on how you feel about it, I would either level with her and tell her you don't feel she's being respectful, or just ignore it and change the subject whenever she brings it up. Of course, this is assuming you want to keep the friendship.
 

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I agree with runnerveggie that she is probably just trying to push your buttons. I would deal with it by saying "that might be your opinion, but I disagree." She really can't argue with you about that.<br><br>
Next time she brings it up, you may try making an observation like "you sure bring this subject up a lot" and see how she reacts to that. Ask her why she finds it so interesting.
 

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because of their looks, thats a weird reason. i would say because of their cognitive abilities. but they are still animals of course
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
<div class="quote-container"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by <strong>RunnerVeggie</strong> <a href="/forum/post/2848073"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style=""></a><br><br>
It really sounds like she's just trying to push your buttons. If she's not listening to your factual arguments, I would drop it. Depending on how you feel about it, I would either level with her and tell her you don't feel she's being respectful, or just ignore it and change the subject whenever she brings it up. Of course, this is assuming you want to keep the friendship.</div>
</div>
<br><br><div class="quote-container"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by <strong>Chrysalis</strong> <a href="/forum/post/2848113"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style=""></a><br><br>
I agree with runnerveggie that she is probably just trying to push your buttons. I would deal with it by saying "that might be your opinion, but I disagree." She really can't argue with you about that.<br><br>
Next time she brings it up, you may try making an observation like "you sure bring this subject up a lot" and see how she reacts to that. Ask her why she finds it so interesting.</div>
</div>
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That's actually interesting, I've never thought of that possibilty. I guess it could be why she does that. It's kind of hard to think that though, why would a friend want to do that? Maybe she isn't, afterall a good friend? She knows how much animals mean to me. Unless it's a bit of both, she's ignorant and trying to push my buttons. Hmmmm, next time I will mention that she brings it up alot.<br><br>
Yeah, it is a weird reason. She always says "They look like plants".<br>
She doesn't seem t have a convincing reason. When I ask her why insects are'nt animals she says "They just aren't"<br>
That isn't exactly a reason!<br><br>
Thanks, peeps
 

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<div class="quote-container"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by <strong>blondegurl38</strong> <a href="/forum/post/2848019"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style=""></a><br><br>
She says that she has told her friends at college about me and apparently they all think I'm crazy.</div>
</div>
<br><img alt="" src="http://www.thesaucyvegan.com/images/smilies/Smilies/1ROFL.gif" style="border:0px solid;"><br>
Must be an outstanding college those dummies are attending.<br><br><div class="quote-container"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by <strong>syzygy</strong> <a href="/forum/post/2848040"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style=""></a><br><br>
I am a biologist and to answer your question:<br>
all bugs are a type of insect<br>
all insects are a type of animal...</div>
</div>
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No, I think some crustaceans are considered bugs too.<br><br><div class="quote-container"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by <strong>Ira</strong> <a href="/forum/post/2848118"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style=""></a><br><br>
because of their looks, thats a weird reason. i would say because of their cognitive abilities. but they are still animals of course</div>
</div>
<br><img alt="" src="http://www.thesaucyvegan.com/images/smilies/Smilies/1ROFL.gif" style="border:0px solid;"><br>
Tell us what you think you know about the cognitive abilities of insects please?
 

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Too bad she can't take 5 seconds for a search on google or wiki to check her facts since she can't seem to remember basic biology. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/images/smilies/book2.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title=":book:"><br><br>
Scientific classification to the right - kingdom: animalia. <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Insect" target="_blank">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Insect</a><br><br>
As opposed to - kingdom: plantae. <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rose" target="_blank">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rose</a><br><br><div class="quote-container"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block">The biological definition of the word refers to all members of the kingdom Animalia, encompassing creatures as diverse as sponges, jellyfish, <b>insects</b> and humans.</div>
</div>
<br><a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Animalia" target="_blank">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Animalia</a><br><br>
But I'm guessing not even information sourced out of a biology book would change her mind. Some insects LOOK like plants because it's an adaptation that gives them an advantage - the ability to hide for example.
 

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<div class="quote-container"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by <strong>SomebodyElse;2848340[IMG</strong> <a href="/forum/post/0"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style=""></a><br><br>
<a href="http://www.thesaucyvegan.com/images/smilies/Smilies/1ROFL.gif%5B/IMG" target="_blank">http://www.thesaucyvegan.com/images/smilies/Smilies/1ROFL.gif[/IMG</a>]<br>
Tell us what you think you know about the cognitive abilities of insects please?</div>
</div>
<br>
enough to not compare them to animals like pigs
 

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I guess they let just about anyone into college, as long as they pay for it.<br><br><div class="quote-container"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by <strong>Ira</strong> <a href="/forum/post/2848469"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style=""></a><br><br>
enough to not compare them to animals like pigs</div>
</div>
<br>
Your statement reminds me of people who dismiss the value of nonhumans by saying 'they're not human' and calling it good. I'm not sure what you know about the cognition of insects, but I'm not convinced that you've given the issue any real consideration.
 

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Bugs and insects are animals they have their own purpose of why they are small animals. An animal doesn't have to be big as a cow , dog or a cat or a fish, I can small like a butterfly or a fly.
 

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Blondegurl, yes you may quote me if you want.<br>
Here are some educational web resources that might help anyone interested in learning more about insects.<br><br><a href="http://www.amentsoc.org/insects/" target="_blank">http://www.amentsoc.org/insects/</a><br><a href="http://www.amentsoc.org/insects/what-bug-is-this/insects.html" target="_blank">http://www.amentsoc.org/insects/what...s/insects.html</a><br><a href="http://bugguide.net/node/view/15740" target="_blank">http://bugguide.net/node/view/15740</a>
 

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Tell her she's right and that you're sorry for being so stupid, then invite her over to your house to hunt in your backyard for beetles to eat since they must be vegetarian if they're plants, and it would be so <i>weak</i> of her not to try out a new food... right? >: D
 

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<div class="quote-container"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by <strong>SomebodyElse</strong> <a href="/forum/post/2848340"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style=""></a><br><br><br>
No, I think some crustaceans are considered bugs too.<br></div>
</div>
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Here is my understanding of the word bug based on what several professors beat into my brain in college:<br><br>
As a slang term "bug" can be anything that makes someone squimish or is considered a creepy-crawly. I have even heard it used on occasion to refer to some people, but more commonly for small crawly, squirmy organism that the person isn't sure how to identify otherwise. In that use of the word, then some crustateans, worms, slugs, arachnids, amphibians ect. can be also be called "bugs".<br><br>
The biological definition of a bug is any insect in the order hemiptera which includes: cicadias, giant water bugs, stink bugs, assassin bugs, bed bugs, milkweed bugs etc. Hemiptera are distinguished from most other insects in that their wing base is made of a hardened material and the tips are usually softer and more membranous, they also usually have sucking mouthparts and consume liquified diets.<br><br>
But then I looked it up in the Merriam Webster Dictionary and realized we both are right. This word has a very varied definition that shows how obscure English can be.<br><br>
2bugnoun<br>
Definition of BUG<br>
1a : an insect or other creeping or crawling invertebrate (as a spider or centipede) b : any of several insects (as the bedbug or cockroach) commonly considered obnoxious c : any of an order (Hemiptera and especially its suborder Heteroptera) of insects that have sucking mouthparts, forewings thickened at the base, and incomplete metamorphosis and are often economic pests called also true bug<br>
2: an unexpected defect, fault, flaw, or imperfection <the software was full of bugs><br>
3a : a germ or microorganism especially when causing disease b : an unspecified or nonspecific sickness usually presumed due to a bug<br>
4: a sudden enthusiasm<br>
5: enthusiast <a camera bug><br>
6: a prominent person<br>
7: a crazy person<br>
8: a concealed listening device<br>
9[from its designation by an asterisk on race programs] : a weight allowance given apprentice jockeys<br>
Origin of BUG<br>
origin unknown<br>
First Known Use: 1622
 

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<div class="quote-container"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by <strong>syzygy</strong> <a href="/forum/post/2848629"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style=""></a><br><br>
The biological definition of a bug is any insect in the order hemiptera which includes: cicadias, giant water bugs, stink bugs, assassin bugs, bed bugs, milkweed bugs etc. Hemiptera are distinguished from most other insects in that their wing base is made of a hardened material and the tips are usually softer and more membranous, they also usually have sucking mouthparts and consume liquified diets.</div>
</div>
<br>
As soon as I read your original claim that all bugs were insects I immediately thought yep, Hemiptera.
 

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<div class="quote-container"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by <strong>syzygy</strong> <a href="/forum/post/2848629"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style=""></a><br><br>
Here is my understanding of the word bug based on what several professors beat into my brain in college:<br><br>
As a slang term "bug" can be anything that makes someone squimish or is considered a creepy-crawly. I have even heard it used on occasion to refer to some people, but more commonly for small crawly, squirmy organism that the person isn't sure how to identify otherwise. In that use of the word, then some crustateans, worms, slugs, arachnids, amphibians ect. can be also be called "bugs".<br><br>
The biological definition of a bug is any insect in the order hemiptera which includes: cicadias, giant water bugs, stink bugs, assassin bugs, bed bugs, milkweed bugs etc. Hemiptera are distinguished from most other insects in that their wing base is made of a hardened material and the tips are usually softer and more membranous, they also usually have sucking mouthparts and consume liquified diets.<br><br>
But then I looked it up in the Merriam Webster Dictionary and realized we both are right. This word has a very varied definition that shows how obscure English can be.<br><br>
2bugnoun<br>
Definition of BUG<br>
1a : an insect or other creeping or crawling invertebrate (as a spider or centipede) b : any of several insects (as the bedbug or cockroach) commonly considered obnoxious c : any of an order (Hemiptera and especially its suborder Heteroptera) of insects that have sucking mouthparts, forewings thickened at the base, and incomplete metamorphosis and are often economic pests —called also true bug<br>
2: an unexpected defect, fault, flaw, or imperfection <the software was full of bugs><br>
3a : a germ or microorganism especially when causing disease b : an unspecified or nonspecific sickness usually presumed due to a bug<br>
4: a sudden enthusiasm<br>
5: enthusiast <a camera bug><br>
6: a prominent person<br>
7: a crazy person<br>
8: a concealed listening device<br>
9[from its designation by an asterisk on race programs] : a weight allowance given apprentice jockeys<br>
Origin of BUG<br>
origin unknown<br>
First Known Use: 1622</div>
</div>
<br>
Ah, thank you. I'm merely an enthusiast. A bug bug. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/images/smilies/tongue3.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title=":p">
 

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*shakes head at the education system* <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/images/smilies/no.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title=":no:"><br><br>
Honestly though, she is probably just trying to get a rise out of you.
 

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Just point out that every dictionary, encyclopedia, and biology book ever published thinks that insects are members of the animal kingdom. Then ask if she's retarded or just intentionally being wrong, as those are obviously the only two options.<br><br>
Why are you friends with this person?<br><br>
--Fromper<br><img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/images/smilies/juggle.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title=":juggle:">
 

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<div class="quote-container"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by <strong>Irizary</strong> <a href="/forum/post/2848494"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style=""></a><br><br>
I guess they let just about anyone into college, as long as they pay for it.<br><br><br><br>
Your statement reminds me of people who dismiss the value of nonhumans by saying 'they're not human' and calling it good. I'm not sure what you know about the cognition of insects, but I'm not convinced that you've given the issue any real consideration.</div>
</div>
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i don't dismiss the value of insects. i am not walking around killing them. if i have a bug in the house i kick it out instead of stepping on it. i just do see differences between cognitive abilities of different animal species
 
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