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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Are you still vegetarian if you simply don't eat meat but don't look for things like Gelatin , Glucose and dextrose, Isinglass, Animal fats, Glycerides, Lactic acid, Lanolin, Lecithin,Pepsin etc...<br><br><br><br>
Thanks for answering <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/images/smilies/smiley.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title=":)"><br><br><br><br><br><br><span style="color:#0000FF;"><br><br><br><br>
Just to make sure everybody is understanding I'm adding this to this post :<br><br><br><br>
My question is : In the <b>official</b> definitions are you still a vegetarian or you're an omnivore if you don't look out for ingredients like the ones listed above ...</span>
 

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IIRC lactic acid is not from animal sources.<br><br>
if you 'consume' these things in non-food sources (like soap) but not in food, you are vegetarian (because vegetarianism in definition is about diet).<br><br><br><br>
if you eat these trace ingredients, and they are from meat sources, you would technically not be vegetarian. On the other hand, plenty of veg*ns would "accept" you as vegetarian even if they don't see you eye-to-eye on the subject of trace ingredients. I would not argue that gelatin-eating vegetarians are not vegetarian, even though I would definitely argue that gelatin is not vegetarian. I guess that the only problem a lot of veg*ns would have with these vegetarians is that they might confuse omnis and result in people thinking these trace ingredients are vegetarian, much like people argue fish eating "vegetarians" do.
 

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Technically no, because if you consume gelatin, you're still consuming a product that has to come from a dead animal. Same goes for lard, and isinglass. This said, when ordering out, it would be more practical to explain yourself as being vegetarian when asking what they have for you to eat.<br><br><br><br>
Lanolin, milk, eggs, etc. are not direct results of an animal's death, so you would still be considered vegetarian if you consumed those.<br><br><br><br>
However, since you make an effort not to consume meat, you still get a huge "thumbs up" from me. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/images/smilies/smiley.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title=":)"><img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/images/smilies/thumbsup.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title=":up:">
 

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<div class="quote-container"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by <strong>Lucine</strong> <a href="/forum/post/0"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style=""></a><br><br>
Yeah! If you can't see it, it aint there right?<br><br>
Out of sight out of mind... =)</div>
</div>
<br><br><br>
As I pour gravy over my turkey???
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
I always check for Gelatin , but since I found out there's way more than this to look out for I ( There's even more than the ones I listed ) I wondered what is the real defenition of a vegetarian so if I read your answer well Isowish a vegetarian by defenition not only does not est meat but any other sources from animals except Diary and eggs am I right ?
 

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<div class="quote-container"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by <strong>Sirene</strong> <a href="/forum/post/0"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style=""></a><br><br>
I always check for Gelatin , but since I found out there's way more than this to look out for I ( There's even more than the ones I listed ) I wondered what is the real defenition of a vegetarian so if I read your answer well Isowish a vegetarian by defenition not only does not est meat but any other sources from animals except Diary and eggs am I right ?</div>
</div>
<br>
a vegetarian will not eat meat or anything derived from meat.<br><br>
and lacto-ovo vegetarians may eat any products from animals that are not the animal's body itself, i.e. eggs and dairy.<br><br>
was that your question? <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/images/smilies/undecided.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title=":-/">
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Okay thanks for answering Froofythefrog,<br><br><br><br><br><br>
I have a list of things to check out is there more ?<br><br><b><br><br>
Albumin is the protein in eggs – specifically, egg whites. It’s often used as<br><br>
a thickeneing agent.<br><br><br><br>
Anchovies, those tiny, salty fish that you pick off your pizza, are an<br><br>
ingredient in Caesar salad dressing and Worcestershire sauce.<br><br><br><br>
Animal fats like butter, lard and suet are used to make packaged crackers<br><br>
and cookies, as well as frozen pie crusts, refried beans and flour tortillas.<br><br><br><br>
Casein, also listed as caseinate, is a milk protein added to cheese<br><br>
products and can even be found in some soy cheese.<br><br><br><br>
Gelatin, used to thicken processed foods, is usually of animal origin, the<br><br>
product from boiling down bones and cartilage. It’s found in gelatin<br><br>
desserts, yogurt, candies and sugar-coated cereals.<br><br><br><br>
Glucose and dextrose, both simple sugars, can be derived from fruit but<br><br>
often comes from animal tissues and fluids. It’s an ingredient in many soft<br><br>
drinks, baked goods, candies and commercial frostings.<br><br><br><br>
Glycerides – listed as monoglycerides, diglycerides or triglycerides, can be<br><br>
derived from either animal fats or from plant sources. They’re found in a<br><br>
staggering number of products, from processed foods and cosmetics to<br><br>
hand lotion, ink, glue and antifreeze.<br><br><br><br>
Isinglass, a gelatin made from the air bladders of freshwater fish, is used<br><br>
as a clarifying agent in some gelatin-based desserts and alcoholic<br><br>
beverages.<br><br><br><br>
Lactic acid is a milk-based bacteria used in cheese, yogurt, candies, jams<br><br>
and jellies, frozen treats and processed vegetables like pickles, olives and<br><br>
sauerkraut.<br><br><br><br>
Lactose, sometimes listed as D-lactose or saccharum lactin, is the sugar<br><br>
forund in milk. It’s used as a sweetener in candies, over-the-counter<br><br>
medications, laxatives and baby formula, and as a culture medium in<br><br>
yogurts and sour cream.<br><br><br><br>
Lanolin is the fat in sheep’s wool, and it’s present in a wide range of<br><br>
cosmetics and lotions, as well as chewing gum and fabric treatments.<br><br><br><br>
Lecithin, a necessary nutrient, is derived from both plant and animal<br><br>
sources, but is most often derived from egg yolks. You’ll see it in many<br><br>
products, including processed breakfast foods, margarine, baked goods,<br><br>
vegetable oil sprays and chocolate.<br><br><br><br>
Lutein, a yellow coloring agent, is made from either plant sources<br><br>
(marigolds) or animal sources (egg yolks) and is used to color a wide range<br><br>
of foods.<br><br><br><br>
Oleinic acid, derived from sheep and cattle fat, is used in butter<br><br>
substitutes, cheese, vegetable oils, baked goods, candies, ice cream and<br><br>
beverages, as well as cosmetics and soap.<br><br>
Pepsin, an enzyme from pig’s stomachs, is used to make cheese.<br><br><br><br>
Stearic acid, also listed as octadecanoic acid, is derived from animal fat,<br><br>
and is found in countless processed foods including baked goods, chewing<br><br>
gum, beverages, artificial vanilla flavoring, cosmetics and the outer coating<br><br>
of pills.<br><br><br><br>
Tallow, the waxy solid fat from sheep and cattle, is an ingredient in waxed<br><br>
paper, soap, margarine, crayons and candles.<br><br><br><br>
Vitamin A, also listed as retinol, can be derived from plant sources or from<br><br>
cod liver oil or egg yolks, and is used to fortify foods as well as being old as<br><br>
a supplement on its own. It’s also sometimes found in cosmetics.<br><br><br><br>
Vitamin B12, another popular supplement, can be made from animal<br><br>
sources or synthesized. The synthetic version is vegan – look for<br><br>
“cobalymin” on the label.<br><br><br><br>
Vitamin D comes in several forms, and is used as a fortifying supplement,<br><br>
and it appears in different forms. Vitamin D2, also listed as ergocalciferol, is<br><br>
derived from plant sources or yeast; Vitamin D3, also identified as<br><br>
cholecalciferol, is made from cod liver oil or lanolin.<br><br><br><br>
Whey, the liquid that’s separated from milk solids when making cheese,<br><br>
can be found in many processed foods, especially baked goods.</b>
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
<div class="quote-container"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by <strong>isowish</strong> <a href="/forum/post/0"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style=""></a><br><br>
a vegetarian will not eat meat or anything derived from meat.<br><br>
and lacto-ovo vegetarians may eat any products from animals that are not the animal's body itself, i.e. eggs and dairy.<br><br>
was that your question? <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/images/smilies/undecided.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title=":-/"></div>
</div>
<br><br><br><br><br>
Well I posted a list in my post above , what in there ( Or is there more ) would not be considered vegetarian ?
 

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I just had to say how helpful this thread is-- nice work on the list! I keep an Animal Ingredients book in my purse for reference when I go grocery shopping. I picked it up here:<a href="http://www.cosmosveganshoppe.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=AIAZ&Category_Code=" target="_blank">http://www.cosmosveganshoppe.com/Mer...Category_Code=</a>
 

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Ah.... Are you talking about vegetarian or vegan? Back when I was vegetarian, I would have consumed:<br><br><br><br>
albumen<br><br>
butter (comes from milk) but not lard or tallow (the actual fat of an animal)<br><br>
casein<br><br>
I am kind of scratching my head on whether it'd really be easier to obtain glucose and dextrose from animal tissue. Maybe someone who knows about manufacturing processes can answer this.<br><br>
Lactic Acid is hardly ever milk-derived now.<br><br>
Lanolin<br><br>
Lutein<br><br>
Eat beta carotene and your body will produce vitamin A from it.<br><br>
Most B12 is synthetic and it's absolutely necessary to consume.<br><br>
Vitamin D can be obtained by spending time out in the sun.<br><br>
whey.<br><br><br><br>
As a vegan, I either don't consume most items on your list or the ones that are possibly derived from plant sources, I will eat them if the ingredients list says "From plant sources." I take B12 supplements that are not animal-derived.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Okay, so really by definition a vegetarian can or cannot eat these ?<br><br><br><br>
This is where I'm lost I of course want to do more research and check for these but I really want to know am I really a vegetarian if I have any of these ?<br><br><br><br>
What are the ones that fit in the official description of a vegetarian and what are the ones that are not and is there more to this list ?<br><br><br><br>
Thanks
 

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Well since most foods we buy from the store have some sort of animal product mixed in that is not on the label (bugs, feces, hairs, etc. from the processing) or stuck to the surface of the food (like our produce) or in our food or killed during the harvesting of our food, then I'm not sure how technical we need to be.<br><br><br><br>
I think there is room for leeway. My mom bought me some lipgloss with some carmine in it and I'm going to use it. Am I still a vegetarian? If not, I want out of this club.
 

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Hmmm.... If you try to memorize lists, vegetarianism will seem difficult. A better approach is to educate yourself about where your food comes from.<br><br><br><br>
There are actually very many types of vegetarians:<br><br><br><br>
A lacto-ovo vegetarian is a vegetarian who eats plant products as well as products that are derived from eggs or milk. Generally, this type of vegetarian will consume any animal product that does not involve the death of an animal. (Are you with me so far?)<br><br><br><br>
A lacto vegetarian consumes plant and milk products but not egg products.<br><br><br><br>
A ovo vegetarian consumes plant and egg products but not milk products.<br><br><br><br>
A strict vegetarian only consumes plant products and avoids eating animal products.<br><br><br><br>
A vegan is a strict vegetarian who eliminates to whatever extent is possible the use of animal products in their life. In addition to not eating animal products, they also avoid wearing leather and wool, and will not buy products -- such as shampoos -- that contain animal ingredients or have been tested on animals.
 

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<div class="quote-container"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by <strong>Thalia</strong> <a href="/forum/post/0"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style=""></a><br><br>
Well since most foods we buy from the store have some sort of animal product mixed in that is not on the label (bugs, feces, hairs, etc. from the processing) or stuck to the surface of the food (like our produce) or in our food or killed during the harvesting of our food, then I'm not sure how technical we need to be.</div>
</div>
<br><br><br>
I go by whether the ingredient was deliberately put into the product. Ie., a burrito I eat might contain a speck of cheese in it due to cross-contanimation. However, I did not order cheese, therefore creating a demand for it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
<div class="quote-container"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by <strong>froggythefrog</strong> <a href="/forum/post/0"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style=""></a><br><br><br><br><br>
A lacto-ovo vegetarian is a vegetarian who eats plant products as well as products that are derived from eggs or milk. Generally, this type of vegetarian will consume any animal product that does not involve the death of an animal. (Are you with me so far?)<br><br><br></div>
</div>
<br><br><br><br><br>
I'm with you <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/images/smilies/smiley.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title=":)"><br><br><br><br>
Makes perfect sense, now I will try to find out what in the list involves the death of an animal so that avoid these at all times<br><br><br><br>
Thanks very much for your help <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/images/smilies/iloveyou.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title=":lovesign:">
 

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I would say yes, simply because it doesn't make sense to me to religiously avoid any trace of gelatin and other said derivatives, yet continue to consume dairy and eggs. It just seems like that is more about meeting a definition than about significantly reducing cruelty or increasing health or whatever your reasons <i>are</i> for being vegetarian. and at that point it would kinda make more sense to just turn vegan rather than avoid cheese with rennet, for example (as I realized in the grocery store the other day!) I myself use the rule of "how much harm and how much of a difference does it make?" I'd rather just live out my life free of meat without worrying if I fit into someone's definition of what a vegetarian is. It seems every month or so I am hearing about some new obscure ingredient that I suddenly have to avoid or I won't be vegetarian enough.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
^ Yes but I really wanted to know if I can tell people I'm a vegetarian or simply a person who does not eat meat ( I also avoid since day one gelatin and rennet, but I'm completely new about the other ones ), I mean to my familly my coworkers, friends... if I was still having some of these "ingredients" and it seems like not when you read Froggythefrog's post<br><br><br><br><i>A lacto-ovo vegetarian is a vegetarian who eats plant products as well as products that are derived from eggs or milk. Generally, this type of vegetarian will consume any animal product that does not involve the death of an animal</i><br><br><br><br>
Just this week I avoided by checking the ingredients, a type of gum, Kraft Dinner, Marshmallows and Jello.<br><br><br><br>
About Rennet, when I went to the grocery store I checked many many brands and sorts of cheese and I found 2 on about 20 that had animal rennet in them ( I live in Canada )<br><br><br><br>
I think we need a clear list of what vegetarians are not supposed to eat if they want to call themselves vegetarians.
 

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We do have clear lists. You will find quite a number around this site. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/images/smilies/smiley.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title=":)"><br><br><br><br>
Basically, if it comes from an animal in any way, shape or form it is not vegan.<br><br><br><br>
If it is a product that directly involves the death of an animal, being a former part of that animal, (and yes, that does include rennet, gelatine and carmine) then it is not vegetarian.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
^<br><br><br><br>
Okay so really a vegetarian who eats carmine, rennet or gelatine <b>cannot tell anyone</b> he is a vegetarian is that correct ?<br><br><br><br>
That's what I really want to know and I also want to know what are the other things besides carmine, rennet or gelatine that should not be consumed by any vegetarian.<br><br><br><br>
Do you have links to the list ?<br><br><br><br>
Oh and how come one can call himself a vegetarian if he wears leather but not if he eats gelatine ?<br><br><br><br>
I really want to know my stuff<br><br><br><br>
Thanks <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/images/smilies/smiley.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title=":)">
 
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