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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hello all. Lately, I've been experiencing something that is really upsetting. To be completely honest, I started being vegan strictly because of the dietary benefits. I mean, I've never been the biggest animal lover. Not to say that I dislike animals just never gave them much passing thought.<br><br>
I've been vegan for about a month and a half I think and this entire experience has changed my view completely on animals and the world around me. I watched earthlings for the first time last night and needless to say I cried like a child. I never want to go back to eating anything from an animal again and for the reasons I thought I wouldn't ever adopt. Now, this is not the upsetting thing that I mentioned in the beginning.<br><br>
My favorite person in the world is my dad. We've been super close my entire life. Now, that I've starting being vegan though he makes comments like "You're being brained-washed" or saying that this whole thing is stupid or even cult-like on occasion. Please do not think ill of my father because he does agree with me on some things. Like I showed him some snipits of Earthlings and he agreed that they were not right. And he is very caring of animals. Moreso than I ever used to be even. He grew up on a farm when he was younger and says that his family always made sure that things were humane at all times. But, there are some things he just can't seem to get over.<br><br>
Like, when I was younger we used to go coon huntin. Me and him had a spirited conversation about how that's how we used to make money when I was younger and how around here the coon population is crazy large and destroys crops if you don't hunt them. I guess, I just don't know how to respond to him when he says things like this. I'm a new vegan and some of things he says I do agree with him. This leaves me speechless and I wish I knew how to counteract he says.<br><br>
Wow, this got real long real fast. lol Sorry, yall. I guess, what I'm saying is my dad and I have always agreed on everything and now it's difficult to talk about this subject that I suddenly feel very passionately about. This sort applies to all my friends though. They aren't taking the change very well. That results in some jesting by all. I realize they just need some time to get used to it and will eventually settle down but, how did yall deal with this transition period? Thanks for taking the time to read this gargantuan novel post. I appreciate it. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/images/smilies/smiley.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title=":)"><br><br>
(And as mentioned before if you feel the need to say something very ill of my dad, would you please keep it to yourself. I would be very grateful :) )
 

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Welcome to the world of vegan living <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/images/smilies/smiley.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title=":)"><br><br>
This phenomenon you're describing is not unique to veganism. Any activity that we habitually engage in tends to come with some psychological baggage. For people who regularly eat animals or their secretions it becomes necessary to refrain from building strong emotional attachments to animals or to recognize their suffering. it's completely natural and normal to do that, and in fact in the case of our ancestors it was likely necessary for survival.<br><br>
So when you shed that action then you also shed the psychological defenses that enabled the action, thus you tend to become more able to empathize with others as well as be more honest with yourself about what hurts.<br><br>
I'm sorry you're feeling pain at this time. Please know that if you continue to stay veg and if you engage in some activism then these feelings will tend to diminish because you will be filled with positive hope for future social change as well as the knowledge that you are no longer a part of the problem.<br><br>
Again, congratulations!
 

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Your father knows now how you feel about animal suffering and not wanting to support it. It might be helpful for the way you two get along if now you focus more on the health aspects of why you follow a vegan diet. This would resonate especially well if there are cardiac issues, obesity or diabetes in your family (like in nearly every family!) and he gets that you're trying to head them off before they become <i>your</i> problem. If you and he watch "The Last Heart Attack" or "Forks Over Knives" together, he might not worry as much that you've been brainwashed by some loony cult.
 

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Your dad sounds like mine was, sort of. My family didn't hunt, and for the most part we cared about animals, but we did fish (I think that's why I was pescetarian for a few years before I became full vegetarian). Dad had a huge collection of magazines like "Field & Stream", "Outdoor Life", and "Sports Afield", and he did buy into the argument that wildlife needs to be controlled through hunting.<br><br>
Few people I have known are really nasty about my vegetarianism, and when they are, I just dump them. Unfortunately, although my friends and family accept my vegetarianism/near-veganism, they haven't embraced it themselves. I hope you have better luck!!!<br><br>
Now, about hunting for population control of wildlife:<br><br>
Although it's true that deer, rabbits, raccoons, etc. might not overpopulate if humans hadn't killed off their original predators like wolves and bobcats, I'm not so sure they're really any worse off now that humans are hunting them instead, seeing as they'd be dead either way. You could point out that many states raise pheasants and trout (for example) to be released into the wild, so that humans can hunt them... and that deer were managed in such a way to provide a maximum "crop" to be "harvested" during the hunting season. Even if wildlife populations did cause problems for humans, they could have been managed with somewhat less killing. People hunt because they enjoy it- not to provide some sort of service.<br><br>
Oh- about being "brain-washed"... so long as you back up what you say, that will prove you're thinking for yourself and doing this because you want to.
 

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<div class="quote-container"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by <strong>Kaylaxmae</strong> <a href="/forum/post/0"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style=""></a><br><br>
I'm a new vegan and some of things he says I do agree with him. This leaves me speechless and I wish I knew how to counteract he says.</div>
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Why would you want to counteract what he says if you agree with it? <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/images/smilies/huh.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title=":confused:"><br><br>
The world is not black and white, you can believe in some or most vegan ideals without believing in all of them. I have to say forget the label "vegan" and just go with what you believe is right on a case by case basis.
 

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Have you thought about seeing if there are any local vegan meet-up groups? That helped me a lot to have a group of people that feel the same way as I do about animals.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
I dont necessarily live in a small town but, in regards to anything vegan-friendly I might as well live in nomansland. The closest things are all in Columbus or Cleveland and both are at least a 3 hour drives from me. I'm gonna try and make a trip to either and stock up on all the delish vegan things I keep hearing about but have no chance of getting around here. So, maybe I can see if I can coordinate that with what you're talking about. I :)
 

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it's not at all unusual to be accused of being brainwashed or being called cult-like....I've had both happen to me too.
 

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<div class="quote-container"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by <strong>Photojess</strong> <a href="/forum/post/3015003"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style=""></a><br><br>
it's not at all unusual to be accused of being brainwashed or being called cult-like....I've had both happen to me too.</div>
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Heh, me, too. I was told I was "drinking the Kook-Aid." If living compassionately is "drinking the Kool-Aid," then I'm happy to guzzle freely. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/images/smilies/smiley.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title=":)">.<br><br>
To the OP, I understand how you feel. It's not easy for others to embrace change, especially when they see it as "drastic" or "extreme." My parents, whom I love dearly, and I don't always agree on things, either, but it doesn't lessen my love for them, and I'm sure your dad doesn't love you any less. It will just take time for him to adjust. My mom was rather unsupportive at first when I went vegan, but she has come around and has even stopped eating some meats and other animal products. Never thought I would see that happen <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/images/smilies/smiley.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title=":)">.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
My mother is like super stoked but I think its because she's always wanted me to lose my bit of pudge. I'm the only "fatty" in my family of skinny people lol<img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/images/smilies/tongue3.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title=":p"> So I think she would like to see the veganism do that. And my dad quite honestly isn't "opposed" he likes to make fun of me and he does certainly disagree. But we'll see what happens I guess lol
 

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Lol Kaylaxmae, Earthlings turned my world upside down too!!!! At least your mom is somewhat supportive. I would say, concentrate on what you have in common with your dad. Let go of trying to talk about the trickier issues until you feel more comfortable/educated in those matters. If you don't like it when your dad makes fun of you, you need to tell him in a serious way. It sounds like you two are close. So I think if you sit down with him and tell him how it hurts your feelings, he will respect that.<br>
Good luck!
 

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<div class="quote-container"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by <strong>Kaylaxmae</strong> <a href="/forum/post/3013961"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style=""></a><br><br>
Like, when I was younger we used to go coon huntin. Me and him had a spirited conversation about how that's how we used to make money when I was younger and how around here the coon population is crazy large and destroys crops if you don't hunt them. I guess, I just don't know how to respond to him when he says things like this. I'm a new vegan and some of things he says I do agree with him. This leaves me speechless and I wish I knew how to counteract he says.</div>
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This one is actualy easy ..<br><br>
The overpopulation of thing like deer and coons (coons? Oh deer!) is largely a human caused problem.<br><br>
The two major factors are;<br><br>
1. Habitat and thus natural food resource loss.<br><br>
2. Extermination of all major predators.<br><br>
Both are directly linked to the human populations insistent on raising vast unnatural flocks and herds so as humans can eat vast and unnaturaly sustainable quantities of meat.<br><br>
A meat eating population (at USA/Western) levels requires around ten times the crop cultivation (for animal feed) that the same population of vegans would.<br><br>
Roughly 90% of all habitat loss, and 90% of conflict twix wildlife and humans that results, can therefore be attributed to meat eaters.<br><br>
A vegan population would only have conflict with natural predators that present a direct threat to humans and the '90% less conflict' rule, above, still applies.<br><br>
Meat eaters have conflict with any natural predator that is a threat to anything from the size of about a chicken upwards.<br><br>
Combine the two factors (habitat loss and predator extermination) and you have a pretty fair argument that without meat eaters predator and prey would self regulate in the way they did for the ten zillion odd years (2-3 days for creationist, ofc) before animal farming humans evolved.<br><br>
For a meat eater to claim to be the 'cure' to the ills of animal overpopulation is on a par with glaziers going around throwing bricks through peoples windows and then saying "look at all these broken windows! Without us what would all these poor unfortunate people do?"
 

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<div class="quote-container"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by <strong>Clueless Git</strong> <a href="/forum/post/3018625"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style=""></a><br><br>
This one is actualy easy ..<br><br>
The overpopulation of thing like deer and coons (coons? Oh deer!) is largely a human caused problem.<br><br>
The two major factors are;<br><br>
1. Habitat and thus natural food resource loss.<br><br>
2. Extermination of all major predators.<br><br>
Both are directly linked to the human populations insistent on raising vast unnatural flocks and herds so as humans can eat vast and unnaturaly sustainable quantities of meat.<br><br>
A meat eating population (at USA/Western) levels requires around ten times the crop cultivation (for animal feed) that the same population of vegans would.<br><br>
Roughly 90% of all habitat loss, and 90% of conflict twix wildlife and humans that results, can therefore be attributed to meat eaters.<br><br>
A vegan population would only have conflict with natural predators that present a direct threat to humans and the '90% less conflict' rule, above, still applies.<br><br>
Meat eaters have conflict with any natural predator that is a threat to anything from the size of about a chicken upwards.<br><br>
Combine the two factors (habitat loss and predator extermination) and you have a pretty fair argument that without meat eaters predator and prey would self regulate in the way they did for the ten zillion odd years (2-3 days for creationist, ofc) before animal farming humans evolved.<br><br>
For a meat eater to claim to be the 'cure' to the ills of animal overpopulation is on a par with glaziers going around throwing bricks through peoples windows and then saying "look at all these broken windows! Without us what would all these poor unfortunate people do?"</div>
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Spot on.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Thank you for all the help everyone and btw coons are Racoons lol <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/images/smilies/wink3.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title=";)">
 
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