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Discussion Starter #1
here is something i do not understand...vegans are against killing/abusing animals, so they don't eat meat. however, what about all of the animals that are killed incidentally during farming and stuff, such as field mice that get run over and stuff?
 

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better they are killed accidently then bred, raised and killed for our use. they atleast had the choice to be in the wrong spot and the wrong time.
 

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I don't like either, but you gotta start somewhere. I doubt farmers would seriously set up expensive methods of preventing these accidental casualties if the food they are raising is being fed to animals who are being purposely killed.<br><br><br><br>
I feel that diet is something we all have an easy choice in every day. It is something easily at hand, something we can use to get people started thinking about animals. As veg*nism spreads, so will concern for animals, and hopefully better plant farming methods.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
I think that buying locally grown organic produce from small growers helps because they harvest by hand not by big machines. Which give the small animals a chance to scurry away. Also accidental killing is a far cry from murder on purpose.
 

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<div class="quote-container"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block"><i>Originally posted by majake</i><br><br><b>they atleast had the choice to be in the wrong spot and the wrong time.</b></div>
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much like hunting wouldn't you say?
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Well, if the factory farmed animals are being fed crops then that's a heck of a lot more animals being killed (the ones in the field and the ones in the factory) then if just the crops were being used. Remember, feeding animals crops is a very inefficient way of making use of food so we probably wouldn't need to grow more crops if everyone went veg.<br><br><br><br>
Also, the animals in the field did not spend their entire life in a prison sell only to be driven in miserable conditions to the murder house.<br><br><br><br>
Just my thoughts.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
but, if u KNOW that at least one animal will die in harvesting, isn't that the same thing as murdering it?
 

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Isn't this the exact same topic/question that you previously posted under the title "animal rights--quick answer needed" a few months ago?<br><br><br><br>
Anyways, that's where my response to this question is.
 

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Birds, squirrels, deer, etc. get ran over by cars all the time. Well birds more likely do. But it is not something that you have the power to change. So my point is that is not something you can help.
 

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We could all shrivel up and die because we don't want to run the risk of accidentally stepping on a bug, running over a squirrel, or whatever, but I'm also interested in my quality of life. Constant worry over things I can't control doesn't make me a very happy person.
 

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actually, a particular sect of hinduism (jainists, i believe) typically do pay strict attention to things like stepping on bugs. so much so that many walk around gently sweeping the ground in front of them to be sure that any insects are removed from their path and wearing veils over their faces to avoid accidentally inhalation of living beings!<br><br><br><br><a href="http://altreligion.about.com/library/faqs/bl_jainism.htm" target="_blank">http://altreligion.about.com/library...bl_jainism.htm</a>
 

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Yes, I've heard about the Jainists. While I admire their dedication and commitment, I don't think I could ever go that far.
 

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Jainism is just plain nutty.<br><br><br><br>
Carbonwafer - your point is valid, I think, but I have to say that no movement is realistic in its goals without some amount of pragmatism. I mean, we can take this thing to an obsurd end and all become Jainist, but how productive can we be when we need three people walking in front of us to sweep away mites (and btw, who sweeps the mites away from those sweeping for us??)<br><br><br><br>
I say you pick your battles and do the best you can. There's no absolute state where one can no <i>somehow</i> effect ones surroundings. The key, I believe, is do as much good as you can, so all the inherent bad you do is at least balanced out to an equalibrium.
 

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"I think that buying locally grown organic produce from small growers helps because they harvest by hand not by big machines."<br><br><br><br>
What about locally grown non-organic produce? And some organic produce is justa as "big business" as non-organic. And much of what passes for "locally grown organic" is not really organic. They use pesticides and chemical fertilizers, add a few organic touches, and call it "organic."
 

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MaxPower writes:<br><br>
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I say you pick your battles and do the best you can.<br><br>
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Yup.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
some people point out to me "plants are alive too but you kill them". everyone has to draw a line somewhere though.
 

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<div class="quote-container"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block"><i>Originally posted by Kitzy</i><br><br><b>some people point out to me "plants are alive too but you kill them". everyone has to draw a line somewhere though.</b></div>
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Imho these kind of statements are just used to make your "statement" on veganism "rediculous".<br><br><br><br>
It's a often used strategy within the Cognitive Disonance reaction.
 
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