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  Topic Review (Newest First)
08-26-2015 03:34 PM
silva Well designed cities could be ideal for most people. To be self contained for work, and home and everything else within walking distance, and bus/trains for trips out. Surrounded by parks, museums, schools and nature. Leave the countrysides for farming folk and plow down the suburbs and leave them to grow back into woods so the animals they poison can take back what is theres
I love the country- I prefer living in the city. I love the automity, the walkability, to be friendly towards my neighbors without having to feel a need to be friends.
I hate the suburbs with a passion. I abhor people who think they deserve to have a house built just for them, and complain of the animals eating their pricey plants. With their polluting lanscape equiment trying to manicure acres of land that's 'all theirs'. Driving hours every day just for the luxury of living their dream. Buying new and trashing old without thinking to see whos in need. Food spoiling every week tightly wrapped in plastic so they don't have to be faced with their sloth
08-26-2015 08:36 AM
Hawx79 The only good thing about cities are the hot chicks to be found there.
08-26-2015 06:55 AM
Linky Cities...huh. Well, I personally don't HATE cities, I've just grown tired of living in one. Everyday dealing with the same old same old. I live in the ghetto of Brooklyn, NY, so dealing with the local Hoodlums as well as the lovely city folk on a daily basis is just grand (eyeroll). The trains are also apart of my lovely routine and I dread every lovely trip.

The whole "Sights and sounds" of the city also get on my nerves. Too many people, too much noise.

Being a loner by nature I can't get my "Recharge" time while in the city, so I usually bike all the way upstate just for some me time. Nothing like finding a nice spot in the woods and just relaxing. ~_~

Anyway, I don't like cities anymore. Been living here since I was born and I can't wait to get out.
08-26-2015 04:06 AM
mrgrimm When viewed from space a city looks like a large canker sore on a large lush living ball. Zoom in and you can see the parasites all over the ball, but cities are the worst because it's an infectious concentration of the parasites!

Just my opinion of course, but rational. Have a fantastic human day!
08-26-2015 01:36 AM
no whey jose
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vegman View Post
well said! it is like a prison. as Veg*ans we claim to be more connected with nature. instead so many of us have the misfortune of being completely separated from it. we are evolving too fast. we dont NEED modern technology. if electronics were never invented we would be better off as a whole. so many lives have been saved and helped by modern science but so many more have been ruined as the cost. if people where happy with what they have then most of the world would still be plowing fields every day and living with there hands in the soil. and we would all be better for that . as Thomas jefferson once said~ "Agriculture... is our wisest pursuit, because it will in the end contribute most to real wealth, good morals and happiness."
I certainly don't claim to be "more connected with nature," whatever that means! I also think it's impossible to determine whether technology has improved more lives than it's hurt, but I would venture that it has. Something isn't good just because it's natural.
08-25-2015 08:14 PM
Vegman
Quote:
Originally Posted by Meiyah View Post
I hate cities too. To me they're like open-sky warehouse, you're trapped between endless walls, you cannot see the sky in front of you, you have to raise your head very high to see it, it's grey and dirty all around, you don't walk on earth, there are no flowers, no grass, and very few trees, no wild animals, few insects. At least there are birds, they are the friendliest people I met when I studied in Paris. But in Paris it was a heartbreak to see pigeons because very often they were missing claws, or had other wounds because, I think, city employees threw nets on them at night to catch and kill them but some fought to escape.
When I walk in nature I receive good vibes, it's as if nature was perspiring serenity, in cities there is none of that the only thing that is perspiring is the evilness and selfishness of its inhabitants.
I love watching stars in a dark blue sky at night, in Paris it was not possible, there are no stars there, the sky always was a heavy blurry milky orange and it was impossible to see any star.

I am totally confused as to how anyone can like living in town. I agree with the person who talked about New-York city, it is sooo ugly, a real monstruosity, you need a telescope to just see the sky. People who live in cities like that spend their life not living a life, it's like living in prison. I used to laugh at people saying Paris was the prettiest town of the world, thinking this idea was copletely absurd but after seeing New-York on TV I realized that indeed Paris was not that bad, still I'd go for least ugly myself and only counting huge cities.

One thing that shocked me is when I came back home (in the country) in train, and I looked at the fields by the window, my eyes were blinded by their colors who appeared so vivid... my eyes were no longer used to colors. That was sad like that.

One strange thing about people who live in cities is you'd think they do beacuse they like the company of others but no they are just not even able to tell you what their neighbor's name is and are very nasty to each others.
well said! it is like a prison. as Veg*ans we claim to be more connected with nature. instead so many of us have the misfortune of being completely separated from it. we are evolving too fast. we dont NEED modern technology. if electronics were never invented we would be better off as a whole. so many lives have been saved and helped by modern science but so many more have been ruined as the cost. if people where happy with what they have then most of the world would still be plowing fields every day and living with there hands in the soil. and we would all be better for that . as Thomas jefferson once said~ "Agriculture... is our wisest pursuit, because it will in the end contribute most to real wealth, good morals and happiness."
08-04-2015 12:55 PM
Dogma
Quote:
People ignore you even if you’re in trouble.
Headphones on, eyes forward: If you're in trouble, you won't get any help from me unless it's important enough to tap me on the shoulder or run in front of me. Otherwise 99% of the time, people want money, cigarettes, or worst of all, to strike up that instantly suspicious casual conversation that always goes bad.

"Hey, how's it going?"

"Yo, what's up?"

"Good, good, how've you been this fine evening?"

"What do you want?"

"Ah! Look at this joker *ghost nudge (physical contact may instigate a fight)* all business now! AHHH! Well, you see I need a couple dollars to take the bus home and I was wondering if you were in need of a wallet? I've got this wallet right? Great condition, genuine leather, holds all your cards, cash, and coins, won't tear on ya."

"I'm not interested."

"Look, see this wallet will last you forever!"

"I'm sorry, I'm really not interested, I don't even carry cash on me."

"Oh, well can I buy a smoke?"

( O_O)



To be fair though, you might also get the funny guy with the notebook who just wants to regale you with his "journey" of the past 3 days which manages to include drugs, his escape from custody, and his attempts to unmask a government conspiracy.

"Man, it was quite a journey. I'm on my way home now, I'll go to the police station tomorrow morning with that information, but now I've told you. You're only the third person I told this story to all night! And now I'm gonna write you down so that I'll remember that you were part of my grand journey too. I hope you have a wonderful evening."
06-20-2015 09:09 AM
vefo
Quote:
Originally Posted by ilikekale View Post
I'm with you all the way. The ultimate "NO" is New York City. I keep hearing NYC is the ultimate place to live. It has EVERYTHING. Not for me. I can't even stand to drive through the place on my way to somewhere else.

No offense to anyone who likes such things but give me land and good health to be able to raise healthful food on it and I'm happy. You can keep all that other stuff. I could almost see wanting to be "near" some amount of shopping back before the internet, but these days you can have anything you need delivered right to your door.

Country is best. Suburbs can be okay. But cities, no thank you.

Ken
No offence taken. my life has been spent regional/coastal/isolated and having just got back from NYC, the variety, diversity, vibrancy, was awesome. Choice of food, activity,new stuff,different stuff really attracted me to city life.

Each to their own though, and the variables are endless for each individual but the mundaneness of country life can be stifling.
06-17-2015 04:35 PM
Meiyah I hate cities too. To me they're like open-sky warehouse, you're trapped between endless walls, you cannot see the sky in front of you, you have to raise your head very high to see it, it's grey and dirty all around, you don't walk on earth, there are no flowers, no grass, and very few trees, no wild animals, few insects. At least there are birds, they are the friendliest people I met when I studied in Paris. But in Paris it was a heartbreak to see pigeons because very often they were missing claws, or had other wounds because, I think, city employees threw nets on them at night to catch and kill them but some fought to escape.
When I walk in nature I receive good vibes, it's as if nature was perspiring serenity, in cities there is none of that the only thing that is perspiring is the evilness and selfishness of its inhabitants.
I love watching stars in a dark blue sky at night, in Paris it was not possible, there are no stars there, the sky always was a heavy blurry milky orange and it was impossible to see any star.

I am totally confused as to how anyone can like living in town. I agree with the person who talked about New-York city, it is sooo ugly, a real monstruosity, you need a telescope to just see the sky. People who live in cities like that spend their life not living a life, it's like living in prison. I used to laugh at people saying Paris was the prettiest town of the world, thinking this idea was copletely absurd but after seeing New-York on TV I realized that indeed Paris was not that bad, still I'd go for least ugly myself and only counting huge cities.

One thing that shocked me is when I came back home (in the country) in train, and I looked at the fields by the window, my eyes were blinded by their colors who appeared so vivid... my eyes were no longer used to colors. That was sad like that.

One strange thing about people who live in cities is you'd think they do beacuse they like the company of others but no they are just not even able to tell you what their neighbor's name is and are very nasty to each others.
02-09-2014 03:21 AM
Naturebound
Quote:
Originally Posted by lavender phase View Post

I live in the country and it is very beautiful however I live far from town and I do not drive and weather permitting I ride my bicycle everywhere .... I live near farms and the deers and snow bunnys leave prints in the snow before any human does Lol smiley.gif however, I will be getting my taste of city life in the fall .... When I begin college in the big apple .... I'm excited and honestly looking forward to it .... Will I get home sick ?probably, but I really won't know for sure till I leave ....

I go snowshoeing off in the woods out in the country sometimes, and it is truly amazing how many different animal tracks are all over everywhere.  It opens your eyes to all the animals that live in the country and around us without us otherwise being aware.  

 

Best wishes with school in the Fall!  Sounds exciting!

02-08-2014 11:59 PM
lavender phase I live in the country and it is very beautiful however I live far from town and I do not drive and weather permitting I ride my bicycle everywhere .... I live near farms and the deers and snow bunnys leave prints in the snow before any human does Lol smiley.gif however, I will be getting my taste of city life in the fall .... When I begin college in the big apple .... I'm excited and honestly looking forward to it .... Will I get home sick ?probably, but I really won't know for sure till I leave ....
02-08-2014 02:17 PM
Vegman
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beautiful Joe View Post
 

I grew up in the country and don't recall being bored. In fact, in my entire life, I've only been bored when I have been in situations where I had to appear as though I was paying attention to something or someone who didn't interest me. I've never been bored when left to my own devices. Imagination, an interest in one's surroundings, thought - there's nothing more needed to avoid boredom.

 

Exactly! I never get bored when i'm on my own. Only simple minds get bored.

 

As for kenickie question about “Do you not listen to music? Or see movies? Or buy books?” of course I do. I can get any music, movie or book I want, it’s called online shopping and mail order! Sometimes its here within two days. Just last months I bought a Richard Wagner box set, a book about eating Raw and a few DVD’s. and last year we got our freezer sent to us by freight which cost us bugger all. And all my organic Heirloom vegetable seeds come via the mail as well. Country living can be great but I know it’s not for everyone, some people just can't cope with living in the country, and some people (like me) can’t cope with living in a residential area, and some people like both. i stand by my statement, i hate the city and the country fits me like a glove.

 

to Quote a favourite book of mine:

  "The city is anti-agriculture; is built on arable land, and trees are uprooted for its construction. It tempts peasants to leave the land and become lazy beggars on its sidewalks. At the same time, the city devours agricultural production and demands more and more of it, although this agricultural production requires land and peasants from outside the city."

 

EDIT: just realised that @ILIKEKALE just mentioned getting things via mail, nice to know we are on the same wavelength. :)

02-08-2014 01:04 PM
ilikekale I'm with you all the way. The ultimate "NO" is New York City. I keep hearing NYC is the ultimate place to live. It has EVERYTHING. Not for me. I can't even stand to drive through the place on my way to somewhere else. wink3.gif

No offense to anyone who likes such things but give me land and good health to be able to raise healthful food on it and I'm happy. You can keep all that other stuff. I could almost see wanting to be "near" some amount of shopping back before the internet, but these days you can have anything you need delivered right to your door.

Country is best. Suburbs can be okay. But cities, no thank you.

Ken
02-08-2014 12:59 PM
beanspud
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenickie View Post


totally forgot this was VB for a second.
sad.gif
02-08-2014 12:54 PM
Kenickie
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenickie View Post
 " why i hate cities" just sounds sooooooo dumb and elitist and privileged and self promoting. 

 

 

totally forgot this was VB for a second.

02-08-2014 12:36 PM
Kenickie
Quote:
Originally Posted by cobalamin View Post
 

Kenickie,

 

How is the air quality in Atlanta?

 

Do you think you have a consumerist mindset when looking at the world?

 

Are you codependent on your peers?

 

Compared to where? 

 

No. I'm an ex starving American refugee. I have a survivalist mentality. Evacuation, eviction, fleeing mentality. Drowning swamp rat in Louisiana and Winter's Bone mountain family in Arkansas. Does that make me more obsessive about things? Sure. Lose (drop) everything you own more than once and the 10 photographs you still have at 24 are more important than the macbook I'm typing this on. Right now, if something terrible happened, I could still carry my whole life on my back. I've lived in this house for 4 years.

 

What peers? The eight people I grew up with? Absolutely not, I could not wait to get away from them. They were all there (as babies) as I emerged from my mom in a tiny house on the ridge. I share a god mother with two of them. I literally know every milestone in these people's lives. Familiarity breeds contempt. I still go back to the mountains once or twice a year, and most of the time it makes my skin crawl. I'm at my mother's less than 10 minutes and the phone starts ringing. Saw Kenickie drive by Harts! How long she in town for!? 

 

I don't hate the country. I was born there and my people are there. I love the springs, the wolves, the rivers. The Old Ways. Love all of that. Seeing my mom is nice, helping winter-fy her cabin is nice. I can do all of that. Doesn't mean I want it.

 

I lived alone, no phone, no internet, no television, no car, completely isolated in a cabin on the ridge for the winter a couple years ago, but it wasn't really by choice - I was too damaged to handle being seen or touched by anyone or anything. I didn't really play any music, read, do anything. I saw my Aunt once every week to 10 days, got groceries with her, and then she would drop me off at the line until next time. Basically just stared at the river, wrote, chopped wood, painted the trees along the line purple, took care of the cat. I would never choose that, though, in a long term way. One, it was dangerous and foolish of me to be so isolated and so alone during a winter thats known for ice storms and other terrible things (I literally could have died) but also I didn't like what it was doing to me. Who I was becoming. Had I spent longer than those three months there, I don't know what kind of person would have come out. I'm not fit to be a pilgrim at tinker creek. Or, damaged daughter on wolf ridge, as it were. 

 

Not everyone can live in the country, and surely not everyone wants to. The future just doesn't have room for that. The future doesn't even have room for suburbs. Otherwise where does all the food for these people come from? Compact, walkable, livable cities are important to promote and develop. Otherwise, ****'s ****ed. I have no problem with city people thinking I'm some sort of bumpkin born on a road that's just numbers. and I have no problem with country people thinking I'm some sort of city slicker who's sold out the old ways and doesn't know how to survive with nothing any more. They are both wrong, and " why i hate cities" just sounds sooooooo dumb and elitist and privileged and self promoting. It's bad and good, just like everything else. Get over it.

02-02-2014 03:43 PM
Contro
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hawx79 View Post
 

I couldn't help wondering, where do you people live that is outside the city live?


 The circle is my house, the area inside the white lines is my property, it goes back farther, about half of what is shown. I am between Baltimore and DC just about 20 minutes south of Annapolis, and about 5 minutes from the Chesapeake Bay.

02-02-2014 02:35 PM
Wolfie
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenickie View Post
 

I have a feeling this person isn't an American. Not an excuse for not speaking clearly about a rural vs suburban. in this country, where I live especially, suburbs are akin to a disease. They force people to drive farther for work, polluting the environment, killing family time, all so they can have a yard and a privacy fence next to Mr and Mrs So and So who sued the people across the street for building a pond too big for their yard. Suburban sickness is a real thing, and sprawl is one of the worst things about where I live, if not the whole country. The suburbs hate Atlanta so much in this state, that the state government is constantly in a battle to further harm the economic engine of the entire southeastern region to feel some petty victory over us. The suburbs would rather literally choke themselves off from us, with miles of interstate than risk contamination by the poors via transport. This is not hyperbolic language. People were on 285 for 19 hours trying to get 10 miles to get back to their bedroom community this week. I've lived within 15 miles of VBers I'd love to meet (Christy, Tame) for years but haven't because it literally takes 2 hours to get there, and neither of them ever come to the City of Atlanta proper where I live.

 

and yeah, super rural living is crap for a teenager. Do you not listen to music? Or see movies? Or buy books?  My hometown got DSL two years ago. What would you propose I do, after my 12 year old self was bored of stealing older brothers beer and getting drunk by the river with the eight other people in my peer group?  My high school graduating class (had I staid there) would have been nine. None of them remained in my hometown. I'm one of three who even still resides in the United States. Because it's literally impossible to accept that is the only thing in the world, not even the Amish limit their children like that. Making the choice to live in a rural community - after seeing record stores, and stop lights, and other things is something totally different.

 

i have chickens, 8 beds which produce everything from kale to squash to blueberries, and three fig trees. i live in the heart of atlanta and the sky looks like blade runner every night. it's the ****.

 

Atlanta must be different than other major cities. Even where I am, which is hardly a "major" city, you can't keep chickens and other farm animals. Heck, they try to limit dogs and cats. And you have to go out a ways to have enough land for that much produce. Would be awesome though. All I know of Atlanta is what I see on TV I'll admit, but it looks too dang crowded for me though. Even in my little city which doesn't appear on most maps, I don't go grocery shopping on a weekend afternoon. I tend to go after work at 1:00 or 2:00 a.m. to avoid the crowds.
I wouldn't want to live in a completely rural area either though. Nothing like having to drive 40 minutes for that 1 item you forgot at the store.
02-02-2014 06:46 AM
cobalamin

Kenickie,

 

How is the air quality in Atlanta?

 

Do you think you have a consumerist mindset when looking at the world?

 

Are you codependent on your peers?

02-01-2014 11:06 PM
Beautiful Joe

I grew up in the country and don't recall being bored. In fact, in my entire life, I've only been bored when I have been in situations where I had to appear as though I was paying attention to something or someone who didn't interest me. I've never been bored when left to my own devices. Imagination, an interest in one's surroundings, thought - there's nothing more needed to avoid boredom.

02-01-2014 09:41 PM
Kenickie

I have a feeling this person isn't an American. Not an excuse for not speaking clearly about a rural vs suburban. in this country, where I live especially, suburbs are akin to a disease. They force people to drive farther for work, polluting the environment, killing family time, all so they can have a yard and a privacy fence next to Mr and Mrs So and So who sued the people across the street for building a pond too big for their yard. Suburban sickness is a real thing, and sprawl is one of the worst things about where I live, if not the whole country. The suburbs hate Atlanta so much in this state, that the state government is constantly in a battle to further harm the economic engine of the entire southeastern region to feel some petty victory over us. The suburbs would rather literally choke themselves off from us, with miles of interstate than risk contamination by the poors via transport. This is not hyperbolic language. People were on 285 for 19 hours trying to get 10 miles to get back to their bedroom community this week. I've lived within 15 miles of VBers I'd love to meet (Christy, Tame) for years but haven't because it literally takes 2 hours to get there, and neither of them ever come to the City of Atlanta proper where I live. 

 

and yeah, super rural living is crap for a teenager. Do you not listen to music? Or see movies? Or buy books?  My hometown got DSL two years ago. What would you propose I do, after my 12 year old self was bored of stealing older brothers beer and getting drunk by the river with the eight other people in my peer group?  My high school graduating class (had I staid there) would have been nine. None of them remained in my hometown. I'm one of three who even still resides in the United States. Because it's literally impossible to accept that is the only thing in the world, not even the Amish limit their children like that. Making the choice to live in a rural community - after seeing record stores, and stop lights, and other things is something totally different.

 

i have chickens, 8 beds which produce everything from kale to squash to blueberries, and three fig trees. i live in the heart of atlanta and the sky looks like blade runner every night. it's the ****.

01-31-2014 04:20 PM
Wolfie
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fromper View Post


Living in Chicago, I've found that while rush hour traffic is horrible, I never have to face it. Public transportation is a good thing. I take the train, and rarely have issues. And by "rarely", I mean two major delays in my first year, before we suddenly started having issues recently with extreme cold freezing switches on the tracks. Still, less than 10 times in 15 months of having my commute take more than 45 minutes is pretty good, especially since I can sit and read on the train during much of that commuting time, unlike when I used to drive down in Florida.

--Fromper
juggle.gif

I don't like public transportation. I like to go places on my schedule, not the train or bus schedule. Plus I'm guessing no dogs allowed on the train, except service dogs.  I don't even like buses here when riding from where my car is parked to an event, like the fair or even a work meeting like we have to do sometimes. I can't stand being packed like sardines in a can (sorry for the nonvegan comment) amongst people I don't know.

 

I love Chicago. I can get there in 2-1/2 hours or so, have some awesome friends up there, it's incredibly vegan friendly and you'd never run out of fun things to do. But I wouldn't want to live there or any other huge city. I also wouldn't have left Florida to suffer through Midwestern winters, but that's another topic. I hate winter almost as much as I hate being surrounded by so many people. :p

01-31-2014 12:35 PM
Fromper I always drove in Florida. I had the same 10-12 minute drive to and from work for over a decade, and at least twice per week, I'd see someone making a right turn from the left lane or a left turn from the right lane of a street that was 3 lanes in either direction. It didn't even surprise me any more.

I love being able to commute by train in Chicago. My only complaint is that the only train lines go from downtown Chicago out to various other places. So if you're on the north side of the city and want to go to the northwest side, you can't just get on a train to go west. You have to go south to downtown and switch to a line going northwest from downtown. If they built rail lines that circled the outer areas of the city and/or nearby suburbs, I might just be tempted to give up the car that I currently only drive maybe 20-30 miles per week.

--Fromper
juggle.gif
01-31-2014 11:46 AM
beanspud
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fromper View Post

Living in Chicago, I've found that while rush hour traffic is horrible, I never have to face it. Public transportation is a good thing. I take the train, and rarely have issues. And by "rarely", I mean two major delays in my first year, before we suddenly started having issues recently with extreme cold freezing switches on the tracks. Still, less than 10 times in 15 months of having my commute take more than 45 minutes is pretty good, especially since I can sit and read on the train during much of that commuting time, unlike when I used to drive down in Florida.

--Fromper
juggle.gif

Don't you miss driving where people merge unexpectedly without turn signals while texting? You can even get on a bus that will require at least two transfers through the same traffic everyone else is stuck in! The trains are late, but it will follow a CSX train so we will feel the speed at which coal travels. Bicycle? If you're lucky enough to be around a bicycle lane or sidewalk, you have the company of motorists who may or may not recognize your right to live.

Ahhh Florida.
01-31-2014 09:31 AM
Fromper
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolfie View Post

I like big cities. To visit. I couldn't live there. Too many freaking people. I really like vegan restaurants on nearly every block, but I dislike literally bumping into people at stores and such. And traffic jams during rush hour. Traffic can get bad here sometimes, but nothing like Chicago or NYC.
Living in Chicago, I've found that while rush hour traffic is horrible, I never have to face it. Public transportation is a good thing. I take the train, and rarely have issues. And by "rarely", I mean two major delays in my first year, before we suddenly started having issues recently with extreme cold freezing switches on the tracks. Still, less than 10 times in 15 months of having my commute take more than 45 minutes is pretty good, especially since I can sit and read on the train during much of that commuting time, unlike when I used to drive down in Florida.

--Fromper
juggle.gif
01-31-2014 08:05 AM
Hawx79

I couldn't help wondering, where do you people live that is outside the city live?

01-30-2014 03:55 PM
Wolfie

I like big cities. To visit. I couldn't live there. Too many freaking people. I really like vegan restaurants on nearly every block, but I dislike literally bumping into people at stores and such. And traffic jams during rush hour. Traffic can get bad here sometimes, but nothing like Chicago or NYC.

01-28-2014 04:30 PM
LedBoots My cousin lives in a rural area, and I love the sounds of nature and the stars at night. :-) I like *all* the places, I wish I could travel more and see everywhere.

Sent from my SPH-L720 using Tapatalk
01-28-2014 04:20 PM
Tiger Lilly
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vegman View Post
 

if i lived in the city I would miss the stars too, where I live its 30km from the nearest town. so in winter when we have fires outside we just sit and look up at the starts for hours, one of the first thing anybody says when the stay the night at my farm is that there are so many stars! They are beautiful.


I do miss the stars.

I like the lights of the city and there's a certain rush, an energy, that just isn't in the country.

But it's not the same as the stars.

01-27-2014 06:18 PM
Vegman

if i lived in the city I would miss the stars too, where I live its 30km from the nearest town. so in winter when we have fires outside we just sit and look up at the starts for hours, one of the first thing anybody says when the stay the night at my farm is that there are so many stars! They are beautiful.

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