Soy Milk (concerned) - VeggieBoards
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#1 Old 07-10-2007, 08:24 PM
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Hey guys...



I was reading a thread in the vegetarian section and (medesha) mention to have soy in moderation (like anything)..But I was wondering what do people here know about soy...



I have one serve a day (250ml) So Good chocolate soy....

I have it for B12 and calcium...



Does that sound okay...??



And someone else mentioned Iodine.. where so you get that from?



Thanks..

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#2 Old 07-11-2007, 01:45 PM
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http://www.alternet.org/healthwellness/56087/?page=1



If I were you I'd avoid soy like the plague. It has anti-nutrients and has horomone-like effects in the body.



It may have b12 and calcium, but it's probably not going to be absorbed if there's anti-nutrients involved anyways. Drink fortified rice milk instead.



Also, soy can cause thyroid problems. I am currently taking care of a lady who drank soy a lot (because of lactose intolerance), she ended up bleeding inside her head and will be taking thyroid medicine for the rest of her life. Not fun at all.



My mother also had thyroid cancer, and was told by the doctor to stay away from soy.... she still continues to eat soy. Tsk tsk.



I don't want to scare you, but just as much evidence suggest soy is bad for you as there is good evidence.
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#3 Old 07-11-2007, 01:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Odalys View Post

Also, soy can cause thyroid problems. I am currently taking care of a lady who drank soy a lot (because of lactose intolerance), she ended up bleeding inside her head and will be taking thyroid medicine for the rest of her life. Not fun at all.



My mother also had thyroid cancer, and was told by the doctor to stay away from soy.... she still continues to eat soy. Tsk tsk.



I don't want to scare you, but just as much evidence suggest soy is bad for you as there is good evidence.

https://www.veggieboards.com/boards/s...49&postcount=6



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#4 Old 07-11-2007, 08:08 PM
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Wow, let's have some education before we scare people off of soy...



Soy "in moderation" means about 3 servings per day, a serving being one cup of soymilk, 1/2 c beans, or 4 oz. tofu/tempeh. Studies have shown that diets with a moderate intake of soy so not adversely affect health, and may actually improve it. It's not a wonder food, but it's not a death trap, either. Soy isoflavins are being studied in terms of their effects, as they are similar to estrogen hormones. However, in moderation, no harm is seen. YEARS of soy consumption in Asia have not negatively affected their cancer rates - in fact, they are much lower than ours. This "anti-nutrient" thing Odalys is talking about is complete BS.
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#5 Old 07-11-2007, 08:45 PM
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How topical. I have an appointment on Friday with an endocrinologist to check for a bum thyroid.



I didn't know ANYTHING about any link between soy and thyroid issue until recently. I started getting hives out of the blue. Every single day. They were waking me up in the middle of the night. It was terrible. After evaluating my diet, the only thing I had been eating differently was WAY more processed soy foods since going from vegetarian to strict vegetarian a couple weeks earlier.



Besides meat analogues I was suddenly eating soy cheeses, soy ice cream, soy milk, etc. I thought maybe I was developing a soy allergy. So I took a short trip away from home to rule out a sudden allergy to my cat and I pounded soy to test my hypothesis. I figured if I got hives worse than normal I would have figured it out and I could go from there. Well, my hives were the same but my throat swelled up really bad! It scared the hell out of me. So, I concluded that I had a soy allergy and in the week afterward I cut soy completely. But the hives didn't go away. So I added a LITTLE bit of soy back to my diet - dressings, a sprinkle of soy parmesan, etc. A week or so ago I went out to a veg restaurant and couldn't resist the soy asada tacos. Within half an hour my throat was swelling again.



I came home and spent several hours googling my ass off and discovered that a) the thyroid is located in the exact spot my throat was swelling, b)chronic hives like I am experiencing are sometimes a sign of thyroid disease and c)that large quantitites of soy can trigger thyroid problems. I also learned that thyroid problems can result due to a lack of iodine and a lot of processed food do NOT have iodized salt in them, so if you're not using iodized table salt (I don't) you might be lacking in iodine. A patch test (where you draw an iodine circle on your arm and see how quickly it fades) seems to point to an iodine deficiency, but I don't know how reliable that is. A blood test indicates there might be aproblem with my thyroid so now I get to go to an endocrinologist and have more tests done to try and get this all figured out. Let me add that my mother and grandmother have thyroid problems so I'm predisposed. Some studies show that there is no relationship between soy and thyroid problems. All I know is that just a little bit of research and all of the pieces fell into place for me. I do not believe that soy CAUSED my problems. I think my family history and not enough iodine put me at risk and the large quantities of soy I began eating triggered an existing condition. I mean, I can't ignore that the gland actually SWELLED right after large quantities of soy were ingested. I think there is enough worry and evidence that it would justify some serious studies being done between processed soy and thyroid problems.



Some studies also show a link between animal proteins and an auto-immune disease of the thyroid called Hashimoto's disease, by the way.



P.S. The blood test I had done recently shows I am getting plenty of protein and iron, despite not eating animal products. Ha!
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#6 Old 07-11-2007, 08:48 PM
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P.S.S.

Isn't the soy that Asians have been eating for years with no ill effect FERMENTED soy and not highly processed soy like so much vegetarian junk food is made of?
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#7 Old 07-11-2007, 08:59 PM
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There are some potential problems with soy, but if they were serious you'd exect to see those problems more abundantly in populations that eat a lot of soy. I've never heard of such cultures having high rates of either thyroid problems or nutritional deficiencies because of 'anti-nutrients', and they have distinctly lower rates of breast cancer (which shouldn't be true if the phytoestrogens were a problem).



As a result, I don't mind having soy (in similar amounts to what you mentioned). If I had any thyroid issues I wouldn't be so comfortable with it. I think it's another case of people who like to worry or have something to sell taking a real issue and blowing it way out of proportion.





... not that THAT ever happens in the diet world...
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#8 Old 07-11-2007, 09:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JenasaurusX View Post

P.S.S.

Isn't the soy that Asians have been eating for years with no ill effect FERMENTED soy and not highly processed soy like so much vegetarian junk food is made of?



Hmm... Odd, I do perfectly fine without this 'highly processed' stuff, and I live in the USA in a state that is not known so highly for 'vegetarian' friendliness.



Asian countries consume a lot of soy in the form of tofu and soy milk, but you are right about the less processed stuff. The problem does not seem to be soy so much as it is the 'ease' of which some of us like to live. I eat tofu regularly and drink soy milk, both homemade. I have yet to have any problems! (Of course processed stuff isn't too great for you. Once in a while they are fine, but I would definitely not eat them unless you have to do so.)



Soy is getting a lot of bad rap lately, and I think that a lot of it is unfair based. Soy does not have to be an unhealthy food. Just use common sense.
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#9 Old 07-11-2007, 09:19 PM
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Anyone have any feed bak on the SO GOOD soy.. Its the SOLEA and NON GM
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#10 Old 07-11-2007, 09:23 PM
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Feedback such as?....



Yes, it is soymilk. If it is non-GMO, it should be alright. No, it does not contain any animal products. However, if your drink more than 2 glasses a day your heart will explode.



I move to vote that no more of these threads be started. There are way too many "Is soy ___ ___ __ " on here.
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#11 Old 07-11-2007, 09:37 PM
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Considering how many processed soy foods are out there and how many people just becoming vegan might turn to them and end up eating them to excess, I can't imagine why it would be a bad thing to raise some valid questions. I just explained my own situation in which soy is directly related to a health problem I am having. Why shouldn't this be discussed?



I've noticed on another board that there are some people who seriously freak out and think that anything slightly negative about soy is some kind of anti-veg propoganda.



Tofu, soy milk, tempeh, and soy sauce have been used for a long time with no evidence of causing health problems. The new, processed soy foods and GMO soy products are relatively new and people must be consuming them in high numbers or big corporations wouldn't be churning them out the way they are. I would think if people are having issues, discussing them would be a good thing.
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#12 Old 07-11-2007, 09:41 PM
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Indeed, but these issues have all been discussed before.



Anyway, the processed foods that you speak of are clearly not the best thing on the planet for you. However, I see them as a lot safer than meat. These days, meat is pretty much a gamble. Soy may also be a gamble (in certain forms), but at least it carries less of a risk.
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#13 Old 07-11-2007, 09:47 PM
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Originally Posted by Aussyj View Post

Indeed, but these issues have all been discussed before.



If you've had multiple people posting personal experiences of soy being related to serious health problems like their throat swelling up so much they can barely breathe then I'd say that would definitely indicate a problem!
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#14 Old 07-11-2007, 09:54 PM
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Eh, more so that people just don't use the search feature.



Listen, I am not scolding you in any way. I am merely stating that soy is not the nasty food that people have put it out to be. Sure, if you eat the GMO form, or the highly processed ****, you will be at risk for some sort of problems (thyroid, possibly), but that should be given. Processed foods are usually not hailed for their healthy qualities.
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#15 Old 07-11-2007, 09:58 PM
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i've read up on the anti-soy information on the web and most of it appears to me to be total bs. the fact is that asians eat much much more soy than people in the USA and Europe and have much lower cancer rates and none of the ill effects talked about in anti-soy rhetoric are prevalent. i think that the anti-soy stuff has a very high BS quotient



highly processed soy is not something that I personally eat, unless you consider soy milk to be highly processed? i don't think that it is.



anecdotally speaking, i eat a lot of soy in the form of tofu and i drink soy milk regularly. i have absolutely no health side effects from it nor does my mom or sister or my two close and vegan friends.
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#16 Old 07-11-2007, 10:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Savannah View Post

i've read up on the anti-soy information on the web and most of it appears to me to be total bs. the fact is that asians eat much much more soy than people in the USA and Europe and have much lower cancer rates and none of the ill effects talked about in anti-soy rhetoric are prevalent. i think that the anti-soy stuff has a very high BS quotient



highly processed soy is not something that I personally eat, unless you consider soy milk to be highly processed? i don't think that it is.



anecdotally speaking, i eat a lot of soy in the form of tofu and i drink soy milk regularly. i have absolutely no health side effects from it nor does my mom or sister or my two close and vegan friends.



Exactly! (Oh, and no - soymilk is not usually processed 'highly'. In fact, it isn't that processed at all. Neither is tofu.)
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#17 Old 07-11-2007, 10:20 PM
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Really, with all this talk about soy, none of it applies to soy in its formented form: Tempeh. There's also the two other forms I rarely hear of and can't spell ^_^ ..The fermentation process gets rid of those toxins.
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#18 Old 07-11-2007, 10:28 PM
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I would say it depends on the form. In Asia they eat soy when they get soy milk, tofu, miso or whatever. It is generally freshly made or at least with far less additives than Western foods.



In the US and similar places soy is used as a filler or additive of many foods that are packaged and produced in factories. Go to the supermarket and look at the ingredients on anything there (breads, cookies, snack foods, candies).



I'm going to compare to the products in the Asian food store to get a feel, but if I made bread at home I wouldn't use soy as an ingredient because that is not a standard ingredient. However, breads in the store, many have soy. So you get a lot more exposure than you think to processed versions.



To me one of the issues is processed foods, and I make a differentiation between mass produced (doing things on a bigger scale) food and processed food. If something is similar to what I might make fresh in my kitchen, I wouldn't worry so much, but if it contains all kinds of ingredients that I wouldn't have used then I would be concerned.
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