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-   -   How to prove that veganism is not expensive (https://www.veggieboards.com/forum/60-vegan-support-forum/228090-how-prove-veganism-not-expensive.html)

Vlady 03-03-2018 09:39 AM

How to prove that veganism is not expensive
 
Jello ! How would you go about explanation of it . Because non-vegans like to tell how soy milk is expensive etc. Thank you for your comments

leedsveg 03-03-2018 10:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vlady (Post 4114680)
Jello ! How would you go about explanation of it . Because non-vegans like to tell how soy milk is expensive etc. Thank you for your comments

The highest cost in non-vegan foods is paid for by animals with their short miserable lives. Cost is not always about money...

lv:(

APhilosophicalGent 03-03-2018 10:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by leedsveg (Post 4114700)
The highest cost in non-vegan foods is paid for by animals with their short miserable lives. Cost is not always about money...

lv:(

Agreed. Plus the soy milk I drink is like a multivitamin tablet as it is highly fortified, so worth the (small) additional cost. I doubt vegan diet IS more expensive in most places but even if it is so what? If you're utterly destitute then perhaps you cant go fully vegan. If you're claiming you cant go vegan due to money, then Id expect you would not be smoking and drinking alcohol and eating out at restaurants.

Mr. H. 03-03-2018 11:54 AM

Soy milk is more expensive than regular milk. But the soy milk I buy is organic, AND the same price as the organic cow's milk. Now your friends probably don't buy the expensive organic milk. If you are feeling mean, you could tell them what the USDA allows to be in non-organic cow's milk

http://www.rense.com/general26/milk.htm

The other things that vegans buy that are expensive is the processed meat substitutes. Veggie hot dogs are more expensive than regular hot dogs. But again I might bring up what you find in a regular hot dog. Same with Veggie burgers. And tofu is sort of up there in price.

But vegans don't NEED to eat soymilk, or tofu, or veggie burgers. And most of the other vegan things are cheaper than the meat alternatives.

Diane Vukovic did a great job of comparing the price of vegan vs nonvegan proteins. The most informative numbers are the price per gram of protein. (we don't need to consider carbs - meat doesn't have carbs. Or fat. who wants more fat?) But she also compared the price of things by the pound.

You might want to take a minute to study this.
https://plenteousveg.com/cost-vegan-...nimal-protein/
or share it with your non-vegan friends.

rileyblue 03-03-2018 05:10 PM

Beans, rice, lentils, split peas, tofu, oats, potatoes, peanut butter, all very cheap. Round it out with fruits and veggies, and you're good. Soy Milk is barely more than cow's milk, and veggie burgers and such are a luxury and not at all necessary.

David3 03-03-2018 05:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vlady (Post 4114680)
Jello ! How would you go about explanation of it . Because non-vegans like to tell how soy milk is expensive etc. Thank you for your comments

The "Being vegan is expensive" myth is hard to kill! Along with this myth comes its nasty co-myth: "Being vegan is elitist - for rich people".

The lowest-income people on the planet live on diets that are nearly vegan. Below is a photo from a wonderful picture book: Hungry Planet - What the World Eats (https://www.amazon.com/Hungry-Planet.../dp/0984074422 ). The book is a collection of photos of families from all over the world, posing with their typical groceries.

Here is a photo of a family from Ecuador. According to the book, this 9 person family spent $32 per week for their food, at the time of publishing (year 2007).

http://www.closeupresearch.com/wp-co...r-menzel-2.jpg

David3 03-03-2018 05:37 PM

Again from the book, Hungry Planet - What the World Eats, here is a photo of a family from Zimbabwe:

https://s3.amazonaws.com/blog.oxfama...1/food-zim.jpg

David3 03-03-2018 05:39 PM

For the sake of comparison, here is a photo of some Americans, posing with their typical groceries. Food expenditure per week: $341.98 (year 2007).

https://timeglobalspin.files.wordpre...1rw1.jpg?w=720

David3 03-03-2018 05:58 PM

Regarding dairy milk vs. soy milk:

Anyone who promotes dairy milk should consider that the vast majority of the world's population are lactose-intolerant after infancy. This information comes from the United Nations, and from reputable peer-reviewed studies. According to the United Nations Food and Agriculture Organization, approximately 70% of the world's population has a reduced ability to digest milk after weaning- see chapter 4.10 of http://www.fao.org/docrep/018/i3396e/i3396e.pdf . Among certain populations in Asia, over 90% of people are lactose intolerant: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4586575/ . In other words, the ability to properly digest milk after infancy is uncommon.

Lactose intolerance can be mitigated by consuming dairy foods in which the lactose has been broken down by fermentation, such as yogurt or aged cheese. These foods are more expensive than fluid milk, however.

The (vegan) Vegetarian Resource Group has a detailed webpage about dietary calcium and vegan diets: http://www.vrg.org/nutrition/calcium.php
.
.

David3 03-03-2018 06:18 PM

One more photo, from Hungry Planet - What the World Eats. This photo shows a family from Mali, posing with their typical groceries. Looks vegan, or awfully close to it (the bottle could contain milk, I suppose). These photos seem to demonstrate that some of the the lowest-income people in the world eat a veg or nearly-veg diet.

Veg diets are cheap!

https://historytech.files.wordpress....15/06/chad.png

Mr. H. 03-03-2018 06:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David3 (Post 4114724)
For the sake of comparison, here is a photo of some Americans, posing with their typical groceries. Food expenditure per week: $341.98 (year 2007).

Holy crap!

Vlady 03-04-2018 08:52 AM

David3 : Thank you for your posts !

Vlady 03-04-2018 08:53 AM

Thank other participants as well .

Vlady 03-04-2018 08:54 AM

The problem is that my friend told me , that he wpuld consider began option of chicken if it would be not 2x as expensive :(

Vlady 03-04-2018 11:28 AM

* Hello . The problem is that people can not control their taste

Vlady 03-04-2018 11:29 AM

Would like to edit older posts but do not know how to . Thank you

VLynx 03-04-2018 11:41 AM

Wow David3, interesting pictures. almost 10 times more spent in America.

What also changed is, that we live in good times. Maybe 60 years ago, people only had meat on sundays, it was expensive and that automatically made people live healthier. the focus was on vegetables. Today it´s in peoples mind that a meal is not complete if there´s no meat coming with it. We eat way too much meat and all that is processed etc. bringing all the civilization diseases. Someone sitting in a Mc Donalds snarfing a burger, I doubt that this person sees it as a very special thing to eat meat at that moment. It´s just given and standard. Vegetables aren´t expensive. With a complete meal including meat, you´d have the same vegetables, it´s just that there needs to be something else than the meat, and more vegetables won´t be as expensive as the meat - at least if you get "quality" meat, but most people only see the price and get antibiotica, bacteria, nitrate etc. with it.

But agreed, a veggie burger is something special, but not necessarily needed.

APhilosophicalGent 03-05-2018 03:44 AM

Hmmm yeah if anything we may have the opposite problem: making reference to virtual veganism being common among some of the poorest of the world and eg medieval peasants doesn't help its status lol. But yes it does show it's often cheaper option.

David3 03-05-2018 08:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by APhilosophicalGent (Post 4114784)
Hmmm yeah if anything we may have the opposite problem: making reference to virtual veganism being common among some of the poorest of the world and eg medieval peasants doesn't help its status lol. But yes it does show it's often cheaper option.




Not true at all. Vegetarians and vegans include some of the wealthiest people in the world. Paul McCartney, Morrissey, Miley Cyrus, Ariana Grande . . .


.

chickpeayogi 03-05-2018 03:10 PM

Unfortunately I think it depends on where you live. I live in a large city in a ‘food desert’ and I can tell you that fruits and veggies are not easy to find - not fresh & affordable ones anyways. It is cheaper to not be a vegan in areas like this. I am a vegan bc it is a commitment I made and I budget accordingly bc it is a priority of mine, but it’s really sad to see how sometimes it is just not cheaper (given the industries of government subsidies - we all know about those!) [emoji35]


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Vlady 03-05-2018 04:03 PM

Hi ! Are you all from the US ?

Latinainsc 03-06-2018 11:53 AM

In some countries vegan meat substitutes and plant milks can be pricey but YouTube is full of videos on how to make all of those things from scratch. If they do not want to bother cooking then they do have a problem but I say that whoever likes to eat should know how to cook. Depending on food prepared by others with ingredients we can't control is not a very wise or healthy way to eat.

I'm in the U.S. and I've been receiving "foods stamps" now called SNAP (a government subsidy for buying food to help low-income people) and at first what I received which was just under US$200 didn't seem enough, but I was restocking my cupboard and then because I must eat gluten free I was indulging in some costly foods and snacks. I then had a modest increase of income and my SNAP was reduced, but realizing that some of the stuff I'd been buying was not really nutritious I cut a lot of it out and was able to make the funds I received last the whole month and sometimes beyond. I recently received an additional increase in income and a subsequent reduction in SNAP, this time quite substantial so I re-examined what I'd been buying and decided to just treat myself to some things (=processed stuff...) only occasionally. Well, I'm pretty sure that in the 2 mo. since that drastic reduction I've only spent around $100 out of pocket and possibly less as my total bill in several places included non-food items.

As long as I have rice, beans, potatoes, veggies and fruit at home I know I'm going to be eating good complete meals and all the other things I like, which don't have good nutritional value, are really not necessary. However, with good planning I still have been treating myself to several things I like to use for variety quite regularly, I recently got lucky with a $1 off coupon on Gardein Meatballs at a supermarket printed in their own in-store coupon/special offers flyer (not the regular one), so I take advantage of things like that, I also shop at both Aldi & Lidl where I can save money. I do have to say though that most of the food I buy is not organic.

David3 03-07-2018 05:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chickpeayogi (Post 4114798)
Unfortunately I think it depends on where you live. I live in a large city in a ‘food desert’ and I can tell you that fruits and veggies are not easy to find - not fresh & affordable ones anyways. It is cheaper to not be a vegan in areas like this. I am a vegan bc it is a commitment I made and I budget accordingly bc it is a priority of mine, but it’s really sad to see how sometimes it is just not cheaper (given the industries of government subsidies - we all know about those!) [emoji35]


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I don't see how this can be true. The recommended intake of vegetables and fruit are the same, for both omnivorous and vegan diets.


Omnivorous diet recommendations, from Harvard University School of Public Health:


https://cdn1.sph.harvard.edu/wp-cont...HEPApr2013.jpg




Vegan diet recommendations, from the Vegan Society:


http://www.brendadavisrd.com/wp-cont...G-hi-res-2.jpg

chickpeayogi 03-07-2018 05:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David3 (Post 4114896)
I don't see how this can be true. The recommended intake of vegetables and fruit are the same, for both omnivorous and vegan diets.


Omnivorous diet recommendations, from Harvard University School of Public Health:


https://cdn1.sph.harvard.edu/wp-cont...HEPApr2013.jpg




Vegan diet recommendations, from the Vegan Society:


http://www.brendadavisrd.com/wp-cont...G-hi-res-2.jpg



I didn’t mention anything about diet recommendations. I was trying to say what kind of food is available in cities, particularly inner cities.


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David3 03-07-2018 07:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chickpeayogi (Post 4114898)
I didn’t mention anything about diet recommendations. I was trying to say what kind of food is available in cities, particularly inner cities.


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I agree 100%. It's no exaggeration to say that our country has failed in that sense. We live in the one of wealthiest countries in the world, and yet people still don't have good access to healthy food.
.

PlantBasedBen 03-20-2018 12:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vlady (Post 4114680)
Jello ! How would you go about explanation of it . Because non-vegans like to tell how soy milk is expensive etc. Thank you for your comments

Veganism allows you to choose your budget. Yes, you can buy expensive soymilks and other expensive vegan products, but you don't have to.

I have fed myself on less than $5 a day and ate mainly fresh fruits and vegetables. I have also fed myself on more than $15 a day with the vegan products, which are still processed.

If you go plant-based and you pay attention to the cost of what you're buying, you can eat a very healthy vegan diet for less than $50 per week. I have even heard of families of 4 going vegan for less than $75 a week.

It's only as expensive as you let it be as most fresh fruits and vegetables, in-season, are rather cheap.


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