the struggle of living amongst omnivores/materialists - VeggieBoards
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#1 Old 02-28-2016, 02:15 AM
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the struggle of living amongst omnivores/materialists

i am in constant struggle living amongst omnivores. eating meat makes people more agressive, insensitive and selfish(proven by neurochemistry, hormonal balance and toxicology)
i myself as a sensitive and compassioanate person struggle to live amongst egocentric, selfish and insensitive society filled with materialism and greed and lacking spiritual values and compassion.

does anyone of you have the same feeling as me?

ps. mabye the main point is that i cannot ignore the selfish and brute nature of our western society. to be ignorant or indifferent means bliss for many people cause they ignore the suffering of other humans and nonhuman beings, but this is impossible for me. to be happy amongst dog eat doggers i myself must become a selfish ******* which goes against my deepest core values.

historically the countries with most meat consumption have the bloodiest history.. meat, alcohol and guns go hand in hand
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Last edited by wanderer1; 02-28-2016 at 03:07 AM.
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#2 Old 02-28-2016, 03:55 AM
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This is exactly what I'm looking for, would you be open to being an interviewee in my podcast? You hit the nail on the bead so to speak on this post and I'd love to discuss it more in-depth.
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#3 Old 02-28-2016, 04:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wanderer1 View Post
i am in constant struggle living amongst omnivores. eating meat makes people more agressive, insensitive and selfish(proven by neurochemistry, hormonal balance and toxicology)
i myself as a sensitive and compassioanate person struggle to live amongst egocentric, selfish and insensitive society filled with materialism and greed and lacking spiritual values and compassion.

does anyone of you have the same feeling as me?

ps. mabye the main point is that i cannot ignore the selfish and brute nature of our western society. to be ignorant or indifferent means bliss for many people cause they ignore the suffering of other humans and nonhuman beings, but this is impossible for me. to be happy amongst dog eat doggers i myself must become a selfish ******* which goes against my deepest core values.

historically the countries with most meat consumption have the bloodiest history.. meat, alcohol and guns go hand in hand
Hi wanderer1,

If you live near a larger city, there's a good chance that there's a vegetarian social group near you. You can search for one at http://www.meetup.com .

_________

Specific recommendations for a healthy diet include: eating more fruit, vegetables, legumes, nuts and grains; cutting down on salt, sugar and fats. It is also advisable to choose unsaturated fats, instead of saturated fats and towards the elimination of trans-fatty acids."
- United Nations' World Health Organization
http://www.who.int/topics/diet/en/
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#4 Old 02-29-2016, 07:09 AM
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You brought it right to the point. One should also mention that the overconsumption of "industrial" meat is even worse since apart from the facts you cited, it is full of antibiotics, growth hormones and god-knows-what-else.

In your case, looking for a support group to find more people that think the same way is indeed a good idea.
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#5 Old 02-29-2016, 04:19 PM
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Originally Posted by wanderer1 View Post
i am in constant struggle living amongst omnivores. eating meat makes people more agressive, insensitive and selfish(proven by neurochemistry, hormonal balance and toxicology)
i myself as a sensitive and compassioanate person struggle to live amongst egocentric, selfish and insensitive society filled with materialism and greed and lacking spiritual values and compassion.

does anyone of you have the same feeling as me?

ps. mabye the main point is that i cannot ignore the selfish and brute nature of our western society. to be ignorant or indifferent means bliss for many people cause they ignore the suffering of other humans and nonhuman beings, but this is impossible for me. to be happy amongst dog eat doggers i myself must become a selfish ******* which goes against my deepest core values.

historically the countries with most meat consumption have the bloodiest history.. meat, alcohol and guns go hand in hand
The World has lost its core values of respect, compassion and dignity.

That's why most people eat animals.

That's why we have crime, abuse, etc.

Spiritual aspirations trump materialism hands down.

We need to get back to the basics.

All animals should be respected & should have the ability to lead a natural & enjoyable life. This means not eating them, or abusing them in any way.
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#6 Old 02-29-2016, 04:29 PM
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One part of the struggle in living among omnivores is that our numbers are so small. Vegans are such a small minority it is ridiculous. If there were more vegans and we banded together, we might be able to do something about carnism. We might be able to form an independent nation of vegans, or at least create sustainable vegan only communities.
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#7 Old 02-29-2016, 05:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Vegan Dave View Post
The World has lost its core values of respect, compassion and dignity.

That's why most people eat animals.

That's why we have crime, abuse, etc.

Spiritual aspirations trump materialism hands down.

We need to get back to the basics.
Unfortunately crime, abuse, greed, and eating animals has been around since humans have. I can't think of a time in history that was any better than now. Sure, there may not have been massive factory farming until the 20th century, but animals were still hunted to near extinction for their pelts, fur, ivory, or just because of the ignorance and hatred of them (such as wolves). Women could not vote, civil rights did not exist, slaves were commonplace. Disease was rampant, clean water was not available to most people. The attitude that humans own the earth and can do what they want with it was probably worse given that people knew even less about the effect of their actions on it. I'm also guessing that just fifty years ago finding non animal clothing and shoes was near impossible. I go to museums and see what people wore and used and it was far worse as far as leather, suede, silk etc. And the only reason people didn't chow down on as much protein or push low carb is because no one could afford that much meat or dairy, until factory farming.

It IS difficult to live in a world where compassion is rare, and it is everyone for themselves. The best we can do is look people in the eye and smile at them, show our own sense of compassion and justice, be who we wish others were, and not let our frustration and anger turn to hate.
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#8 Old 02-29-2016, 05:26 PM
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Originally Posted by wanderer1 View Post
i am in constant struggle living amongst omnivores. eating meat makes people more agressive, insensitive and selfish(proven by neurochemistry, hormonal balance and toxicology)
i myself as a sensitive and compassioanate person struggle to live amongst egocentric, selfish and insensitive society filled with materialism and greed and lacking spiritual values and compassion.

does anyone of you have the same feeling as me?

ps. mabye the main point is that i cannot ignore the selfish and brute nature of our western society. to be ignorant or indifferent means bliss for many people cause they ignore the suffering of other humans and nonhuman beings, but this is impossible for me. to be happy amongst dog eat doggers i myself must become a selfish ******* which goes against my deepest core values.

historically the countries with most meat consumption have the bloodiest history.. meat, alcohol and guns go hand in hand
Actually, the omnivores in my life are really great people. Sorry, but I don't have that experience at all and I hope to never feel that way that you do. What study are you referring to where omnivores are more aggressive?
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#9 Old 02-29-2016, 05:26 PM
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I would agree with you, but alas I find that I, too, can be egocentric, selfish and insensitive. I know vegans who frequently exhibit less than charming personalities, are very materialistic, and lack what might be call "spiritual values".

Remember that people go vegan for a variety of reasons - health, ethics, economics, weight loss, allergies, to annoy parents, etc. Some of those reasons can be purely selfish, and not at all altruistic.

It's nice when you do find a group of people who share your values and appreciate your journey. Over time, I'm sure you'll find that some of the omnis in your life will appreciate you, help you, and allow you to be who you need to be. Be sure to appreciate them back.
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It is our choices that show what we truly are far more than our abilities. ~A. Dumbledore
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#10 Old 03-01-2016, 07:39 AM
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I don't know.
It can be difficult. It is difficult. And it can feel very lonely sometimes.

But I don't know about this idea that meat makes people more aggressive. It's possibly a cultural thing. I mean, just going by anecdotal evidence. (My mother eats meat and she cannot stand violence and aggression, to suggest that she is those things would be hilarious)

There will always be some brutish types out there though. I feel for male vegans especially, it must be difficult going against everyone telling you that it's manly to eat meat. To be honest, I think facing that kind of thing is what requires balls!
But not all omnivores are like that. Just the "hur hur bacon" types.
Besides. Vegans can be aggressive too. Just look at Gary Yourofsky who suggests that vegans should be more violent and aggressive. To me, being that way is NOT vegan. But that's just how I feel.

I'd like to note that I am not a spiritual person at all (although I used to be) and I find aggression and brutishness abhorrent and am all about love and compassion and making this life as pain free for all I share the planet with as I can. Of course I am in no way perfect. But it is important for me to strive to be such.
I mean, I can understand why it could be seen as spiritual and that is very sweet. But then there are others who use their spirituality to defend killing animals because they were "put here for us to use".

It's all perspective I guess. And more culture than anything.
Certain circles tend to be more brutish. I suppose they sort of egg each other on or something. Often times it might be out of fear of ridicule, lest you be seen as weak for not following the might is right principle.
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Last edited by SweetPotato; 03-01-2016 at 07:45 AM.
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#11 Old 03-01-2016, 08:46 AM
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I grew up with rude, egotistical omnivores who will never change their ways. I guess I just grew a thick skin because it doesn't really bother me on a personal level to be mocked and made fun of for being a vegan because I am and have always been confident in my decision to not contribute to the suffering of other living beings (I also reap the rewards of good health from a better diet). What I do struggle with is to have sympathy for them when they suffer the consequences health wise of a animal product heavy diet when they know the facts yet choose to ignore them.

I also have seen over the years a HUGE shift toward greater acceptance of veggies and more people willing to, if nothing else, make small positive changes (such as reducing meat consumption or buying from small local farm that have less cruel practices). Meat has always been a part of the human diet, meat, animal products and animal ownership has always been associated with wealth and success in most cultures, use of animal products helped build civilization and get us to the point we are now. It's going to take time for millions of years of something being part of our daily existence and survival to be phased out.

"The reward for conformity is that everyone likes you but yourself"

Last edited by Kiwibird08; 03-01-2016 at 08:50 AM.
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#12 Old 03-01-2016, 12:12 PM
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I can understand why you would feel the way you do, but I also can't say I feel the way you do. I am the only Vegan among all of my friends, my family, and my live-in partner. They're all incredibly supportive of my decision even if they can't understand it because they know it's something I'm passionate about. Considering the fact that I once ate meat (and most vegans have at one point eaten meat) I personally find it widely hypocritical to berate them for their actions. It's more than a little taxing and often gets me nowhere.

Being egotistical, selfish, insensitive, indifferent, ignorant, materialistic ect... these are simply traits that can be prominent in any human whether they're a meat-head or vegg-head. To be honest I've seen an equal share of omnivores and vegans who have a superiority complex.

I'm curious to see where the study is on meat and aggression is. Currently, Canada and Australia for are both within the top ten countries for both peace and meat consumption. Italy definitely has one of the one of the more bloody histories, but also ate considerably low meat consumption. Iran, Israel, Syria, Egypt most middle eastern countries... all have an abundance of violence in their history but have lots of vegetarian dishes. Then there's Japan and Korea which is more fish than anything else... I'm not say it's not possible, but it would be an incredibly interesting read.

And while I know this is probably not going to be a comment that's liked very much, isn't it possible that your post could also be taken as aggressive as well?
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#13 Old 03-02-2016, 02:33 AM
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I can agree with seeing a shift toward more acceptance lately, at least in Europe. But we have quite a mixture of different people here, with more refugees coming in everyday, so this necessarily brings together a lot of lifestyles and cultures. I'd even say vegetarianism and veganism are getting more and more popular as time passes by and people grow more aware of the machinations of some industries (like scandals where they had put sawdust in minced meat and so on).

I think the greedier they get, the more stupidities they will make, more people will stop buying their stuff and begin to look for alternatives.
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#14 Old 03-02-2016, 01:04 PM
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For me he key word is 'unconscious'.

99.9% of people are just stumbling through life like a zombie without ever taking time to actually think about their lives.

I don't blame those sort of people for not being vegan, they're just doing what the rest of society does and they know no different. I was one of them for 24 years.

Once you begin to become aware of your own thoughts and emotions as well as how society works, it's a completely different world.

I believe going vegan is a natural part of any sort of self-development, awakening, enlightenment...
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#15 Old 03-02-2016, 03:34 PM
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Originally Posted by Naturebound View Post
Unfortunately crime, abuse, greed, and eating animals has been around since humans have. I can't think of a time in history that was any better than now. Sure, there may not have been massive factory farming until the 20th century, but animals were still hunted to near extinction for their pelts, fur, ivory, or just because of the ignorance and hatred of them (such as wolves). Women could not vote, civil rights did not exist, slaves were commonplace. Disease was rampant, clean water was not available to most people. The attitude that humans own the earth and can do what they want with it was probably worse given that people knew even less about the effect of their actions on it. I'm also guessing that just fifty years ago finding non animal clothing and shoes was near impossible. I go to museums and see what people wore and used and it was far worse as far as leather, suede, silk etc. And the only reason people didn't chow down on as much protein or push low carb is because no one could afford that much meat or dairy, until factory farming.

It IS difficult to live in a world where compassion is rare, and it is everyone for themselves. The best we can do is look people in the eye and smile at them, show our own sense of compassion and justice, be who we wish others were, and not let our frustration and anger turn to hate.
NB-

Good points. Your posts are always informative.

Maybe I was wishing things were different.

Sometimes reality kinda blows.

We need more compassion in the World.
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All animals should be respected & should have the ability to lead a natural & enjoyable life. This means not eating them, or abusing them in any way.
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#16 Old 03-02-2016, 07:18 PM
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I've become evangelical in every sly way possible, from sending family members links about Dr.McDougall and Forks Over Knives, emphasizing their good health above all, providing basic information, and not responding if they insist they'll still eat seafood, because that won't help anyone - pescetarians have a similar foot print to lacto-ovos, from the environmental standpoint.

I have Pinterist boards full of recipes, I push the conservative buttons with Pope Francis asking the world to eat less meat. With liberal folks, I invoke the UN, and on Facebook I only occasionally post vegan pushes, like Veganuary, or Vegan Valentine, so I won't automatically get unfriended.

Of course I'm going to just avoid some people, but I'm going to be the change I wish to see in the world instead of hiding in a hole. I can't wait to order some funny tee shirts to speak for me in public places. I already wear shirts that are environmental in nature, so this isn't a big leap for me to have a couple or three snarky vegan shirts.
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