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-   -   The controversy of Freelee (https://www.veggieboards.com/forum/60-vegan-support-forum/178529-controversy-freelee.html)

lightergait 05-12-2015 07:58 AM

The controversy of Freelee
 
Lately I seem to have come across so many people that are determined to paint Freelee as a bad person and a completely crazy, judgemental vegan.

I've always said her lifestyle can be considered extreme and not to listen to everything that she says, but am also aware that her overall message is great and clear and that she's a wonderful activist from having converted thousands of people to veganism.

Would any of you rather her not be in the public eye because of the stuff she does wrong, even though she's converted thousands? I guess it's a bit like the controversy of Gary.

River 05-12-2015 08:05 AM

I wonder how many people she has given an eating disorder to.

odizzido 05-12-2015 08:09 AM

Don't even know who that is.

River 05-12-2015 08:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by odizzido (Post 3645601)
Don't even know who that is.

A nut who eats like 60 bananas a day and has a habit of calling foods "bad". She "used to" have an eating disorder, apparently what she has now is just delightfully eccentric.

no whey jose 05-12-2015 08:27 AM

I've made a point not to give her any traffic, primarily for the reason River's mentioned. I did watch one of her videos, once, chosen at random. In it she complained that other women are jealous of her hot body, that they're just haters and b*****s, etc. I think I just grimaced and turned her off as quickly as I could. I don't understand how someone like that could inspire anyone-- except, unfortunately, because she's skinny and too many of us are desperate to lose weight no matter the cost.

odizzido 05-12-2015 08:30 AM

heh sounds charming.

David3 05-12-2015 08:34 AM

Freelee doesn't promote calorie-restriction. However, because of her extremely-thin physique (augmented with silicone breasts), she seems to attract a fair share of young women who already have eating disorders.

I used to participate in the "Vegetarian & Vegan" forum on Yahoo Answers. Anytime a young woman posted an interest in a raw vegan diet, I would automatically check her other publicly-posted questions in the "Diet" forum. Very often, the young woman's other posts made it obvious that she was obsessed with being thin, or was in "recovery" from anorexia, or was calorie-restricting.

no whey jose 05-12-2015 09:14 AM

An emphasis on "good" and "bad" foods is a hallmark of disordered eating. Freelee may not be restricting calories, but she's encouraging women to subsist primarily on fruit. In general, that's not a healthy or sustainable recommendation, and it's exactly the kind of thing that someone with an ED would grab onto. The whole thing just rubs me the wrong way, including Freelee's focus on her physical appearance. I just so desperately want to move on from all that. I can't see the benefit.

Muttley 05-12-2015 09:27 AM

i have her subscribed without notifications on youtube as well as follow her on IG, but i dont really watch many of her videos unless i see a title that strikes my fancy. she makes some good points, some points i dont necessarily agree with, and can get a little obnoxious sometimes when it seems like she's making videos just to make videos but she is a voice with alot of followers to spread the message of a cruelty free lifestyle, albeit a little too focused on the health and excercise side of veganism for me. Lately, it seems she is pushing eating large portions more and more and very anti-calorie restriction, maybe she's changing her tune a bit? i dont really read too deep into what she says about alot of subjects, (of course she has a book to peddle) or when it seems shes trying too hard but she can be still be entertaining as well as motivating to get out in the fresh air and excercise, or just something to have as background noise while doing other things. oddly enough, some of her posts have made me more aware of alot of vegan IG posts , generally young women, who seem to be very calorie centric and makes me a bit dis-heartened, so i susppose she is a good voice for not counting calories.

with the exception of Emily's Bite Size Vegan videos, there aren't alot of vegan themed youtube channels, who's videos i generally keep up with, but im sure there are alot that i dont know about that are lovely and could get into!

for referrence, im a big guy who doesnt count calories but tries to excercise regularly, so health/ excercise vids are nice/ can be motivating!

azerea_02 05-12-2015 10:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by River (Post 3645649)
A nut who eats like 60 bananas a day and has a habit of calling foods "bad". She "used to" have an eating disorder, apparently what she has now is just delightfully eccentric.

I think calling her a nut for eating a raw food diet is the same concept as carnists calling us nuts for eating a plant-based diet.

I think she's saying what a lot of vegans are thinking. There has never been a huge radical cultural shift without having a few feathers ruffled. I admire her courage for using blunt honesty.

River 05-12-2015 10:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by azerea_02 (Post 3645937)
I think calling her a nut for eating a raw food diet is the same concept as carnists calling us nuts for eating a plant-based diet.

I think she's saying what a lot of vegans are thinking. There has never been a huge radical cultural shift without having a few feathers ruffled. I admire her courage for using blunt honesty.

I am not calling her a nut for eating raw, I am calling her a nut for imposing unrealistic expectations onto people, promoting an eating disorder like ideology around food, and being obsessed with appearance to dangerous levels. She is the kind of person who give raw vegans, and vegans in general, a bad name.

It's not blunt honesty if it is fat shaming and eating disorder promoting, then it is just dangerous.

cuberail 05-12-2015 11:09 AM

She's alright but lately she's dropped the sunny positive side and is showing more of her true colors. She's angry, frustrated, and fed up with meat eaters.

This is the real challenge of veganism IMHO--how to stay positive in such a dark, violent, gruesome world.

I think a lot of her perspective is ok, since she has a history of overweight and wants to share what worked for her regarding normalizing her weight. They key, though, is that she is so active that she *can* eat that many calories. Most people are not that active.

I think her lowfat unrefined plant-based veganism is working for her (it worked for me for a time, too, when I did it in year 2000 but I could not keep it up--I ended up binging on fat, so now I include somewhat more fat and no more binges).

There are a lot of reasons why it could be a healthy choice (Ornish trials for reversing CHD, prostate cancer, lengthening telomeres and other trials for reversing type II diabetes) although I personally would not do so many dates and bananas. I need a lot more variety. Also I do not eat that much.

Not all people can eat as much as they want, even if it's unrefined plant foods with no added oils. Also she has no hard science background and it shows. I am positive that if she had a science background there would be more emphasis on vegetables and leaves, more variety in the starch sources, and more highlights from journal articles rather than pics of celebrities and bike rides. She would be much more informative.

But that's not what's popular.

I never understood why she got implants, though.

melimomTARDIS 05-12-2015 12:44 PM

I think freelee is beautiful. She is slim and fit, and seems to have quite a following.

However, quite a few of Her fans have serious eating disorders, and that is concerning, to say the least.

I prefer bitesizevegan, and "unnatural vegan" on YouTube. Those two make veganism look rational and do-able. Much more my style.

no whey jose 05-12-2015 01:00 PM

Yes, Emily from Bite Size Vegan is a much better role model and, IMO, much more beautiful than Freelee. I find that arrogance and vanity can really make people look unattractive.

River 05-12-2015 01:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by no whey jose (Post 3646129)
Yes, Emily from Bite Size Vegan is a much better role model and, IMO, much more beautiful than Freelee. I find that arrogance and vanity can really make people look unattractive.

Agreeeee.
@BiteSizeVegan

Tom 05-12-2015 01:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by no whey jose (Post 3645657)
I've made a point not to give her any traffic, primarily for the reason River's mentioned. I did watch one of her videos, once, chosen at random. In it she complained that other women are jealous of her hot body, that they're just haters and b*****s, etc. I think I just grimaced and turned her off as quickly as I could. I don't understand how someone like that could inspire anyone-- except, unfortunately, because she's skinny and too many of us are desperate to lose weight no matter the cost.

Yep. Fat shaming = NOT COOL.

If someone has health issues which are being caused or worsened by greater-than-ideal weight, they deserve support (and maybe counseling from someone who can tell them something constructive).

melimomTARDIS 05-12-2015 04:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by no whey jose (Post 3646129)
Yes, Emily from Bite Size Vegan is a much better role model and, IMO, much more beautiful than Freelee. I find that arrogance and vanity can really make people look unattractive.

i have seen 3 or 4 freelee videos in total, but I have seen every single bitesizedvegan video, I think that says something!

Naturebound 05-12-2015 05:30 PM

I only watched a few of Freelee's videos and was somewhat put off by her. I don't have any strong opinions of her one way or another, but I thought it was a bit disturbing in one video where she said it was "normal" to not have a period as a raw vegan and that everyone can achieve a thigh gap at a normal weight. If that isn't a bit disordered. As someone with a very short lifetime exposure to menstruation, I can attest to the damaging effects that has on a woman's skeletal structure, and it is not something to be taken lightly. Bones are living tissue, but they don't grow back too fast.

On the other hand, I think we spend way too much time tearing down famous vegan figures (men or women) for not being perfect and saintly and far too little time out in society speaking up for those without a voice.

RedPill 05-12-2015 08:25 PM

Freelee is a maniac. I don't think she even follows the diet she suggests. She also gives out totally incorrect advice about weight training.
Her husband, Durian Rider lives off a similar diet. He claims he's so strong from his fruity diet, but his lifts are not even intermediate level. He's also rumored to be on testosterone replacement therapy. On top of all that, he's being sued for slander or something.

There are too many 'celebrity' veg*ns that promote plant based diets for all the wrong reasons.

Purp 05-12-2015 11:36 PM

I have no idea who "Freelee" is...something to do with bananas?? Anyhow, I perfer Emily @BiteSizeVegan ..who gives good solid sound advice.

odizzido 05-13-2015 03:22 AM

There is another vegan person who I've watched a few videos from that is currently called unnatural vegan but I think used to be fitonraw

https://www.youtube.com/user/FitOnRaw/videos


I like her videos because she seems very rational and sensible. Apparently from her intro video she wasn't always so.

no whey jose 05-13-2015 03:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Naturebound (Post 3646289)
I only watched a few of Freelee's videos and was somewhat put off by her. I don't have any strong opinions of her one way or another, but I thought it was a bit disturbing in one video where she said it was "normal" to not have a period as a raw vegan and that everyone can achieve a thigh gap at a normal weight. If that isn't a bit disordered. As someone with a very short lifetime exposure to menstruation, I can attest to the damaging effects that has on a woman's skeletal structure, and it is not something to be taken lightly. Bones are living tissue, but they don't grow back too fast.

On the other hand, I think we spend way too much time tearing down famous vegan figures (men or women) for not being perfect and saintly and far too little time out in society speaking up for those without a voice.

I had no idea she was encouraging women to try for a "thigh gap." How irresponsible! I know that we're meant to be glad for anyone giving up animal products for any reason, but I can't support women going vegan as an excuse to starve themselves into their ideal shape. As vegans-- heck, as human beings-- I believe that we have a responsibility toward our fellow man, and this trend toward veganism as a method of concealing or excusing an eating disorder is completely unacceptable.

melimomTARDIS 05-13-2015 06:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by odizzido (Post 3646649)
There is another vegan person who I've watched a few videos from that is currently called unnatural vegan but I think used to be fitonraw

https://www.youtube.com/user/FitOnRaw/videos


I like her videos because she seems very rational and sensible. Apparently from her intro video she wasn't always so.

i havent seen any of her old videos back when she was "fit on raw" but I have seen a few of the newer ones as "unnatural vegan" and I really like her.

azerea_02 05-13-2015 06:17 AM

I'm overweight and I've never felt like she was fat shaming. She points out that being overweight is bad for health and we should all strive to be healthier. I agree with that message. I think she's just very raw when she speaks and doesn't sugar coat anything, and that seems to chafe certain people the wrong way. There are too many people out there trying to silence her for spreading the vegan message, and no one should ever be silenced for that.

She promotes eating as many calories as desired from high-carb whole foods. And people say this promotes eating disorders? She got sued trying to speak out AGAINST someone who WAS promoting eating disorders. Her heart is in the right place.

no whey jose 05-13-2015 07:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by azerea_02 (Post 3646825)
I'm overweight and I've never felt like she was fat shaming. She points out that being overweight is bad for health and we should all strive to be healthier. I agree with that message. I think she's just very raw when she speaks and doesn't sugar coat anything, and that seems to chafe certain people the wrong way. There are too many people out there trying to silence her for spreading the vegan message, and no one should ever be silenced for that.

She promotes eating as many calories as desired from high-carb whole foods. And people say this promotes eating disorders? She got sued trying to speak out AGAINST someone who WAS promoting eating disorders. Her heart is in the right place.

"Thin" and "healthy" are not synonymous. Neither are "overweight" and "unhealthy." Encouraging women of all shapes and sizes to attempt to lose enough weight to obtain a thigh gap (which is physically impossible for many), and promoting the idea that amenorrhea is "normal" on a vegan diet is decidedly not healthy and could potentially cause a great deal of harm to a great number of vulnerable people. I'm sorry, but she's not a credible spokesperson for veganism and she's certainly not someone that any woman should admire.

Between this and Beyonce, I'm tempted to make a new thread showcasing strong female vegetarian role models like Jane Goodall and Ellen DeGeneres.

azerea_02 05-13-2015 08:44 AM

There are vegans who believe vegansim should be the moral baseline and will stand up for it in any situation regardless of what people think of them, then there are vegans who believe it's better to coddle carnists lest they create a bit of friction between two people, nevermind that it would be in the name of speaking up for innocent lives. Alteast Freelee practices what she preaches. I myself am kind of in the middle of those views and believe people both like Freelee and Jane Goodall can be considered role models.

This thread has ignored everything Freelee has said in every video she has published, except for a couple of lines from a couple of videos, taken out of context and blown out of proportion, in order to bash someone just because they said something you disagree with. This is the same tactic carnists try to take down vegans. If you want to bash someone for promoting eating disorders, there are tens of thousands of other people we can pick on. Leave those on the vegan team alone. Or better yet, here's a novel concept, let's stop attacking each other and instead support each other to present a united front!

no whey jose 05-13-2015 09:03 AM

I'll publicly disapprove of anyone who promotes eating disorders, vegan or otherwise, because women starving or exercising themselves into oblivion is just as important an issue as animal rights. This particular thread happens to be about Freelee. I hardly think that calling out a celebrity for giving dangerous health advice to thousands of followers can be considered "bashing."

azerea_02 05-13-2015 09:18 AM

Except that she doesn't promote eating disorders. Being accused of starving herself and exercising endlessly is something she has been accused of countless times and addressed in her videos also countless times. Like I said : a couple of lines from a couple of videos, taken out of context and blown out of proportion. I really don't know where you get that she gives out "dangerous health advice". I have been following her for years and she has always promoted eating healthy foods in healthy quantities with a healthy exercise routine.

azerea_02 05-13-2015 10:14 AM

Further to prove my point that comments are being taken out of context: I never said that skinny=healthy (and neither has Freelee). What I said (and Freelee says in her videos): overweight=detrimental to optimal health. I am a healthy person, and I am also 30 lbs overweight. But it's still a fact that if I lost those extra pounds in a healthy sustainable way (which is all Freelee ever advocated for), that I would be healthIER for it. But people get so defensive towards her that they end up twisting her words into something she never said and then putting her down for it.

Furthermore, I must point out the double standard that so many people accuse her of fat shaming, but completely get away with skinny shaming her (not necessarily in this thread, but in general).

And if this thread is to discuss Freelee, I don't know why Durian Rider, who's not even her husband btw, is being brought into this as another way of painting Freelee with a negative light.

And lastly, I don't agree with everything Freelee says or does. But I understand she is a human being and like all of us, is forever evolving as a person. She HAS evolved over the years, and has been doing the best she can during her several years of being in the public eye, which is NOT an easy feat! So many people would have been ruined, thrown into a well of depression, going through the flack she has gone through. She is a strong person who is doing a heck of a lot more for the world than I am and so I would never give myself the right to try and tear anyone like that down.

no whey jose 05-13-2015 10:46 AM

The controversy of Freelee
 
Here she is giving dangerous health advice and fat shaming in full context, then.

How I lost my period on a RAW VEGAN Diet: https://youtu.be/A0ptJE79npA

Can every woman get a THIGH GAP?: https://youtu.be/VCWY32-AOLU

FAT Acceptance FAT Shaming: https://youtu.be/eP0gtM5pcoU


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