I was eagerly looking forward to become a vegetarian until I heard this - VeggieBoards
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#1 Old 07-12-2015, 04:58 AM
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I was eagerly looking forward to become a vegetarian until I heard this

So I am hoping to become a vegetarian once I get my first salary. I felt sorry for the animals(I only eat chicken and fish so far) so I am hoping to become a vegetarian soon.

I wanted to save the chicken from their suffering so I am going to be a vegetarian. But I recently heard that chicken are still being tortured for eggs. Since I am not even close to giving up eating eggs (as it doesn't kill animals), I do not see a point of being a vegetarian any more. They are going to suffer anyway. Eggs or meat. Now I feel de-motivated. What should I do?

No I am not going to be a Vegan.

Thanks.
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#2 Old 07-12-2015, 06:04 AM
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Every little bit counts -- it is better to do *something* than to do *nothing,* even if you can't do everything. It's ok that you are not ready to tackle giving up eggs right now.

Here is my challenge for you: Give up meat without increasing your egg consumption. As a compromise, you could try to find a local farm where you at least can see that the hens are treated well (even if they are eventually slaughtered when they have outlived their peak production). It's not a perfect solution, but maybe you can live with it until you are ready to make more changes.

After you have given up the meat, you could start thinking about reducing your egg consumption. You could give up eggs at home but eat lacto-ovo vegetarian when you are with friends or at a restaurant. Try some vegan alternatives to eggs -- for example, VegWeb has a pretty good list of egg alternatives. Tofu scrambles are easy and delicious (and you don't need to worry about contaminating your kitchen with salmonella), and Ener-G egg replacer is actually very cheap per use and handier to keep on hand for use in baked goods than real eggs.

Good luck with becoming vegetarian, and don't lose hope. You will be making a difference even if you don't become vegan.
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#3 Old 07-12-2015, 06:49 AM
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I second what runnerveggie said!
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#4 Old 07-12-2015, 09:05 AM
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In theory eggs simply come from hens naturally, they just pop out and lay on the ground. Sometimes the hen will eat them (like the human placenta is eaten by some people) or they become food for other animals. The eggs you find packaged in stores come from hens that are tightly packed in wire cages surrounded by their own waste, often have their beaks cut off with hot clippers, and often never seeing daylight. In breeding egg laying chickens the ones that hatch as males are killed off in various ways since they aren't a breed good for meat

If you are that adament about continuing to eat eggs how about doing some research on farms or private families that are responsible for keeping good conditions? There are people who rescue hens from factory conditions that sell eggs

What are your reasons for not wanting to quit eggs?

Why do you consider throwing everything under the bus just because you can't save every life? If you were to see a dozen children struggling in a lake, about to drown, would you pass by because you could only save 2 at the most? Or would you do what you could to save some?

My biggest problem with the attitute of 'why bother' is how it reflects on the people around us. I may wish that everyone become vegan, BUT, I adore the ones who think about meatless Mondays or look at vegetarian recipes and have meatless meals. I'm inspired by those who are willing to open their eyes to the lives that they consume. It all adds up, and it inspires the next generation, whose tastes will have changed, and can more easily enbrace different choices. Most of us today weren't raised with veg'n choices and that makes it harder to change

don't let perfect be the enemy of good!
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#5 Old 07-12-2015, 09:09 AM
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If you can get to an Indian store ask for black salt--Kala Namak. It's tastes unbelievably like eggs. My son missed having scrambled eggs and now sprinkles that on tofu scramble. He even sprinkles it on toast with margarine, and fried rice

You can find it online, but in Indian stores it's like $2 or $3 dollars a good sized bag. Whole Foods has many types as well
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#6 Old 07-12-2015, 09:11 AM
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You know the starfish story? Think about it personally...
One day a man was walking along the beach when he noticed
a boy picking something up and gently throwing it into the ocean.

Approaching the boy, he asked, �What are you doing?�
The youth replied, �Throwing starfish back into the ocean.
The surf is up and the tide is going out. If I don�t throw them back, they�ll die.�

�Son,� the man said, �don�t you realize there are miles and miles of beach and hundreds of starfish?
You can�t make a
difference!�

After listening politely, the boy bent down, picked up another starfish,
and threw it back into the surf. Then, smiling at the
man, he said��
I made a difference for that one.�

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#7 Old 07-12-2015, 09:33 AM
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May i ask, why are you "not going to be vegan?"
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#8 Old 07-12-2015, 10:45 AM
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I've been a vegetarian for years. Then I found out that egg and milk production stinks a lot. Though I keep on eating dairies and eggs, I try not to abuse of them. I haven't gone back to eating meat because the difference you make between eating meat and being a lacto-ovo-vegetarian is already HUGE. In terms of slaughtering (you don't get one chicken per week killed for you alone), in terms of environment too (look at the pig production : from them we get more manure than we can use). Also because I find it disgusting to put dead animals in my mouth, while their secretion don't disturb me that much (yes I know about the pus).

As Silva said, don't let perfect be the enemy of good !

Also, vegetarian food is very tasty. I'm back from holidays in Switzerland. I was the only vegetarian in the group and the whole table was so jealous of the dishes I was served in the refuge !
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Bon appétit !
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#9 Old 07-12-2015, 01:48 PM
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You should still be vegetarian, try going vegetarian now and maybe down the road you can give up eggs. You are still helping by being vegetarian and trying to do something.
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#10 Old 07-12-2015, 09:06 PM
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Originally Posted by silva View Post
If you can get to an Indian store ask for black salt--Kala Namak. It's tastes unbelievably like eggs. My son missed having scrambled eggs and now sprinkles that on tofu scramble. He even sprinkles it on toast with margarine, and fried rice

You can find it online, but in Indian stores it's like $2 or $3 dollars a good sized bag. Whole Foods has many types as well

Even stranger: This salt, if sprinkled on avocado, provides both the taste AND texture of hard-boiled egg yolk. If you like eggs, you'll be pleasantly surprised.

_________

Specific recommendations for a healthy diet include: eating more fruit, vegetables, legumes, nuts and grains; cutting down on salt, sugar and fats. It is also advisable to choose unsaturated fats, instead of saturated fats and towards the elimination of trans-fatty acids."
- United Nations' World Health Organization
http://www.who.int/topics/diet/en/
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#11 Old 07-13-2015, 02:24 AM
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So I am hoping to become a vegetarian once I get my first salary. I felt sorry for the animals(I only eat chicken and fish so far) so I am hoping to become a vegetarian soon.

I wanted to save the chicken from their suffering so I am going to be a vegetarian. But I recently heard that chicken are still being tortured for eggs. Since I am not even close to giving up eating eggs (as it doesn't kill animals), I do not see a point of being a vegetarian any more. They are going to suffer anyway. Eggs or meat. Now I feel de-motivated. What should I do?

No I am not going to be a Vegan.

Thanks.
I'm not sure I understand your logic.

You want to save chickens, but because the egg industry is cruel, you're going to continue to eat chickens?

If your goal is to help chickens, not eating them is still going to help them a lot more than continuing to eat them. Don't you think?


If you feel that not eating chickens is too small of a difference to make, that it's not a perfect solution, then I would ask you look at the numbers.

While I'm in no way trying to discount the suffering of all animals, on sheer numbers alone, the suffering of chickens is huge. 9 billion killed in the U.S each year, means that if people stopped eating chickens, 9 billion lives wouldn't have to be filled with so much pain.

For every one person that stops eating animals, we get closer to decreasing the amount of animals kills for meat. You may not be the one that tips the scales, but just being on the vegetarian side of the scales, gets us that much closer.

Do you feel it's still counter productive to stop eating chickens, but continue eating eggs?

It does depend on what your goal is. If you don't want any chickens to suffer, then the answer is ultimately to give up eggs and chickens as a form of food (unless you have your own pet chickens).

But, I get the feeling you think meat chickens and egg chickens are the same thing, when they're not. Meat chickens are known as 'broilers', where egg chickens are known as 'layers' (as far as I've always known them to be). By not eating meat chickens, you're at least landing a blow to that part of the industry. As long as you don't increase your egg consumption, you're at least doing something to help the chickens.

One part of your post struck me though.....That eggs "don't kill animals". It does.

It's up to you as to whether you're okay with that. When I ate eggs, I was of the belief that if we changed our mindset around animals, that we could make egg production a less cruel industry.

When I found out that it went beyond small cages and hellish living conditions, I stopped eating eggs. The boy chicks are killed at a day or two old (in some horrifying ways). When the egg production falls for the hens, they get killed as well and they're not that old. It's not like they're there for years and years. Due to the species of chicken they've chosen to use as egg producers, they produce a lot over a short period of time and then stop producing eggs. To me, they're practically still babies.

Still, even if all you do for chickens right now, is stop eating them then you'll be making a difference for them. You've said you don't want them to be hurt, so don't be afraid to live your own morals, even if it's a bit imperfect and isn't going to solve all the problems at once. Start with this one thing and then see where it takes you.
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Last edited by Tiger Lilly; 07-13-2015 at 02:27 AM.
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#12 Old 07-13-2015, 07:50 AM
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You know how many more cows and pigs and chickens would die if every vegetarian thought that way?
Also, you try to do what you can. None of us are perfect.
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#13 Old 07-13-2015, 08:35 PM
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If you can get to an Indian store ask for black salt--Kala Namak. It's tastes unbelievably like eggs. My son missed having scrambled eggs and now sprinkles that on tofu scramble. He even sprinkles it on toast with margarine, and fried rice

You can find it online, but in Indian stores it's like $2 or $3 dollars a good sized bag. Whole Foods has many types as well
I have to try that! maybe in a chickpea salad
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#14 Old 07-16-2015, 04:57 AM
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SilverCat -

My suggestion would be to visit a poultry farm.

See what's really going on.

Then make an informed decision.
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All animals should be respected & should have the ability to lead a natural & enjoyable life. This means not eating them, or abusing them in any way.
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#15 Old 07-26-2015, 10:20 PM
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I really appreciate all the replies! Thanks.

My main reason to not to give up eggs is that they are a cheap good complete protien source. They come in handy. I am in to body building and need high protien. I also have a limtied budget.
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#16 Old 07-26-2015, 11:07 PM
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I really appreciate all the replies! Thanks.

My main reason to not to give up eggs is that they are a cheap good complete protien source. They come in handy. I am in to body building and need high protien. I also have a limtied budget.
Do you like beans? Beans are super cheap and a great source of protein. Also peanut butter!
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#17 Old 07-27-2015, 09:29 AM
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I have a feeling there are no incognito Hollywood stars on this forum, so we are all "on a budget." The main vegan and vegetarian foods are rice, beans, vegetables and fruit. Maybe a bit of oil. Extras like Tofu, Peanut butter and all sorts of expensive ready made food is an option. That's it. This can be done cheaply, or more spendy depending on your whims and budget.

I am not a body builder, but I have seen various photos, and bios of vegan bodybuilders, and cannot see why one would need eggs for protein.

All food has protein. Think of the elephant, the biggest land animal out there. Does he sneak eggs when we are not looking? No, he gets protein from grasses and leaves. This is not a tiny little skinny animal, this is an animal who is like a walking mountain of muscles.

The chicken argument is logical, but the conclusion is a slippery slope. All chickens will end up being eaten (unless they are wild or a personal pet). Layers are kept around as long as they can put out a certain amount of eggs per day. Then when they reach a certain age, like 3 or 4, they are sent off to soup factories, or dog food. The same goes for milk cows. I live in a milk producing town with lots of dairies around. I even worked at a dairy once and saw what they do there. You see those cattle trucks with black and white "milk" cows going to the Cargill feed lot on Route 70 between Texaco and Amarillo. In the mix of doomed cattle out there, you see black and white milk cows. Basically in a sense too much of an economy has been built on the bits and pieces of dead animals. Every part is used. It is not probable that in My and your lifetime the rainbow farting unicorn will come down and make farm animals into cherished pets and regrow the rain forests. Yes, this is sarcasm. However, to stop doing something that you feel in your heart you must do because you cannot singlehandedly stop the evil empire is your choice. I cannot stop the milk industry, or the egg industry or the meat industry alone. But I can refuse to buy their wares.
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#18 Old 07-27-2015, 09:48 AM
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do the best you can. as a personal challenge, try to replace your meat consumption with veggie protiens, and not increase your current dairy and egg intake.

ie- if you typically order pepperoni pizza, try ordering meatless pizzas instead. you will be using less animal products overall by doing that.

Also, one step at a time, is the way to start any journey.
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#19 Old 07-27-2015, 12:12 PM
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Try looking for these brands.... (I'm sure you can find store locations on their websites.)

-- The Happy Egg Co. (I get these.... they are DEEELISH!) ---- You could also check out Vital Farms/Backyard Eggs

-- Rumiano organic cheese (with vegetarian enzymes... NO animal rennet!)

Also, the adorable, little, round Babybel cheeses are veg-friendly... not organic, but if you need a cheese fix, these are really quite amazing & easily found in most groceries.

I wish you the best of luck. Chin up! This is an adventure! Get sleuthing, & may the force be with you.... ;-)
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#20 Old 07-27-2015, 12:35 PM
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Try looking for these brands.... (I'm sure you can find store locations on their websites.)

-- The Happy Egg Co. (I get these.... they are DEEELISH!) ---- You could also check out Vital Farms/Backyard Eggs

-- Rumiano organic cheese (with vegetarian enzymes... NO animal rennet!)

Also, the adorable, little, round Babybel cheeses are veg-friendly... not organic, but if you need a cheese fix, these are really quite amazing & easily found in most groceries.

I wish you the best of luck. Chin up! This is an adventure! Get sleuthing, & may the force be with you.... ;-)
Unfortunately, the Happy Egg Company isn't so happy. Male baby chicks are gassed to death immediately after birth, as are all hens when their productivity drops (which is quite young.) Here's an email from the company:

"Thank you for your email to the happy egg co and your questions. We put the care for our hens at the forefront of whatever we do, which includes how we care for them at the end of their laying life.            

Hen productivity declines as they age, and they stop laying eggs that we can supply to supermarkets at around 72 weeks of age.  At this age they are taken to our facility where hens are exposed to a non-aversive gas to end their lives, this all happens in accordance with guidelines laid down by the RSPCA’s Freedom Food Scheme and the Humane Slaughter Association.    

As it is only hens which lay eggs, male chicks cannot be used on laying farms. We cannot have any cockerels on our happy egg farms as we would risk hens laying fertilised eggs.  At present in the industry there is no way to only hatch female chicks.  Hatcheries are fully focussed on to the most humane ways to remove the male chicks which are identified by their feather colour.  The males are then exposed to a non-aversive gas again in line with Humane Slaughter Association and Freedom Food guidelines.   

We sincerely hope this is enough to assure you that we do all we can to make this process as humane as possible. If you have any further questions please do not hesitate to contact us, we will be more than happy to help.  

With Kind regards  

www.thehappyegg.co.uk"
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#21 Old 07-27-2015, 01:09 PM
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Ughhh... thanks for the encouraging words. **sigh** LOL :-\ I love eggs, I love cheese.... and I can do amazing things with both. What producers (in or around Michigan, preferably) can I trust to be humane in their practices?? Are these poor gassed hens then used for food elsewhere, or are they treated as garbage? This make me ill. I've already cut out SO much in my diet (super low sodium, NO ADDED SALT when I cook, no animal "enzymes"/gelatin/vitamin A palmitate, etc... no restaurant/take-food, no preservative-laden processed crapola, organic/non-GMO whenever possible, even better if locally farmed)....

I'm so tired of bad news & I don't want to feel like a fraud. That being said, I don't want "fake" food either (food masquerading as other food, meaning no egg-like substitutes, no cashew-cheese, and absolutely NO tofu.... yick.)

I hope I can get some helpful information that will make me feel better instead of worse. Thanks muchly.


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#22 Old 07-27-2015, 01:22 PM
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I don't have so many rules.
1. Nothing from an animal.
2. Make it healthy, but make it taste great, too.

And tofu is not a "fake" food.
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#23 Old 07-27-2015, 01:25 PM
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I have to try that! maybe in a chickpea salad
It tastes like egg salad! I used the mashed chickpeas, Just Mayo, chopped celery, diced onion, salt, celery seed, and the black salt. Mmm
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#24 Old 07-27-2015, 01:30 PM
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Don't like mayo... and wow, that looks like a lot of salt! LOL! Thanks but no thanks.


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#25 Old 07-27-2015, 01:31 PM
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Neither are cashews.... but they most certainly are not cheese. See what I'm getting at here? LOL


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#26 Old 07-27-2015, 01:36 PM
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Don't like mayo... and wow, that looks like a lot of salt! LOL! Thanks but no thanks.
Well, we all have different tastes, don't we? I am an RN who has been successfully vegan for over a decade now, so I think I know how to prepare food that is both healthy and tasty.

Since I live in a very hot climate (with 2 other vegans, one of whom is an athlete), and use very little air conditioning, some salt is required in our diets due to the loss of electrolytes as well as fluids. It isn't like I am pouring teaspoons of salt in the mix.
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#27 Old 07-27-2015, 03:48 PM
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I don't have so many rules.
1. Nothing from an animal.
2. Make it healthy, but make it taste great, too.

And tofu is not a "fake" food.
I know it's not "fake," silly.... But I'm not easily fooled. I'm VERY big on the texture & "mouth feel" of food. I've given tofu more than enough chances.... I'll never be a fan, that's just the way it goes. LOL


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#28 Old 07-27-2015, 04:28 PM
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Remember that we are in the vegetarian forum, not the vegan one. There are many reasons to become vegan, but not everyone wants to make that step or is ready to make those changes in their life.

As far as "fake" foods -- of course this is kind of a misnomer. Vegan versions merely pay homage to the nonvegan version, emulating a few qualities (texture or flavor, perhaps) but it's best to consider them as their own entity rather than an exact replica. There are a few veggie foods that could actually fool people (veggie burger crumbles in chili or taco meat, or perhaps veggie turkey deli slices), but vegan egg and dairy technologies haven't quite come this far yet.

Thankfully, if you don't like tofu, there is no need to consume it even if you were vegan (even if I do think you probably just haven't had it prepared the right way yet!).

There is certainly no nutritional need to consume eggs or dairy or their vegan counterparts, but you can certainly reduce your negative impact on animals without giving up eggs and dairy.
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#29 Old 07-27-2015, 06:46 PM
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Indian food is my idea for great vegan eats. No need for much salt for all those spices, and very easy to find vegan. Certainly without egg or meat.
I hate when people dis on tofu. But, it's good for people to realize just how plant based eating styles are so varied.

I've gotten hooked on blending silken tofu with bananas, lemon juice, and a bit of syrup. Put in freezer just enough to freeze around the edges and it's delish! Or with cocoa.... or good vanilla, or strawberries and a good spoon of cornstarch
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#30 Old 07-27-2015, 07:44 PM
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It tastes like egg salad! I used the mashed chickpeas, Just Mayo, chopped celery, diced onion, salt, celery seed, and the black salt. Mmm
I've made that.....and it's YUMMY!!!!
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All animals should be respected & should have the ability to lead a natural & enjoyable life. This means not eating them, or abusing them in any way.
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