Creating a genuinely healthy fad diet - VeggieBoards
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#1 Old 02-12-2016, 08:52 AM
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Creating a genuinely healthy fad diet

I had a thought today, and I don't know if it's worth anything but I figured I would throw it out there anyway. I was thinking about all the popular recent fad diets (Raw Til 4, Paleo, the Potato Cleanse, etc) and I wondered what would happen if we were to promote a genuinely healthy diet program-- I mean both physically and psychologically healthy, with no extreme restriction and no body shaming-- using the same tactics which are used to promote fad diets: a catchy name, bright and well-edited YouTube videos, hashtags on social media, that sort of thing. Do you think it would catch on?
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#2 Old 02-12-2016, 08:55 AM
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Would it be a vegan diet program?
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#3 Old 02-12-2016, 09:13 AM
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I had a thought today, and I don't know if it's worth anything but I figured I would throw it out there anyway. I was thinking about all the popular recent fad diets (Raw Til 4, Paleo, the Potato Cleanse, etc) and I wondered what would happen if we were to promote a genuinely healthy diet program-- I mean both physically and psychologically healthy, with no extreme restriction and no body shaming-- using the same tactics which are used to promote fad diets: a catchy name, bright and well-edited YouTube videos, hashtags on social media, that sort of thing. Do you think it would catch on?
I think pretty much anything can become successful if marketed effectively, but to do that you have to understand what kind of audience you're pitching it at.

Also you need to decide what your USP is. What's so different from all the other fad programmes out there and how will you get the audience you're trying to reach engaged and excited by what you're offering?

Perhaps for starters you could go through all the existent successful programmes and determine what exactly their flaws are and where people fall down on them. Some online polls might help there.

There's also going to be a slew of psychological studies one could draw on too to do with what motivates people and keeps them motivated, if you like research.

I think it's an interesting idea, though there's one hell of a load of competition in this market.
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#4 Old 02-12-2016, 09:15 AM
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It has been done successfully before. The Pritikin program was very successful in the 1980s: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pritikin_Diet . His book sold 10 million copies, and the book was on the New York Times Top 10 Bestseller list for more than a year.

The Pritikin diet is based on whole grains, legumes, fruits, and vegetables. Small amounts of animal foods are permitted, but not required. For cardiac patients, the program recommends no more than 4 ounces of lean meat per week. The diet fully accommodates and encourages the vegan option.

http://healthyeating.sfgate.com/eat-...diet-9511.html

https://www.pritikin.com/healthiest-...in-eating-plan

Dr. John McDougall did an interview with Nathan Pritikin in 1982:

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Specific recommendations for a healthy diet include: eating more fruit, vegetables, legumes, nuts and grains; cutting down on salt, sugar and fats. It is also advisable to choose unsaturated fats, instead of saturated fats and towards the elimination of trans-fatty acids."
- United Nations' World Health Organization
http://www.who.int/topics/diet/en/

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#5 Old 02-12-2016, 09:16 AM
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We could certainly do with something that calls out 'accepted wisdom' on BMI as a sound indicator of health.

Particularly in the vegan world where thinness is absolutely seen as representing a superior kind of being. Thinking here in particular of popular YouTube channels like Freelee which celebrate thigh gaps and shame ("offer help to") celebrities for putting on a few pounds. Then there's that "Skinny B1tch" book that was really successful not so long ago, again emphasising the relationship between good, thin and vegan.

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#6 Old 02-12-2016, 10:03 AM
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I think it's an interesting idea, though there's one hell of a load of competition in this market.
Yeah, this is the difficult part. With YouTube, there are thousands of people trying to attract attention. It's clear that accurate facts and figures are of no use; some people have gained incredible popularity, even while spouting gross lies.
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_________

Specific recommendations for a healthy diet include: eating more fruit, vegetables, legumes, nuts and grains; cutting down on salt, sugar and fats. It is also advisable to choose unsaturated fats, instead of saturated fats and towards the elimination of trans-fatty acids."
- United Nations' World Health Organization
http://www.who.int/topics/diet/en/
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#7 Old 02-12-2016, 10:13 AM
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We could certainly do with something that calls out 'accepted wisdom' on BMI as a sound indicator of health.

Particularly in the vegan world where thinness is absolutely seen as representing a superior kind of being. Thinking here in particular of popular YouTube channels like Freelee which celebrate thigh gaps and shame ("offer help to") celebrities for putting on a few pounds. Then there's that "Skinny B1tch" book that was really successful not so long ago, again emphasising the relationship between good, thin and vegan.
Yeah, I was thinking of something diametrically opposed to Freelee, something which promotes a healthy relationship with food and an acceptance of one's body no matter its size or shape, with an emphasis not on weight loss but on overall physical and mental health and happiness.

Fad diets don't produce long-term results because they aren't sustainable. It's nearly impossible for someone who doesn't eat particularly healthily to suddenly adopt an extremely demanding or restrictive diet program and to keep it going indefinitely. In order for a diet to truly work, it would need to be sustainable throughout an entire lifetime. Nobody is going to be happy or healthy by counting calories or by never eating a drop of fat or by only eating fruit FOREVER. It's just an insane thing to expect of someone. Eventually they will fail, feel defeated, and end up in a worse place than when they began.

What if we were able to sell lifestyle changes that were actually sustainable and accessible to everyone? I'm thinking maybe of monthly steps, a very slow process of rethinking food and exercise.

As an example, one step could be: "Without changing anything else in your regular diet, find a way to incorporate vegetables so that you genuinely enjoy eating them. Buy several different types of vegetables each week of this month and explore all the ways to prepare them. Bake, grill, roast, sautee, stir fry, whatever-- just find at least four vegetable dishes by the end of the month that you really, truly enjoy. Don't settle for something that you can tolerate; find something that makes you go back for seconds and thirds." We could offer guidance on which vegetables might be good to try and recipes for how to prepare them.
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#8 Old 02-12-2016, 10:15 AM
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The most successful diet promoters seem to harness a myth or story. For example, the "Paleo" diet is based on the myth of the fierce caveman hunter. This is what grabs people. People are willing to overlook outright lies, if you have a story that captures them.

_________

Specific recommendations for a healthy diet include: eating more fruit, vegetables, legumes, nuts and grains; cutting down on salt, sugar and fats. It is also advisable to choose unsaturated fats, instead of saturated fats and towards the elimination of trans-fatty acids."
- United Nations' World Health Organization
http://www.who.int/topics/diet/en/
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#9 Old 02-12-2016, 10:25 AM
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The most successful diet promoters seem to harness a myth or story. For example, the "Paleo" diet is based on the myth of the fierce caveman hunter. This is what grabs people. People are willing to overlook outright lies, if you have a story that captures them.
Surely there's a nice story somewhere in here.

I think that the focus would be on finding things that are both healthy and genuinely enjoyable. I believe that there MUST be at least a few healthy recipes out there for everyone and that someone can gradually learn to prefer the taste of healthy foods if it's a fun, relaxed, pleasant experience rather than a gruelling exercise in willpower and self-denial.
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#10 Old 02-12-2016, 10:54 AM
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What if we were able to sell lifestyle changes that were actually sustainable and accessible to everyone? I'm thinking maybe of monthly steps, a very slow process of rethinking food and exercise.

As an example, one step could be: "Without changing anything else in your regular diet, find a way to incorporate vegetables so that you genuinely enjoy eating them. Buy several different types of vegetables each week of this month and explore all the ways to prepare them. Bake, grill, roast, sautee, stir fry, whatever-- just find at least four vegetable dishes by the end of the month that you really, truly enjoy. Don't settle for something that you can tolerate; find something that makes you go back for seconds and thirds." We could offer guidance on which vegetables might be good to try and recipes for how to prepare them.
I'm completely sold on slow gradual adoption of healthy habits. Evolution not revolution. I do this myself when I buy a self-help book. There may only be one thing in that whole book that clicks for me, but if it clicks I'll try it and if it works then I keep it up. One solid habit a month is a good amount; I think (don't quote me) that it typically takes about three weeks of doing something regularly for it to start to feel like a normal part of your routine (like brushing your teeth) rather than some dreadful 'good for me' chore you feel obliged to do but don't really want to.

I'm also sold on beginning with tiny bite-sized chunks in order to initiate the establishment of a long-term habit. Anyone, literally anyone, can manage ten minutes of doing something, whatever it is and however much you don't fancy doing it. Whether it be taking a walk, trying a new fruit, or meditating.

I also think it helps to do a bit of thinking and figure out from past experience, what strategies are effective for you, how you tick and what gets you turned off or on to something. A questionnaire as a part of a health programme might be good for this kind of self analysis.
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#11 Old 02-12-2016, 11:01 AM
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Surely there's a nice story somewhere in here.
Testimonials in the form of personal 'journeys' make *excellent* stories.
A lot of TV works well on this basis. Including body positive shows like Gok Wan's stuff glamming up big girls.

A trial group would be needed for this, and ideally for trying out the programme before going fully live.

Might be worth talking to HAES and seeing if there might be some interest among members in exploring a vegan approach to health and wellness from a body positive perspective?
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#12 Old 02-12-2016, 11:02 AM
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Yes, exactly that sort of thing. I know that people want the instant gratification promised by fad diets ("I lost 30 lbs and changed my eye colour in three months!") but I'm sure that, after failing so many times, people will want something they can actually absorb into their daily lives.

If I ever were to do this, I wouldn't want to literally sell anything-- I mean, I wouldn't want to publish a book or make any money off it. There's so much of that going on, people profiting off others' insecurities. It would be so nice to redirect some of that traffic from the "thinspo" path to a more reasonable, forgiving way of changing habits.
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#13 Old 02-12-2016, 11:15 AM
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A loving compassionate approach to health and wellness, which unites both compassion towards oneself as well as to other animals might be a good focus?

I think a lot of attempts at weight loss is sadly motivated by self-hate and particularly hatred of the body, which only results in destructive cycles of self abuse.

The vegan message spends a lot of time emphasising compassion towards other animals, but sadly there's an equal amount of misanthropy and hatred of the human species thrown into the mix there too (as well as the fat shaming), which is counterproductive on all levels.
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Last edited by Spudulika; 02-12-2016 at 11:17 AM.
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#14 Old 02-12-2016, 11:28 AM
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Martian Song Vegan youtube channel?

You could post your channel here.
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Specific recommendations for a healthy diet include: eating more fruit, vegetables, legumes, nuts and grains; cutting down on salt, sugar and fats. It is also advisable to choose unsaturated fats, instead of saturated fats and towards the elimination of trans-fatty acids."
- United Nations' World Health Organization
http://www.who.int/topics/diet/en/
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#15 Old 02-12-2016, 11:59 AM
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Fat people are now to blame for starving people.
As well as for the animal industry.

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#16 Old 02-12-2016, 01:37 PM
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A loving compassionate approach to health and wellness, which unites both compassion towards oneself as well as to other animals might be a good focus?

I think a lot of attempts at weight loss is sadly motivated by self-hate and particularly hatred of the body, which only results in destructive cycles of self abuse.

The vegan message spends a lot of time emphasising compassion towards other animals, but sadly there's an equal amount of misanthropy and hatred of the human species thrown into the mix there too (as well as the fat shaming), which is counterproductive on all levels.
Oh, I really like this! Yes, a focus on compassion for oneself and for others.

I know exactly what you mean about weight loss being fuelled by self-hatred. It's only in the last few years that I've finally begun to realize that my body is amazing and that I should be taking better care of it -- ironically, when I'm at my highest weight ever. It would mean a lot if I could nudge others in this direction, because it's been a wonderfully freeing experience.
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Martian Song Vegan youtube channel?

You could post your channel here.
Aww, that's sweet. 😊 Maybe I will. I have no experience with editing or anything. Does anyone here know anything about that? Maybe Emily @Bite Sized Vegan?
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Fat people are now to blame for starving people.
As well as for the animal industry.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zZ3nEtiHU8Q
I couldn't even watch all of that. I hate that this is how vegans are being represented. It's shallowness masquerading as compassion. Have they seriously never met a fat vegan??
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#17 Old 02-12-2016, 01:48 PM
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Aww, that's sweet. 😊 Maybe I will. I have no experience with editing or anything. Does anyone here know anything about that? Maybe Emily @Bite Sized Vegan?
If you ever need any help with this, I could help you out. I have a degree in computer animation, and studied film editing all throughout University and High School.
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#18 Old 02-12-2016, 02:03 PM
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I couldn't even watch all of that. I hate that this is how vegans are being represented. It's shallowness masquerading as compassion. Have they seriously never met a fat vegan??
What pisses me off about that video is that they are focusing on the miniscule proportion of women models who are 'fat' for their criticism, as though these women because they eat more (I guess they do) are somehow more responsible than all the other billions of people on the planet for the animal industry.

Newsflash: fat people and thin people eat animals every day. Shaming the tiny percentage of fat models will not encourage anyone to go vegan, just because they, like most people (or models), aren't vegan.

And yes, there are fat vegans! Not that the Toobers want to admit it. According to them, anyone who stays fat, is simply doing vegan incorrectly. Natch.
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#19 Old 02-12-2016, 02:09 PM
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If you ever need any help with this, I could help you out. I have a degree in computer animation, and studied film editing all throughout University and High School.
That would be amazing! @Spudulika and I are hoping to actually turn this into something real. Would you be able to help us with the video part of it when we get that far?
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#20 Old 02-12-2016, 02:09 PM
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What pisses me off about that video is that they are focusing on the miniscule proportion of women models who are 'fat' for their criticism, as though these women because they eat more (I guess they do) are somehow more responsible than all the other billions of people on the planet for the animal industry.

Newsflash: fat people and thin people eat animals every day. Shaming the tiny percentage of fat models will not encourage anyone to go vegan, just because they, like most people (or models), aren't vegan.

And yes, there are fat vegans! Not that the Toobers want to admit it. According to them, anyone who stays fat, is simply doing vegan incorrectly. Natch.
Oh man the idea that there can't be fat vegans annoys me. I guess it depends where you live, but it would be so easy to be a strict vegan and still gain weight here. There's vegan burger places, hot dog places, and most vegan sweets have just as much or more sugar than the dairy ones. Even in the US you can now buy tubs of vegan ben and jerrys ice cream. No dairy doesn't mean no fat and it certainly doesn't mean no sugar.
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#21 Old 02-12-2016, 02:13 PM
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I'd make a diet called "Oodles of Noodles" like a noodle cleanse <.< . Based around noodles. Italian pastas, rice noodles, whole grain noodles, vegetable noodles, tofu noodles(yes these exist). I would make soups, Asian soups, stir frys, Italian noodle dishes, anything with noodles. Lots of vegetables of course, and legumes. Fruit in snacks.

This is not a serious suggestion. Just something that made me laugh cause I love noodles.
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#22 Old 02-12-2016, 02:24 PM
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Fat people are now to blame for starving people.
As well as for the animal industry.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zZ3nEtiHU8Q
not a fan of the vegan couple
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#23 Old 02-12-2016, 02:29 PM
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I'd make a diet called "Oodles of Noodles" like a noodle cleanse <.< . Based around noodles. Italian pastas, rice noodles, whole grain noodles, vegetable noodles, tofu noodles(yes these exist). I would make soups, Asian soups, stir frys, Italian noodle dishes, anything with noodles. Lots of vegetables of course, and legumes. Fruit in snacks.

This is not a serious suggestion. Just something that made me laugh cause I love noodles.
Noodles... Mmmmm.
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#24 Old 02-12-2016, 02:48 PM
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That would be amazing! @Spudulika and I are hoping to actually turn this into something real. Would you be able to help us with the video part of it when we get that far?
Yeah totally, I can give you advice on editing, or we could even go as far as you somehow sending me files through large-file delivery sites and me editing them here.
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#25 Old 02-12-2016, 02:55 PM
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Yeah totally, I can give you advice on editing, or we could even go as far as you somehow sending me files through large-file delivery sites and me editing them here.
Thank you so much!
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#26 Old 02-12-2016, 03:09 PM
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Yeah, this is the difficult part. With YouTube, there are thousands of people trying to attract attention. It's clear that accurate facts and figures are of no use; some people have gained incredible popularity, even while spouting gross lies.
I'm not sure about this. I follow Unnatural Vegan who is possibly one of the most disliked yet successful vegan activists on YouTube for her unflinching honesty regarding the scientifically recognised health benefits of vegan diets and she's got thousands of subscribers, who like me, no doubt, get weary of the foofy flowery woo peddled by many other channels.

NOTE @no whey jose : Unnatural Vegan would be worth checking out and/or collaborating with.
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#27 Old 02-12-2016, 03:58 PM
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That would be amazing! @Spudulika and I are hoping to actually turn this into something real. Would you be able to help us with the video part of it when we get that far?
You should definitely do this!! And don't think of making money on it as a bad thing--you can reach more people with more funds.
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#28 Old 02-12-2016, 03:58 PM
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I'm not sure about this. I follow Unnatural Vegan who is possibly one of the most disliked yet successful vegan activists on YouTube for her unflinching honesty regarding the scientifically recognised health benefits of vegan diets and she's got thousands of subscribers, who like me, no doubt, get weary of the foofy flowery woo peddled by many other channels.

NOTE @no whey jose : Unnatural Vegan would be worth checking out and/or collaborating with.
I'll check her out. Thank you!

ETA: @Spudulika I just watched a few of her videos and I absolutely LOVE her!

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#29 Old 02-12-2016, 07:34 PM
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Well hasn't Forks Over Knives kinda sorta done this? It's healthy and meant to be for health rather than vanity, focuses on nutrition rather than appearance. It's a diet people can follow or stick with, or at least help them have a vegan diet or mostly vegan. It's got cook books, apps, and of course the documentary.

In fact the only thing I find unrealistic about it is the no oil thing might not sit well with a lot of people unless they already have health problems.
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#30 Old 02-12-2016, 08:08 PM
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Oh man the idea that there can't be fat vegans annoys me. I guess it depends where you live, but it would be so easy to be a strict vegan and still gain weight here. There's vegan burger places, hot dog places, and most vegan sweets have just as much or more sugar than the dairy ones. Even in the US you can now buy tubs of vegan ben and jerrys ice cream. No dairy doesn't mean no fat and it certainly doesn't mean no sugar.
I remember a quarter of a century or so ago when I went vegetarian, people said to me, "You're going to lose so much weight!" My response: "there's no meat in brownies."
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