Weights before cardio - VeggieBoards
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#1 Old 09-01-2008, 09:37 PM
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I've heard that it's best to do weight training before doing cardio, especially for weight-loss. Can anyone explain if this is a myth or, if not, why this is the case?



Oh, and I just have to brag. I've lost 4 centrimetres around my waist - in the past 4 weeks I've gone from 76 cm down to 72. I've also lost something like 2.5 cm's from my arm (each), 1.5 centrimetres from my hips and none from my thighs, ha.
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#2 Old 09-01-2008, 10:18 PM
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I read the same thing from one of the personal trainers over at veganbodybuilding.com. I've also heard that weight training will continue to burn fat well after the actual work out. But like you, I'd like to hear what others (more experienced) think. Especially about the latter that I mentioned.
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#3 Old 09-01-2008, 11:37 PM
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I guess weight-training will boost your resting metabolism as the more lean mass you have, the more energy your muscles need to consume, and to repair themselves.



But my housemate's pt, who's apparently really passionate about sports science and constantly researching, told her to do weights prior to cardio and I asked my friend, who's also a pt, and she said she's never heard of such a thing.
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#4 Old 09-02-2008, 12:28 AM
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Would you happen to know the qualifications of each of these trainers?



I think with training there will always be differences of opinions and even some new theory that comes out and either sticks or is proven to be wrong or misunderstood.



Congrats on your successes.
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#5 Old 09-02-2008, 05:54 AM
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I'm too buggered to do cardio after weights so I always do it before.



I'm no expert in weight-training though, and I've got zero interest in being one, I just do what I do and it seems to work for me.

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#6 Old 09-02-2008, 09:09 AM
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It depends on your goals. If you're trying to build muscle and strength, you're going to want to focus on heavy weights. Since cardio will deplete your glycogen stores, you don't want to do much of it prior to a weights workout so you can lift heavier weights. You could then choose to do cardio after your weights workout to fully deplete glycogen.



If you're just looking to get a nice, general workout and don't care about depletion or muscle development, then it really doesn't matter.
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#7 Old 09-02-2008, 12:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Dirty Martini View Post

It depends on your goals. If you're trying to build muscle and strength, you're going to want to focus on heavy weights. Since cardio will deplete your glycogen stores, you don't want to do much of it prior to a weights workout so you can lift heavier weights. You could then choose to do cardio after your weights workout to fully deplete glycogen.



If you're just looking to get a nice, general workout and don't care about depletion or muscle development, then it really doesn't matter.





I agree. It really depends on your goals. In general I would say do what is more important to you to make gains in first, when you have more energy.



As far as "muscle burning more fat"--1 pound of muscle burns about 50 calories per day, while 1 pound of fat burns only 2 calories per day (at rest).



I'm a fitness manager and trainer, have my BS in Exercise Phys, and several national certifications blah, blah... I'm just letting you know I *should* know what I'm talking about anyway since there was a post about checking your trainer's qualifications.
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#8 Old 09-02-2008, 06:17 PM
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I heard that too, and I also think that it's better to get weights and abs done first because it is easier to slack on your routine if you are already tired from cardio
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#9 Old 09-16-2008, 12:06 AM
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I've heard this too , but if I do weights and then cardio, I feel like a wobbly noodle.
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#10 Old 09-16-2008, 10:12 AM
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every trainer i talk to says that its best to do what you will really do LOL If you wont do the cardio after then thats not a good plan. Most people have more strength though when they do weights first.
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#11 Old 09-22-2008, 11:21 PM
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do whatever you like. Personally i'd advise on going out for a run, coming back and eat a small snack (banana, etc.) then go into lifting.
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#12 Old 09-23-2008, 10:54 AM
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do whatever you like. Personally i'd advise on going out for a run, coming back and eat a small snack (banana, etc.) then go into lifting.



Why?



As several people have said, do first what aligns with your goals. If you want to be an endurance runner, do running first. If you want to build muscle, definitely do weight lifting first.
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#13 Old 09-23-2008, 01:10 PM
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Did you see the first sentence, "do whatever you like".
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#14 Old 09-23-2008, 01:52 PM
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You said "do whatever you like" then gave a recommendation.
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#15 Old 09-23-2008, 06:37 PM
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yes, yes; but giving one's opinion can help inform.



let's not take this tooo seriously and let it become an argument. Remember it all boils down to, "Whatever floats you boat" ;-)
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#16 Old 09-25-2008, 06:50 PM
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Well I had a program created for me at the gym which is a 10 minute warm-up, weights, then I think about 30 mins of interval training.



Considering my phobia of stationary cardio equipment though, I'll probably mostly do cardio either outside, or in a class.



But another question (for you, Dirty martini!): the trainer has me doing about 3 sets of 15 reps on a low weight on the machines. But if I want to actually build muscle mass, would it be better to up the weight and lower the reps to say, about 3 x 6?

Does that make any sense?
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#17 Old 09-25-2008, 09:39 PM
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i do weights first and then have a short break and start on the treadmill.









Quote:
Originally Posted by Dirty Martini View Post

You said "do whatever you like" then gave a recommendation.



hey, ease up on people about this stuff would ya? you discovered weights only a short time ago and now suddenly youre acting like no one elses input on the subject counts. not cool.
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#18 Old 09-26-2008, 02:37 AM
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hey, ease up on people about this stuff would ya? you discovered weights only a short time ago and now suddenly youre acting like no one elses input on the subject counts. not cool.



I know! Her stuff cracks me up. Very entertaining to read though.

‎"I just think there's something in being lost. I never feel lost. I just think, 'Oh. I've taken a diversion'." ~ Karl Pilkington
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#19 Old 09-26-2008, 08:03 PM
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I just started with a trainer a few weeks ago- he had me start with Cardio, says it gets the blood flowing and to the muscles -



He know has me doing the Nautalist machines, I also do 3 sets of 15 reps - he said for men he has them do lower sets and reps at higher weights but it's best for women to do it the other way- you will gain muscle but not the huge bulk



For me it works- I do feel more energized when I get off the treadmill -so I don't feel as sluggish when I hit the weights and I know that I don't want the bulk.



Hope this helps some
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#20 Old 09-26-2008, 10:33 PM
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He know has me doing the Nautalist machines, I also do 3 sets of 15 reps - he said for men he has them do lower sets and reps at higher weights but it's best for women to do it the other way- you will gain muscle but not the huge bulk



Does he like to keep the girls in a special room with little pink weights so they don't hurt themselves or get all sweaty as well?



Have him show you just one woman that he has successfully trained to achieve "huge bulk".
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#21 Old 09-27-2008, 09:54 AM
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Ah Terry- No I choose the little pink dumbbells - I didn't want to touch the ones after the sweaty meatheads touched them.



Seriously- Most trainers will do it that way- at least everywhere my hubby and I have been- besides, if one thinks about it if a woman picks up a 85lb weight and does 6 reps right out of the start her chances of tearing a muscle are greater than if she picks up a 30lb weight and does 15 it does the same with less chance of muscle damage.



Not everything is about chauvinism it's about a woman's body is not designed the same as a man's
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#22 Old 09-27-2008, 10:28 AM
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Originally Posted by kali View Post


hey, ease up on people about this stuff would ya? you discovered weights only a short time ago and now suddenly youre acting like no one elses input on the subject counts. not cool.



LOL, see how opinionated people get about exercise and their style and exercise routine?



Remember peoples, strength can come from a lot of sources.

Don't forget the most basic of exercises can get you incredibly stronger, i swear by push ups, pull ups, dumbbell curls, lifting heavy objects (as simple as that sounds, think heavy boxes, rocks, etc.)
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#23 Old 09-27-2008, 01:53 PM
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LOL, see how opinionated people get about exercise and their style and exercise routine?



Kinda like vegetarianism. Just because I've been lifting weights seriously for 10 months doesn't mean I can't have educated input. Better tell all those new vegetarians that they don't know anything about being veg.



Anyway, man, I was giving you a hard time; take it in stride. You said to do whatever you want - then told her what to do, and I thought it was funny. I asked you why you would advise something that might not align with her goals, especially since several people prior to you were telling her to do what aligns with her goals, suddenly I'm the anti-christ.



Quote:
i swear by push ups, pull ups, dumbbell curls, lifting heavy objects (as simple as that sounds, think heavy boxes, rocks, etc.)



As do I (well, minus the curls). OH NOES WE AGREE!!! :P
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#24 Old 09-28-2008, 01:38 AM
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I can now do proper push-ups
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#25 Old 09-28-2008, 05:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Terry B. View Post

Does he like to keep the girls in a special room with little pink weights so they don't hurt themselves or get all sweaty as well?



Have him show you just one woman that he has successfully trained to achieve "huge bulk".





AMEN! Unless a woman has extremely high levels of testosterone and growth hormone, whether naturally or otherwise, she will NOT become bulky. Just my two cents, so keep working hard... the results will pay off.
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#26 Old 10-06-2008, 11:57 AM
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Originally Posted by Dirty Martini View Post

suddenly I'm the anti-christ.





I wouldn't say suddenly







I tried my routine the other way around again - wasn't successful.

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#27 Old 10-06-2008, 02:04 PM
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Im not so sure I should post in here seems a little passive aggressive



Anyway, I would definitely agree with some of the early post suggesting doing weight training before cardio, and here is why:

Cardio, especially for fat loss, is really all about hitting a target heart rate (what is that heart rate is another question and debate for another time and place)- and it is easy to hit a target heart rate even if you are completely tired from weight training.

Weight training on the other hand, for muscle maintenance or gain, is all about really pushing yourself. Muscle building is really about overloading the muscle, in effect causing small micro trauma to the muscle fibers, allowing this muscle to rest (for at least a day) so your body can repair the muscle and grow. Fortunately (or unfortunately) the human body is incredibly resilient, and learns to adapt to applied loads and work, etc over time you have to run faster to get the same pulse rate, and over time you have to apply higher loads to grow. My point here is twofold- one being, you really need to exert all possible energy in the weights to ensure growth- your body will get used to the workouts that you do, and if youre tired and cant give 100% then you wont make the progress that your spending so much time and energy trying to make. This is especially true for fat loss, but Im getting the feeling that you understand the importance of weight training for fat loss. The second point I will make is towards your question on number of reps Starting out at 15 reps of low weight is completely normal for beginners to intermediates. What you have to avoid is staying at the same numbers of reps at the same weight for too long. Your body adapts fast, and you should frequently adjust your routine in some manner such as same number of reps w/ and extra 5 lbs, or bump up the weight and do sets of 10. It can also be effective to do the same number of reps with the same weights, but rest 15 seconds fewer between sets (in effect doing the entire routine faster, but KEEPING GOOD TECHNIQUE!)

Id like to applaud you on the gains (losses!) youve made, and encourage you to keep asking questions. None of us knows everything, and everyone is a little different (some more than others). People see different results on the same routines know what it does for you. Keep track of your data (%BF, weight, circumference, workout routine, etc) and use it as feed back to figure out what direction you need to go.

I personally dont like to half-ass things, and if Im going to spend the time to do something, I like to do it right. One thing I do know from experience, the harder you work, the better your results!
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#28 Old 10-06-2008, 04:16 PM
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If you insist on doing cardio and weights in the same session, then I agree with 31770. However, why not split them into different sessions, then you can give each session 100% and achieve better results.



For fat loss, I'd suggest doing cardio 1st thing in the morning on an empty stomach. This ensures you're losing fat immediately whereas if you've eaten, the first 20 mins are wasted burning up carbs before you'll see any fat loss. (NB. The first 20 mins exercise is still useful, just not in a fat-burning way).



This is controversial but a lot of people believe this, and I've had good results myself. Conversely I've read that weights shouldn't be done until you've been up an hour, but that's for completely different reasons.
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#29 Old 10-07-2008, 07:02 AM
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If you insist on doing cardio and weights in the same session, then I agree with 31770. However, why not split them into different sessions, then you can give each session 100% and achieve better results.



For fat loss, I'd suggest doing cardio 1st thing in the morning on an empty stomach. This ensures you're losing fat immediately whereas if you've eaten, the first 20 mins are wasted burning up carbs before you'll see any fat loss. (NB. The first 20 mins exercise is still useful, just not in a fat-burning way).



This is controversial but a lot of people believe this, and I've had good results myself. Conversely I've read that weights shouldn't be done until you've been up an hour, but that's for completely different reasons.



OF COURSE!!! i completely intended to mention that you should split them into different sessions!!! +1 for licence! That's actually what i do, cardio 1st thing in the morning, before breakfast, and then weights in the evening when i get home from work. I also have gotten very good results from early morning cardio. Ive heard something wrt not doing weights until youve been up for a while to avoid potentially messing up your back/spine. Supposedly while sleeping, youre spine wets (or dries, I forget), and it takes a while to get back to a normal safe to life weight condition.



I totally agree with the theory behind cardio first thing in the morning on an empty stomach- you will not have any glycogen stores after 8 ish hours of sleep, and you burn more fat when glycogen is low. Eating also releases insulin which interferes- less insulin is present in the morning on an empty stomic so more body fat can be burned w/ cardio. There is less glucose (carbs) in the blood when you wake up- less available glucose mean you burn more fat. Ive also hear the cardio in the morning elevates your metabolism for a certain time after your workout is over. Plus you can brag to everybody that you got your @$$ out of bed before the crack of dawn while everyone else was being a lazzy blob errr Im mean you get an amazing sense of accomplishment- actually, cardio should give you a little endorphin boost which could make you more cheering in the morning and help you feel good all day.
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#30 Old 10-07-2008, 11:38 PM
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Thanks for the advice! When I was doing bootcamp it was at 6am 3 mornings a week and I couldn't bring myself to face food at that time (I remember trying to eat a banana when I was driving to it and dry-retching). But I have heard that you start burning fat far more quickly doing cardio on an empty stomach. I also heard something that contradicts that (you start burning muscle or something?) but whatever.



I've started training with my friend, who I mentioned in the OP, and she has me doing something she calls super-reps. It's mostly resistance training but high reps and with no break in between so my heart-rate stays up. So for example she'll have me doing 15 reps on a machine that works my back, then straight onto doing 15 push-ups then back onto weights and we'll repeat it 3 times. We do intervals of a little bit of cardio too, like skipping.



I've only used her twice and the first time I walked out of the session feeling like my legs were about shatter beneath me haha.
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