Avoiding TV for the first 2-3 years...? - Page 2 - VeggieBoards
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#31 Old 01-18-2007, 01:36 PM
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Thanks for all your replies! We've already started playing board games at night instead of watching the tube or moveis as much, just to try to get us weaned off it somewhat.



We love to watch movies though, but we'll do that after the kid is in bed and very asleep first.



I imagine as soon as we have an infant in the house, movies will seem really boring compared to watching and caring for our tiny person anyway...



My husband is WAH and I'm hoping to be within the next year, so we'll both be around to switch off with the child responsibilities. Hopefully it'll work out well.
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#32 Old 01-18-2007, 02:29 PM
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I have no children of my own at this point, but was a nanny for sometime, to two beautiful, intelligent and totally television-dependant little girls. The girls were 4 and 6 when I moved away (and heavens I miss them!) and they knew how to use the television, remote and dvd player better than I did. These girls, while I don't know myself if there's any solid evidence to prove tv=add/adhd, were incredibly, amazingly hyperactive and couldn't focus on anything at all, unless it was on the television screen, and even then it could be very limited at times. When the time comes to raise my own children, I refuse to let them watch more than 30-60 minutes of television per day, and only after they're 3 or 4 years old. The only time I'll let them watch more than that is on special occasions, or particularly educational specials, ect. Children can be so innundated and overwhelmed by all these mainstream views and such everywhere they go, they don't need that in their own home. Okay, sorry, that came out pretty strongly, I don't want or mean to offend anybody, and I would --never-- argue with anybody else's choices or decisions on how to raise their children. I don't pretend to know everything, this is just my opinion based on what experience I have.
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#33 Old 01-18-2007, 02:55 PM
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My brother and I grew up infront of the tv, it must have taken up the majority of our day. My mother was into giving us the freedom to do what we wanted, or something like that, so we pretty much did whatever we felt like doing. I remember watching show, after show untill I was at least school age, and even then, I would watch it when I got home.

I eventually grew out of my tv-addicted ways, I started to watch much less by junior high and highschool and now that I'm in college, I rarely have time for it. My brother and I turned out ok in the end, and I would consider us both to be successful. In the future, I would still probably moniter tv time for my own kids.
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#34 Old 01-18-2007, 03:15 PM
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I didn't read this thread, so apologies if this has already been mentioned, but I saved an article last year which speculated that TV may be linked the rise of autism seen in recent times.



http://www.slate.com/id/2151538/



There are a number of reasons not to plop your toddlers in front of a TV all day, but I think this one is quite compelling.



(I wouldn't take this as fact though, the article is just speculation)
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#35 Old 01-18-2007, 06:45 PM
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Well - does anyone have any credible sources for tv damaging babies? I know that it can be a problem for older kids, because of content, lack of physical exercise, no socialization, etc. I let my little one sit in front of it sometimes because she seems to like it. Not everything, but things with bright colors, like the simpsons or other cartoons, or things with face to face dialogue - like (i know, i know) Oprah. She likes Frasier as well. Anything that is mainly people talking to each other, with little background movement she seems to like. I didn't think that it would be a problem - how is it different from her watching people talking, which I know IS good for her?
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#36 Old 01-18-2007, 06:46 PM
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Also - it really is only sometimes. The vast majority of her time is spent playing with myself or her dad, or her toys. Can such a little bit here and there hurt her? Not rhetorical - I would really like to know what you think!
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#37 Old 01-18-2007, 07:52 PM
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wow.... i just read that article, jeff_veg. scary stuff.... yes, speculation, but maybe enough to not take the risk?
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#38 Old 01-18-2007, 10:49 PM
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I actually asked the dr. about my baby watching tv, because she seems to love it, and actually tries to watch it whenever it's on. My 3 yr old wasn't like that as a baby, so I was a little concerned. He said it won't harm the baby (I specifically asked about ADHD and Autism), but he would never want me to put the tv on for her. She should be spending her time doing things other than watching tv, obviously.
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#39 Old 01-27-2007, 06:47 AM
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I think you are doing an excellent thing. I've never had a complet no tv rule....but certainly very limited tv...and you're right...experts reccomend NO TV before age 3. I wish i had known that when my daughter was little. I'm not a big tv person...there have been times in my life when I have decided not to own a tv. Now we use tv sparingly on the weekends. We might watch a movie a night (friday and saturday). And, when my daughter is non-compliant with rules, she loses movie night. She watches a little tv Saturday morning, so maybe a total of six hours a week...if that. At one of our parent ed nights this week, a parent stood up and said, "Why are we as parents sitting our children in front of the tv? We know this is bad for them....why do we do it?"



Unfortunately, like meat eating, society sees tv viewing as part of our normal culture...and no tv as well...sort of fringe. Even though we know the experts say otherwise...what's best for us doesn't match up with what we are doing as a society on so many levels...look at conservation, global warming. Everyone knows people should be carpooling, riding bikes and finding alternative forms of transportation (ie green cars, walking..etc)...but are we doing that? It's like we're deciding conciously (as a society) to go to hell in a handbasket.



Sorry, but there are so many of these issues, where we know what's right and what we should do (for our own best interests and also for the planet) but we don't do those things.



B
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#40 Old 01-27-2007, 06:50 AM
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IF you think the article is scarey, try reading the book Endangered Minds. If you'd like to know about how tv effects brain functioning. This isn't speculation...it's well researched and documented.
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#41 Old 01-27-2007, 08:03 AM
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Coney, I'm not sure if anyone posted this link, but it just may be an interesting read for you and the other parents : http://www.aap.org/family/tv1.htm



Quote:
Until more research is done about the effects of TV on very young children, the American Academy of Pediatrics (AAP) does not recommend television for children age 2 or younger. For older children, the Academy recommends no more than 1 to 2 hours per day of educational, nonviolent programs.

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#42 Old 01-27-2007, 10:29 AM
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Does anyone have a link to actual studies done on this? Actual sound research? I agree with you all, but I would like to see the facts before I start to stress out too much about it.
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#43 Old 01-27-2007, 10:44 AM
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In case there is anyone interested in research as I am, here:



This one is about ADD



This one is actually about how kids can LEARN from tv - just monitor the content.



More to come....
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#44 Old 01-27-2007, 10:53 AM
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So, basically, it COULD be damaging, we're not sure. Apparently, almost all of the research has been done on school age kids, and not surprisingly, it's linked to obesity, less reading, less physical activity, etc. But that is not an effect of TV in itself, just how it takes away from other stuff.



They speculate that because TV scenarios and imagery change so much more quickly than real life, it may affect a child's attention span. Hmmm... has anyone here ever watched a baby einstein video? They move painfully slowly. But maybe that's not the point. ??



Conclusion : Use caution, but more research is definitely needed.
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#45 Old 01-27-2007, 01:37 PM
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The Baby Einstein videos are made to be slow and contain images that a baby would see in real life. I know my baby loves them. I don't let her watch them regularly, but sometimes when she's crabby, they really cheer her up. She really gets excited about them. Like I said before, my 3 yr old loves tv, but she is usually interacting with the show or talking about it to me. I think if she ever does that blank stare, I'll shut it off.
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#46 Old 01-27-2007, 01:40 PM
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here, here. We will watch stuff like baby einstein with Sofia - key word - WITH. We'll sit with her and talk to her about the stuff she's seeing. There are no words in the ones we have, so we can narrate in french.
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#47 Old 01-27-2007, 07:07 PM
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Again, if you are really interested in an in depth analysis of this topic, I suggest Endangered Minds by Jane Healy, PHD. The book talks about, in mostly laymens terms, brain research that has been done on the effects of too much tv on young children. I know there are many more books on the subject out there, but I've found this one so far to be the most informative. To be honest, I think every parent of young children should read it.



B
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#48 Old 01-28-2007, 02:35 AM
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ADHD is highly heritable (80% IIRC) and a correlation between watching TV and symptoms needn't point to a causal relationship. Could be that parents who are ADHD watch too much TV themselves or that they can't handle their kids bouncing around when they're trying to get things done around the house. Or that the TV is simply something to hyperfocus on. I did that with books to the point that I genuinely couldn't remember having been asked to come downstairs and eat - no TV required.
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#49 Old 01-28-2007, 03:35 PM
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I guess my question is nookle, if you care to answer it....if you are sitting and watching tv with baby Sophia, couldn't you just as easily be doing something interractive with her rather than the two of you interacting with the tv? I have a problem with videos called 'baby einstien.' I'm guessing Einstien after all wasn't raised on tv. Does baby Einstien offer something to your child that you yourself couldn't offer her by dialoging with her, walking her through an art museum, going on a nature walk...etc? The other day I observed a parent stopping on a walk with her baby in stroller so she could point out a bird that had landed close by....she knelt by the stroller of the little one and actually spent time pointing this out and talking to the child about it.



Sorry, but I just hate the gimmics companies use to encourage parents to buy their products...."Baby Einstien"...of course we want our children to be smart....if this video does the trick, what good parent wouldn't want to buy it...but all the research done on early childhood learning points to the fact that what helps children learn most is direct interraction with other humans and a real environment...not interractions with two dimensional pictures (tv, computer, games). I guess I'd just encourage you to shut it off now (the tv)....it amazes me that people want children to read and love reading, which is a slow process, where the pictures don't move and the letters don't light up or jump off the page or make a sound when you touch them....but we're in the meantime hooking kids up with all these things that require only the push of a button and allow the child to 'be entertained' rather than use intellect or imagination. There's a big difference between these two things....being entertained means I am doing nothing significant....I am passive.



I don't think anyone need 'stress' over this...the last thing worried mothers need is more to stress over. It's more a matter of lining up what you know is right/best with what you do as a parent. I think/hope it's a lesson we all learn as parents...I'm speaking as a parent AND an educator here on a subject I have a large amount of passion for...so sorry to go on, and I'll put my soapbox away.



b
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#50 Old 01-28-2007, 03:51 PM
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I think it's a great idea to throw away the tv, not just until your kid is three, but for the whole of their childhood. :-)



I grew up with very limited tv and I really appreciate that now. Our house was always filled with books and it gave me a lifelong love of reading. I also loved going on bike rides, drawing and painting, playing outside games and imaginary games with my sisters. My boyfriend was also raised in a house with no tv and his family is so creative and awesome. Lots of art and musical instruments and singing.



Throw your tv out the window!
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#51 Old 01-28-2007, 07:46 PM
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I think there are more important things to be concerned with. I think anyone who is even questioning if tv is good or bad, is not going to be one of those people who sticks their kids in front of the tv all day, or who buys the gimmicks of the companies selling these products. I grew up in a home with minimal tv, and alot of books and projects and educational trips/activities. I guess it made me who I am today, and for that I appreciate it. But, I also think there were other things lacking in my home. More important things. There was also the fact that alot of these activities were forced upon me, and I ended up resenting them. I don't think tv is going to make my kids smarter, but I do think it's something they enjoy, and it doesn't bother me to let them enjoy it on occasion. We can't always go out to a concert in the park, or on a nature walk, or to a museum. But I know I can put on a Wiggles video anytime, and my 3 year old will dance and sing and have fun. As far as a lot of those electronic educational toys and things go...I was opposed to them at first. But, that's the way the world is going. Our kids will most likely have to know how to use computers and technology. I'd like my children to learn other skills as well, but I don't really have a problem with Leap Frog type toys and things. I just think it's all about moderation.
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#52 Old 01-28-2007, 07:59 PM
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well my kids have both used the baby einstein dvd's, the wiggles too, pbs too...........they also both know how to use the computer, better than me....LOL....they are 6 yo and 3 yo........i homeschool and my 6 yo is doing work at a 2nd grade level, neither child has a short attention span, neither has add.......they are both articulate, intelligent, and creative.

but then again, i never plopped them for hours on end. it was more of short bursts of time,

i think depending on how it is used, tv and educational programs can be beneficial. i truly believe its the TYPE of program they are watching, there is a vast difference in all of them.

oh we also have many leap frog toys, they LOVE them. we also have many wooden toys that require much imagination.
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#53 Old 01-28-2007, 11:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rat love View Post


I grew up with very limited tv and I really appreciate that now. Our house was always filled with books and it gave me a lifelong love of reading. I also loved going on bike rides, drawing and painting, playing outside games and imaginary games with my sisters. My boyfriend was also raised in a house with no tv and his family is so creative and awesome. Lots of art and musical instruments and singing.





I grew up doing and loving all those things as well, and reading was especially encouraged. I now am an avid reader, and have more books than will fit in my house, and I've read all of them multiple times. I also play the guitar, the saxophone, and the Piano. I am a music lover - I have an incredible collection of music of every genre, and I sometimes spend evenings just listening to music, or dancing with my baby. I go outside for walks, hikes, swimming, skating, skiiing, on a regular basis. I know how to snowshoe, build a campfire, pitch a tent. For our honeymoon, we went CAMPING. And you know what? We were allowed to watch tv when we wanted growing up. I think, as Bonoluvr said - it has a lot to do with programming, but more to do with the mentality of it. The role tv plays in your house. Right now, the research we have all points to the fact that it's the attitudes and behaviors surrounding tv that cause problems. Not the TV itself. So, to my mind, if you can combat these issues, of obesity, inactivity, not reading or playing because you're watching tv instead, then you're all set. Banning tv 100% I don't see as being necessary, or particularly beneficial.



Also, as to the baby einstein videos. One - we didn't buy them - so no need to fear the company profiting off of our ignorance and lazy child-rearing attitudes. Two, we have them NOT to make a genius out of our baby, but simply to see what they're like, and if she likes them. And - surprise! - she does! And yes, we do all the other things you listed, Bethanie. Today we took her to a Taiko drumming concert as part of Japanese New year celebrations. Yesterday, we took her out for the day to the harbor to see all the boats. Before that, to the grocery store to show her all the beautiful colors of the produce..... Because she watches these videos with us sometimes does NOT mean that we are not doing other things with her, or NOT interacting with her. I have about 10 hours a day with her - with her being awake. And I would say that at least 8 of those hours see me interacting with her - face to face (or foot to foot, as the case may be ). The other 2 or 3 are largely spent her entertaining herself.



I think that the tendency to lump all tv watching into the fat-ass, lazy, never reads, aggressive, adhd, no social interaction group is a little short-sighted, and if we take care to not let tv rule our lives, it can be a beneficial, EDUCATIONAL tool.
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#54 Old 02-01-2007, 11:48 AM
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If it counts my family didn't even have a TV until I was in 6th grade. My parents still don't have a dish or cable(cant get cable). Of course we lived in the country with miles of forests around us...so the outdoors was our TV. My summer days basically entailed disappearing for hours in the woods, swimming in the stream, and coming home with a couple more bruises then when I left.



It was glorious
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#55 Old 02-01-2007, 01:13 PM
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I don't tend to lump tv watching into fat-ass, lazy, never reads or aggressive, adhd....etc...what you said. But I do lump tv for under age three into a not a good idea category. There's evidence in fact to suggest no tv for under age six.



I am not making any claims nookle on what kind of a parent you are...first of all, I don't have any reason to do so....second of all, I don't know you except for how you've represented yourself in this particular discussion as a good parent. I just think that this is one of those things parents have to decide for themselves. However, as a parent and educator, I can and do let parents know that really...whatever you can learn from the boob tube (I get so tired of parents claiming their children only watch 'educational tv'...), you can learn elsewhere and probably should.



bonolovr....I am not trying to indicate that children who watch tv are going to have learning problems. I guess I am suggesting though that it is more difficult than I think it used to be to get kids interested in non-televised stories and storytelling....and reading. Particularly sustained reading takes a level of concentration that many children just aren't managing these days. I'm not talking about adhd children either...I'm speaking of normal, everyday kids who aren't really interested in reading and writing.



It's important to note that I work in a Montessori school/am a Montessorian. I think generally Montessorians tend to advocate for no/minimal tv...which seems more in line with the education of the 'whole child.' We believe in general that children need to be spending most of their time learning from experiences and a natural environment...and that tv time tends to limit these real experiences in defference to fantasy and virtual experience.



In fact I'd say in most homes tv and video are provided as an 'escape' from real life...and I'd wonder why so many of us need to escape from our real lives. To me this runs contrary to really living, and living in the moment.



Again...this is just an opinion...and as a parent, I also think it's important to find balance at home and not be an extremist. This is probably why I have not yet thrown out the tv.



B
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#56 Old 02-01-2007, 01:18 PM
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grrrr.... I don't WANT to, but I have to admit that was well said. However, I do NOT claim that she only sees 'educational tv'. She tends to be riveted by dialogue more than anything else. So this is usually talking heads - the news, or (I know, I am horrible) Oprah. Anything that moves fast, even cartoons, she doesn't seem to care for at all.
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#57 Old 02-01-2007, 04:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bethanie View Post

...We believe in general that children need to be spending most of their time learning from experiences and a natural environment...



B



exactly
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#58 Old 02-02-2007, 02:06 AM
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Keeping kids away from TV is a great idea, but it is not a guarantee that they won't get ADD. My son had practically no TV at all before age 5 and only limited TV once he was older. He has ADD. Some kids are born with it.
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#59 Old 02-02-2007, 08:13 PM
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"My summer days basically entailed disappearing for hours in the woods, swimming in the stream, and coming home with a couple more bruises then when I left."



Mikey, this was my childhood as well, but anyone who watches the news knows today's reality is far different for our kids, no matter if you live in the safest community or not, the sad fact is I know few parents who would do this. and i think its a sad reality of our society today. sickos preying on children.
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#60 Old 02-02-2007, 09:24 PM
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there actually aren't statisticly more sickos preying on children today than in the past, but rather, there is more news about it. 100 or more years ago, a sicko preying on children may make local or state-wide news, but not national or international.



because of this, and the hype surrounding it (that is, our news is sensationalizing), parents are afraid. and thus, their children do not have a lot of 'free play' time.



but in other countries, where the 'sicko' rates are about the same, the news is less sensational about it and those children seem to get more unscheduled, unstructured, and unsupervised play time than those in the US.



(it might also be noted that most 'sicko' incidents happen within families or close friends of families, and that it is relatively uncommon for a 'stranger sicko' to disturb or harm a child. that is particularly rare.)
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