Same-Sex Marriage - VeggieBoards
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#1 Old 10-10-2008, 03:09 PM
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we are voting on same-sex marriage in California this election and the recent polls show about a 50/50 split. i understand that many states have already voted on defining marriage between a man and woman therefore banning same-sex marriage licenses, Ca did too but the state supreme court over-turned that measure and same-sex marriages have been acknowledged by the state for the past few months.

i am very confused by the campaign that supports this proposition (voting yes=no same sex marriage), "Protect Marriage" is the slogan used, and undertones of protecting children are indicated.

What does marriage need to be protected from? And how does restricting marriage protect children?





also, what are opinions on same-sex marriage from countries other than U.S.?
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#2 Old 10-10-2008, 03:15 PM
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I may be naive here but my first response to this was "what?! the U.S doesn't allow same sex marriages!" It's been here in the U.K for a while now and to me it just seems the norm, I stupidly seemed to think the rest of the world was in agreement. Marriage is a bit of paper, a legal document, a contract, it has nothing to do with god/whoever you believe created the world or whatever. So who cares who marries who, as long as both parties are aware of the contract they are entering into.
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#3 Old 10-10-2008, 03:19 PM
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Kudos to Jerry Brown for getting the name of the prop changed from "Marriage Protection" to "Eliminates Right of Same-Sex Couples to Marry"
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#4 Old 10-10-2008, 03:24 PM
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I may be naive here but my first response to this was "what?! the U.S doesn't allow same sex marriages!" It's been here in the U.K for a while now and to me it just seems the norm, I stupidly seemed to think the rest of the world was in agreement. Marriage is a bit of paper, a legal document, a contract, it has nothing to do with god/whoever you believe created the world or whatever. So who cares who marries who, as long as both parties are aware of the contract they are entering into.





It has a lot to do with taxes, family insurance policies and death benefits here. Anybody can get married in the US, it's more over the matter of how the government recognizes it and how that affects marriage entitlements.



I'm curious - in the UK, if a person in a same-sex marriage dies is the partner entitled to the same spousal benefits as the spouse in a m-f marriage?
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#5 Old 10-10-2008, 03:26 PM
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I'm curious - in the UK, if a person in a same-sex marriage dies is the partner entitled to the same spousal benefits as the spouse in a m-f marriage?



As far as I know, yes, that was part of the reason for introducing it.
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#6 Old 10-10-2008, 03:38 PM
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As far as I know, yes, that was part of the reason for introducing it.



When was that enacted?
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#7 Old 10-10-2008, 03:42 PM
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I am disappointed that our Country still feels that one group deserves more rights over another group. Created equal indeed. If marriage continues to come with the benefits that it currently has then it should be allowed for ALL consenting adults not just some. If marriage is strictly going to be religious then all married couples should have their special rights stripped away so that we are all treated equally in this matter.



I'm really confused on how it protects children. Can anyone explain that to me? I have two great Aunts that have been together since my mother was little. They adopted two girls who were raised in a loving home and never went with out anything they needed. It was the lesbian couples version of the Cleavers! My cousins are now happily married to great people and have a family of their own. How many unadopted children out there do you think would love to be taken in by a family like that? So is THIS the thing they're trying to protect children from? Families that would take them in and love them? Or am I missing something?
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#8 Old 10-10-2008, 03:49 PM
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In the UK it's not legally called marrage but a civil partnership instead so not to upset some religious loons. It was enacted in 2004 and civil partners have the same rights and responsabilitys under law as married couples - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civil_p...United_Kingdom
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#9 Old 10-10-2008, 04:28 PM
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In the UK it's not legally called marrage but a civil partnership instead so not to upset some religious loons. It was enacted in 2004 and civil partners have the same rights and responsabilitys under law as married couples - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civil_p...United_Kingdom



Ah - it's four years old. Thanks.
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#10 Old 10-10-2008, 04:45 PM
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I do not think this is an issue that should be left to single states. Marriages should be legal in all states because people want to move around. Imagine being married legally, finding a job somewhere else and not being able to go because you would no longer be married. That would be tough.
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#11 Old 10-10-2008, 05:56 PM
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I do not think this is an issue that should be left to single states. Marriages should be legal in all states because people want to move around. Imagine being married legally, finding a job somewhere else and not being able to go because you would no longer be married. That would be tough.

Agreed. I think no matter the sexual orientation if its real they should have the same rights. It still hurts the partner if one is sick, injured or passed on. They should be able to adopt because the ability to provide a loving home.



One of my sisters has been with her partner for 17 years. they have been non legally married for 11. A lot of herto marriages don't come close to that long. (mine included)

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#12 Old 10-10-2008, 06:09 PM
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We in Florida also have a "marriage amendment" on the ballot. As I understand it, not only will same sex couples be affected, but EVERYONE who is in an unmarried relationship may lose their rights. It is sad that some groups have nothing better to do than try to impose their beliefs on others. As for the children aspect of it, that is nothing but homophobic beliefs that have no actual factual basis. This is a subject that really gets me POed.

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#13 Old 10-10-2008, 06:13 PM
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We in Florida also have a "marriage amendment" on the ballot. As I understand it, not only will same sex couples be affected, but EVERYONE who is in an unmarried relationship may lose their rights. It is sad that some groups have nothing better to do than try to impose their beliefs on others. As for the children aspect of it, that is nothing but homophobic beliefs that have no actual factual basis. This is a subject that really gets me POed.

Shoot! Send me a pm about what that is because I did not hear about it.

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#14 Old 10-11-2008, 06:43 PM
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I believe you can get married in another state and move somewhere else and still be recognized. I'm not 100% sure, but I believe that the issues at hand are technicalities about allowing the state to award marriages, not reconize them. Again, I may be wrong, so please correct if so
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#15 Old 10-11-2008, 07:11 PM
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I believe you can get married in another state and move somewhere else and still be recognized. I'm not 100% sure, but I believe that the issues at hand are technicalities about allowing the state to award marriages, not reconize them. Again, I may be wrong, so please correct if so



It really boils down to what you mean by "recognized." For the most part, and in most states, it's worthless.
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#16 Old 10-11-2008, 09:06 PM
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http://www.hrc.org/about_us/state_laws.asp



here's a state-by-state breakdown of who has what rights, and where....

Nec Aspera Terrent
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#17 Old 10-11-2008, 09:32 PM
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This is the one thing that really "Grinds my gears" as Peter Griffen would say. It makes me sad that people are so cruel and uncaring for other people. It just proves my theory that most people are evil. EVIL I SAY!



Seriously though, I think many people have already summed up my feelings in this thread. I think that as vegetarians, we know what it's like to not be accepted by others. To me, the same sex marriage is no different than interracial marriage.



I'm voting no on Prop 8!
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#18 Old 10-12-2008, 12:04 AM
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In NZ we sorta have it and don't , they call it same-sex union . We are a strange lot down here . We have homosexuals , lesbian and one transsexual (just retired) who are openly gay and elected as Members of Parliament. But for some reason the people wouldn't support gay marriages .



http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/4081089.stm
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#19 Old 10-12-2008, 09:23 AM
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ya, in CA and other states we call those Civil Unions. People that support Prop 8 use the Civil Union argument, trying to say homosexuals have equality b/c they get Civil Unions (which offer some of the same rights as marriage). HOWEVER, civil unions are not recognized in other states and it makes it pretty impossible to move ever, and the processes of obtaining them are completely different than a marriage license.



Most of my neighbors support restricting same sex marriage rights (and McPalin!) it is very discouragig but it is so wonderful to know that I am not the only one that believes in equal rights, thanks vegetarians for being so awesome!
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#20 Old 10-12-2008, 10:33 AM
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I think the people who are fighting to oppose same sex marriage are reprehensible.
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#21 Old 10-12-2008, 10:37 AM
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... or have gay feelings that they've surpressed. They don't think it's fair that they've had to surpress them and want those who didn't to suffer
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#22 Old 10-12-2008, 12:18 PM
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[youtube]u-pSye9W7FY[/youtube]



Here is a video of CA prop 8 commercial with commentary. The commercial is pretty silly.
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#23 Old 10-12-2008, 01:43 PM
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here in norway we've had partnership for as long as I can remember, and after new years same-sex couples can get married as well. I'm glad for it. the way I see it it's a step in the right direction at least half of my friends are bi/gay/lesbian so for me it seem just natural that same-sex marriage should be allowed
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#24 Old 10-12-2008, 06:36 PM
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Separate but Equal





Remind anyone of something?
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#25 Old 10-12-2008, 08:14 PM
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Also, for the Floridians:



Um, yeah, I am voting NO ammendment 2, but its not really just about gay marriage. http://www.sayno2.com/



I'm with you sarahjayn... No on 2! Florida can be a pretty backward state, just look at the adoption ban We're going to vote and hope for the best, that's about all we can do.



BTW - Did you know that the owner of the Orlando Magic basketball team cut a $100,000 check to the pro amendment 2 camp? What a bigot, I boycott the Magic
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#26 Old 10-13-2008, 05:59 AM
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I do not think this is an issue that should be left to single states. Marriages should be legal in all states because people want to move around. Imagine being married legally, finding a job somewhere else and not being able to go because you would no longer be married. That would be tough.



I believe this too. All of America should allow same-sex marriage. I believe it is ridiculous that in a land where "everyone is created equal" that this debate is even going ON. America should have been like, "Damn, those people don't have the same rights? We should fix that right away." Of course that's pretty simplified, but you get the picture.

I really do start to hate my country sometimes when I look at issues like this, and the monkey in the white house doesn't help <100 days left with that though! lol
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#27 Old 10-13-2008, 06:24 AM
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in the immortal words of Chris Rock."Everyone have the right to be miserable."
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#28 Old 10-13-2008, 09:15 AM
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in the immortal words of Chris Rock."Everyone have the right to be miserable."



I heard that one too... HILARIOUS skit.



Found it! Warning: Adult Language:



[youtube]7sKWo3Q-UZ8[/youtube]
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#29 Old 10-13-2008, 09:35 PM
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Same-sex marraige is legal here in British Columbia, Canada. It makes so much sense and I just can't understand why someone would be threatened enough to vote against something that DOESN'T EVEN EFFECT THEM!



It seems awful to think that a wonderful, happy couple could be together for years and years... devote their lives together, but not get the benefits and recognition that a hetero-sexual couple gets. If one of them dies, it leaves the other without legal rights which is JUST WRONG in my opinion.



I'm another one who gets PO'ed by this topic. Open your minds, People!!
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#30 Old 10-13-2008, 11:43 PM
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Same-sex marraige is legal here in British Columbia, Canada. It makes so much sense and I just can't understand why someone would be threatened enough to vote against something that DOESN'T EVEN EFFECT THEM!



It seems awful to think that a wonderful, happy couple could be together for years and years... devote their lives together, but not get the benefits and recognition that a hetero-sexual couple gets. If one of them dies, it leaves the other without legal rights which is JUST WRONG in my opinion.



I'm another one who gets PO'ed by this topic. Open your minds, People!!



That's my issue exactly! Just like I don't think it's fair for men to vote on the abortion issue (a male doctor, maybe) or if there was some law about adult male circumcision, I don't think women should be able to vote on it. Although even when it comes to abortion, a woman doesn't have the right to tell another women they cannot get one.



These issues are just... hairy overall.
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