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#1 Old 04-05-2011, 06:52 PM
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is there a better way to replace egg for baking recipes? i'm getting ready to try making my own fat free breads, so there will be no oil either.
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#2 Old 04-05-2011, 10:00 PM
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I just tried baking soda and apple cider vinegar (in brownies). I can't tell whether or not it worked because I burned them, but I've had success with apple cider vinegar mixed in soymilk for cupcakes. If you get stuck using ener-g, don't mix it with water first. that gives whatever you are baking a chalky consistency. Just mix it in with the rest of the dry ingredients.

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#3 Old 04-05-2011, 11:24 PM
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fat free breads are going to be a little tricky. Applesauce or bananas can work well as a fat replacer and egg substitute, but not for many eggs. I use EnerG replacer when called for in recipes. I haven't experimented with replacing that . Baking is a science, and I haven't attempted to go there yet, but would like to. Just a thought, if you are making quick breads, what's going to hold your bread together if not using oil or eggs/replacer? I'm just curious.

Let us know how your recipes come out.

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#4 Old 04-05-2011, 11:30 PM
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it's going to take a long time for me to get back to you on that. a skilled baker, i am not . but i am tiring of commercial bread products, so i suppose necessity will be the mother or invention, as they say. is anyone here making fat free vegan breads?
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#5 Old 04-05-2011, 11:34 PM
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sandwhich bread with yeast? or just a quick bread like banana, zucchini or applesauce bread?
If making yeast breads, there are tons that are already vegan, and I would supppose the amt of fat in them would vary. Why do you want to make fat free bread? Have you checked out Susan's site and blog at www.fatfreevegan.com or www.blog.fatfreevegan.com? I don't know if you've been on her sites, but I would start looking there for recipes! Her sites are awesome!

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#6 Old 04-06-2011, 12:02 AM
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yeah, i've been browsing her recipes. i'm basically trying to eat without oils or nuts or concentrated fats or animal products. i'm making this change for health reasons, proactively. not to say that on rare occasion i may have nuts (i've got a couple of nut trees), but in my basic everyday diet i'd like to eliminate fats. i've read where some folks say ener-g is terrible. i'm going to try it, regardlesss, but i'm also looking for other alternatives. i'd like to make several kinds of bread. my favorite breads, if we're talking about taste only, are yeasty white breads. but i'm going through a change as far as what food means to me (it's not worth dying for literally), and i know that's out of the question. so the adventure begins .
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#7 Old 04-06-2011, 07:15 AM
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I totally understand wanting to cut down your fat consumption, and a veg diet can be a great way to do it, but don't forget that you can't eliminate oils all together! Your body needs some, but the better oils come from walnuts for the omega 3s (should be eaten every day!), and cashews and other nuts, and then be sure to add in avocado for the healthy veg based saturated fats. Even coconut oil has a place in your diet. Don't be completely fat free, or you could see some negative mood effects, your hair can become brittle and lifeless, your skin dry and not as supple,

here are the reasons we need healthy fats from another site:
Unsaturated fats are mainly oils from vegetables like olive oils, as well as the oils that we get from seeds, nuts, eggs, and leafy green vegetables. These are all needed, as they give us the essential fatty acids that we need from the groups Omega 3 and Omega 6. It is important that you are getting the correct ratio of Omega 3:6 in your daily diet, it is essential for good health and can protect us against certain disorders and food allergies.

These essential fatty acids are needed in the body for many reasons:
Healthy hormone production
Healthy immune system
Protect our internal organs
Help improve cholesterol levels
Fuel to burn when needed
Keep our skin & hair healthy
Maintaining our mental stability
To assist in the absorption of fat-soluble vitamins A,D,E & K, which we need for healthy growth and development

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#8 Old 04-06-2011, 08:17 AM
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the doctors i am reading (ornish, mcdougal, esselstyn) dispute that we actually "need" additional fats added to our diet. there are more than sufficient trace amounts of essential fatty acids in a starch. fruit and vegetable based plant diet.

per Dr. Esselstyn

• You may not eat anything with a mother or a face (no meat, poultry, or fish).
• You cannot eat dairy products.
• You must not consume oil of any kind—not a drop. (Yes, you devotees of the Mediterranean Diet, that includes olive oil, as I’ll explain in Chapter 10.)
• Generally, you cannot eat nuts or avocados.
You can eat a wonderful variety of delicious, nutrient-dense foods:
• All vegetables except avocado. Leafy green vegetables, root vegetables, veggies that are red, green, purple, orange, and yellowand everything in between
• All legumes—beans, peas, and lentils of all varieties.
• All whole grains and products, such as bread and pasta, that are made from them—as long as they do not contain added fats.
• All fruits.




eat like this and your vascular system will clear itself. i've read extensively of these physicians, and i believe they are absolutely correct.
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#9 Old 04-06-2011, 08:43 AM
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I disagree, it sounds too restrictive, but you have to do what you think is right. Do they tell you how to bake and cook fat free then? If you're looking for the breads, maybe checking out some RAW sites would be beneficial to you. Ani's is a good site to start. Actually they aren't really breads, but more cracker types, and they use dehydrators for many food items.

I can confirm the mood swings and dry skin from going too low on fat. Just be careful and monitor your body closely.

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#10 Old 04-06-2011, 10:06 AM
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i have to admit, you made me curious. I never heard of Dr Essylstyn before so googled him, and watched his media video. It didn't give a whole lot of info, but I'm really curious why he would eliminate nuts and avocados from the diet. I can totally understand canola and olive oil, but not natural oils in whole foods themselves. What does the "generally" mean when he says you can not eat nuts or avocados. Are there exceptions or limits?


What does he say in that chapter 10? Please share, might be worth taking out of the library.

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#11 Old 04-06-2011, 11:10 AM
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check out youtube for esselstyn and ornish and john mcdougall. there are others as well. i have esselstyn's book, but i must have mislaid it, as i cannot find it. i looked for 5 minutes, and that's all i can invest . one thing i will tell you is the book does give some recipes but it's weak there, and its real value is esselstyn's discussion and case studies. i asked a surgeon at work about these guys, and he actually went to school with dean ornish. he thinks they are correct but he says people do not want to stay on the diet. i also spoke with a prominnent cardiologist who makes a fortune placing heart stents and he says the problem with these diets is that most patients don't stay on them. the cardiologist himself is about 60 lbs overweight, so he ought to know. so most heart patients (who got to their state of health by eating the typical american diet) now hear they cannot eat meat or animal products, and it's highly unpopular to them. hell, they're still in denial. however, a vegetarian giving up oil and milk and eggs isn't as big a leap. basically, you're going vegan and giving up oil, rarely eating nuts and avacado.

fat deposts don't just happen in the arteries. it also happens in the microvessels in our organs, and the effect is cumulative. i have worked enough heart attacks and chest pains to know there is nothing special protecting me.

in his book, esseltyn points out cases where people have been eating those "good" oils, but have had very bad health results in terms of continued vascular damage. check out the imaging he's done, showing the effectiveness of this diet. it's quite impressive.

i don't have heart disease as far as i know, and i'm going to have a little almond milk for baking, etc. it's just important to use fat in your diet very carefully, with no more than 10% of the calories coming from fat. for a 2000 calorie diet, that would mean around 19 grams of fat a day, which is what i want to limit consumption to. if i had heart disease, i'd go on the ultra low fat regimin, no almond milk even. i will tell you after you've been on this diet for a bit, you will find oils repulsive. if you eat anything fried in oil, as soon as your tounge hits it, you go *yecch!*
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#12 Old 04-06-2011, 11:32 AM
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You don't need any egg replacer to make fat free yeast breads. The only ingredients you need are yeast, water, salt, and flour. If you want to do whole grains, it helps to add some gluten flour (makes the breads a bit lighter). This is the recipe I use - there are also whole grain versions if your browse the recipes on that site.

If you're talking about quick breads, ener-G egg replacer should work. You can also check out some other egg substitutes, depending on whether your recipe needs binding or leavening. For example, I've used flax eggs successfully in recipes that already contained some baking powder/soda and mostly needed the binding aspect of eggs.
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#13 Old 04-06-2011, 12:25 PM
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Originally Posted by RunnerVeggie View Post

You don't need any egg replacer to make fat free yeast breads. The only ingredients you need are yeast, water, salt, and flour. If you want to do whole grains, it helps to add some gluten flour (makes the breads a bit lighter). This is the recipe I use - there are also whole grain versions if your browse the recipes on that site.

If you're talking about quick breads, ener-G egg replacer should work. You can also check out some other egg substitutes, depending on whether your recipe needs binding or leavening. For example, I've used flax eggs successfully in recipes that already contained some baking powder/soda and mostly needed the binding aspect of eggs.

thanks, exactly what i was looking for .
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#14 Old 04-06-2011, 02:23 PM
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papyamon. Like the poster above said. I make loads of whole grain breads that contain ONLY 5 ingredients, yeast, flour, sugar, salt and water. Some don't even contain much sugar, if any.
I don't have an online place to go, but if you googled traditional yeast breads I imagine you would find something of help

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#15 Old 04-06-2011, 03:02 PM
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thanks, exactly what i was looking for .

Happy to help!

I should also add, I haven't used Ener-G egg replacer in anything that's totally fat free, but I have used it to veganize some recipes for things like cornbread, cookies, and brownies. It worked great. I'm not sure why the bad rap - I'm sure it doesn't work perfectly in every recipe, but it's inexpensive and easy to use.
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#16 Old 04-06-2011, 03:33 PM
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i have to admit, you made me curious. I never heard of Dr Essylstyn before so googled him, and watched his media video. It didn't give a whole lot of info, but I'm really curious why he would eliminate nuts and avocados from the diet. I can totally understand canola and olive oil, but not natural oils in whole foods themselves. What does the "generally" mean when he says you can not eat nuts or avocados. Are there exceptions or limits?


What does he say in that chapter 10? Please share, might be worth taking out of the library.

Dr. Caldwell Esselstyn, Prevent and reverse heart disease. I know a man who had triple bypass, stents, drugs... then told there was nothing more that could be done-his wife was prepared for his death. He got this book, followed it to the letter, called on Esselstyn, and now is one of the most vibrant people at work! It's been over a year now, and his tests show great improvement. Actual reversal of blocked arteries. He also had type 2 diabetes enough to warrent insulin-he's now off all diabetes drugs!
This is a severely restrictive diet, specifically geared towards heart problems. No fat, largely raw. It's had documented success unlike any other studies. What I've been told from this man is that the people he knows on it, stay on it because it means life or death to them.
He went vegan for health, now it's also ethical.
His son is Rip Esselstyn of the Engine 2 Diet-vegan, and low fat.

I recommend vegans read this as another testimont of vegan health.

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#17 Old 04-06-2011, 03:42 PM
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I use only 1T. of olive oil when I make bread, and often forget. It's fine. I don't know of any need for eggs in a yeast recipe.
Never tried Ener-g. I use 1T. cornstarch to 2T. water, the cornstarch going in the dry ingrediants.
I post this list of subsitutions on my cabinet:
http://www.bobsredmill.com/docs/pdf/egg.pdf

I like this for muffins, and non-chewy cookies like chocolate chip. For heavier things, quick breads, oatmeal cookies i like flax- 1T. ground flax mixed with 2T. water.

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#18 Old 04-06-2011, 06:35 PM
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Dr. Caldwell Esselstyn, Prevent and reverse heart disease. I know a man who had triple bypass, stents, drugs... then told there was nothing more that could be done-his wife was prepared for his death. He got this book, followed it to the letter, called on Esselstyn, and now is one of the most vibrant people at work! It's been over a year now, and his tests show great improvement. Actual reversal of blocked arteries. He also had type 2 diabetes enough to warrent insulin-he's now off all diabetes drugs!
This is a severely restrictive diet, specifically geared towards heart problems. No fat, largely raw. It's had documented success unlike any other studies. What I've been told from this man is that the people he knows on it, stay on it because it means life or death to them.
He went vegan for health, now it's also ethical.
His son is Rip Esselstyn of the Engine 2 Diet-vegan, and low fat.

I recommend vegans read this as another testimont of vegan health.

yes, it's the very antithesis of the standard western diet! another good read is dr. john mcdougall. this movement is gaining steam .
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#19 Old 04-06-2011, 09:54 PM
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McDougall and Ornish I'm a little familiar with, but hadn't heard of Esselstyn before. That's why I was thinking to check out raw diet sites, because I believe many don't use much oils either. That would be one diet very hard to follow I think. I'm not sure i could or would want to do it now. I'm really pretty careful about my fats in general, but if it really is life or death, then a person would be foolish not to follow it. I think my diet is much better than the typical western diet, but due to hereditary genes, my fasting cholesterol was still 181, and that's being vegan!

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#20 Old 04-06-2011, 11:01 PM
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Here is a one page handout about Baking Without Eggs that you can print up and put on your fridge or cupboard:
http://www.veganbakesale.org/veganba...thout-eggs.pdf

Here is what it says:
Quote:
Baking Without Eggs
Condensed from The Joy of Vegan Baking By Colleen Patrick-Goudreau

Eggs perform various functions in baked goods, from binding and leavening to adding moisture and richness, all of which can be replicated as well if not better with healthful, plant-based ingredients.
Below is a brief overview of which ingredients work best when, and in what quantities.

Ground Flaxseed
For each egg you replace, whisk 1 tablespoon of ground flaxseed with 3 tablespoons of water until the mixture is thick and creamy.
Works best in: waffles, pancakes, bran muffins, breads, oatmeal cookies.

Ripe Banana
Consider half a mashed or pureed banana as a replacement for one or two eggs.
Works best in: breads, muffins, cakes, and pancakes.

Applesauce
¼ cup of unsweetened applesauce equals one egg.
Works best in: moist cakes, breads, quick breads, and brownies.

Silken Tofu
Whip ¼ cup in a blender or food processor until smooth and creamy. This equals one egg.
Works best in: rich, dense, and moist cakes and brownies.

Vinegar and Baking Soda
A ratio that works well is 1 teaspoon of baking soda along with 1 tablespoon of vinegar. Apple cider vinegar and white distilled vinegar are good choices.
Works best in: cakes, cupcakes, and quick breads.

Commercial Egg Replacer Powder (NOT Egg Beaters or Better N Eggs®)
The most common brand is Ener-G. Egg replacer powder is economical and long-lasting. Follow the instructions on the box. For best results, whip into a froth.
Works best in: cookies. But is also a handy all-around egg substitute for recipes.

Also: Search online for recipe vegan followed by whatever it is you want to make. You will find thousands of delicious egg-free recipes.

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#21 Old 04-07-2011, 01:24 PM
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McDougall and Ornish I'm a little familiar with, but hadn't heard of Esselstyn before. That's why I was thinking to check out raw diet sites, because I believe many don't use much oils either. That would be one diet very hard to follow I think. I'm not sure i could or would want to do it now. I'm really pretty careful about my fats in general, but if it really is life or death, then a person would be foolish not to follow it. I think my diet is much better than the typical western diet, but due to hereditary genes, my fasting cholesterol was still 181, and that's being vegan!

the diet is not that hard to follow. your taste buds change over the first few weeks. i eat all i want. beans, rice, veggies, fruits. all you'd be doing is eliminating oils. see what mcdougall has to say about oil .

Not a day goes by that I dont hear someone say to me, My diet is completely vegan, but I am still 40 pounds overweight. The oily sheen on her face and hair are a clear give away that she hasnt been willing to stop adding the half cup of extra virgin olive oil to her spaghetti sauce. Many people fall short of their health and appearance goals because they have yet to eliminate all the added vegetable oils from their cooking. Eating out is a major stumbling block. More often than not, even after using the best communication skills with the waiter, the diner plate still glistens with an oil slick. Avoiding free vegetable oils is the last important hurdle for people seeking better health. Take the final stepjust say No to these really unessential added oils.
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#22 Old 04-07-2011, 02:48 PM
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there's a lot of controversy over the added canola/olive oil, and I can't condone at all that either of those are necessary, but I still can't get over no nut oils. I enjoy baking occasionally, and even sauteing in a Tbsp or less for 4-6 servings. i'm not like the food channel, where they start with a quarter cup. I think I'll see if the books are at the library, although can't seem to get much reading done. I have Mark Bittman's book on my night stand, and have only read a few pages

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#23 Old 04-07-2011, 03:13 PM
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yes, it's the very antithesis of the standard western diet! another good read is dr. john mcdougall. this movement is gaining steam .

Hmm, I need to look into this. I usually just use a bit of evoo on salads or pasta, and use almonds as a caloric filler. Will read up on this, vascular health is important.
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#24 Old 04-07-2011, 03:19 PM
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thanks for all the suggestions, everyone. i'm going to be experimenting shortly .
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#25 Old 04-07-2011, 03:42 PM
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Ener-G I've only used in cookies. I'm a huge fan of soygurt in quickbreads & cupcakes. I don't bake that often. Other things that 'replace' eggs intrigue me but I don't have first hand experience with.

(I put replace in quotes because I try to think in terms of function rather than terms of ingredients - so 'replace with X' is just shorthand for 'what ingredient will be functionally similar in this recipe to whatever I'm NOT using')

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#26 Old 04-07-2011, 03:49 PM
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there's a lot of controversy over the added canola/olive oil, and I can't condone at all that either of those are necessary, but I still can't get over no nut oils. I enjoy baking occasionally, and even sauteing in a Tbsp or less for 4-6 servings. i'm not like the food channel, where they start with a quarter cup. I think I'll see if the books are at the library, although can't seem to get much reading done. I have Mark Bittman's book on my night stand, and have only read a few pages

any oils are not found in nature in concentrated amounts. nuts aren't totally off limits, but very rarely, and you should eat whole nuts, not pressed oils.

why can't you get over this? i loved chips and salsa. i had that as a snack every day. now it's wasa bread and salsa, and it's not any less satisfying. i can only promise you your taste buds will change (along with your high blood lipids).
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#27 Old 05-16-2011, 10:14 PM
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It took me 10 minutes to go back though all the posts I've made to early April to find this post, and am happy to say, I finally pulled this book out of the library....The first chapter is so impressive, that I read most of it out loud to my hubby as he was driving today. I can't wait to get into chapter 10 where he talks about the nuts....that's what I really want to know about. Anyway, I'm going to read this one first, then take out Rip's book the Engine 2, and if that's really good, I'm going to get a copy for my SIL to be, as he's a firefighter also.

Very intriguing....I was online last night reading somewhere about the OMega 3 to OMega 6 ratio, and how most American's are way out of whack with that, and one woman did her own trial being supervised for 30 days, and ate more 6's than 3s, and she could tell her abdomen got larger, and her resting metabolic rate decreased, with some other issues....anyway, he addresses that early on too.

So while I was really anti NO FAT, I'm definately willing to read up on it.....I need to make peace with how our bodies can be ok without some added fat from whole foods..

Just wanted to let you know papyamon!



edited: Didn't know they got banned........oops....oh well, this discussion was good for me!

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