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#1 Old 02-16-2018, 08:07 AM
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Vegan activist?

Hey all
I'm echidna
I'm 17, and I've been vegan for almost a year, but I'm joining this because...
it doesn't feel like enough
I want to do more, and I'm seeking ideas on activism...of all kinds
Excited to be here!
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#2 Old 02-16-2018, 12:25 PM
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Here's an idea I saw just now: https://littlegreenseedling.com/2018...table-animals/

I suggest you have a think about what is best for you. Different types of activism are appropriate for introverts vs extroverts for example. Are you a good cook, a good speaker, a good organizer etc. Or, given your age, what do you feel more comfortable developing skills in?

What country do you live in and what region of that country? Are there any organizations near you?
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#3 Old 02-16-2018, 06:15 PM
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Originally Posted by echidna View Post
Hey all
I'm echidna
I'm 17, and I've been vegan for almost a year, but I'm joining this because...
it doesn't feel like enough
I want to do more, and I'm seeking ideas on activism...of all kinds
Excited to be here!

Jamie makes excellent points. There are many types of vegan activism, and you may find that some types are better suited to your personality.

I would urge you to be very careful about joining organizations that personally confront people who abuse animals, or organizations that stage protests directed towards specific individuals. I used to work with a woman who was involved in a protest against a university animal testing lab director. The protesters staged a demonstration in front of the guy's house. Things quickly went bad when the group started chanting, "We know where you sleep! We know where you sleep!". The protesters were arrested for making a violent threat, and several of them ended up in legal court. Certain high-profile activists, such as Chris DeRose of Last Chance for Animals, have been jailed multiple times. He is a hero in my opinion, but it is a risky path. The point I'm making is that, if you choose to work in confrontational activism, you need to know your legal rights and risks. A felony record can make it very difficult to get a job.

If I were your age, and if I had already become a vegan, I might consider a career in lab-grown meat (also called "cultured meat") - that is, meat foods that are grown in vats, from a tiny sample of animal tissue. We need committed biologists, food scientists, process engineers, and business people to help make cultured meat affordable - I think it's the only way to really end large-scale animal agriculture.
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Specific recommendations for a healthy diet include: eating more fruit, vegetables, legumes, nuts and grains; cutting down on salt, sugar and fats. It is also advisable to choose unsaturated fats, instead of saturated fats and towards the elimination of trans-fatty acids."
- United Nations' World Health Organization
http://www.who.int/topics/diet/en/

Last edited by David3; 02-16-2018 at 06:32 PM.
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#4 Old 02-16-2018, 07:25 PM
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Jamie makes excellent points. There are many types of vegan activism, and you may find that some types are better suited to your personality.

I would urge you to be very careful about joining organizations that personally confront people who abuse animals, or organizations that stage protests directed towards specific individuals. I used to work with a woman who was involved in a protest against a university animal testing lab director. The protesters staged a demonstration in front of the guy's house. Things quickly went bad when the group started chanting, "We know where you sleep! We know where you sleep!". The protesters were arrested for making a violent threat, and several of them ended up in legal court. Certain high-profile activists, such as Chris DeRose of Last Chance for Animals, have been jailed multiple times. He is a hero in my opinion, but it is a risky path. The point I'm making is that, if you choose to work in confrontational activism, you need to know your legal rights and risks. A felony record can make it very difficult to get a job.

If I were your age, and if I had already become a vegan, I might consider a career in lab-grown meat (also called "cultured meat") - that is, meat foods that are grown in vats, from a tiny sample of animal tissue. We need committed biologists, food scientists, process engineers, and business people to help make cultured meat affordable - I think it's the only way to really end large-scale animal agriculture.
.
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Lab grown meat is hardly the only way, or the best solution. The solution is every single person becoming an ethical vegan for the animals.

When people wake up and make the ethical connection for justice, and for the animals, then large-scale animal agriculture will end.

Cultured meat is NOT the solution. It's a nasty way for people to replicate the sensation of meat-eating.

How would you obtain the first cells for the cultured meat? would you biopsy an animal? would you slaughter an animal? either way, that is ethically problematic.

The future, in my opinion, for vegan activism in in INTERSECTIONALITY.

I would recommend, for the new vegan activist, to understand how issues of justice are inter-sectional. In other words, understand how the injustice inflicted on animals is related to the injustice inflicted on humans.

That is the future. That is intersectional veganism.
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#5 Old 02-16-2018, 07:44 PM
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How would you obtain the first cells for the cultured meat? would you biopsy an animal? would you slaughter an animal? either way, that is ethically problematic.
A biopsy is minimally invasive - it's certainly far less invasive than the slaughter of hundreds of millions of animals.

It's unlikely that 100% of the world, or even 50% of the world, can be quickly convinced to join an idealistic revolution of compassion - especially one that requires an initially radical change in lifestyle. I don't think it's fair to make the animals wait for such a revolution.

I agree that eating cultured meat is distasteful - I personally wouldn't eat it. But, it would prevent countless animals from suffering.

.

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Specific recommendations for a healthy diet include: eating more fruit, vegetables, legumes, nuts and grains; cutting down on salt, sugar and fats. It is also advisable to choose unsaturated fats, instead of saturated fats and towards the elimination of trans-fatty acids."
- United Nations' World Health Organization
http://www.who.int/topics/diet/en/

Last edited by David3; 02-16-2018 at 08:38 PM.
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#6 Old 02-16-2018, 07:53 PM
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Biopsies are minimally invasive - it's certain less invasive than the slaughter of hundreds of millions of animals.

Affordable cultured meat could happen in 20 years - it could mark the end of large-scale animal agriculture. Or, we could wait another 100 years, or longer, for people to become vegan.

It's very unlikely that 100% of the world, or even 50% of the world, can be convinced to join an idealistic revolution of compassion. It's not fair to make the animals wait for it.

.
Veganism is NOT an "idealistic revolution of compassion". It's about fundamental JUSTICE. Veganism is a JUSTICE movement. In other words, people are morally obligated to live vegan-and if they do not, they are living an unjust life.

It's not fair to live as a non-vegan. It's not fair to animals. Compassion and justice are different.

Again, the solution is NOT cultured meat. The solution is VEGANISM.

The solution is forcing veganism on the world, just as laws against murder and rape are forced on the world.

Yes, cultured meat might prevent some suffering, but we as vegans are concerned with fundamental justice. Justice for animals means complete veganism.

Last edited by Necter; 02-16-2018 at 07:57 PM.
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#7 Old 02-16-2018, 07:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Necter View Post
Veganism is NOT an "idealistic revolution of compassion". It's about fundamental JUSTICE. Veganism is a JUSTICE movement. In other words, people are morally obligated to live vegan-and if they do not, they are living an unjust life.

It's not fair to live as a non-vegan. It's not fair to animals. Compassion and justice are different.

Again, the solution is NOT cultured meat. The solution is VEGANISM.

The solution is forcing veganism on the world, just as laws against murder and rape are forced on the world.

You may be right - the solution may be veganism. I welcome whichever solution comes first - world veganism, cultured meat, or some other solution. More importantly, the animals will welcome whichever solution comes first.

Unfortunately, laws are not sufficient to protect individuals from violence. According to the Bureau of Justice Statistics, in the year 2016, U.S. residents age 12 or older experienced 5.7 million violent victimizations, including rape or sexual assault, robbery, and aggravated and simple assault: https://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/press/cv16pr.cfm
.

_________

Specific recommendations for a healthy diet include: eating more fruit, vegetables, legumes, nuts and grains; cutting down on salt, sugar and fats. It is also advisable to choose unsaturated fats, instead of saturated fats and towards the elimination of trans-fatty acids."
- United Nations' World Health Organization
http://www.who.int/topics/diet/en/
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#8 Old 02-16-2018, 08:09 PM
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You may be right - the solution may be veganism. I welcome whichever solution comes first - world veganism, cultured meat, or some other solution. More importantly, the animals will welcome whichever solution comes first.

Unfortunately, laws are not sufficient to protect individuals from violence. According to the Bureau of Justice Statistics, in the year 2016, U.S. residents age 12 or older experienced 5.7 million violent victimizations, including rape or sexual assault, robbery, and aggravated and simple assault: https://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/press/cv16pr.cfm
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Yes, it is obvious that laws are not sufficient. But in a civilized society, laws send a message about what is right and what is wrong.

Veganism, similarly, is about right vs. wrong. Veganism is right, non-veganism is wrong.

It is important that veganism be law because that sets an initial line as to what is acceptable and what is not acceptable. It is unacceptable to abuse animals for any reason; it is unacceptable to murder animals; it is unacceptable to rape animals. Therefore veganism should be enforced by law.

Veganism is about justice, morality, ethics, and animals rights.

It is not enough to make veganism law, I agree. We must be vigilantes for the animals.

It is up to each of us, personally, to make veganism the moral baseline and ethical imperative.
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#9 Old 02-16-2018, 08:21 PM
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Yes, it is obvious that laws are not sufficient. But in a civilized society, laws send a message about what is right and what is wrong.

Veganism, similarly, is about right vs. wrong. Veganism is right, non-veganism is wrong.

It is important that veganism be law because that sets an initial line as to what is acceptable and what is not acceptable. It is unacceptable to abuse animals for any reason; it is unacceptable to murder animals; it is unacceptable to rape animals. Therefore veganism should be enforced by law.

Veganism is about justice, morality, ethics, and animals rights.

It is not enough to make veganism law, I agree. We must be vigilantes for the animals.

It is up to each of us, personally, to make veganism the moral baseline and ethical imperative.

I agree with your points. However, the idea of vigilantism is risky. Even trained and licensed police officers have been guilty of abusing the rights of others, in violation of the law. With vigilantism, the risk of abuse is greater, because the vigilante may act anonymously, with no professional obligation towards the law.

Law enforcement is essential, but police and vigilantes can only do so much. For society to operate peacefully, people have to be raised and socialized to be peaceful. People must be taught compassion - the threat of legal punishment is not enough to guarantee peace.
.

_________

Specific recommendations for a healthy diet include: eating more fruit, vegetables, legumes, nuts and grains; cutting down on salt, sugar and fats. It is also advisable to choose unsaturated fats, instead of saturated fats and towards the elimination of trans-fatty acids."
- United Nations' World Health Organization
http://www.who.int/topics/diet/en/
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#10 Old 02-16-2018, 08:30 PM
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I agree with your points. However, the idea of vigilantism is risky. Even trained and licensed police officers have been guilty of abusing the rights of others, in violation of the law. With vigilantism, the risk of abuse is greater, because the vigilante may act anonymously, with no professional obligation towards the law.

Law enforcement is essential, but police and vigilantes can only do so much. For society to operate peacefully, people have to be raised and socialized to be peaceful. People must be taught compassion - the threat of legal punishment is not enough to guarantee peace.
.
Yes, I believe that may be correct.

It is certainly correct that police officers have been guilty of abuse up to and including murder. I believe it is essential to recognize this fact.

Now, I don't think police are the solution--I think that vegan activism is the solution. We need a diversity of vegan activists on the frontlines, to be sure.

Justice for animals, Justice for humans. I believe the future of vegan activism is in Intersectionality.

Intersectional veganism is about justice for animals and humans.
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#11 Old 02-17-2018, 09:22 AM
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be safe! treat others how you would like to be treated
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