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#31 Old 07-12-2015, 10:56 PM
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Originally Posted by varun View Post
Vegetarian = no meat & eggs, but milk, cheese & honey allowed.

Vegan = no meat, eggs, milk, cheese, honey, leather & silk, not even in small traces.

Lacto-vegan = only milk and milk by-products allowed, rest are not.

Lacto-ovo-vegan = only milk, milk by-products and egg allowed, rest are not.

Most people including me believe that the last 2 categories should not exist but they do and I'm only making my point within the popular definitions of each.
This is interesting.

Vegetarian, in Australia, just means "no meat/animals". (The Vegetarian Society seems to hold a similar view). There's no mention, really, of whether we eat eggs or not.

Then we have lacto-vegetarian, ovo-vegetarian and lacto-ovo vegetarian.

And seriously? There's such a thing as a lacto-ovo vegan? That seems silly. Whoever is calling themselves that can report to my office at once, I have a disappointing look and a dictionary to show them.
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#32 Old 07-13-2015, 04:38 AM
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Originally Posted by Tiger Lilly View Post
And seriously? There's such a thing as a lacto-ovo vegan? That seems silly. Whoever is calling themselves that can report to my office at once, I have a disappointing look and a dictionary to show them.
I know right? When I was new here it took me awhile to understand why so many classifications are needed, and then I became numb to logic when it comes to such nomenclatures. Apparently for each group whose preferences are different, they create their own dietary identity howsoever weird it maybe. Personally I feel there should be just one word (as is the system where I'm at) - vegetarian i.e basically someone who doesn't consume meat & eggs. Then there can also be pure vegetarian, i.e someone who shuns milk & honey and other animal by-products.

Apparently lacto-ovo-vegans are people who want milk and eggs as part of their diet, but they do the other stuff like avoiding leather, silk etc. A few hard & fast rules in this area wont hurt but then people who want to forcefully include themselves into a vegan umbrella without fully being vegan will cry foul and call our lifestyle as extreme or intolerant.

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#33 Old 07-13-2015, 10:45 AM
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Originally Posted by PigPrairieDog View Post
I have been reading a lot of the threads throughout the vegan forums and have noticed that a fair bit of irritation occurs when people call themselves vegans but still 'insert offense here'. Examples of offenses could be continuing to eat honey, not using separate kitchen tools for your meat-eating family, or any such non-vegan behaviors. So, as a newbie here in the forums, I would like to pose a question to the seasoned vegan veterans (and anyone else that cares to add their opinion...).

Which is better? Continuing to use items that either came from an animal (such as leather shoes or kitchen tools/appliances that you purchased before becoming a vegan) or throwing away items because they are not part of a vegan lifestyle?

I know that many people will say that you don't have to throw away these items, you can just give them away, but I'm asking more about older items that other people may not want (like used shoes). Plus this is a little bit of a philosophical question...
I usually say, if you have one pair of leather workboots and that's all you can afford: wear the damn boots ad choose differently next time the only issue with wearing animal product items you'd previoulsy purchased is it gives people the impression that it's "okay." But I think if it's going to be a terrible hardship, wear them out till they're gone and then choose differently. I personally chucked everything but that's because I didn't want it near me.

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#34 Old 07-13-2015, 02:56 PM
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New stuff requires materials and creates waste
Bingo! I saw a great essay by a British vegan who was on a long-term work assignment overseas. He needed to replace his shoes some time after he got there and he couldn't find anything suitable locally. He could order a pair, but when he "ran the numbers" he saw that when he took all things involved into account it would actually have a greater negative impact on animals to get vegan shoes delivered than it would to purchase locally produced nonvegan shoes! Ultimately he had the vegan shoes delivered, but he was honest about the negatives.

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I call myself a vegetarian, but I choose to not consume eggs or dairy for ethical reasons.
I use 'non-dairy ethical vegetarian' in my head and sometimes in public, but it's often just a whole lot easier to just use 'vegan'. The problem I have with that word is the way it is often portrayed. Specifically, as being committed to a particular view - deontological, legalistic, seeing Western property law as both the problem and the solution.

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Apparently lacto-ovo-vegans are people who want milk and eggs as part of their diet, but they do the other stuff like avoiding leather, silk etc.
In other words an 'ethical vegetarian'. When I first went vegetarian (long before I started eating a vegan diet) it was understood that ethical vegetarians wouldn't use leather and such even though many of us consumed dairy and eggs. To pretend otherwise (as contemporary veganism often does) is nothing short of self aggrandizing ahistorical claptrap. A retcon, nothing more. ('Retcon' comes from comics fandom, it means 'retroactive continuity')
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Last edited by Dave in MPLS; 07-13-2015 at 03:18 PM.
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#35 Old 07-14-2015, 04:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PigPrairieDog View Post
I have been reading a lot of the threads throughout the vegan forums and have noticed that a fair bit of irritation occurs when people call themselves vegans but still 'insert offense here'. Examples of offenses could be continuing to eat honey, not using separate kitchen tools for your meat-eating family, or any such non-vegan behaviors. So, as a newbie here in the forums, I would like to pose a question to the seasoned vegan veterans (and anyone else that cares to add their opinion...).

Which is better? Continuing to use items that either came from an animal (such as leather shoes or kitchen tools/appliances that you purchased before becoming a vegan) or throwing away items because they are not part of a vegan lifestyle?

I know that many people will say that you don't have to throw away these items, you can just give them away, but I'm asking more about older items that other people may not want (like used shoes). Plus this is a little bit of a philosophical question...
I'm a new vegan 22 days in and I think its a complete waste to toss tools clothes or anything else that you had before your lifestyle change. Particulary with clothing the damage has already been done, its better to use it and be conscious of your decisions in the future imo.
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#36 Old 07-15-2015, 04:33 AM
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Don't make it too hard on yourself - Anyone even at least trying a vegan lifestyle is admirable. Being alive requires consumption which at some point requires destruction of something on the Earth. It's all about how little impact we can have and fact is even a person that decides to not eat meat one day a week is better than probably 2/3 of the world population.

After years of wanting to support and live in an environmentally friendly way I have found veganism to be the strongest choice. It's because the strictness and micromanaging down to even the almost silly things like we are discussing here - but that's what makes veganism effective!

I think focus should be on strict dieting, then once you got that covered start small with other products. Again, make it enjoyable (but work hard at not being a hypocrite) so you and the others around you can truly see the positive about being vegan rather than always being worried/bitter. (easier said than done, I know!)
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