Stimulus package-GOP itemized things it didn't like. Your thoughts? - VeggieBoards
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#1 Old 02-03-2009, 10:51 AM
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http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/02/...ies/index.html



Assuming this is an accurate list and hasn't been exaggerated/warped by the GOP, do you agree with them?



A number of these don't create jobs directly but could help in the long run.(e.g. smoking cessation program could reduces medical cost which allows people to spend the $$ on something else.



..and in general living people spend more money than dead people.



This however is clearly pork:

A $246 million tax break for Hollywood movie producers to buy motion picture film.

Happiness is not the result of a mathematical equation comparing the good times and bad times someone has had. It is a state of mind.
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#2 Old 02-03-2009, 11:13 AM
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Obama doesn't seem to be starting off too well. Some of the items in other lists have been hilarious and these aren't much better. It seems that most Americans don't approve of it either. I just hope they can come to an agreement soon and get it signed by their mid-February deadline.
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#3 Old 02-03-2009, 11:33 AM
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Part of the problem is that everyone wants everything immediately. That attitude started the whole problem. I want to be rich immediately and you got sub-prime loans, no down payment, no job, no credit. Sell them to the next group bundled together and make your money now - you don't have to worry about anyone paying on their mortgage. Bundled loans get sent up the line to risk management and insurance companies. Everyone is making money NOW! Oh no -- people who shouldn't be owning a home because they are bad credit risks aren't making their payments! Who could have guessed that but I made my brokerage fee NOW! Now the republicans was everything fixed NOW. Obama has been in office for 2 weeks. Bush was in office 8 years while this sh__ was happening and the republicans were in power for 12 of the last 14 years in congress but Obama has to fix everything NOW! Good grief. Calm down and let things start recovering.



I'll give you one example of some recovery happening right now in Colorado. 2 years ago we voted in a requirement that 20% of utility energy had to be renewable by 2012. We already have a Danish wind blade factory going north of Denver with an American company coming in to start another one. My rural county is going to get a wind farm in the next 2 years. Another one is nearly complete in northern Colorado. This is recovery but it takes place over a period of years.
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#4 Old 02-03-2009, 11:53 AM
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I agree that they should invest in long term initiatives as well, but it just burns me up when I see grossly obvious pork such as the tax break for Hollywood producers.

Happiness is not the result of a mathematical equation comparing the good times and bad times someone has had. It is a state of mind.
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#5 Old 02-03-2009, 12:05 PM
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I can't see the hybrid vehicles as being a bad thing, but most of the rest of that list is a bit laughable if true. There were two items I had heard last week that made me laugh, but I don't see them on there and I don't remember what they are right now. I don't care for Obama but I hope he has success with this.
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#6 Old 02-03-2009, 01:07 PM
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I don't think any one like the obvious pork except the people back home who will benefit from it. Our fire department got a grant (pork) to buy a new fire truck and we put in some of the money and got it. The truck has put out fires here and it was built by people in the U.S. It isn't a chinese truck. So even pork sometimes makes jobs and benefits people.



I would like to see a stimulus program that spends money on things the government already does as part of its job such as roads, bridges, police, fire, prisons, rails. All of these things produce jobs. Let the private sector rise and fall on its own merits with encouragement by the stimulus package of tax credits for creating jobs, tax credits for buying fuel efficient cars and putting solar on your roof. I might put a wind generator on my place if I got a good credit for it. (I already have a wind mill but it only pumps water) Tax credits promote certain behaviors and private enterprise responds to those behaviors.
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#7 Old 02-03-2009, 01:13 PM
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I say they just hand out 20k to all Americans instead of stupid pork and that will get the economy going again.
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#8 Old 02-03-2009, 01:14 PM
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I say they just hand out 20k to all Americans instead of stupid pork and that will get the economy going again.



or just erase everyone's student loans
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#9 Old 02-03-2009, 01:17 PM
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Everything looks great to me except that Hollywood producer one.. I don't quite understand that...

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#10 Old 02-03-2009, 01:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Tori~CL View Post

I say they just hand out 20k to all Americans instead of stupid pork and that will get the economy going again.



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or just erase everyone's student loans



Or both!

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#11 Old 02-03-2009, 01:25 PM
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or just erase everyone's student loans



And don't forget credit card debt and health insurance debt.
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#12 Old 02-03-2009, 01:30 PM
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or just erase everyone's student loans



I wouldn't argue with that one. Scot free!
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#13 Old 02-03-2009, 01:31 PM
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But seriously, I agree with the protestations of Congressional Republicans on all of the itemized spending.
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#14 Old 02-03-2009, 01:43 PM
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Originally Posted by Tori~CL View Post

I say they just hand out 20k to all Americans instead of stupid pork and that will get the economy going again.





That would cost $6 trillion. If you divide the $819 billion package by 300 million people, each person would get $2730. You might make a dent in your student loan with that or you could buy a couple wide screen tv's (give it to china). You could put a small down payment on a car. You could pay rent for a couple months or your mortgage. I would buy a horse.
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#15 Old 02-03-2009, 02:01 PM
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That would cost $6 trillion. If you divide the $819 billion package by 300 million people, each person would get $2730. You might make a dent in your student loan with that or you could buy a couple wide screen tv's (give it to china). You could put a small down payment on a car. You could pay rent for a couple months or your mortgage. I would buy a horse.



Maybe it should go by a certain age group?
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#16 Old 02-03-2009, 02:12 PM
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Maybe it should go by a certain age group?



Don't you dare leave us old folks out!
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#17 Old 02-03-2009, 02:30 PM
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Don't you dare leave us old folks out!



I would never. I am liberal.
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#18 Old 02-03-2009, 03:32 PM
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But seriously, I agree with the protestations of Congressional Republicans on all of the itemized spending.



I actually do too, and I love Obama and am getting more liberal each day that passes.
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#19 Old 02-03-2009, 05:18 PM
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or just erase everyone's student loans



+1



Long term benefits for the society!
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#20 Old 02-03-2009, 06:25 PM
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i agree with the thing about stds and ermm...



maybe 2 or 3 more things but that is it.
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#21 Old 02-04-2009, 12:17 PM
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Funny how massive budget deficits and trillion dollar pork packages are now good for the future of the U.S., and the most important thing is to get people out to the malls and spending money.



Was GW really a closet Democrat, or just a man ahead of his time?
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#22 Old 02-04-2009, 02:10 PM
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Was GW really a closet Democrat, or just a man ahead of his time?



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#23 Old 02-04-2009, 08:55 PM
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Was GW really a closet Democrat, or just a man ahead of his time?



Only at the end to try something 'smart' to only mess it up again before his butt got kicked back to Texas.
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#24 Old 02-04-2009, 09:07 PM
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#25 Old 02-04-2009, 09:24 PM
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Gah, don't like Glenn Beck.
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#26 Old 02-05-2009, 02:29 AM
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Gah, don't like Glenn Beck.

I agree but he has his moments.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z1JyU3dQxLM

one of the worst things about Columbus is our mayor (his wife isn't great either).



I was talking with my grandfather the other day. He had some stories to tell about the great depression. He's a former army officer and was building an airfield using a labor crew from the civilian conservation corps. They couldn't use any of the vehicles, just shovels, even then it was just a few shovel fulls then they'd stop to watch a plane take off then a few shovel fulls then watch a plane take off. They couldn't be fired. and really if the idea is to maximize labor by not using construction vehicles why let them use shovels when they can use spoons. Why even waste their time they could be using to look for a real job.



Keynes said that only important thing was getting the money into circulation. People could be employed in digging holes then filling them back up. I don't agree with that classical keynesian approach (utterly pointless work or money for no work devalues the dignity of work). But it's shamefully how badly the stimulus bill messes up such a simple task by finding all these projects that mean the money will be bond up and not injected into the system immediately. The "buy american" provision sends the wrong signal to all the rest of the world.



the stimulus bill got derailed by some democratic agenda items. some of the republican ideas should be incorporated as it goes ahead. they have a counter proposal thats smaller, more immediate and targeted and one idea that i really liked was that spending will stop once the recession has ended (two quarters of positive growth). a stimulus with an exit plan, not bad.



how about a massive tree planting campaign, thats something we can do quickly. it wouldn't crowd out the private sector.

* This post may contain pork, beef and fingers of undocumented workers. This post was manufactured in a facility that processes peanuts.
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#27 Old 02-05-2009, 07:48 AM
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Gah, don't like Glenn Beck.



He is about as shallow and they come. He gets small details wrong which support his agrument but if corrected negates his argument. He skims over the surface of problems with his talking points and never delves deep into the problem where you might find a solution. He aims for the lowest common denominator of viewers and listeners. I started turning him off back when he was on CNN.
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#28 Old 02-05-2009, 07:56 AM
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Notice how Glen talks about Al Gore the whole time the money supply is shooting up under Bush but never mentions Bush. Al Gore had nothing to do with the Treasury Dept under Bush. Beck is really a piece of work.
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#29 Old 02-05-2009, 09:21 AM
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how about a massive tree planting campaign, thats something we can do quickly. it wouldn't crowd out the private sector.



Obama's plans for a new green sector is like a tree-planting campaign on steroids, in one sense.
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#30 Old 02-05-2009, 06:43 PM
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Notice how Glen talks about Al Gore the whole time the money supply is shooting up under Bush but never mentions Bush. Al Gore had nothing to do with the Treasury Dept under Bush. Beck is really a piece of work.



Why does no one want to talk about the information presented in the video?
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