Obese have right to 2 airline seats, court rules - VeggieBoards
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#1 Old 11-20-2008, 02:21 PM
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From Canada:



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OTTAWA, Nov 20 (Reuters) - Obese people have the right to two seats for the price of one on flights within Canada, the Supreme Court of Canada ruled on Thursday.



The high court declined to hear an appeal by Canadian airlines of a decision by the Canadian Transportation Agency that people who are "functionally disabled by obesity" deserve to have two seats for one fare.



The airlines had lost an appeal at the Federal Court of Appeal in May and had sought to launch a fresh appeal at the Supreme Court. The court's decision not to hear a new appeal means the one-person-one-fare policy stands...

http://www.reuters.com/article/rbssA...39776920081120



What about very tall people? And why do they charge extra for a pet that is put under the seat? And what about fees for exceeding the weight limits on luggage, no matter how necessary the cargo? Does this law make sense? Should they extend leniency to others who have need for more space or more weight?

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#2 Old 11-20-2008, 02:32 PM
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Huh... I see the airline's point....



What happens if they sell 100 tickets on a 100 seat plane -- only to find 1-4 people need 2 seats? But then if you ask "do you need two seats because you're obese", will people who really take up that much space really say "yes" and will people who don't need it say "yes" just to have more space for free? They'd have to potentially undersell all flights just to make sure there's enough room for everyone. Or put in larger seats on every plane (that'd drive the cost up real quick), or just put in a few seats on every plane for those needing it (probably the best solution overall, as it's cheaper all the way around) -- then they only have to worry that they're "discriminating" by making obese people sit together or something.



Maybe a compromise of not having to pay for both seats, but like a 25-50% markup or something on the seat sale could've just been done.... as I'm wondering if they say "obese seating is 35% more" compared to "obese people need to pay 2x the cost of their seat (2 seats)" would've been less.... "controversial".
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#3 Old 11-20-2008, 03:30 PM
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Install smaller doors on the planes, that'll fix it.
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#4 Old 11-20-2008, 04:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scythe View Post

Install smaller doors on the planes, that'll fix it.



Ha! I like it. I personally think that if you are taking up 2 seats just because you are obese, you should have to pay for 2 seats. Maybe that's harsh, but that's my opinion.
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#5 Old 11-20-2008, 04:49 PM
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I remember when this happened on Southwest Airlines and it turned out that their seats were four inches narrower than the average airline seat. I personally think it is fine to charge for two seats, but don't fix it so you have the upper hand....
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#6 Old 11-20-2008, 04:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FitChick99 View Post

I personally think that if you are taking up 2 seats just because you are obese, you should have to pay for 2 seats. Maybe that's harsh, but that's my opinion.



I don't think it's harsh, and I agree.
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#7 Old 11-20-2008, 05:06 PM
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If I get two seats for the price of one simply because I am fat then I'm going to start flying with pillows shoved up my clothes. Sweet!

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#8 Old 11-20-2008, 05:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kiz View Post

If I get two seats for the price of one simply because I am fat then I'm going to start flying with pillows shoved up my clothes. Sweet!



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#9 Old 11-20-2008, 06:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kiz View Post

If I get two seats for the price of one simply because I am fat then I'm going to start flying with pillows shoved up my clothes. Sweet!







It wouldn't surprise me if people actually tried that. It'd be pretty comfy!
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#10 Old 11-20-2008, 08:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sarahjayn1980 View Post

Wow. I hope you then plan to take those pillows and consistantly have them strapped to you . . . all day, every day, constantly. And that the pillows have the density of human fat. And that you are subject to the discrimination that obese people face on a daily basis.



I cannot believe the insensitivity of people on this thread. It's sickening. If someone said, "I'm going to walk with a limp so I can get a handicapped spot," I would imagine that a lot of you would think that was pretty disgusting. How is this different? Not all fat people are fat due to over consumption, and many (many, not most, not the majority) people are handicapped by their own decisions.



I don't agree with giving away free extra seats to all obese people, but this little snippet hardly gives the full extent of the law. I'd be interested to read more. In the meantime, I'd hardly think its a good idea to throw compassion to the side and mock the obese. There's never a reason to be mean.



Thanks for expressing my thoughts much more politely than I ever could have.
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#11 Old 11-20-2008, 08:09 PM
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No, but the problem is that it's only obese people who are getting more seats. 7'4" men don't get them. People with severe social phobia don't get them. What, exactly, is the difference between a fat person who needs two seats and someone with a phobia they cannot control needing two seats? Why should the phobic and tall pay and the fat not? C'mon, either all people who want or need a spare seat should get it free or all should pay.

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#12 Old 11-20-2008, 08:10 PM
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Is it a surprise that this forum may not be sympathetic towards people who don't restrict what they eat?



Most of us are vegans or vegetarians, and, by nature, restrict what we eat.
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#13 Old 11-20-2008, 08:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sarahjayn1980 View Post

in the meantime, i'd hardly think its a good idea to throw compassion to the side and mock the obese. There's never a reason to be mean.







qft.
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#14 Old 11-20-2008, 08:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by das_nut View Post

Is it a surprise that this forum may not be sympathetic towards people who don't restrict what they eat?



Most of us are vegans or vegetarians, and, by nature, restrict what we eat.



I restrict what I eat. I am very strict and I am still over weight! I have lost plenty of weight and still losing, feeling healthier everyday, So your argument is moot.
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#15 Old 11-20-2008, 08:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by das_nut View Post

Is it a surprise that this forum may not be sympathetic towards people who don't restrict what they eat?



Most of us are vegans or vegetarians, and, by nature, restrict what we eat.

So you're saying that them fatsos eat everything. Good to know.

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#16 Old 11-20-2008, 08:20 PM
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I think the ruling by the Court is a good one.



There's more than enough mean spirited discrimination in the name of making a buck.



I'm not too (ok, not at all) familiar with Canadian law but seems to me a measure of accomodation for those with a physical difference. There have been many very positive rulings handed down by U.S. Courts using that same rationale.
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#17 Old 11-20-2008, 08:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Sevenseas View Post

So you're saying that them fatsos eat everything. Good to know.



Yes we do, I'd eat my own hand but I'm not sure if that would be vegan.



Oh by the way I am going to sleep. Luckily the person who sold it to me seen me coming and gave me a great deal, he said, "For people your size we usually have to charge you for 2 beds, but I like you so today only, I'll just charge you for one!"
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#18 Old 11-20-2008, 08:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kiz View Post

....People with severe social phobia don't get them....





I'm slightly claustrophobic (basically I like having space around me), whenever I get on a plane i have to be by the window (strange in a sense as I'm more "trapped" - but I look out the window so it's like it's more open).... let's just say I wish people with problems like that could get other seats..... I once got caught between two obese people on a plane (I got kicked out of my seat because they couldn't sit next to each other). Let's just say with one overweight person to my left, and one to my right -- my seat was already full before I got in there. What really annoyed me was I had the seat reserved before them.... I know because when I got it I was told the row was empty.
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#19 Old 11-20-2008, 08:28 PM
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I don't think anyone on this thread is maliciously mocking fat people. It just simply doesn't make sense for the airline to absorb the cost of "unsold" seats because of someone else's lifestyle choices. As others have said, they charge by weight on luggage and these benefits don't extend to very tall people, etc. I would think this policy would cause everyone's fare to rise.



A person has every right to be fat, and if they make choices that cause them to remain obese (the fraction who are genetically obese aside), that's their deal. More power to them. No one else should have to pay for it.
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#20 Old 11-20-2008, 08:39 PM
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I'm sorry if this thread is making anyone feel bad.



I just thought it was a very interesting and controversial ruling.

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#21 Old 11-20-2008, 08:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sarahjayn1980 View Post

I agreed with that, but I'm sorry, you can't convence me that saying, "I'm going to strap pillows to myself!" isn't mockery. It is.



Of course it is mockery. But it's mocking the court system and it's insane level of disparity and not obese people. If you drop the pretense of being politically correct and thought about what the OP was about (laws, court cases) and not "obese people" you might have picked up on that.

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#22 Old 11-20-2008, 08:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sarahjayn1980 View Post

I'm claustrophobic, too, and I have skin problems that are angried by close contact over a prolonged period. So, I understand sitting in close quarters sucks. It is part of flying, though.



It wouldn't of been as bad had I not of been in the middle (despite having a different seat on my ticket), arms and legs crossed just to fit in. If they hadn't also had a bag in their lap, heavy winter coats, pillows/etc..... I was so not amused. When I woke up right before landing (apparently I had passed out before the takeoff), they even put their things on top of me to give themselves more room! It was just a shame when I had to be by people that just happened to be jerks as well.



But at the same time nothing could be done during the flight as the airline apparently had a lot of last-minute bookings by a group.... a number were in my situation (some people had to be moved from ticket-seats because of a similar situation), and they had filled every single seat in the plane. The flight attendants looked like they were having a bad day too, no one was happy, everyone was crammed in, etc. They had practically given up and just wanted the flight over and it hadn't even started.



All I know is, the airline I was on definitely needed something in place to prevent things like that from happening. I even heard some people asking who to complain to when they got off the plane (we arrived at 4-5am, before the airport was "open" fully so to speak). Basically, that experience was just a bad flight all the way around. Not the common for me. Normally there's free space, flight attendants could move people so they had more room/etc.
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#23 Old 11-20-2008, 08:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sarahjayn1980 View Post

Maybe if you would get past the fact that obese people aren't pawns in politcal satire, but people with feeling who often are the subject of discrimination and mockery daily, you'd see why things like this are so upsetting.



Why aren't you upset that other people are discriminated against? Why is it OK to allow fat people two seats but not people with social phobia? Oh.. because they're not you and they don't count!

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#24 Old 11-20-2008, 08:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Irizary View Post

I'm sorry if this thread is making anyone feel bad.



I just thought it was a very interesting and controversial ruling.



I think the ruling should've been "airlines must have 6-8 seats that are 50% larger than the standard and kept open for the obese, tall, etc on every flight". And maybe a "strong suggestion" that all seats should be that way (on new planes at the least). The way they did it's just going to make people unhappy (cramped people on a plane), or have the airline out money (loss of seat prices if they don't put someone in it).



But then that only really matters if your flights are really full.
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#25 Old 11-20-2008, 09:01 PM
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If I was a betting woman I'd make a tonne of cash betting that a good 99% of people that get "upset" at internet forums and just bunging it on for the attention.

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#26 Old 11-20-2008, 09:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sarahjayn1980 View Post


ETA: I'm still waiting to be shown where I said that it was okay to discriminate against some people, but not others, Kiz. I'm really interested to know when I said something that is the complete opposite of my thoughts and feelings.

You have raised the issue of discrimination against overweight people, but you haven't at the same time talked about the discrimination of every other group of individuals on the planet. This makes you selfish and biased.



Either you should enumerate all discriminated groups known to man and address each of them in a looooong post, or then you should not voice any concerns about discrimination at all.

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#27 Old 11-20-2008, 09:27 PM
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I express jolliness @ this thread.
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#28 Old 11-20-2008, 09:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sarahjayn1980 View Post

You're right. It is just for the attention. That's the only reason fat people ever express emotions other than jolliness. Let me get back to laughing so my belly can shake like a bowl full of jelly for you.



Or, maybe, its because the commentary on this thread has upset me, and I'm a person with equal rights to express my opinions, thoughts, and feelings on this board like every body else.



ETA: I'm still waiting to be shown where I said that it was okay to discriminate against some people, but not others, Kiz. I'm really interested to know when I said something that is the complete opposite of my thoughts and feelings.



One: this is an internet message board. You know what you are getting when you come here. It's the Compost Heap no less. You gird your loins and spring into the battle and then get butt-hurt when someone disagrees? Yes, of course you have a right to opinions and to saying them. Getting butt hurt over a no-hold-barred debate on a message board is just being silly.Two:It was the bit where I was mocking the court system and you seemed to think that was disallowed because fat people where involved. Why on earth would it matter who the people in the court case where? Fat, tall, phobic? It was you who came out with the idea that becasue somewhere along the line obese people were involved you can't somehow mock a system that gives free things to one set of people and no free things to another set who are also suffering in just the same way.It's a goddamn message board. HTFU

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#29 Old 11-20-2008, 10:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sarahjayn1980 View Post


Maybe people with noisy babies should be required to get their own private planes.



Yes.
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#30 Old 11-20-2008, 11:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sarahjayn1980 View Post




Maybe people with noisy babies should be required to get their own private planes.



I like that idea.
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