Who won the 2nd debate - Page 2 - VeggieBoards
View Poll Results: Who won the 2nd debate
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#31 Old 10-09-2004, 11:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Annie View Post

I'm glad of it. I'd rather have someone jump up and do something when my family is threatened or at risk of danger, than have someone be too afraid of what everyone *might* think about them, to actually take action. I don't want a "leader" who's going to pander to the masses and make bad choices, only to increase his self esteem.





Yeah, he really jumped when he found out the WTC was attacked. He spent 7 minutes just sitting in that classroom, and another 20 minutes before he even left the school! Great leadership!
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#32 Old 10-10-2004, 12:31 AM
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I've been on Vioxx for almost a year. When I first started it, I was warned about the things that are making headlines now. The relief from 24 hour pain made it worth the risk. It really isn't some big coverup.



OK. I guess it depends on your definition of coverup.



Quote:
The US Food and Drug Administration silenced one of its drug experts who raised safety concerns weeks before Merck & Co removed the blockbuster drug Vioxx due to increased risks for heart attack and strokes, the chairman of the Senate Finance Committee said.



Dr David J. Graham, associate director for science in the FDA Drug Centre's Office of Drug Safety, told Senate investigators he faced stiff resistance within the regulatory agency to his findings.



"Dr Graham described an environment where he was 'ostracized', 'subjected to veiled threats' and 'intimidation'," Republican Senator Chuck Grassley, of Iowa, said in a statement after Finance Committee investigators interviewed the researcher yesterday.



(emphasis mine)



http://www.heraldsun.news.com.au/com...5E1702,00.html
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#33 Old 10-10-2004, 05:39 AM
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From pollingreport.com



http://pollingreport.com/wh04misc.htm



Bush 41%



Kerry 44%



Tie 13%
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#34 Old 10-10-2004, 01:46 PM
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Bush is smart, he plays it american anti-intellectual though. listen, he gave a clear answer on the supreme court judge question mentioning he would be a "constructionist" after explaining what that means (a clear philosophical school of constitutional law), kerry dodged it and said he'd pick a "a good one" riiiigghhht. he also mentioned biodiesel, which makes him awesome in my book. Kerry has no ideas, he just claims to do everything better, now he's saying Iraq may be a Lebanon (is he hinting he'll just pull out? talk about vacillating). Screamin' Dean had ideas and integrity, Kerry is just an opportunist.

* This post may contain pork, beef and fingers of undocumented workers. This post was manufactured in a facility that processes peanuts.
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#35 Old 10-10-2004, 02:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Gothic Sponge View Post

Yeah, he really jumped when he found out the WTC was attacked. He spent 7 minutes just sitting in that classroom, and another 20 minutes before he even left the school! Great leadership!

Read Kerry's book. He said he (and the rest of congress) sat there in bewilderment for "more than 30 minutes" before they were physically wisked away to a safer place. Seven doesn't seem so long to collect your thoughts, consider your options, weigh the outcome, gather strategy, and give an order. Bet YOU couldn't have done better.
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#36 Old 10-10-2004, 04:27 PM
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Not the 7 minute argument again. Can we put that in another thread? PLEASE?
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#37 Old 10-10-2004, 04:31 PM
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Ahhhhhhhhhh it all makes sense now.



I was banging my head against the wall trying to figure out why on earth Bush would bring up Dred Scott. I thought perhaps his strategists were trying to have Bush appear smart by bringing up a point in American history. Or maybe just to show that personal opinion doesn't necessarily mean that something is right.



In fact, it goes beyond that and now it's obvious... here's a post from a Democrats Abroad AU forum I read:



Quote:
When asked in the second debate what kind of judges he'd appoint to the Supreme Court, George W. Bush first joked that he'd pick people who would appoint him President -- and then made a seemingly bizarre reference to the 1857 Dred Scott decision. From the transcript:



> Another example would be the Dred Scott case, which is where judges,

> years ago, said that the Constitution allowed slavery because of

> personal property rights.

>

> That's a personal opinion. That's not what the Constitution says. The

> Constitution of the United States says we're all -- you know, it

> doesn't say that. It doesn't speak to the equality of America.



For 95 percent of us, Bush's remark was utterly baffling: What on earth does the Dred Scott case have to do with selecting modern judges? It's not as though you'd find many pro-slavery judges here in the 21st century.



But for the other 5 percent of the audience -- the hardcore fringe of the anti-abortion crusade -- Bush's answer spoke directly to them. In the language of the extreme right, Dred Scott decided that slaves were not citizens, had no Constitutional rights, and were the "property" of their owners... and Roe vs. Wade decided that *fetuses* were not citizens, had no Constitutional rights, and were the "property" of the women whose bodies they resided in.



To anti-abortion zealots, Roe vs. Wade is the modern-day Dred Scott decision: A judicial mistake that *must* be corrected, by Constitutional amendment if necessary. Anti-abortion web sites frequently cite Dred Scott as the frame of reference for thinking about Roe vs. Wade; you can see a list of citations at <http://www.dailykos.com/story/2004/10/9/16460/5820>.



In sum, Bush's remarks were a shout-out to his fans in the

anti-abortion seats. You may not have understood him -- you're not *meant* to have understood him -- but Bush's base got the message loud and clear. A vote for Bush is not a vote for judges who'll overturn Dred Scott: It's a vote for judges who'll overturn Roe vs. Wade.

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#38 Old 10-10-2004, 07:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Annie View Post

Read Kerry's book. He said he (and the rest of congress) sat there in bewilderment for "more than 30 minutes" before they were physically wisked away to a safer place. Seven doesn't seem so long to collect your thoughts, consider your options, weigh the outcome, gather strategy, and give an order. Bet YOU couldn't have done better.



Congress doesn't have the authority to give to NORAD, the president does! Face it, Bush has had two major screw ups as president. He ignored the 8/6/01 PDB Entitled "Bin Laden Determined to Strike in U.S." Where was he for the month of august? on vacation! BTW Bush has spent more than 40% of his presidency at one of his three retreats. (I wish i could get that amount of time off) He led us into a unjust war with Iraq! Now our troops and thousands of Iraqis are dead, FOR NOTHING! All for Haliburton profits right!?!



I suggest that you go enlist in the military. No excuses. No waiting. If you support Bush and war in general, you should enlist!
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#39 Old 10-10-2004, 08:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Gothic Sponge View Post

Congress doesn't have the authority to give to NORAD, the president does! Face it, Bush has had two major screw ups as president. He ignored the 8/6/01 PDB Entitled "Bin Laden Determined to Strike in U.S." Where was he for the month of august? on vacation! BTW Bush has spent more than 40% of his presidency at one of his three retreats. (I wish i could get that amount of time off) He led us into a unjust war with Iraq! Now our troops and thousands of Iraqis are dead, FOR NOTHING! All for Haliburton profits right!?!





Do you really believe that a president at a "retreat" doesn't meet daily with his advisors? Hasn't BUsh met with numerous members of Congress and diplomats, not to mention foreign leaders, while on what you incorrectly call "vacations"?
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#40 Old 10-10-2004, 10:20 PM
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Do you really believe that a president at a "retreat" doesn't meet daily with his advisors? Hasn't BUsh met with numerous members of Congress and diplomats, not to mention foreign leaders, while on what you incorrectly call "vacations"?



Yep. He takes 'em down into the basement and he "looks" at 'em. Then he asks them if they "got everything they need."



Then he goes back to trimming that pesky brush.







d
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#41 Old 10-11-2004, 12:08 AM
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I didn't watch it..



But I'm just gonna go with Kerry would have bet Bush.

And I hope he did.



By the looks of things.. he did. Hahah. sucker.
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