Video game linked to murder, taken off market - Page 2 - VeggieBoards
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#31 Old 07-30-2004, 03:52 PM
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I know that. And I appreciate your perspective. I never once thought I would end up with boys. I grew up with all sisters. I was supposed to have girls...



My husband used to play some of the games. (He's their step-dad). We're trying to do the best we can. And he tempers me, cause I can get a bit crazed about the violent stuff. I've never been properly desensitized...



The almost 6 year old starts school a week from Monday. Right now my biggest worry is what to pack in his veg*n lunchbox. It just gets harder, doesn't it?
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#32 Old 07-30-2004, 03:54 PM
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Rincaro -



Sounds like you parent your kids just like I do.

I cringe when I see kids playing like they are killing one another.

I don't think it makes them all become killers, by any means, but any displays of meanness (even in "pretend") really bothers me.



As they grow older, I relax the standards according to their maturity level.....I don't want to dominate or overly shelter them.
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#33 Old 07-30-2004, 03:59 PM
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And yes, it does get harder.

My daughter is 15....just started driving, no less....



I'm so blessed that she truly respects me....so many teens don't respect, or even like, their parents (I was one, once upon a time.) She really values my opinions and viewpoints. I'd eat glass before I'd do anything to screw that up.....she's the best!
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#34 Old 07-30-2004, 04:03 PM
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Games have ratings on them just like movies and music. Manhunt was made for adults and only adults. It's not the developer of the game's responsibility to make sure kids aren't playing it, it's the parents responsibility and no one elses.



People need to take the ratings on them seriously, they aren't just there for show. Parents need to stop buying these games for their kids, or stores need to stop selling them to kids. Developers should be able to make anything they want, even if you think it's disgusting. Personally, I enjoy playing violent video games, but I'm a non-violent person. I played Doom when I was like 12 years old and I've never gone out and killed anyone because my mom taught me how to be a decent human being.
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#35 Old 07-30-2004, 04:29 PM
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I rented that game a while back and I thought it was pretty lame. It's fairly gory but.. then again so is the news.
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#36 Old 07-30-2004, 06:06 PM
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As long as it's private retailers calling the shots and not the government, I don't really care.
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#37 Old 07-30-2004, 06:42 PM
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every single one of my friends and I have played the most violent things available throughout our whole lives and have never even seriously injured a person, so if games do have any relation to violence, its probably already to disturbed children, so to me the real thing is to identify these disturbed children and try to get them treatment early to prevent this type of thing from happening..because anything could have set this kid off..(which would require healthcare) a game..a movie..a book..a poem..anything could be used as an excuse..people love to trample on games and say they are too realistic but just wait until your form of expression is trampled upon then you'll look back and think "oh"



(assuming that it was even that and thats just not the excuse they use, how do i even know the kid ever played the game..do they have video of him playing it ?)
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#38 Old 07-30-2004, 06:59 PM
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I don't think anybody is blaming the video game directly for the violence that happened in this case here. What they're doing is saying a certain game may have influenced this person's actions. There's a difference. The person could have seen a violent act in the video game and decided to do use that same idea when they committed the crime. Ultimately, the person made the decision to be violent, not the video game.



Everything around us can influence our actions. It doesn't mean we're going to follow that influence, but it does influence our thoughts. Thoughts can turn into deeds if we think about them enough. This can be positive or negative depending on what the results are.



So, I personally try to avoid violent/graphic movies and video games. I've noticed when I do play/watch these sorts of things I'm a lot more aggressive and mean, so I'd rather avoid it. It doesn't mean I'm gonna go out an hurt or kill someone/something, but I'd rather not act aggressive or mean. I don't need to be desensitized about violence, either. Violence is a horrible thing and I'd like to be able to keep this mindset about it. I think it's awful when some people are so desenstized toward violence that they watch violent things happen or on tv and think it's funny or cool.



When I have children of my own, I will probably do the same thing with them that I do for myself. As they get older I'll relax that rule to what I think they can handle at the time so they're not too sheltered.



I think parents should be more involved in what games they let their children play and what movies/tv programs they let them watch. Most kids aren't going to flip out and do something violent, but there's always a few who will. That can be prevented if parents, educators, and others watch out for the kids (and adults) around them and take action if they see things that start to look questionable.
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#39 Old 07-30-2004, 07:12 PM
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"I think parents should be more involved in what games they let their children play and what movies/tv programs they let them watch. Most kids aren't going to flip out and do something violent, but there's always a few who will. That can be prevented if parents, educators, and others watch out for the kids (and adults) around them and take action if they see things that start to look questionable."



i completely agree with that last part...to me it simply says that the kids violence could be triggered by anything violent whether it be the news, a movie or a game..or maybe even family conflict



i find it very hard to believe that a child in a normal home would just go out and kill someone with a claw hammer..i think that his parents should be the ones under the intense scrutiny, they shouldnt be the ones barking about games etc
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#40 Old 07-30-2004, 07:18 PM
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I think it's awful when some people are so desenstized toward violence that they watch violent things happen or on tv and think it's funny or cool.



I agree with most of what you said except this part. At least for me, there's a big difference between being desensitized to fake violence and desensitized to real violence. I may enjoy killing things in video games and it doesn't effect me in any way, but when I see real violence I still get very upset by it. I absolutely hate violence, but I have no problem being violent in a game. I don't feel more aggressive after playing a violent game either, but every person is different. I would think kids are affected the most by video game violence, which is exactly why parents have to be very careful what they allow them to do.



And I'm pretty sure they are trying to blame the game itself from what I read, otherwise it probably wouldn't have been taken off the shelves anywhere.
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#41 Old 07-30-2004, 07:20 PM
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Oh dear. I've really got to fess up here. Since playing Counter Strike I have taken a job as a counter-terrorist. On the weekends I moonlight as a terrorist. To pay for my bombs, I steal cars, just like I did whilst playing Grand Theft Auto. My next career move is going to be dressing up as an elf and casting magic spells, I'm sure it will make my life so much easier.

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#42 Old 07-30-2004, 07:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Kiz View Post

Oh dear. I've really got to fess up here. Since playing Counter Strike I have taken a job as a counter-terrorist. On the weekends I moonlight as a terrorist. To pay for my bombs, I steal cars, just like I did whilst playing Grand Theft Auto. My next career move is going to be dressing up as an elf and casting magic spells, I'm sure it will make my life so much easier.



let me know how that goes for ya, ive been thinking about dressing up like a monkey and rolling around in a ball



(super monkey ball if anyone knows what that is )]



to add..yes i do play manhunt .....AND super monkey ball
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#43 Old 07-30-2004, 07:38 PM
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censorship causes brain damage. this game was pretty lame in my opinion, give me silent hill or resident evil over this, anyday, but the way this situation was handled wasnt mature at all. Thats like the parents who tried to sue Ozzy Osbourne for saying that one of his songs made their son kill himself, when in reality that kid was pretty seriously depressed before he heard that record. The parents should be looking at other things that could have made this kid go out and kill someone, not at what video game was in his playstation.
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#44 Old 07-30-2004, 07:54 PM
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Originally Posted by BDever View Post

I agree with most of what you said except this part. At least for me, there's a big difference between being desensitized to fake violence and desensitized to real violence. I may enjoy killing things in video games and it doesn't effect me in any way, but when I see real violence I still get very upset by it. I absolutely hate violence, but I have no problem being violent in a game. I don't feel more aggressive after playing a violent game either, but every person is different. I would think kids are affected the most by video game violence, which is exactly why parents have to be very careful what they allow them to do.



I said some people, not all.



Quote:
Originally Posted by BDever View Post

And I'm pretty sure they are trying to blame the game itself from what I read, otherwise it probably wouldn't have been taken off the shelves anywhere.



Ok, I did miss that part. It helps when I read things through thoroughly. The general argument I think though is that games/tv shows aren't directly to blame, but that they can influence people's actions so parents should be careful what they let their children play/watch.
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#45 Old 07-30-2004, 08:06 PM
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Originally Posted by schu View Post

let me know how that goes for ya, ive been thinking about dressing up like a monkey and rolling around in a ball



(super monkey ball if anyone knows what that is )]



to add..yes i do play manhunt .....AND super monkey ball



Oh, I've got Super Monkey Ball 2, that's some good stuff right there. Me and my friends go crazy on all the multiplayer games. Monkey Bowling and Monkey Baseball are some of the best!
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#46 Old 07-30-2004, 08:07 PM
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For the record, I like Super Monkey Ball 2 a LOT better than Manhunt.
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#47 Old 07-30-2004, 08:10 PM
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Silent Hill 1&2 kicks Monkey Ball out of the water, man. and Twisted Metal Black. that game gave me nightmares...sheesh.

but Monkey Ball is really fun with alot of people.
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#48 Old 07-30-2004, 08:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Rebel Girl View Post

Silent Hill 1&2 kicks Monkey Ball out of the water, man. and Twisted Metal Black. that game gave me nightmares...sheesh.

but Monkey Ball is really fun with alot of people.



Comparing Silent Hill to Monkey Ball is like apples and oranges. I do loves me some scary games though. I had this friend who was too scared to play resident evil games on his own, so we'd always play them together. (Well, actually, I'd play them, and he'd watch while hiding under a blanked). We'd stay up all night screaming and laughing. Good times. Whats embarassing is that this was only about 2 years ago.
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#49 Old 07-30-2004, 09:16 PM
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yeah i cant play RE alone. same with Twisted Metal Black, even though I've beaten both. Silent Hill i think is my all time scary game fun.
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#50 Old 07-30-2004, 09:29 PM
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Silent Hill was cool, but it never scared me that much. Other than the radio static when you come close to a zombie, which was kinda spooky, it never really scared me. RE has some cheap shocks in it, which are always fun, but it's also got an axiety factor SH doesn't have. I felt a lot worse when I ran out of ammo in RE and could hear zombies moaning across the hall than any time in SH.
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#51 Old 07-30-2004, 09:50 PM
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Oh, and to get back on topic, even violent games can have a good message. My friend sent me this screenshot from the rediculously violent Postal 2 today:
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#52 Old 07-30-2004, 10:21 PM
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Originally Posted by MikeyVT View Post

My parents let me play video games such as Doom and Wolfinstein as a child and I am an educated, mature, and responsable human.





What a surprise Mikey, we disagree again. I didn't say you were immature or irresponsible. I just think that parent allowing children time with games where the child is acting as a shooter is a mistake. Nothing may EVER happen, the child may grow up to be as you said, 'educated, mature and responsible'. But my feeling as a parent and educator is that it's a mistake.



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#53 Old 07-30-2004, 10:31 PM
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My parents never had a problem with me playing videogames, even violent ones. In their opinion, they'd rather have me using my brain for problem solving, strategic thinking, reading, etc. than just being a vegetable watching crappy TV shows. As far as the violence issue, they knew I could tell the difference between make believe and reality, and that I would never hurt someone in real life. It's just like boys playing cowboys and indians or cops and robbers 50 years ago, there's a difference between play violence and reality. Most kids know the difference. If they don't, then there are more serious problems than what videogames they play.





well to be quite honest, we don't watch crappy tv shows around here either. some pbs occasionally, and age appropriate computer on the internet. We do a lot of problem solving with real life games, and we spend a lot of time outside. Media, for the most part, takes up a small percentage of our time. I think i just have a different take on this than most of you.



Granted, I don't think the movies or the games are to blame either. I really don't.



But I think when parents aren't monitoring what their children are buying and gaming or watching, it can be a bad combination. And when children who are already emotionally unbalanced play games and watch movies (generally as a babysitter) that depict violence, that's a ticking time bomb. You can't judge that as a salesperson...who you're selling the games to, and of COURSE it isn't fair to ask companies not to sell games that people want to buy. That's bad business.



I am saying though that parents/educators need to have a better handle on this. It's always the same after the fact...the kid spent a lot of time alone playing games, listening to rock music, watching slasher movies. Well the movies/games/rock music aren't really the problem...the ALONE part is. I feel bad for the kid that did the shooting....how the heck did he get to that place?



just my opinion.



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#54 Old 07-30-2004, 10:45 PM
 
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Now I don't reason that a single video game can be responsible for inciting a perfectly mentally healty child to kill someone. However, dismissing violent media as having no effect at all is ignorant. Study upon study, for at least 30 years, have been highlighting the link between consumption of violent images, and increases in violent behavior (among children).



For *some* links to studies/research, check out www.mediafamily.org and click on "research". Good info from a non-partisan, non-sectarian source.



Personally, I don't believe censorship is the best answer. Allowing the videogame industry to police itself = not the best answer either. (duh)

The ones I pity are the ones who never stick out their neck for something they believe, never know the taste of moral struggle, and never have the thrill of victory. - Jonathan Kozol
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#55 Old 07-30-2004, 11:02 PM
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Eh...I dunno, I have a hard time seeing a company called "Media Family" as non partisan. I've yet to see anything conclusive saying that videogames increase violent behavior, and I'd say any evidence that does suggest it hasn't been around long enough to stand the test of time. Videogames have only been a serious part american culture for a 20-25 years. It's probably only been 10-12 years since videogames realistic and violent enough to influence kids have been around. They've probably only been studied the past 5 or 6.
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#56 Old 07-31-2004, 12:07 AM
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I cannot deny that I find violent video games disturbing. I also believe that there is some credance to the claim that witnessing violence on TV/in movies, and engaging in virtual violence through video games, can and does have an effect on peoples' minds and behavior. But I feel uneasy about the blame being laid directly at the feet of video games. Granted, this game sounds like it has no redeeming social value, but can it really be seen as responsible for leading the young man into murder? Is it not more likely that this young man was already very disturbed?



I agree the game is disturbing but the blame has to be placed on the 17 year old nutjob. No video game makes a normal person go out and commit murder.
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#57 Old 07-31-2004, 01:12 AM
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I wonder: what video game was Charles Manson into? How about Hitler? Just curious.
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#58 Old 07-31-2004, 02:16 AM
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IMHO: I don't think video games, movies, music or anything else can be responsible for the things that people do, I have been a fan of violent video games all my life, I played Mortal Kombat from about the age of 6, the worlds first ever violent video game, and still love it, I am also a big fan of other things that have been made scapegoats for a murderers actions, rock/metal music, horror movies, ect, I love FAKE violence, but am completley against ANY sort of real violence (which is obvious due to me being vegan), I would never dream of hurting any living being, much less kill them, you have to have that sort of mind set to do something like that, a video game (or anything else) cannot make a perfecty normal, sane human turn into a murderer, nor does anyone that likes violent video games believe that real life violece is OK, this game is just another thing that has been made a scapegoat for "good, innocent yet impresionable youths turning bad", just like when Marilyn Manson's music was made a scapegoat for other teenage murderes actions,



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#59 Old 07-31-2004, 08:57 AM
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I really think there's some middle ground here that we're missing. I keep trying to bring it up but oh well...



There's somewhere in between banning all violent video games and admitting that yes, exposure to media violence has been/is linked to more violent children.



Again, I'm totally against censorship...but I very much believe that parents need to keep a close eye on their kids and what they watch/play. The media industry is going to sell crap and they have every right to if it makes them money. But parents can have good relationships with their kids, spend time with them and make sure they play games that are age appropriate (it's not age appropriate for a seven yo to be playing a game where he/she shoots at someone).



We always want to argue the extreme right/left of the issues...and we never believe there's any other option.



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#60 Old 07-31-2004, 09:04 AM
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I wonder: what video game was Charles Manson into? How about Hitler? Just curious.



It was obviously those evil frank Sinatra records that spit out violent stananic messages when spun backwards on a turntable.
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