Trayvon Martin Murder - VeggieBoards
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#1 Old 03-25-2012, 07:10 PM
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Ironic that someone tosses flour on Kim Kardashian and gets arrested, and everybody wants to talk about it, but a black kid is murdered in cold blood and the killer remains free, and it's already old news.
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#2 Old 03-25-2012, 07:23 PM
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Ya and a kid was doused with gasoline and set on fire by two black teens because he's white and that didn't make huge news. Looks like nothing is very fair.
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#3 Old 03-25-2012, 07:23 PM
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It's certainly inconsistent and reprehensible.

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#4 Old 03-25-2012, 07:25 PM
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Did we seriously not have a thread about this already?

The whole thing makes me feel really sick, I listened to the 911 call where you could hear him screaming for help. How anyone can try to justify what Zimmerman did is beyond me, the man should have been arrested immediately.

George Takei just wrote an excellent blog post about this and the ridiculous "Stand Your Ground" laws that allowed a murderer to walk free: http://www.allegiancemusical.com/blo...serves-justice

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#5 Old 03-25-2012, 07:27 PM
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Originally Posted by AlixJ18 View Post

Ya and a kid was doused with gasoline and set on fire by two black teens because he's white and that didn't make huge news. Looks like nothing is very fair.

You do bring up a good point. There are literally thousands of cases every day that deserve outrage, and yet only a few gain mass media attention. Maybe there's too much tragedy to handle all at once

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#6 Old 03-25-2012, 07:27 PM
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I saw a blurb on TV where someone was saying that wasn't Martin screaming for help, it was Zimmerman. I haven't paid much attention to the whole thing though I admit.
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#7 Old 03-25-2012, 07:29 PM
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I saw a blurb on TV where someone was saying that wasn't Martin screaming for help, it was Zimmerman. I haven't paid much attention to the whole thing though I admit.

That is absolutely ridiculous, it was clearly the voice of a kid. I've heard people say all kinds of ridiculous bull**** trying to justify Zimmerman's actions, it's horrifying. The man murdered an unarmed 17 year old who had nothing but some iced tea and a pack of skittles, there shouldn't be a debate about who the bad guy is here, geeze

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#8 Old 03-25-2012, 07:32 PM
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Ya and a kid was doused with gasoline and set on fire by two black teens because he's white and that didn't make huge news. Looks like nothing is very fair.

Where's the thread where you discussed it?
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#9 Old 03-25-2012, 07:33 PM
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Wait, does starting threads on Veggieboards actually help people now?

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#10 Old 03-25-2012, 07:35 PM
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Wait, does starting threads on Veggieboards actually help people now?

If that's some sort of measure on here, we have a pretty big problem.
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#11 Old 03-25-2012, 07:36 PM
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Where's the thread where you discussed it?

Haha seriously i'm not going to start a thread about everything i see that is horrible, otherwise that's all that would be on here. You seem to think that if we talk about anything else but this, we are ignoring it even though it's worldwide news, and nobody here is on 'the other side'. Do you think us talking about it is going to magically get him arrested? Because it's not. Generally i don't start any threads except for ones with civil rights violations with petitions to sign, ones where we might actually be able to help.
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#12 Old 03-25-2012, 07:38 PM
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That is absolutely ridiculous, it was clearly the voice of a kid. I've heard people say all kinds of ridiculous bull**** trying to justify Zimmerman's actions, it's horrifying. The man murdered an unarmed 17 year old who had nothing but some iced tea and a pack of skittles, there shouldn't be a debate about who the bad guy is here, geeze

I wasn't debating. I didn't pay much attention to it, just heard it in passing.
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#13 Old 03-25-2012, 07:45 PM
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I wasn't debating. I didn't pay much attention to it, just heard it in passing.

Oh sorry, I wasn't referring to you, just all the people I have been reading about who are trying to justify Zimmerman's actions. Just look at this, it's unbelievable: http://thinkprogress.org/politics/20...nds-zimmerman/

I love the first comment:

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So in essence I can stalk Pratt's kid, wait till he hits me for stalking him, then I get to shot him. Do these people think beyond the next 30 seconds?


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#14 Old 03-25-2012, 07:58 PM
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Haha seriously i'm not going to start a thread about everything i see that is horrible, otherwise that's all that would be on here. You seem to think that if we talk about anything else but this, we are ignoring it even though it's worldwide news, and nobody here is on 'the other side'. Do you think us talking about it is going to magically get him arrested? Because it's not. Generally i don't start any threads except for ones with civil rights violations with petitions to sign, ones where we might actually be able to help.

Is that what I seem to think? You just appeared pretty worked up over it and I thought I have missed something. I don't have any idea what you mean by 'the other side'?
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#15 Old 03-25-2012, 08:19 PM
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VB is pretty notorious slow when it comes to things like current events. When The Jasmine Revolution was happening, on other boards where I posted we were up to 15 pages while I was posting here by myself over and over. It finally picked up speed well into the Egyptian leg of it, but still. Slow on the draw.

It's been almost two months and it gets sadder and sadder by the day. But then part of me feels like the real tragedy isn't just that this kid was murdered in cold blood, but that black parents still have to have The Talk, as Michele Norris put it with their children about how they have to be constantly on the defensive when they go outside, because people will view them as a threat or whatever. Hopefully people will look past not just the cold blooded murder of some kid walking home from a 7011, but will look forward to how a whole community feels that their lives aren't worth anything, that they are disposable and invisible, and how to change that. but i doubt it. actually, i know so. i keep hearing people talking about how Trayvon Martin is this generation's Emmit Till and seriously, I just laugh. Are you serious? It's ridiculous, especially since crimes like this one happen all the time all over this country. Black men are killed all the time, innocent or guilty, armed or unarmed, by cops or civilians. what's so special about this one? people said that some sort of national revelation or something was going to happen when the Jena 6 happened. but they were wrong. nothing happened. not even in Louisiana. i'll be surprised if zimmerman goes to jail at all (you know, who gets in trouble for killing black men nowadays?), and by the time summer rolls around we won't be thinking about Trayvon Martin at all.


still sad though :/ i guess black people really shouldn't be wearing hoodies, amirite?

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#16 Old 03-25-2012, 08:21 PM
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Not sure what the point of you posting this is then if you know that everyone is talking about it, and that nobody is on Zimmermans side.
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#17 Old 03-25-2012, 08:25 PM
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what?

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#18 Old 03-25-2012, 08:27 PM
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Talking to OP
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#19 Old 03-25-2012, 08:48 PM
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It's hard out there if you're black
Walking down the street and get attacked
Bag of Skittles and tea in your hand
Getting shot by the mother****ing man
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#20 Old 03-25-2012, 09:06 PM
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Originally Posted by Wolfie View Post

I saw a blurb on TV where someone was saying that wasn't Martin screaming for help, it was Zimmerman. I haven't paid much attention to the whole thing though I admit.

I highly doubt that.

It took a while for this story to blow up, I heard about it over a month ago.
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#21 Old 03-25-2012, 09:08 PM
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Attachment 18040
Will Smith had the same idea, paperhanger. Psychic!
LL

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#22 Old 03-25-2012, 09:10 PM
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....black parents still have to have The Talk, as Michele Norris put it with their children about how they have to be constantly on the defensive when they go outside, because people will view them as a threat or whatever. Hopefully people will look past not just the cold blooded murder of some kid walking home from a 7011, but will look forward to how a whole community feels that their lives aren't worth anything, that they are disposable and invisible, and how to change that. but i doubt it. actually, i know so. i keep hearing people talking about how Trayvon Martin is this generation's Emmit Till and seriously, I just laugh. Are you serious? It's ridiculous, especially since crimes like this one happen all the time all over this country. Black men are killed all the time, innocent or guilty, armed or unarmed, by cops or civilians. what's so special about this one? people said that some sort of national revelation or something was going to happen when the Jena 6 happened. but they were wrong. nothing happened. not even in Louisiana. i'll be surprised if zimmerman goes to jail at all (you know, who gets in trouble for killing black men nowadays?), and by the time summer rolls around we won't be thinking about Trayvon Martin at all

What a bunch of absolute nonsense. Why is it that people pretend whites perpetrate more violent crimes against blacks than vice versa, or that blacks suffer a significant amount of violence from the hand of whites? Here, have some statistics:

Quote:
Based on US government stats from 2005 (PDF available HERE), over a third of the verified 111,490 rapes and sexual assaults on white women that year were committed by blacks, leading to a total estimated number of black-on-white victims at 37,460. By contrast, black victims of white sexual predators were listed at 0.0%. Scanning these government stats from 2003 to 2008, I counted 135,207 rapes and sexual assaults perpetrated by blacks against whites and ZERO committed by whites against blacks. For the year 2006, Wikipedia’s “Rape in the United States” entry cites statistics that work out to roughly 32,443 black-on-white sexual assaults compared to “a negligible number of white offenders.”

link

We really, really need to stop pretending that black Americans are under some sort of savage assault by white people. The majority of black victims of violent crime had a black offender; the number of blacks victims of violent crime at the hands of a white (non-hispanic) offender are negligible.

If you're serious about helping black Americans live a life free from fear of violent crime, we need to be serious about taking black violent criminals off the street, who are a scourge not only to their own community but all communities of America who have to deal with their b.s.

edit:
here, have some more statistics
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#23 Old 03-25-2012, 09:26 PM
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If you're serious about helping black Americans live a life free from fear of violent crime, we need to be serious about taking black violent criminals off the street, who are a scourge not only to their own community but all communities of America who have to deal with their b.s.

Do you really think putting more black people in prison will solve this problem? Nearly half of all people incarcerated in the United States prison system are black.

This is a complex problem. Rounding up all the black people and sending them off to prison won't solve it.
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#24 Old 03-25-2012, 09:28 PM
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Just to play devil's advocate, it could be that Zimmerman confronted Martin verbally, and Martin initiated the physical assault, which may have justified the use of deadly force by Zimmerman.

I'm rather skeptical of that theory myself, but it could have happened. We don't have all the details. Nor do we know how active the investigation was before this hit the news.

My impression of Zimmerman, just from reading the news, makes me think he's an individual who would have physically tried to stop Martin, if Martin tried to leave. I also wonder if this case wasn't being strongly investigated before it hit the news. (Oh look a dead black teen in a hoodie, who cares?)

Personally, I like "stand your ground laws". I base this on my own habits - I occasionally have to travel at night through sketchy areas. If I'm ever assaulted, I may have a hard time fleeing from someone who has a willingness to use deadly force. The reason is simple - do I really want to turn my back on someone with a weapon? No. But that being said, I don't think this is one of those situations, nor is it something the law was intended to allow. People have a right to defend themselves in a bad situation only if they didn't cause the confrontation in the first place. I suspect Zimmerman either physically restrained or otherwise used force to stop Martin, and in that situation, Zimmerman is responsible for what happened. If the facts of the case shows that, Zimmerman should be found guilty of murder.
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#25 Old 03-25-2012, 09:32 PM
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We really, really need to stop pretending that black Americans are under some sort of savage assault by white people. The majority of black victims of violent crime had a black offender; the number of blacks victims of violent crime at the hands of a white (non-hispanic) offender are negligible.

I don't really think that's the way that most people are talking about it - that black folks are being brutalized by white people. In fact, George Zimmerman's mother is a Latina. I think what they're talking about is that this boy was killed and the killer wasn't arrested and a thorough investigation done before he was released, that his life wasn't worth that. That seems like a miscarriage of justice, however you look at it, no?

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#26 Old 03-25-2012, 09:46 PM
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I think it is pretty clear where Zimmerman was coming from. Muttering "f-ing coon" under his breath while on the 911 call and continuing to pursue the kid when he was advised not to do so is pretty telling. The police had been notified and the moron merely could have kept Trayvon under observation until the police arrived, but he apparently wanted to play cop instead. Now a 17 year-old is dead for what? Walking back from a store with some snacks. Unfortunately, I doubt Zimmerman will ever be convicted of anything, unless the genius spills the beans himself, because there are no witnesses to what transpired. It is a tragedy for Trayvon's family.
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#27 Old 03-25-2012, 09:49 PM
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What a bunch of absolute nonsense. Why is it that people pretend whites perpetrate more violent crimes against blacks than vice versa, or that blacks suffer a significant amount of violence from the hand of whites? Here, have some statistics:

link

We really, really need to stop pretending that black Americans are under some sort of savage assault by white people. The majority of black victims of violent crime had a black offender; the number of blacks victims of violent crime at the hands of a white (non-hispanic) offender are negligible.

If you're serious about helping black Americans live a life free from fear of violent crime, we need to be serious about taking black violent criminals off the street, who are a scourge not only to their own community but all communities of America who have to deal with their b.s.

edit:
here, have some more statistics

When the police fill someone with lead with multiple weapons and the guy ends up being unarmed and holding a soda or a cell phone, it generally is a black male who has been blown to bits. I don't know when the last time it was that i heard of an artillery barrage against an unarmed white guy by some policemen.
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#28 Old 03-25-2012, 10:15 PM
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I think it is pretty clear where Zimmerman was coming from. Muttering "f-ing coon" under his breath while on the 911 call

I've heard he said "f-ing punk".

YMMV. 911 call is online, I'm told.
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#29 Old 03-25-2012, 10:24 PM
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My thoughts on this in no particular order:

1. Trayvon is an interesting name. This stands out to me because for some reason a lot of black people in America who end up in the news seem to have really awful names, like someone tried to be original but had no sense of style. This one sounds unusual but not in a way that would make me ashamed to have it.

2. Upon a brief scan through all this, it seems to me like the guy who killed him was an *******, and I'm not sure how somewhere in the legal system it was decided he should be out in society.

3. I like the idea of those laws in principle though. Requiring people to flee seems like putting the risk on them rather than their attacker, as you generally don't know if you can outrun them until you either have done or haven't, and if you haven't then you've just been caught with your back turned and probably pissed them off.

4. Attention is not a measure of worth, people. It doesn't need to be distributed fairly.

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#30 Old 03-25-2012, 11:03 PM
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3. I like the idea of those laws in principle though. Requiring people to flee seems like putting the risk on them rather than their attacker, as you generally don't know if you can outrun them until you either have done or haven't, and if you haven't then you've just been caught with your back turned and probably pissed them off.

Agreed. Once someone is willing to use violence, I'm not going to run unless its the best option. I think the attacker forfeits the right to avoid deadly force by his or her would-be victim.
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