Should it be considered child abuse if you let your child... - VeggieBoards
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#1 Old 01-01-2012, 01:29 PM
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Become morbidly obese?

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#2 Old 01-01-2012, 01:31 PM
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If they are young, then perhaps.

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#3 Old 01-01-2012, 01:31 PM
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How do you prove a crime in that situation? The kid becomes obese, so the crime is committed without any determination of intent or causation?

No, it is not possible to make such a situation fit into a proper definition of a crime or abuse.
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#4 Old 01-01-2012, 01:32 PM
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If they are young, then perhaps.

Well, the sad TV show i'm watching has an 800lb teenager.


I think the mother should probably be considered a child abuser.

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#5 Old 01-01-2012, 01:33 PM
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The problem with prosecuting parents is that everyone's body works differently. Someone who might eat a lot, and eat a lot of unhealthy stuff, might not be morbidly obese while someone else's body might react differently and that child becomes morbidly obese. It's kind of leaving everything to appearance and weight to prosecute them when another parent might be feeding and letting their child eat just as unhealthy foods in large proportions, too.
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#6 Old 01-01-2012, 01:34 PM
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How do you prove a crime in that situation? The kid become obese, so the crime is committed without any determination of intent or causation?

No, it is not possible to make such a situation fit into a proper definition of a crime or abuse.

I disagree, but then I usually do with you, you don't need intent to convict someone of a crime like child endangerment or abuse, if you're feeling someone so much they can get that big, it's certainly endangerment at least.

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#7 Old 01-01-2012, 01:35 PM
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The problem with prosecuting parents is that everyone's body works differently. Someone who might eat a lot, and eat a lot of unhealthy stuff, might not be morbidly obese while someone else's body might react differently and that child becomes morbidly obese. It's kind of leaving everything to appearance and weight to prosecute them when another parent might be feeding and letting their child eat just as unhealthy foods in large proportions, too.

good point, it just doesn't seem right someone could possibly let their kid get this way!!

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#8 Old 01-01-2012, 01:35 PM
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too many things are considered child abuse these days

but i would say that EXTREME obesity of a young child is maybe not abuse, but neglect
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#9 Old 01-01-2012, 01:36 PM
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It should be considered child abuse if you let your child watch more than 10 seconds of Will & Grace.

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#10 Old 01-01-2012, 01:38 PM
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too many things are considered child abuse these days

but i would say that EXTREME obesity of a young child is maybe not abuse, but neglect

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It should be considered child abuse if you let your child watch more than 10 seconds of Will & Grace.


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#11 Old 01-01-2012, 01:41 PM
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I disagree, but then I usually do with you, you don't need intent to convict someone of a crime like child endangerment or abuse, if you're feeling someone so much they can get that big, it's certainly endangerment at least.

I want to formulate an intelligent response to this thread but this post is preventing me from doing so...

Enjoying the view over at http://forum.veggieviews.com/

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#12 Old 01-01-2012, 01:45 PM
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I want to formulate an intelligent response to this thread but this post is preventing me from doing so...

LOL Oh geez

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#13 Old 01-01-2012, 01:47 PM
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I think it is important to work on healthy habits with your child. As a child I often binge-ate candy and cookies, a lot of it was because I had a very stressful childhood and food was the only thing that never let me down. I can still say the same thing in my life now...

Also it is good to have emphasis on social activities that dont involve food. Food is great, but it shouldnt be everything in life...
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#14 Old 01-01-2012, 01:50 PM
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I think it is important to work on healthy habits with your child. As a child I often binge-ate candy and cookies, a lot of it was because I had a very stressful childhood and food was the only thing that never let me down. I can still say the same thing in my life now...

Also it is good to have emphasis on social activities that dont involve food. Food is great, but it shouldnt be everything in life...


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#15 Old 01-01-2012, 02:01 PM
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Of course once we make an assumption it's the parents' fault that the child is abused because the child is obese it could entail that we could persecute parents of a vegetarian child for malnutrition.

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#16 Old 01-01-2012, 02:07 PM
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Of course once we make an assumption it's the parents' fault that the child is abused because the child is obese it could entail that we could persecute parents of a vegetarian child for malnutrition.

Except that vegetarian children can easily get a balanced nutritious diet and omni children are entirely capable of suffering from malnurtition.
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#17 Old 01-01-2012, 02:37 PM
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The states that are choosing to see childhood obesity as child abuse do not criminalize the original causes of the obesity per se, they criminalize the parental response to medical professional's advice. That is, the parents commited medical neglect by failing to follow doctor's orders to put the kid on a diet and exercise program.

Yes, I think it is child maltreatment to create a situation where a young child becomes obese and stays that way.

That said, I don't think the right course of action is to place those kids in fostercare because I don't think fostercare should or even can be a remedy for widespread social ills such as childhood obesity. There is a thread about this topic here: https://www.veggieboards.com/newvb/sh...in-foster-care
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#18 Old 01-01-2012, 02:39 PM
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Except that vegetarian children can easy get a balanced nutritious diet and omni children are entirely capable of suffering from malnurtition.

I agree.
However, it would be not up to us how to raise our children, but up to "experts" who are good at proving whatever the money tells them to. If the meat industry wants to sink millions into showing your child is not getting enough protein, iron, B12, or pig brains in their diet then we get what we deserve letting the law take a foothold.

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#19 Old 01-01-2012, 02:40 PM
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Of course once we make an assumption it's the parents' fault that the child is abused because the child is obese it could entail that we could persecute parents of a vegetarian child for malnutrition.

... if a child is malnourished, the parents should be prosecuted.

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#20 Old 01-01-2012, 02:41 PM
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... if a child is malnourished, the parents should be prosecuted.

Would it be a benefit to the child if their parents, who can't afford to buy food, were to be fined and/or thrown into jail?
Would it be to the benefit of the parents?
Society?
Shall we not look at the root problems of society and instead take the western approach of "a pill for every ill" -- dealing with cancer, cut it out; dealing with bacteria, kill it; dealing with societal problems, throw them in jail.
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#21 Old 01-01-2012, 02:57 PM
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Would it be a benefit to the child if their parents, who can't afford to buy food, were to be fined and/or thrown into jail?

Yes. Maybe they could go to a family member who can buy them food. There are food banks and food stamps for people who can't afford food. You should not have a child in your care if you can't feed them.
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Would it be to the benefit of the parents?

Maybe they would learn you have to feed your kid.
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Society?

Yes.
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Shall we not look at the root problems of society and instead take the western approach of "a pill for every ill" -- dealing with cancer, cut it out; dealing with bacteria, kill it; dealing with societal problems, throw them in jail.

I don't follow your logic, if someone doesn't feed their dog, they go to jail. If someone doesn't feed their kid, they should go to jail.

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#22 Old 01-01-2012, 02:57 PM
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Considering how he is a teen and not a small child, I don't think the parents should be prosecuted. Besides I doubt they're force feeding him there's only so much control the parents have.

You call me sweet like I'm some kinda of cheese....vegan cheese 0.0
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#23 Old 01-01-2012, 02:57 PM
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Considering how he is a teen and not a small child, I don't think the parents should be prosecuted. Besides I doubt they're force feeding him there's only so much control the parents have.

This particular case, they are. The kid hasn't left the house in years.

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#24 Old 01-01-2012, 03:18 PM
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Originally Posted by River View Post

Yes. Maybe they could go to a family member who can buy them food. There are food banks and food stamps for people who can't afford food. You should not have a child in your care if you can't feed them.

Under these laws they would be under state control. The government is not a parent, the government is not a nanny, the government is not a human -- government does not know how to take care of children. I say this with experience because I am Native American, I have studied college level NA history, and I've heard plenty of personal testimony from my people on the subject of state care because Native Americans were not deemed responsible enough to take care of their children after government laws forced them from their lands, took their food, their way of life, and their family away from them.
This isn't just an ethnocentric view either, as the same story will be told from the African American, Hispanic American, and even Anglo American.
Every who had to deal with these situations will tell you the same thing with which any sound reason would concur: The government is not in the business to make sure our children are taken care of.

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Maybe they would learn you have to feed your kid.

When the economy tanks and businesses lay of thousands of employees, it's not a matter of learning.

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Yes.

I disagree, these people who cannot afford to take care of their children are not a threat to you and me. They are the victims, and victims should not be punished, they should be embraced with help from us.

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I don't follow your logic, if someone doesn't feed their dog, they go to jail. If someone doesn't feed their kid, they should go to jail.

Allow me to help:
Western philosophy teaches that if there's a problem then we seek to irradicate it; whether it's health (cancer), foreign relations (military attack against a country), or societal problems (throw victims into jail) -- THIS SOLUTION ONLY CAUSES MORE PROBLEMS.
The cancer will reoccur; the country will fight back; those thrown in jail will be a stress on the tax payer and cause more economic problems which result in more going hungry then more people put in jail.

Whereas we fix the root of the problem. A good diet stops cancer, healthy trade and relations stops war, and focusing on improving the economy stops crime.
Until this western philosophy changes, and our the views and beliefs we developed in such a society, it all continues in a downward spiral.

Just my take on things.
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#25 Old 01-01-2012, 03:22 PM
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Thats cold, man.

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#26 Old 01-01-2012, 03:26 PM
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This particular case, they are. The kid hasn't left the house in years.

They are what? Force feeding him? I don't think they're shoving food down his throat. At his age he should be able to decide for himself when to stop eating, you can't blame the parents for that.

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#27 Old 01-01-2012, 03:34 PM
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They are what? Force feeding him? I don't think they're shoving food down his throat. At his age he should be able to decide for himself when to stop eating, you can't blame the parents for that.

Parents should educate their son on healthy eating habits, they should have from the start. They should be and should have set discipline down with eating large portions of food and eating unhealthy food and treats. How are the parents not to blame?
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#28 Old 01-01-2012, 03:38 PM
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My parents never taught me about healthy eating nor have any parents I've ever met, usually the schools are in charge of that. Besides even if they did like I said he's a teen and has the ability to make his own decisions regardless of what his parents say.

You call me sweet like I'm some kinda of cheese....vegan cheese 0.0
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#29 Old 01-01-2012, 03:43 PM
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My parents never taught me about healthy eating nor have any parents I've ever met, usually the schools are in charge of that. Besides even if they did like I said he's a teen and has the ability to make his own decisions regardless of what his parents say.

That's not really true. You learn what to eat from your family, but what they eat. Most people what their family eats, I think the rare exception of that actually is vegetarians in omni families. Healthy eating practices start when your VERY young. And by the time he reached the weight that particular teen was, it's unlikely he has the self esteem to change things. You don't grow to 800lb overnight.

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#30 Old 01-01-2012, 04:32 PM
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Parents should educate their son on healthy eating habits, they should have from the start. They should be and should have set discipline down with eating large portions of food and eating unhealthy food and treats. How are the parents not to blame?

I can't tell if you are being serious or sarcastic?
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