Religion And Racism - Page 2 - VeggieBoards
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#31 Old 07-05-2010, 11:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenickie' date='05 July 2010 - 02:38 PM' timestamp='1278351490' post='2669239 View Post


i thought white people fretted about the bros gettin' uppity and rioting anytime the police carry out their authority to kill a minority



Only the same socioeconomic faction that worries about white guilt.
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#32 Old 07-05-2010, 01:07 PM
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sorry

thought all white people were the same

it's hard to tell

they all look the same




cry havoc! and let slip the dogs of war.
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#33 Old 07-05-2010, 01:31 PM
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They do.



People have been going shirtless in the heat around here.



BLINDING WHITE SKIN!
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#34 Old 07-05-2010, 03:39 PM
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Okay, let's get back on topic. We have a private messaging system for a reason.
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#35 Old 07-05-2010, 08:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenickie' date='04 July 2010 - 04:42 PM' timestamp='1278276136' post='2668829 View Post


or just an older man who's been fighting his entire life and not getting anywhere? bitterness of failure is not racism imho.

He has made directly racist statements and supports affirmative action which is the nothing more than the practice of making a decision based on race.



Quote:

Faolan has never been to the South, or met black people from there.

You obviously didn't read my post. I stated the the Church has at least historically been an intrical part of the Black community which is a direct implication that Blacks very much do go to church, and in numbers that are higher in proportion to that of whites. Also, I've lived 22 years in the south, mostly in Tallahassee but also in smaller towns as well and I can tell you over the last ten years Black culture has pretty much been homogenized by the mainstream media, but so has the rest of the nation for the most part.



Also, watching that video was just painful. I feel like a part of me has been raped. I'm so lucky I do not own a TV.





Quote:
no s***? i had no idea.

you mean like Nation of Islam? Or the 5%ers? or what exactly are you talking about and can I get some of that.

Nation of Islam is a such a small group in the reality of schemes and are generally considered to be a bunch of fringe looneys. They only get a lot of airtime because they are so vocal.



@ das_nut:

I have no sense of "white guilt" because I don't think I should have to apologize for something that even my ancestors were not a part of. In fact, being of Irish origin, my people know what it is like to be dominated and enslaved by another culture and even still today my motherland remains occupied by the Crown. These people are fretting and angry over things that are history. It would be best they learn to forgive as their own Church teaches, but that seems to be asking too much.



If every culture were to be punished and weighed down by the transgressions of their forefathers, societies would never advance. It would simple be a constant cycle of pain and misery for everyone. There comes a time where we have to learn to let it go.
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#36 Old 07-05-2010, 08:21 PM
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no, you didn't say that, you said that the church IS, as in nowadays, not historically, stand behind your statements. Is tallahasse considered southern? As far as I know it's Florida, and that's not south.



faolan says he was raped by black southern vegans.



huh.



black people go to church, sure. But is it for jesus or a social outing?

cry havoc! and let slip the dogs of war.
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#37 Old 07-05-2010, 08:57 PM
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I'm pretty sure Florida is it's own special case.



Kind of like the Twilight Zone.
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#38 Old 07-05-2010, 10:02 PM
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Looks like things have gotten a little side-tracked. The central ideas for this thread were:

Quote:
The meta-analysis, titled Why Don't We Practice What We Preach, was published in the Personality and Social Psychology Review. The authors analyzed data from 55 studies on religion and racism in America dating to the Civil Rights era. Combined, the studies include more than 22,000 participants, mostly white and Protestant. An abstract of the study reports: "A meta-analytic review of past research evaluated the link between religiosity and racism in the United States since the Civil Rights Act. Religious racism partly reflects intergroup dynamics. That is, a strong religious in-group identity was associated with derogation of racial out-groups. Other races might be treated as out-groups because religion is practiced largely within race, because training in a religious in-group identity promotes general ethnocentrism, and because different others appear to be in competition for resources. In addition, religious racism is tied to basic life values of social conformity and respect for tradition. In support, individuals who were religious for reasons of conformity and tradition expressed racism that declined in recent years with the decreased societal acceptance of overt racial discrimination. The authors failed to find that racial tolerance arises from humanitarian values, consistent with the idea that religious humanitarianism is largely expressed to in-group members. Only religious agnostics were racially tolerant."

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#39 Old 07-05-2010, 10:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenickie' date='05 July 2010 - 10:21 PM' timestamp='1278382915' post='2669454 View Post


no, you didn't say that, you said that the church IS, as in nowadays, not historically, stand behind your statements. Is tallahasse considered southern? As far as I know it's Florida, and that's not south.

Tallahassee is very much an old southern town. Northern Florida is more like Southern Georgia. You're thinking of Central and South Florida. Most of the rural areas are pretty much hick towns as well. You should check out the Panhandle: It's a whole 'nother state!



Back on topic, the black church is still fairly integrated withing black society even if the ties are not as strong as they were historically. I used the term historically to indicate that connection has been there for a long time. It still is present. Sorry, the English language sucks because it has no tense or meathod for allowing the "present-perfect" grammatical function



Quote:

black people go to church, sure. But is it for jesus or a social outing?

Given the fact that most black people when confronted with that question refuse to deny Jesus, even when presented with the facts that do not stack in favor of Christianity, I would say there is very much a religious aspect to this. There are plenty of anti-gay, young earthers, and other quacks within the black community, they just don't get the same amount of air time. As far as the media's depiction of the church as just being a social outing, perhaps you should attend a service and verify that claim because I've been to Black churches and I can tell you that it is a very intense and active service that is taken very seriously and is nothing like what was depicted in that video.



Also, I can verify that my own experience as a neopagan has been met with a lot of aggression by members of the black community here and one of the big organizations here that try to protest and halt pagan gatherings here is the Black church organizations in addition to the usual suspects such as the Southern Baptists and what not. Though, this over the last couple years has gotten a little bit better in the more urban areas, it still exists within the majority.



The problem is that people don't seem to understand that bigotry can come from any side and regardless of that it is still wrong.
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#40 Old 07-06-2010, 11:37 AM
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anti gay the same as being racist?

cry havoc! and let slip the dogs of war.
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#41 Old 07-06-2010, 01:44 PM
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I don't think so.



It's a separate bigotry.
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#42 Old 07-07-2010, 07:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by das_nut' date='06 July 2010 - 12:44 PM' timestamp='1278445460' post='2669819 View Post


I don't think so.



It's a separate bigotry.





it seems that the argument being made is that because black churches tend to be homophobic they are also racist.

cry havoc! and let slip the dogs of war.
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#43 Old 07-07-2010, 10:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenickie' date='07 July 2010 - 09:35 AM' timestamp='1278509746' post='2670130 View Post


it seems that the argument being made is that because black churches tend to be homophobic they are also racist.



I think it is more of a matter of hatred tends to bread more hatred. It is not necessarily a direct correlation and really what is going on with the race issue, rather the people are racist and want to use religion as a means to somehow justify opinions they know are bigoted and wrong. Generally it is taught in black churches that the African peoples are "God's People" and the "chosen people" which is simply nothing more than a statement of supremacy and a declaration that all others are lesser and ungodly. There are those who even try to make the arguments that are counter to archaeological findings that the Israelites were black.
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#44 Old 07-07-2010, 02:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Faolan' date='07 July 2010 - 01:26 PM' timestamp='1278519964' post='2670238 View Post


I think it is more of a matter of hatred tends to bread more hatred.



If that is the case, most of VB is screwed. See, look: *mutters 'Sarah Palin'. *watches crowd start foaming at the mouth*. Q.E.D.
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#45 Old 07-07-2010, 03:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by das_nut' date='07 July 2010 - 04:20 PM' timestamp='1278534042' post='2670346 View Post


If that is the case, most of VB is screwed. See, look: *mutters 'Sarah Palin'. *watches crowd start foaming at the mouth*. Q.E.D.

You make a good point. I don't hate Sarah Palin, but I do pity her and her ilk.
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#46 Old 07-09-2010, 08:12 PM
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Quote:
Generally it is taught in black churches that the African peoples are "God's People" and the "chosen people" which is simply nothing more than a statement of supremacy and a declaration that all others are lesser and ungodly. There are those who even try to make the arguments that are counter to archaeological findings that the Israelites were black.



"Generally"? Really? It seems that you have picked out a caricature of the very worst from preachers at a small selection of Black churches. At worst, we typically see Afro-centric pride as a (flawed) reaction to conditions of racism and according undue criticism of 'Black culture' (as if such a unitary entity exists). Indeed, I believe the chauvinism of subordinate groups to function quite socially distinctly from the chauvinism of the privileged.



ebola
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#47 Old 07-12-2010, 05:08 AM
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@ Gnome Chomsky:

Rest assure that is not a small segment of Black Churches. Most churches in general preach that their adherents are "God's People," "The Chosen Ones," and "saved". If you fail to see the inherent supremacy of these terms then that is your own fault and while I agree with some points I'm afraid your knee-jerk reaction to this observation is unwarranted since it is cannon within Christianity that believers are free of "God's wrath" (or that's at least what they say to trick you into joining their cults, because the Bible isn't actually very clear on how far salvation goes and such).



I think you are just trying to get into debate with me over terms such as "common" and "general". Sorry, what I posted was an accurate statement of the churches themselves, however, that does not necessarily mean that every member of the churches in question believe that, including the preachers espousing it. The problem is that many of them do believe it and while some of the religious views are Afrocentric, many of them are not and are just cannon manifestations.
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#48 Old 07-13-2010, 12:08 PM
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Ummmm...as a proselytizing religion, Xianity is inherently universalistic, so ethno-racialized exclusion (beyond the general, de facto tendencies of our racialized society) tends to be the exception rather than the norm, if anything because it requires some funny conceptual acrobatics to bar a group from salvation. This is not to imply that no one deploys those conceptual acrobatics.



And, yeah, my contention was that your use of "general" falls below the criterion of "most", and "common" below "typical" (even for ethnically concentrated areas).



ebola
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#49 Old 07-15-2010, 06:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh James xVx' date='04 July 2010 - 02:59 PM' timestamp='1278269964' post='2668792 View Post


I wonder if that's actually naturally occurring, or learned behavior. Haven't they done studies with little babies and small children that strongly indicate there's no natural bias based on skin color? It's a very politicized adult notion IMO.



Yes they have Josh

One study we were told about at university sticks in my mind. It was at an American infant school . A black child was introduced to a class in which every other child was white. He was given a different colour uniform to the white children and spent several days attending classes with them. White children were asked by teachers to point out which child was 'Peter', most children just pointed and said 'that one' without any reference to his colour. When pressed to explain exactly which one 'Peter' was in a crowd children consistently said' the one in the green jumper. They seemed completely oblivious to any colour except the green of his jumper!!!
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#50 Old 07-16-2010, 09:29 AM
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There are plenty of studies that indicate racism is learned, but not only by being taught. Rather, racism is learn by the absence of anti-racist teachings.



Racial bias is learned by all races, but the specific biases are not always for ones own race.



http://www.newsweek.com/2009/09/04/s...criminate.html



http://www.cnn.com/2010/US/05/13/doll.study/index.html
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