How Class Works - Interactive - VeggieBoards
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#1 Old 10-23-2006, 08:49 PM
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I found this awhile ago and couldn't remember where I saw it... I stumbled across it again today. I didn't think I'd actually ever post something from the NY Times... but this is cool.



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While there are many characteristics that could be used to describe a person's class, among the most influential are the person's occupation, education, income, and wealth. Below are different ways of looking at class using these factors, as well as an examination of how mobility has changed in recent decades. The fourth tab presents results from a poll conducted by The Times that asked people about class issues.

This is really fun to play around with. It even gives you an average percentile based on the data you enter. You can also check out how class breaks down, income motility, and nationwide poll data on class.



So, where do you fit in, according to your fellow citizens? Is there anything that surprises you about the poll results?



http://www.nytimes.com/packages/html.../index_01.html
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#2 Old 10-23-2006, 08:52 PM
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That's really interesting. I'm trying it now, and i'm already stuck. I hate answering the "profession" question. It's so friggin impossible to find a suitable catagory without lowering the profession, or just choosing "other."



Ok I give up and just choose "Miscellaneous social service specialists."

I'm kind of surprised at how low the income brackets are to be part of the top 5th.





57th, with choosing "miscellaneous social service specialist." Whatever that is.
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#3 Old 10-23-2006, 08:53 PM
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I think its common stuff we know of how society defines us based on the class listed on the website.
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#4 Old 10-23-2006, 08:58 PM
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60th



My profession is pretty low prestige.
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#5 Old 10-23-2006, 09:04 PM
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89th.



My professional title hurt, but income and education picked up the slack.
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#6 Old 10-23-2006, 09:07 PM
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My education and wealth hurt. I think my professional title did, too.
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#7 Old 10-23-2006, 09:10 PM
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Actually the income brackets are two high. Those are the roughly the household income percentiles, many households have two incomes.



I go from 60th to 70th if I replace actuary with accountant. Why accountants have so much more prestige I don't understand. Wealth is also killing me.



I do decent for income and education.
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#8 Old 10-23-2006, 09:12 PM
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I imagine two-income households would make as much or more than me.



What is the average household/single income?



Doing it on this, about $35,000 puts you in the middle of the middle-class. You think that's for a household?
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#9 Old 10-23-2006, 09:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jessica Alana View Post

I imagine two-income households would make as much or more than me.



What is the average household/single income?



I think median is very low thirties. Like 31K. Average/arithmetic mean is probably over 100k.
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#10 Old 10-23-2006, 09:18 PM
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For household?????
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#11 Old 10-23-2006, 09:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jessica Alana View Post

For household?????

Nah for individual. Mean is adding up all the incomes and dividing by the number of people. Median is lining up all the incomes and taking the one in the middle. For things like income and house prices the mean is usually much higher than the median (because millionaires and billionares are much farther away from the center than someone with nothing would be) so median is usually considered a more informative measure of central tendancy in these cases.



ETA I'm confused. I think median for individual is about 31, for houshold is about 36. I think the mean in either case is much higher.
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#12 Old 10-23-2006, 09:30 PM
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Median is middle. Mean is average. Except the 31 single, 36 household is rather confusing. Wouldn't household average be double the single?

Ok I'm confusing myself. Nevermind!



I'm just surprised at how someone can make $70,000 and be in the top 5th.



I don't imagine people who make $70,000 as "wealthy," especially if it's $70,000 for household, $35,000 single.
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#13 Old 10-23-2006, 09:32 PM
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If a person made $40,000, that puts them at middle class. Say their spouse made $40,000, that puts the spouse at middle class. Combined, they're at $80,000. Does that put them (their household) into upper 5th, or does that keep them in middle because of the average?
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#14 Old 10-23-2006, 09:46 PM
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Oh, most households in the 2nd and 3rd quintiles have a single wage earner. Most households in the bottom quintile have no wage earners.
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#15 Old 10-23-2006, 09:55 PM
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I was in the 64th.

http://bringingyouohm.wordpress.com/

Lokah Samastah Sukhino Bhavanto

'May everyone everywhere be happy
May the whole world be joyous'
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#16 Old 10-23-2006, 10:06 PM
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Oh, ok.

I wish I could figure out a better category for profession. I don't even know if interpreting belongs in community and social services. Rawr. Even librarians are ranked 35 higher than what I used.
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#17 Old 10-24-2006, 12:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jessica Alana View Post

I'm just surprised at how someone can make $70,000 and be in the top 5th.



I don't imagine people who make $70,000 as "wealthy," especially if it's $70,000 for household, $35,000 single.



$70,000 is a ton of money. If that's not wealthy, what is it??!!
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#18 Old 10-24-2006, 01:31 AM
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I don't know.

I just don't think that $70,000 a year, especially as a combined income is "wealthy." With a house, and car payments, and bills, and especially if you have kids, $70,000 doesn't go very far in this world.

I think you could be comfortable; but I wouldn't call it "wealthy."



If a couple made a combined $70,000/yr, working 40 hours a week, that's less than $17 an hour.



Are factory workers considered "wealthy"? The ones I know make a bit more than that.

I certainly don't consider myself even remotely "wealthy."



Maybe in a world of Bill Gates and Oprahs and doctors and actors, I have a skewed view.
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#19 Old 10-24-2006, 02:23 AM
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I don't understand how $70,000 couldn't go very far. Americans are just so used to wasteful spending in every aspect of their lives--that being filthy rich is viewed as "just getting by" in American Standards.
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#20 Old 10-24-2006, 05:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jessica Alana View Post


Maybe in a world of Bill Gates and Oprahs and doctors and actors, I have a skewed view.



You definitely do..



$70,000 WOULD go very far. Seriously. It's a lot of money.
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#21 Old 10-24-2006, 05:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kpickell View Post



$70,000 is a ton of money. If that's not wealthy, what is it??!!





Depends on where you live, and how many kids you have.



No, $70,000 isn't wealthy, at least not in large met areas. It ain't poor, but it ain't wealthy.
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#22 Old 10-24-2006, 07:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tame View Post

Depends on where you live, and how many kids you have.



No, $70,000 isn't wealthy, at least not in large met areas. It ain't poor, but it ain't wealthy.



i agree. numbers totally depend on where you live (and family situation).



i live in boston--$70k is not a huge amount.



(ETA: not that i make anywhere near $70K).



for profession and education i'm very high, but since i'm still in grad school my income and wealth are quite low.
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#23 Old 10-24-2006, 07:18 AM
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You do realize that people who make 70k aren't in the 10% tax bracket right?
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#24 Old 10-24-2006, 07:22 AM
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Right. I'm in the 70th percentile.
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#25 Old 10-24-2006, 07:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kpickell View Post

I don't understand how $70,000 couldn't go very far. Americans are just so used to wasteful spending in every aspect of their lives--that being filthy rich is viewed as "just getting by" in American Standards.

Aren't your mortgage payments something like $300 or $400? For most people in a midsize city, mortgage payments are well over $1500 for a moderate 3-bedroom house.



If you make $40,000 net off $70,000 gross (that includes pre-tax deductions for retirement & a HSA) and your mortgage payments are, say, $1700/month, (maybe $2000 with HO insurance and utilities), you're looking at just over $1000/month available for groceries, saving, anything you put into your 401k (pretax of course), stuff for the kids, etc.



$250/week isn't a whole lot for a family.
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#26 Old 10-24-2006, 07:40 AM
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Our current tax structure is way, way too progressive under 100,000 (I barely take home more than someone who grosses half and has a couple kids) and way not progressive enough for the wealthiest people.



I sometimes find myself thinking that a flat tax starting at -30,000 and with NO exemptions would, while not perfect, be a huge improvement.
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#27 Old 10-24-2006, 07:43 AM
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You could always buy a house in cash.



$250 a week would be more than enough for my family when I was growing up. We didn't have $250 a week. We got by on much, much less.



P.S. I'm not trying to argue, just offering an additional view.
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#28 Old 10-24-2006, 07:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by remilard View Post

Our current tax structure is way, way too progressive under 100,000 (I barely take home more than someone who grosses half and has a couple kids) and way not progressive enough for the wealthiest people.



I sometimes find myself thinking that a flat tax starting at -30,000 and with NO exemptions would, while not perfect, be a huge improvement.





I agree. Does anybody know if this style of taxation goes on anywhere in the world?
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#29 Old 10-24-2006, 08:30 AM
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I'm with Tame (:eek) and Jessica on this. $70K is not wealthy. We all survived on less 20 yrs ago - that doesn't mean you can year after year. Prices change with inflation.



My monthly bills / expenses = $2907

this doesn't even account for food, clothing, car repair, etc.. This is just mortgage, car payment, train fare, gas, electric, phone, internet, water bill, trash pick up, car insurance, health insurance (for 1), life insurance, retirement and ($350 worth of credit card payments)



$70k - 32% tax (??- could be more I get taxed at 27.848% for $48k)



= $47,600 take home (but as stated could be much less not sure on taxes)



My bills x 12 months = $34,884.



(my take home is actually $200 short of this figure, which is why I'm in a credit card mess in the first place.)



My point, the person making $70k will have more bills than me. People trying to say it would be "easy" to raise a family on this one income ... I just don't think you have all of the facts. The higher up you go in the career ladder, you have to buy "nice" clothes / suits for work. They'd have to buy food for themselves and their family.



Yes, they would have something left over, but they wouldn't be able to afford a mansion or to buy their house outright with cash. I do think that as you go along in your career path the more money you make, the more you are obligated to donate to charity. I only make about $48k but I do donate every month to charity.
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#30 Old 10-24-2006, 09:04 AM
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FWIW - a single person making 70K won't pay much more than $12,000 in Fed income taxes (after standardized deductions/exemptions).



I agree with your point, though.
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