The sexism of women - VeggieBoards
Forum Jump: 
 
Thread Tools
#1 Old 01-28-2005, 12:49 PM
Veggie Regular
 
beforewisdom's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 3,190
I was thinking how it seems like there is a lot of male bashing going on around the internet.



It occurred to me that when men have a bad date, a bad relationship ... etc a man is likely to think "wow, what a loser she was........life goes on" whereas a woman who gets mixed up with a loser will generalize her experience into........."all men are pigs".



Then as I was reading some women's responses to other women's "male bashing" writings it occurred to me I was generalizing as well. There were responses from several women pointing out, diplomatically, gently, to the author how they have seen various behaviors in both sexes and that maybe the author of the male bashing writings is seeing things only through the lenses of her own experiences.



If men in a public forum started generating with a lot of "Are women ____?" threads accusations of chauvinism, sexism, stereotyping, and bigotry would fly....with a lot of heat....as well as with some justification.



I know from my own personal experience that is very easy to get caught up in a cycle of complaining .



I think some people just get up in such cycles not being aware that they sould like a bigot, or that they are making themelves miserable. After a while you have to fix your fix problems, not just whine about them, no matter who created them for you or you will never be free. Plus you make yourself frustrated by whining. Things start to look worse then they actually are

My Blog: beforewisdom.com
beforewisdom is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
#2 Old 01-28-2005, 01:05 PM
Veggie Regular
 
xrodolfox's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 1,644
Quote:
Originally Posted by beforewisdom View Post

I was thinking how it seems like there is a lot of male bashing going on around the internet.



I think if I saw some names and links and specifics I might be able to comment more. I don't really know what you are talking about. Perhaps I haven't been paying attention? I don't feel any male-bashing on this board, and I am a man. But then again, that doesn't mean it doesn't happen.



I would like to see example. Perhaps then it would not just be an academic exercise; I might have a good reason to get pissed. And that is fun.
xrodolfox is offline  
#3 Old 01-28-2005, 01:07 PM
Veggie Regular
 
beforewisdom's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 3,190
Quote:
Originally Posted by xrodolfox View Post

I think if I saw some names and links and specifics I might be able to comment more.



I think that might violate the policy of this board.

My Blog: beforewisdom.com
beforewisdom is offline  
#4 Old 01-28-2005, 01:12 PM
Veggie Regular
 
xrodolfox's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 1,644
Quote:
Originally Posted by beforewisdom View Post

I think that might violate the policy of this board.



It would? It wouldn't be like the people who read it would have their minds made up by what you quoted.



How about some links to some threads?



I just don't know what you are talking about when you talk about sexism towards men. I know that it exists, and I think I know what it looks like when I see it, but I just haven't seen any here.



It is hard to make a point when there isn't any evidence (or it is hidden in hollow diplomatic words).
xrodolfox is offline  
#5 Old 01-28-2005, 01:18 PM
Veggie Regular
 
beforewisdom's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 3,190
Quote:
Originally Posted by xrodolfox View Post

It would? It wouldn't be like the people who read it would have their minds made up by what you quoted.

No, but the internet is a small place and "going there" is something that may be frowned upon by the people who run VB. I like the way VB is run and what it delievers so I like to respect the spirit of those rules

My Blog: beforewisdom.com
beforewisdom is offline  
#6 Old 01-28-2005, 01:29 PM
Veggie Regular
 
xrodolfox's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 1,644
Quote:
Originally Posted by beforewisdom View Post

I think you just answered your own question, though some people might wonder how somebody who thinks of diplomatic words as hollow could truly recognize diplomacy.





You lost me there.



...but if something more concrete pops up, or if I see something on the boards, I will be sure to call it out on the spot, or at least try to.

I don't doubt you in saying that sexism against men happens on this board. I just don't know how to help or what to say or even how to sympathize when I haven't seen any of it.
xrodolfox is offline  
#7 Old 01-28-2005, 01:57 PM
Banned
 
Tame's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 13,022
BWF - feel free to provide a link via PM.
Tame is offline  
#8 Old 01-28-2005, 02:05 PM
Administrator
 
Michael's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 19,873
I have asked him not to refer to specific situations. It's not too hard to figure out.

VeggieBoards Alumni Facebook Group

If you're an old time VB'er stop by and say hi!


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Michael is offline  
#9 Old 01-28-2005, 02:12 PM
Veggie Regular
 
xrodolfox's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 1,644
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tame View Post

BWF - feel free to provide a link via PM.

right on.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael View Post

I have asked him not to refer to specific situations. It's not too hard to figure out.

How are we supposed to address it if we don't know what he is referring to?



If it is so easy, then it should be more obvious. If it is that obvious, then a link won't do too much harm, especially if it is PM'd.
xrodolfox is offline  
#10 Old 01-28-2005, 02:52 PM
Banned
 
kirkjobsluder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 4,276
beforewisdom: Well, I don't know. I have met many men who turn their bad experiences in relationships with women into broad generalizations of women. So I don't think that you can say that women are alone in making sexist generalizations.
kirkjobsluder is offline  
#11 Old 01-28-2005, 02:53 PM
Newbie
 
GhostUser's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 0
I think the only reason men get bashed on more is the age old "never hit a girl" attitude that women need special protection. When Andrew Dice Clay tried to turn the tables on the man-bashing fad in comedy a few years back, you see how they crucified him.



Personally, I don't think it's such a big deal. There are those who have chips on their shoulder and those who don't. I try to focus on people who don't have prejudices against me (for my gender, or any other reason) and ignore the rest.







The Rev
GhostUser is offline  
#12 Old 01-28-2005, 02:57 PM
Veggie Regular
 
beforewisdom's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 3,190
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Rev View Post

I think the only reason men get bashed on more is the age old "never hit a girl" attitude that women need special protection. When Andrew Dice Clay tried to turn the tables on the man-bashing fad in comedy a few years back, you see how they crucified him.



That is an interesting viewpoint. I never saw ADC as setting out to that with those intentions.



His more main stream stuff was funny, but audio tapes I heard of his off the grid routines sounded very hateful........imho.

My Blog: beforewisdom.com
beforewisdom is offline  
#13 Old 01-28-2005, 03:35 PM
Beginner
 
empathanimal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 147
Both genders can exhibit sexism towards the other.
empathanimal is offline  
#14 Old 01-31-2005, 04:13 AM
Veggie Regular
 
schu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 1,111
from my experiences women and men are definetely tied when it comes to sex based generalizations
schu is offline  
#15 Old 01-31-2005, 10:52 AM
Banned
 
remilard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 5,772
Quote:
Originally Posted by schu View Post

from my experiences women and men are definetely tied when it comes to sex based generalizations



But men come out way ahead when it comes to how those generalizations affect how they live their lives, what types of jobs and promotions are available, what type of pay they will receive for a given job, whether or not they will be beaten by a family member, etc.
remilard is offline  
#16 Old 01-31-2005, 08:10 PM
Veggie Regular
 
Peebs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,748
"Women should stop complaining about men until they get better taste in them."



-Bill Maher

(paraphrased)
Peebs is offline  
#17 Old 01-31-2005, 08:41 PM
Veggie Regular
 
beforewisdom's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 3,190
Quote:
Originally Posted by Peebs View Post

"Women should stop complaining about men until they get better taste in them."



-Bill Maher

(paraphrased)



Nail..........head...........direct hit..........bang!

My Blog: beforewisdom.com
beforewisdom is offline  
#18 Old 02-18-2005, 12:52 AM
Newbie
 
GhostUser's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 0
Quote:
Originally Posted by Peebs View Post

"Women should stop complaining about men until they get better taste in them."



-Bill Maher

(paraphrased)

absolutely
GhostUser is offline  
#19 Old 02-18-2005, 12:06 PM
Veggie Regular
 
das_nut's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 8,130
Quote:
Originally Posted by remilard View Post

But men come out way ahead when it comes to how those generalizations affect how they live their lives, what types of jobs and promotions are available, what type of pay they will receive for a given job, whether or not they will be beaten by a family member, etc.



Do men really come out ahead? For the same work experience, men don't seem to make more then women at the same job[1]. As a reward, we don't get equal paternity leave for maternity leave.



Men are less likely to graduate college/highschool then women. Men are more likely to be incarcerated for crimes. Men even die earlier. Speaking of health issues, guess who's more likely to be diagnosed with ADD/ADHD.



As for the legal system, there is gender bias in child custody cases, in sexual assault cases and in domestic abuse cases. While physical strength, size and culture does result in more man to woman violence, occasionally men are physically or sexually assaulted and the legal system, more often than not, does little or nothing. Take the famous case of a certain teacher sexually assaulting her male student -- she got parole for the first offense!



In short, being a guy isn't all fun and roses.



(Oh, and a woman keeps calling me "sweatheart" at work! Agghhh[2])



[1] My figure says women make $.97 - $1.01 for every $1.00 that men make if the experience is the same. Women tend to make drastically less then men because women are in lower paying jobs.



[2] I do have a client that calls me "sweatheart", but this seems to be her term for any young man. (I just told my wife about this: She told me that she thinks the client in question thinks I'm cute. I told my wife that I'm going to sue for sexual harassment -- she snickered.)
das_nut is offline  
#20 Old 02-18-2005, 12:54 PM
Banned
 
remilard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 5,772
Quote:
Originally Posted by das_nut View Post

Do men really come out ahead? For the same work experience, men don't seem to make more then women at the same job[1]. As a reward, we don't get equal paternity leave for maternity leave.



Uh, not in the United States. Men and women have the same federal right to have their job protected if they leave to care for a newborn or an ill family member. Very few jobs have paid maternity leave.



Quote:
Men are less likely to graduate college/highschool then women. Men are more likely to be incarcerated for crimes. Men even die earlier. Speaking of health issues, guess who's more likely to be diagnosed with ADD/ADHD.



And any of this is systematic opression by women? Because most of the problems women complain about (lower wages, violence against them etc) are the result of systematic opression of them by men.





Quote:
[1] My figure says women make $.97 - $1.01 for every $1.00 that men make if the experience is the same. Women tend to make drastically less then men because women are in lower paying jobs.



Your figure is from? Women are in lower paying jobs because they are discouraged from getting graduate degrees in high paying fields, are passed over for promotions, and are given a different job title for doing the same job.
remilard is offline  
#21 Old 02-18-2005, 02:08 PM
Beginner
 
empathanimal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by remilard View Post


And any of this is systematic opression by women? Because most of the problems women complain about (lower wages, violence against them etc) are the result of systematic opression of them by men.



Reread his point and the quote he was responding to. It wasn't about any "systematic oppression" from women, it was focused more on the idea that "men come out ahead".
empathanimal is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the VeggieBoards forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
If you do not want to register, fill this field only and the name will be used as user name for your post.
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in


Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off