$4000 or death - Page 3 - VeggieBoards
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#61 Old 02-24-2004, 04:23 PM
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Can you make payments on the $4,000? Get what you want/need and pay for it bit by bit?
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#62 Old 02-24-2004, 04:46 PM
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soilman has a tiny income and no credit, I believe.
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#63 Old 02-24-2004, 05:55 PM
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Soilman. I was at the doctor's waiting room yesterday waiting for an appointment and reading one of their Reader's Digest issues; I came across an article and thought of you.



There is a man who started an organization that offers grants to people truly in need. He might not be able to help you with the whole 5K, but it might be worth a try to see if he could help you with some of it.



Here is his website: www.modestneeds.org



It's worth a try don't you think?
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#64 Old 02-24-2004, 06:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kreeli View Post

and may i humbly suggest that those of you who don't have anything nice to say to soilman, not say anything at all? honestly. your calling his character and motives out in public here into question is totally inappropriate. if you think he's crossed a line somewhere with his posts, report them to the mods and administration.



ETRemove: a unneccessarily rude remark. sorry, all. ~K



I think he raised some ire by using a "support forum" to try and get money out of people. People at first responded by giving him reasonable suggestions for obtaining more affordable treatment, but he just responded by saying he just wants the more expensive treatment, poor him, he can't afford it, here's the address of his dentist to send the money to.

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#65 Old 02-24-2004, 11:06 PM
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Look.... In the US, a hospital can not turn you away without treating you for pain... Do it enough and they will probably even prescribe you pain meds.





I can't believe I am posting to this thread. There are so many humane organizations who would see your plight and pay for some kind of treatment (may or may not be what you want). Posting this over the Internet? You may really be in pain, but for all I know...



Hey, if I am lucky, somebody will send me $5 (US). Just PM me and I will give you my email and you can pay me via Paypal. It's for a good cause -- lunch!
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#66 Old 02-25-2004, 12:40 AM
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You could start a website... My idea for www.helpmegetridofmydog.com was originally to raise money for our no kill shelter, but they opposed the idea so I had to scrap that concept and just turn it into a scrap book of sorts. But I was basing it on websites such as www.helpmeleavemyhusband.com where people used the art of pity to raise money. If it's catchy, humorous, heartfelt, sincere, and wity, you can possibly get enough minor media outlet exposure that you'll be able to draw enough attention to your cause to get people to donate. Do a search for "online beggars" or "cyber begging" and you'll see what I mean. There's nothing wrong with asking for a hand.



(Oh and I still think our shelter was dumb for turning down my idea about helpmegetridofmydog)
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#67 Old 02-25-2004, 12:49 AM
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Let's try again (I deleted my previous message)



Hospitals in the US are required to treat for pain... This could give you some temporary relief. There might be some organizations around your town who would fund treatment for you.



Looking for help over the Internet is not a good idea. Here's why: Spam about organizations in Africa that want to put $1000000 US in your bank account for accounting reasons (so you provide them your bank account number), people on the internet who are gullible and fall for these scams. If you're legit, go to a local organization who can verify your ID, see your face, etc. You must be holding back the pain somehow. You're still reading and typing messages. I've had mouth pain before.
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#68 Old 02-25-2004, 01:20 AM
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soilman has been a longtime member in good standing here on VB. he has never been well-known for his tact or willingness to mince words. it is his personality to say exactly what he means at all times. yes, it comes across as rude, if you are hung up on social niceties. if you can see past that, i think you can see he is a real human being with real problems and he's come here to ask his online VB friends for support and help, in his own way.



soilman has always had a lot to contribute to VB in the past; really, i counted on him to come through with all sorts of great information especially pertaining to veganic gardnening but also through his views on animal rights and welfare, and the healthfulness of a vegan diet and lifestyle. i've "known" him now for almost four years and in that time i have never known him to utter a dishonest word or to be sly about anything...he has always been sincere and up-front, even painfully so. it strikes me as ironic that everyone who is accusing him of being potentially fraudulent in this thread are the ones who are most upset at his truthfulness and lack of apology for saying what his problems are, how he needs them to be met, and how we, as individuals, could help.



asking for assistance from other human beings immediately puts you in a strange position, especially if it is financial in nature. money is an emotional issue for people so that, coupled with soilman's...ummm...lack of tact makes for a charged exchange of comments. this is understable but should not be insurmountable if people could just get over the fact that he won't grovel or beat around the bush when asked why he does not want to accept inferior treatment on his mouth.



there is nothing sneaky or fishy about soilman, as far as i can tell. several times in my life i have been helped by people, complete strangers inasmuch as 3D interaction goes, without ever once asking for it directly. it makes me feel incredibly guilty knowing that i can rely on the kindness of strangers when i've never even remotely been in the kind of health crisis situation soilman is, and all he's getting is flack for being honest about it.
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#69 Old 02-25-2004, 01:33 AM
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Kreeli:



I noticed that soilman's number of posts is high, and I looked at a few of his posts. It would be nothing off of me to Paypal him a small donation. If we did this collectively, it could raise $4000 for him. I get a lump in my throat suggesting this -- I've been gullible throughout my life and am a bit paranoid, but Paypal is safe... He would need to establish a Paypal account and publish the associated email address here. This way feels safest. None of us part with a significant sum of money, and he gets the funds for his treatment.



Froggy
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#70 Old 02-25-2004, 01:39 AM
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Well said Kreeli





I'd also like to add that I feel Soilman has a right to his opinion on the matter whether or not we agree with it.



If people simply don't agree with it - the least they can do is be supportive of his feelings and perhaps offer alternate suggestions (which he may or may not take - that's up to him). This is a SUPPORT thread people - not the compost heap. Get over yourself already.
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#71 Old 02-25-2004, 01:59 AM
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i think, soilman, that opening up a paypal account (if you don't have one already) is a good idea. even if each person can only afford a buck or two, it could add up. i'd really like to see you get your entirely reasonable wish for a healthy mouth. if that woman who racked up $25,000 in credit card debt buying gucci bags and designer clothes can get strangers to pay it off for her, i don't think it's wrong for you to ask people for $4000 for the dental work you need done.



paypal -- it might amount to very little, but it could help out a lot. at least it is something.
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#72 Old 02-25-2004, 03:22 AM
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How close are you to Mexico?



Or Canada?



Howto: Get Your Teeth Fixed In Mexico:

http://www.kuro5hin.org/story/2003/12/20/121018/65
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#73 Old 02-25-2004, 09:05 AM
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Thanks all.



The Mexico idea sounds promising, das_nut. I don't know why I didn't think of it. I don't need the most advanced super-dentistry, rather, I need old-fashioned tried and true gold inlays, and gold crowns, which can cost anywhere form 750US to 1100 US, per tooth. Despite the what the web page says, almost all the most advanced dentistry is available in Mexico. From what I understand, only a few things that are still highly experimental, aren't available. Everything else is available in Mexico. Plus I don't mind having gold on my 5 front teeth -- which does not bring the cost down in the US, but may bring the cost down in Mexico. In this age of body-modification, 5 gold front teeth shouldn't alarm anyone. I might add that the first gold crowns and inlays that we have historical evidence for -- were made in mexico -- 5000 years ago.



I am reasonably certain resin-bonding is available. Only difficulty would be finding the right dentist to do the bonding. As doing it poorly generally results in the resin breaking up after a year or 2, and needing to be done all oer again. Tho gold inlays would be a satisfactory substitute for resin bonding, in fact better -- they are more expensive. My $4000 estimate if for, just a fast look in my mouth: a combo of 8 gold crowns, 2 gold inlays, 2 resin fillings, and 19 resin-build-ups of occlusal surfaces. Substituting gold inlays for the 2 resin-fillings would bring the cost up considerably, in the US, from $4000 to about $5,500, a $1,500 increase, but would probably bring the cost up in Mexico by only about $400 -- I believe there may be a bigger cost savings when comparing gold inlays, than there is when comparing resin fillings or bondings.



I could take a plane to Mexico from the east coast (New York) which I estimate would be $500 round trip. Just a real fast estimate. And I could probably find enough to eat in Mexico to stay there 3 or 4 days if I had a bowl, a pot, and hot plate, in a hotel room. Rice, beans, legumes, green vegetables, and tons of fruit -- that is all I need, and these are reportely easier to find in Mexico than in the US. Actually I could probably live on nothing but tortillas for a week.



4 days in a hotel in mexico would be about $400 I'm guessing. I don't need to drive into a border town; I could fly into a major city like Mexico city, where food markets will be just outside my doorstep.



Most difficult part would be locating the right dentist. Tho the web site that das_nut directed me to says there are internet sites that specialize in directing foreigners to mexican dentists, but oddly, I couldnt find any links from that that web site, to such internet sites.



Just some really rough estimating: we are talking about $1000 for the trip, and maybe $1,500 for dentistry that would cost $4000 in the US. Meaning my total cost could be $2,500 instead of $4000. Of course, being a foreigner, I would have to pay the whole thing in advance. In the US, I could probably get $4000 worth of work, from a dentist who knows me and knows I make payments, for about $3000 in advance, even with my bad credit record. (Many dentists are concerned about getting enough up front to at least pay for the lab-work costs they have; an 1000 crown could cost the dentist, I'm just guessing, $250 in lab fees.)



Having the work done in Mexico still sounds like a good idea.



Kreeli, I have had a lot of trouble figuring out how PayPal works. I have no basic objections to it; but they don't tell you upfront how much they charge for their services, which leads me to believe that you don't find out until they deduct the charge from your first payment. It is not clear whether you need a bank account. I don't have a bank account, and can't get one. I need to get checks, which I can cash at my local check-cashing place, or deposit in a friend's account, a friend who can then give me the cash.
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#74 Old 02-25-2004, 09:18 AM
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Paypal does not charge to send money, but charges to receive money. I believe it is a percentage. Let me sign on and look around...



from https://www.paypal.com/us/cgi-bin/we...y-fees-outside



Quote:

Open an Account:

Personal Account - Free

Premier/Business Account - Free



Send Money:

Personal Account - Free

Premier/Business Account - Free



Withdraw Funds:

Personal Account - Free for US bank accounts, Fees for other banks

Premier/Business Account - Free for US bank accounts, Fees for other banks



Add Funds:

Personal Account - Free

Premier/Business Account - Free



Receive Funds:

Personal Account - Free

Premier/Business Account - 2.2% + $0.30 USD to 2.9% + $0.30 USD



Multiple Currency Transactions - Exchange rate includes a 2.5% fee*





If you receive a payment from a user in another country, an additional cross border fee will be charged. The cross border fee is an additional 1% for U.S. Dollar payments and 0.5% for Canadian Dollar, Euro, Pound Sterling, and Yen payments. This cross border fee is currently waived for Canadian sellers receiving payments from U.S. buyers.



* If your transaction involves a currency conversion, it will be completed at a retail foreign exchange rate determined by PayPal, which is adjusted regularly based on market conditions. This exchange rate includes a 2.5% spread above the wholesale exchange rate at which PayPal obtains foreign currency, and the spread is retained by PayPal. The specific exchange rate that applies to your multiple currency transaction will be displayed at the time of the transaction. View Currency Converter.

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#75 Old 02-25-2004, 09:38 AM
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I am convinces that, just like in the US, there are both good and bad dentists, and the difference between how good and how bad can be quite substantial. I am also convinced that the good Mexican denstist charge less than good US dentists. The only problem is finding out which ones are good and which ones are bad. This is not and easy thing to do. There are few, if any, lists, rating dentists. My ploy in the US has been to have just a tiny job done, then a bigger job done, to see how well they do. Or to make friends with dentists socially (like at the vegetarian society meeting; you'd be surprised at how many vegetarians are dentists) and then pick their brains. Then, once I find a good dentist, stick with her, and treat her real nice. Be on time for every appointment. Brush my teeth scrupulously before getting in the chair.
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#76 Old 02-25-2004, 09:45 AM
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I can't figure out from the stuff you posted, Christy 13, just how much gets charged to who, when someone sends money to someone else using paypall. What is a "personal account." What does "free for US bank accounts" mean? I want to know what the person receiving the money pays for receiving it. The phrase "free for US bank accounts" doesn't explain how much it costs for a person to get the money.





what are "multiple currency transactions" and how do they figure in the picture, or not figure in the picture?



Also, I don't have a bank account and can't get one, and it is not clear from this info whether I need one or not. The info is extremely confusing to me.



It costs me 1.4% I think to cash a check; $0.60 miniumum fee, on the smallest check. So if someone sends me a check for $10 it costs me $0.60 to cash it, not $0.14.
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#77 Old 02-25-2004, 09:50 AM
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#78 Old 02-25-2004, 09:54 AM
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As I said, I don't understand Paypals explanation of how things work. I know where to find the explanations. I read them. I just don't understand them. You know those little buttons on the bottom of the page that says "did you find this page helpful." I had to click "No."



I just noticed that PayPal is "an ebay company." I have some junk I could sell for $5.00 and $4.00 there; but I can't figure out how to use ebay either.
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#79 Old 02-25-2004, 09:55 AM
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Makes sense to me. I think you can call or email them for a better explanation.
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#80 Old 02-25-2004, 10:08 AM
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I generally find written explanations to be easier to undertand than spoken explanations, as I can read them phrase by phrase, pause to assimilate a phrase, and then read the next phrase. If people are explaining technical subjects by speaking to me, I have to ask them to pause while I assimilate one phrase, perhaps ask them to repeat the phrase several times, then ask them to pause again after each repetition, while I try to assimilate the phrase -- then finally go on to the next phrase, and repeat the process. Often people are unwilling to do that, don't have the patience to do that.



Don't let the fact that I write well and speak well lead you to assume that I understand things easily. It is just the opposite. I write well because I have to go over things many times before I finally understand them, and then I have to translate what I've finally understood, into my own words. Then I refer to my own text, instead of the original text that I learned the subject from. Then I go over my own text over and I revise it, and go over it again, and revise it again, and go over it again, until it gets clearer and clearer. So I get a lot of practice writing, and putting things into words, in lots of different ways.



I have gotten a lot of practice writing and explaining things, and gotten good at it -- precisely because I have so much trouble understanding things.



I can't take the bus anywhere without spending most of a day or 2 reading schedules, and then translating them into a written step by step description, of what I have to do to get from place A to place B. My story of how to get from eastern long island to a doctor's office in manhattan, is a page and 1/2 long. I put it in my pocket before I leave my home. It tells me what time to leave my home, which of the bus stops near my home I have to walk to, how long it takes to walk there, what time the bus will arrive at that bus stop to pick me up, where I have to get off and what time the bus will arrive there, directions for where i have to walk to catch the next bus, how long it will take to walk there, how long i will have to wait at the second bus stop until the second bus comes, what time the bus comes, where I have to get off, directions for walking from the bus station to the long island railroad station, what time the train comes, where I have to get off the train, where i have to walk to from the train station to get to which subway station, which subway line to take once I get to the station, and in which direction, what stop to get off, which subway line i have to fine next, and in which direction, and where i have to get off the subway train. Then i have directions for how to walk from the subway station to the building that the doctor's office is in. I have direction for where to go in the building, where to find the elevator, which floor to take the elevator to, and which way to walk once I get out of the elevator.



I keep the 2 sheets of paper in front of me throughout the whole trip, and follow the directions phrase by phrase.



The step by step direction sheets takes me 2 days to write and rewrite. I refer to on-line train schedules and maps, on-line bus schedules and maps, and subway maps, in the process of writing and revising my directions sheet. If I go to the same doctor's office a month later, I have to go over the whole process again. I can't remember how I got there last time, since it was more than a day or 2 ago. Also, everything has to be revised since my appointment is likely to be at a different time, and since bus and train schedules change. So every time I have to go to my docto'rs office in manhatten, which takes about 4 hours (would take 2 hours by car), I have to spend 2 days before hand, just revising my directions sheet. I have similar information, which i include in the directions sheet, for how to get from the doctor's office to my home.



In regard to very technical things like computer applications, say for example a word processing program or a spread sheet, I can't understand it from the documentation. I have to have both the documentation and the program right in front of me, then read the doc phrase by phrase, then do what the doc says to do, with the keyboard or mouse, and see if what it says is supposed to come up on the screen, indeed comes up. I suspect I may not be able to figure out how paypal works until after I sign up for it, and can actually see how it works, step by step.
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#81 Old 02-25-2004, 10:11 AM
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If you can't get a bank account and it costs to cash checks, it may cost you too much in fees (paypal, chech cashing, etc.). I think you can have a check cut and mailed instead of transferring money from paypal to a credit card or bank account.
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#82 Old 02-25-2004, 10:22 AM
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http://www.peoplesguide.com/mexico/l...dentists.shtml



=======================

I guess I,m the dental expert around here.Lorena gave me your adress. I,m married to a Mexican dentist, that makes me the expert. From my experience in Mexico ,dental cost run aprox. 1/3rd to 1/5th of what they cost in the states, sometimes even less. That,s if you go to a doctor who deals with Mexicans and he /she charges you the going Mexican rate. There are many fine dentist, doctors and all types of med-profs here.There are also , unfortunately, a lot of jokers who want nothing more than to get in your pocket and do less than spectacular work.The key , like with anything, is to know who,s what.

===============================
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#83 Old 02-25-2004, 11:11 AM
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is there any way for someone to set up a paypal account on soilman's behalf, and to send donations collected through it to him via snail mail once there is a sum worth sending?



i would offer to do it but i learned the hard way that paypal charges much more to convert funds back and forth from canadian to american dollars.
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#84 Old 02-26-2004, 12:30 PM
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is medicare the same as britains NHS?
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#85 Old 02-26-2004, 01:17 PM
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soilman i live in southern nevada and there is a very good dentist just past the border that a lot of people here go to for major work at an extremely cheap price: dr. juan camacho, 011-52-658-517-7713 and its in los algodones hope that helps!
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#86 Old 02-26-2004, 04:00 PM
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I noticed you live on LI. So do I?



Unfortunately, I cannot help you financially.



I will search around though for more info.
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#87 Old 02-26-2004, 04:05 PM
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Also, there has to be a way that you can walk into a

dentist and receive help.



People hop over the border and get welfare ( don't get me

started on this subject )... you must be able to get something!
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#88 Old 02-27-2004, 05:52 AM
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I think I may be having a stomach hemorage (spelling) (from a bleeding stomach ulcer) as I am getting my ulcer symtoms back, even tho I am taking my Nexium, plus I feel like "cold" and really like totaly out of energy and the "cold" thing is what makes me think it as they say that is how you feel when you are having a fairly large blood loss.
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#89 Old 02-27-2004, 06:02 AM
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I think it's stopped now. I don't think I lost enough blood to die; just to get anemic, and very very weak.
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#90 Old 02-27-2004, 09:57 AM
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" there has to be a way that you can walk into a

dentist and receive help."



(1) Bring him enough money or valuable things so that he feels he is getting well-paid for the amount of work he would be doing. (2) Beat him up and make him fear for his life if he doesn't do what you say.



There seem to be no other alternatives.



(1) I am unable to do without help from others, but no-one wants to help me.



(2) I consider to be immoral and would not do.
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