"Health Food" - VeggieBoards
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#1 Old 09-13-2014, 06:21 PM
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"Health Food"

I get a bit wearing of people calling junk food "healthy" just because it might be a bit better than the standard animal derived food.

I see it over and over again...the vegan and vegan raw community are the worst culprits in this trend in my opinion.
Take for example this recipe that is "secretly healthy!" http://chocolatecoveredkatie.com/201...ud-cheesecake/

1/4 of maple syrup (they fool you into thinking that's healthy because it's not sugar)...coco butter (full of fat to fool you into saying "yeah but it's good fat and better than animal fat")...chocolate chips...(sugar and fat)....high caloric (to fool you into saying "well we all need treats, no need to deprive yourself)...this fat-sugar-high calorie desert is designed to fool you into saying "yeah but it's better than real cheesecake so it's healthy.

It's not healthy or good for you. But that's what probably makes it so good. LOL.
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#2 Old 09-13-2014, 07:34 PM
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Sometimes it pays to glance at the url before bothering to visit sites.
"chocolatecoveredkatie.com" pretty much guarantees its either junk food or porn (hey, this is the internet)
By default I tune out anything with 'healthy' in the name or ad space, or any food with health claims. Its almost invariably an advertizing gimmick or someone trying to delude themselves when, in truth, they know better.
'Traditional' fares a little bit better if its on a recipe site or blog, rather than a can.
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#3 Old 09-14-2014, 07:33 AM
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Originally Posted by Tweety View Post
I get a bit wearing of people calling junk food "healthy" just because it might be a bit better than the standard animal derived food.

I see it over and over again...the vegan and vegan raw community are the worst culprits in this trend in my opinion.
Take for example this recipe that is "secretly healthy!" http://chocolatecoveredkatie.com/201...ud-cheesecake/

1/4 of maple syrup (they fool you into thinking that's healthy because it's not sugar)...coco butter (full of fat to fool you into saying "yeah but it's good fat and better than animal fat")...chocolate chips...(sugar and fat)....high caloric (to fool you into saying "well we all need treats, no need to deprive yourself)...this fat-sugar-high calorie desert is designed to fool you into saying "yeah but it's better than real cheesecake so it's healthy.

It's not healthy or good for you. But that's what probably makes it so good. LOL.
Perhaps you stay out of sites with names like "chocolate". In fact, stay away from dessert recipes altogether.
Perhaps you are missing something from your diet if simply hearing about sugar/fat makes you "weary"?
Recently people have posted their annoyance with what they consider attacks on food choices from the "health police". I've responded by saying everyone has their opinion and they should chill out. I'm giving you the same advice.
What's it to you about moderating the degrees of what 'healthy' or 'healthier' means to people? A "cheesecake" made with tofu and maple syrup certainly meets my standard for healthier, in fact I deem it healthy. Leave out the syrup and oil and you have--lunch.
Eat what you like and quit yer b*itch-n
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#4 Old 09-14-2014, 09:34 AM
 
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Tweety has a right to her(?) opinion and can post what she wants, just like anyone else on here can. Anyone that has a problem with the "vegan health police" will know not to read any furthur than the first paragraph. She never said you don't have a right to eat the vegan cheesecake. She expressed an annoyance with calling it healthy. There's not much about it that can be called healthy or something that promotes health even though it might be delicious. It can maybe be considered "not as bad".

I do on occasion eat raw vegan desserts or all natural labeled snacks like potato or corn chips, but I don't kid myself by pretending it's actually healthy. I just make sure to limit those occasions.

I see patients all the time that wonder why they're still overweight, or their diabetes isn't getting any better, or their inflammation isn't going away. When I go through their diet with them, they list all of the "healthy" changes they've made and are proud of it. I have to let them know it's definitely a step in the right direction, but if it's a "healthy" version of junk food, it's more than likely still junk and should only be consumed in small amounts.
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#5 Old 09-15-2014, 09:26 AM
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Perhaps you stay out of sites with names like "chocolate". In fact, stay away from dessert recipes altogether.
Perhaps you are missing something from your diet if simply hearing about sugar/fat makes you "weary"?
Recently people have posted their annoyance with what they consider attacks on food choices from the "health police". I've responded by saying everyone has their opinion and they should chill out. I'm giving you the same advice.
What's it to you about moderating the degrees of what 'healthy' or 'healthier' means to people? A "cheesecake" made with tofu and maple syrup certainly meets my standard for healthier, in fact I deem it healthy. Leave out the syrup and oil and you have--lunch.
Eat what you like and quit yer b*itch-n

Advice read and considered, but will throw it in the trash and ignore it. I respect your right to post your opinion about me expressing my opinion. That's what these boards are about and I'l continue to ***** about things that I want to ***** about. If I'm considered "health police" in a negative light, so be it.

As to what's it to me, as an RN, i take care of people with the ravages that simple lifestyle choices do their body, at a high cost to their personal well being and billions to us as a society. Their right for sure, I'm not telling anyone what to do and what not to do. I allow people to eat what they like. I don't remember telling anyone not to eat this recipe. But to eat it thinking it's good for you doesn't sit right with me. Heck I eat junk food all the time myself.

I do have a pet peeve with marketers and vegans saying things like "it's secretly healthy" about a desert that's laden with fat and calories and isn't healthy at all. Sure it's "healthier" than a processed animal fat cheese cake...say that, but don't call it healthy.

That site bills itself as the "Healthy Desert Blog" and someone sent it to me is how I went to it. On a scale of 1 to 10 of things that are important to me, this issue is a 1. I don't sweat the small stuff.

Last edited by Tweety; 09-15-2014 at 09:36 AM.
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#6 Old 09-15-2014, 09:35 AM
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Tweety has a right to her(?) opinion and can post what she wants, just like anyone else on here can. Anyone that has a problem with the "vegan health police" will know not to read any furthur than the first paragraph. She never said you don't have a right to eat the vegan cheesecake. She expressed an annoyance with calling it healthy. There's not much about it that can be called healthy or something that promotes health even though it might be delicious. It can maybe be considered "not as bad".

I do on occasion eat raw vegan desserts or all natural labeled snacks like potato or corn chips, but I don't kid myself by pretending it's actually healthy. I just make sure to limit those occasions.

I see patients all the time that wonder why they're still overweight, or their diabetes isn't getting any better, or their inflammation isn't going away. When I go through their diet with them, they list all of the "healthy" changes they've made and are proud of it. I have to let them know it's definitely a step in the right direction, but if it's a "healthy" version of junk food, it's more than likely still junk and should only be consumed in small amounts.
Thanks for you support and understanding what I'm saying. I am a male btw.
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#7 Old 09-15-2014, 12:00 PM
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I do have a pet peeve with marketers and vegans saying things like "it's secretly healthy" about a desert that's laden with fat and calories and isn't healthy at all.
That one bugs me too. Not so much in regard to adults, its been my experience that the great majority of adults know junk food when they see it, even if they wont admit it. I've watched people cheeseburger themselves to death and they knew what they were doing. What bugs me is that advertisers use that 'secretly healthy' line to convince parents to feed physically injurious quantities of junk to children.
At some point our cultures will have to face the question of just where to draw the line of child abuse in regards to diet.
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#8 Old 09-15-2014, 05:28 PM
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Advice read and considered, but will throw it in the trash and ignore it. I respect your right to post your opinion about me expressing my opinion. That's what these boards are about and I'l continue to ***** about things that I want to ***** about. If I'm considered "health police" in a negative light, so be it.

As to what's it to me, as an RN, i take care of people with the ravages that simple lifestyle choices do their body, at a high cost to their personal well being and billions to us as a society. Their right for sure, I'm not telling anyone what to do and what not to do. I allow people to eat what they like. I don't remember telling anyone not to eat this recipe. But to eat it thinking it's good for you doesn't sit right with me. Heck I eat junk food all the time myself.

I do have a pet peeve with marketers and vegans saying things like "it's secretly healthy" about a desert that's laden with fat and calories and isn't healthy at all. Sure it's "healthier" than a processed animal fat cheese cake...say that, but don't call it healthy.

That site bills itself as the "Healthy Desert Blog" and someone sent it to me is how I went to it. On a scale of 1 to 10 of things that are important to me, this issue is a 1. I don't sweat the small stuff.
Yeah, okay.
I was a bit more ticked than I should have been. There was a thread started about being annoyed by what was perceived as judgement from the health police. I said they should chill out. Really though, I have also felt annoyance at what seems like undue critique of foods. Like just when you think you're doing good someone tells you it's not good enough.
I agree with you about the label "healthy" used too lightly, but not nearly as strictly. When something is labeled dessert I get sad if it's not sweet or--unhealthy in some way. When the dessert gets a label of healthy I still want that. If it's nothing but healthy, then --call it fruit, or something besides dessert.
If you go on amazon.com book reviews there's a ton of complainers who think vegan means nothing but health. Sugar free, fat free, even grain free. Where do we draw the line? We have the paleo gang advocating grain free organic meats, the Mediterean trend with the fish and olive oils, and the plant based with nothing but whole fresh foods.
I appreciate what you're saying, I just think it's more out there than the majority is willing to go.
I'm personally tired of seeing recipes for avocado myself
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#9 Old 09-15-2014, 10:35 PM
 
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At some point our cultures will have to face the question of just where to draw the line of child abuse in regards to diet.
I've thought about that one. Parents have a responsibility to give children what they need, not necessarily what they want. They are responsible for their health and well being. But, the question is, where do you draw the line? People have different parenting techniques, there's more than one right way and more than one wrong way. In the same way, what someone else would allow their child to eat, I might not come close to considering. You would almost have to judge by body fat percentage alone. Some children have higher metabolisms than others, so two children fed the exact same diet can have very different results. Is it a case of do what you want as long as the child doesn't reach more than a predetermined body fat percentage and that's all that matters?

I do think that allowing/causing your children to become extremely overweight is pretty much criminal. Not only is the child's health being damaged, but likely their self-esteem and life opportunities to a certain extent.

I have two nieces on my husband's side of the family that are lovely girls, but pretty overweight. While our family can look at them and see them for who they are on the inside and think they're beautiful, the rest of society and their peers don't see them that way. Unfortunately, kids can be really mean. When you're young, what others think of you matters a lot. The really frustrating part is that if they were their ideal weight, they would be considered really pretty and likely have an easier time of it.

The oldest one, who's 14, wants to get healthier and tried to go vegan because of my husband and me, but her house is filled with nothing but junk. She sees everyone else eating all the goodies and then gives in because there is no comparable or at least as tasty of an alternative.

At what point do you say someone just has to use self-control? It has to be extremely hard to be someone young, who grew up on junk, and has no immediate family support, to exercise self-control. She wanted to live with my husband and me for the summer so that it would be easier, which my husband and I were all for, but her mother understandably wouldn't allow.

I feel like strangling the mother for teaching them bad habits and compromising their health, but I'm mostly upset about what they're weight is doing to their self-esteem and social life.
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#10 Old 09-16-2014, 12:55 AM
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I've thought about that one. Parents have a responsibility to give children what they need, not necessarily what they want. They are responsible for their health and well being. But, the question is, where do you draw the line? People have different parenting techniques, there's more than one right way and more than one wrong way. In the same way, what someone else would allow their child to eat, I might not come close to considering. You would almost have to judge by body fat percentage alone. Some children have higher metabolisms than others, so two children fed the exact same diet can have very different results. Is it a case of do what you want as long as the child doesn't reach more than a predetermined body fat percentage and that's all that matters?

I do think that allowing/causing your children to become extremely overweight is pretty much criminal. Not only is the child's health being damaged, but likely their self-esteem and life opportunities to a certain extent.

I have two nieces on my husband's side of the family that are lovely girls, but pretty overweight. While our family can look at them and see them for who they are on the inside and think they're beautiful, the rest of society and their peers don't see them that way. Unfortunately, kids can be really mean. When you're young, what others think of you matters a lot. The really frustrating part is that if they were their ideal weight, they would be considered really pretty and likely have an easier time of it.

The oldest one, who's 14, wants to get healthier and tried to go vegan because of my husband and me, but her house is filled with nothing but junk. She sees everyone else eating all the goodies and then gives in because there is no comparable or at least as tasty of an alternative.

At what point do you say someone just has to use self-control? It has to be extremely hard to be someone young, who grew up on junk, and has no immediate family support, to exercise self-control. She wanted to live with my husband and me for the summer so that it would be easier, which my husband and I were all for, but her mother understandably wouldn't allow.

I feel like strangling the mother for teaching them bad habits and compromising their health, but I'm mostly upset about what they're weight is doing to their self-esteem and social life.
I'm sorry if this sounds rude, but I wondered why your sister "understandably wouldn't allow" your niece to spend time with you?

On what grounds, surely your sister trusts you to provide a safe environment for your niece for a few weeks? As both a child and a teenager, during the summer (and other) holidays I spent lots of time away at other family member's homes, especially my grandparents, but often also with aunts and uncles too, so personally I don't understand why denying her teenage daughter that kind of opportunity - especially while she's growing into young adulthood - is 'understandable.'

If I were in your situation (and I know I'm not), I would be inclined to question your sister's motivation for preventing her daughter from spending constructive time with other close family members. She may not have that opportunity again once she's older and living an adult life of her own.

I wonder what your sister fears her daughter will do if she changes the way she eats? Sometimes families and parents can unconsciously not want their children to change; it means they are losing control, and if the choices their children make are not in line with the way they were raised, it can feel like a rejection of that family unit's values. Or maybe even a challenge to those harmful habits that the family are in denial of.

I'm sorry to be so forthright, of course I don't know the situation, but I can't but think you welcoming your niece into your home for the summer, to help her make needed changes in her life, would be an incredible support to her and maybe even change her life for the better, for the good.

Maybe next summer your sister will change her mind? I hope so for your nieces future health and wellbeing. As well as her developing independence and mental growth. If anything I've written sounds disrespectful, my apologies.

Last edited by Spudulika; 09-16-2014 at 01:05 AM.
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#11 Old 09-16-2014, 05:59 AM
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Yeah, okay.
I was a bit more ticked than I should have been. There was a thread started about being annoyed by what was perceived as judgement from the health police. I said they should chill out. Really though, I have also felt annoyance at what seems like undue critique of foods. Like just when you think you're doing good someone tells you it's not good enough.
I agree with you about the label "healthy" used too lightly, but not nearly as strictly. When something is labeled dessert I get sad if it's not sweet or--unhealthy in some way. When the dessert gets a label of healthy I still want that. If it's nothing but healthy, then --call it fruit, or something besides dessert.
If you go on amazon.com book reviews there's a ton of complainers who think vegan means nothing but health. Sugar free, fat free, even grain free. Where do we draw the line? We have the paleo gang advocating grain free organic meats, the Mediterean trend with the fish and olive oils, and the plant based with nothing but whole fresh foods.
I appreciate what you're saying, I just think it's more out there than the majority is willing to go.
I'm personally tired of seeing recipes for avocado myself
Thanks. I understand what you're saying as well and pretty much agree. The health police degrades everything with oil, sugar, salt, etc. Sometimes they need to take a chill pill. The tablespoon of olive oil I use in a gallon pot of soup isn't going to kill me so STFU about it. LOL

Sometimes too I need to be called out.

My beef really isn't with the comfort food or veganizing of junk food movement in the vegan community...it's compassionate and very tasty I support that. My beef really isn't with this recipe, it's with the blog calling itself the "healthy dessert blog" and labeling the recipe as "secretly healthy". I've noticed this trend for a few years in cookbooks and blogs and it doesn't serve people well with misleading labels. My beef is that just because someone substitutes cream with cashews and cocoa butter they label it "healthy". Again, it's barely a blip on my radar, just something that irks me.

Put me in the majority that isn't willing to degrade everything I eat...vegan cheesecake has to have fat and sugar to be any kinda good. I'm not going to be one of those that eat 10 heads of lettuce, 30 bananas, 50 apricots, etc. I'm striving for a balance between the uberhealthy and junk/processed food.
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#12 Old 09-16-2014, 10:11 AM
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I do see your point, but I'm not sure that the example you gave really illustrates it well (at least for me). I think a lot has to do with proportions of foods. For example, in the recipe you posted, 1/4 cup maple syrup doesn't sound like a lot to me for one 8 inch cake. The 1/3 cup cocoa butter is a bit much for my taste, but that's because I usually do more low fat baking when I bake (but that's a personal preference - I actually don't like cakes and baked good with too much fat in them so that they end up too "moist" and greasy).

I do agree with you that some recipes do seem to define "healthy" in a way that I wouldn't. For example, a lot of raw dessert recipes call for a lot of ground raw nuts/nut butter and dates (for example, a raw chocolate cake recipe might call for 2 or 3 cups of ground nuts and 1 1/2 cups of mashed dates - I'm just throwing out these amounts) which I would not consider healthy, even though nuts and dates are considered health foods by many. If I were eating an ounce of nuts and a date or two for a snack, that might not be so bad. But in large quantities, I don't consider them health foods.

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#13 Old 09-16-2014, 12:28 PM
 
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I'm sorry if this sounds rude, but I wondered why your sister "understandably wouldn't allow" your niece to spend time with you?

On what grounds, surely your sister trusts you to provide a safe environment for your niece for a few weeks? As both a child and a teenager, during the summer (and other) holidays I spent lots of time away at other family member's homes, especially my grandparents, but often also with aunts and uncles too, so personally I don't understand why denying her teenage daughter that kind of opportunity - especially while she's growing into young adulthood - is 'understandable.'

If I were in your situation (and I know I'm not), I would be inclined to question your sister's motivation for preventing her daughter from spending constructive time with other close family members. She may not have that opportunity again once she's older and living an adult life of her own.

I wonder what your sister fears her daughter will do if she changes the way she eats? Sometimes families and parents can unconsciously not want their children to change; it means they are losing control, and if the choices their children make are not in line with the way they were raised, it can feel like a rejection of that family unit's values. Or maybe even a challenge to those harmful habits that the family are in denial of.

I'm sorry to be so forthright, of course I don't know the situation, but I can't but think you welcoming your niece into your home for the summer, to help her make needed changes in her life, would be an incredible support to her and maybe even change her life for the better, for the good.

Maybe next summer your sister will change her mind? I hope so for your nieces future health and wellbeing. As well as her developing independence and mental growth. If anything I've written sounds disrespectful, my apologies.
Ugh! My replies keep disappearing, so I'm obviously saying too much. Lol! I'll try to keep it short and sweet this time. I don't mind your questions.

The short answer is that my husband's family is extremely dysfunctional, especially my sister-in-law. She is also extremely obese and has had health issues because of it. She used to be more threatened by my niece wanting to get healthier, but at least she's willing to buy my niece whatever she wants to eat now and my niece can fix her own dinner when she wants to. The problem is that everything else in the house is junk and my niece caves in and eats all the junk along with her healthy stuff.

My sister-in-law doesn't like her kids to be away from her too long, so that was what I was understanding of. Not that I agree with her choices. The kids are lucky to be allowed to spend the night ever. They're just recently being allowed to hang out with friends. Not a normal childhood. I could write a book. At one time, i contacted child protective services without saying who i was talking about just too see if someone should intervene. But, after talking to several child child psychologists, i learned that the trauma from being taken away from their mother could actually outweigh the benefits gained. I decided to just do what i can to minimize damage.

I'm concerned about the clinginess, because I do believe she will hold the kids back from things that other parents would encourage. She already does a lot of that, and my husband's and her mother was the same way. It's bad enough that I'm afraid she'll try to stop my niece from going to college or from succeeding with it. My niece wants to be a pediatrician, so I keep telling her she can do whatever she puts her mind to and to not let anyone tell her otherwise. I think it's sincerely what she wants to do, and doubt she'll change her mind, unless it's from all the doubt planted by her mother and grandmother. My husband and I are determined to make sure she gets through school.

A few years ago, I decided I wanted to be a naturopathic doctor. I'm not that young, and had considered just being a nutritionist, but I've decided to go ahead and go to med school. I'll have to work the rest of my life to pay the student loans, but that's okay. The only thing that concerns me is having that much more time not being with my husband since my nose will be constantly buried in a book studying. I want the kids to learn not to settle for less because of circumstances, but I also have to take into account what my priorities are and how my decisions will affect my life. If I were to just be a nutritionist, I would still be young enough to adopt my own kids. Becoming a doctor, I'll be close to 50 when I'm done. That means probably not having my own family, but I can invest in my sister-in-law's kids. I'm still torn.
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#14 Old 09-16-2014, 06:14 PM
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Thanks for you support and understanding what I'm saying. I am a male btw.
So is Tweety Bird, if I remember correctly.
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#15 Old 09-16-2014, 07:03 PM
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Really great points are being made here, and how interesting from different perspectives.
After you've followed a more whole food life, avoiding additives and things unnecessary, it's just insane to think of the things the majority of people can't understand how to live without. At first glance it seems so extreme to judge this simple vegan recipe as anything but healthy when compared to it's counterparts.

I want fast food places to offer vegan foods--but then think-no, making vegan foods into SAD options isn't a good idea.
But people gravitate towards easy taste good foods. If they're going to eat that way anyway, why not make it vegan?
They like being convinced they're doing better, but they'll only want to do better if they like it.
We literally have a whole campaign going against healthy foods saying kids will just throw it away, and rubbing it in that fruits and vegetables are yucky. I've seen a website against vegan diets that's strewn with pictures of kids holding veggies making yuck faces.
I get that labeling something healthy when it's misleading isn't being truthful. I don't know where we should draw the line when we have typical grocery stores jammed packed with the worst crap touted as having whole grain goodness, high fiber, extra protein and such that shouldn't be seen as food. We're a nation addicted to medical shows that sell fish oil one day and the next day expose it for being full of undisclosed toxins. Dairy good-dairy bad. Eggs high cholestorol- but good cholesterol. All kinds of talk of eating junk food in moderation--but what are they labeling junk food? The healthier desserts on chocolatecovered katie is the healthiest food most of these people will ever eat!

It's terrible what we allow children to be fed, but when it's the common foods that the largest of corporations are pushing how do we put limits on what parents do? We definitely need to recognize the health hazards these foods are and restrict their manufacture.
I'm in America and the whole "freedom" cry of instant gratification is held with iron fists. Whatever the mess your "right" may do to everyone elses future seems to be a moot point.
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#16 Old 09-16-2014, 08:19 PM
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One totally improbable corrective action would be quite simple, really.
Make health care free for everyone and derive the funds by taxing the things that cause the specific health problems.
Tobacco taxes would pay for all lung cancer treatments.
Alcohol taxes would pay for all liver disease treatment.
Trampoline tax would fix broken legs.
Meat, dairy, and junk food tax would pay for all treatments for heart disease, stroke, diabetes, most cancers, acne, obesity, arthritis, impotence, multiple sclerosis, bad vision, scoliosis, etc.
Beans, rice, and kale tax would.... be non existent?

I guess property tax would fill in the gap for people who simply die of old age.
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#17 Old 09-17-2014, 09:54 AM
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Ugh! My replies keep disappearing, so I'm obviously saying too much. Lol! I'll try to keep it short and sweet this time. I don't mind your questions.

The short answer is that my husband's family is extremely dysfunctional, especially my sister-in-law. She is also extremely obese and has had health issues because of it. She used to be more threatened by my niece wanting to get healthier, but at least she's willing to buy my niece whatever she wants to eat now and my niece can fix her own dinner when she wants to. The problem is that everything else in the house is junk and my niece caves in and eats all the junk along with her healthy stuff.

My sister-in-law doesn't like her kids to be away from her too long, so that was what I was understanding of. Not that I agree with her choices. The kids are lucky to be allowed to spend the night ever. They're just recently being allowed to hang out with friends. Not a normal childhood. I could write a book. At one time, i contacted child protective services without saying who i was talking about just too see if someone should intervene. But, after talking to several child child psychologists, i learned that the trauma from being taken away from their mother could actually outweigh the benefits gained. I decided to just do what i can to minimize damage.

I'm concerned about the clinginess, because I do believe she will hold the kids back from things that other parents would encourage. She already does a lot of that, and my husband's and her mother was the same way. It's bad enough that I'm afraid she'll try to stop my niece from going to college or from succeeding with it. My niece wants to be a pediatrician, so I keep telling her she can do whatever she puts her mind to and to not let anyone tell her otherwise. I think it's sincerely what she wants to do, and doubt she'll change her mind, unless it's from all the doubt planted by her mother and grandmother. My husband and I are determined to make sure she gets through school.

A few years ago, I decided I wanted to be a naturopathic doctor. I'm not that young, and had considered just being a nutritionist, but I've decided to go ahead and go to med school. I'll have to work the rest of my life to pay the student loans, but that's okay. The only thing that concerns me is having that much more time not being with my husband since my nose will be constantly buried in a book studying. I want the kids to learn not to settle for less because of circumstances, but I also have to take into account what my priorities are and how my decisions will affect my life. If I were to just be a nutritionist, I would still be young enough to adopt my own kids. Becoming a doctor, I'll be close to 50 when I'm done. That means probably not having my own family, but I can invest in my sister-in-law's kids. I'm still torn.
You were going to call child protective services on your sister? That's opening up a can of worms that you would likely regret. Chances are they'd go to a foster home and be used as free workers. And if you're thinking about taking them from her, sorry, but shame on you. They have parents, not.perfect, but whoia?

You could help by cooking your sisters kids some healthy meals that can be easily frozen in portions. And give her a cookbook that will help her learn to cook healthy and delicious meals. Give her a gym membership and a way to get there, or exercise with her.

Everyone parents differently. You probably would have called me clingy when my kids were young, too, and they are 25 and 21 now, fun, smart, independent, and still family oriented.
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#18 Old 09-17-2014, 12:02 PM
 
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You were going to call child protective services on your sister? That's opening up a can of worms that you would likely regret. Chances are they'd go to a foster home and be used as free workers. And if you're thinking about taking them from her, sorry, but shame on you. They have parents, not.perfect, but whoia?

You could help by cooking your sisters kids some healthy meals that can be easily frozen in portions. And give her a cookbook that will help her learn to cook healthy and delicious meals. Give her a gym membership and a way to get there, or exercise with her.

Everyone parents differently. You probably would have called me clingy when my kids were young, too, and they are 25 and 21 now, fun, smart, independent, and still family oriented.
There's a lot more to the story than I told. I didn't call because of clingyness. They don't take your kids away for being clingy. Her clingyness was somewhat abusive though, because they weren't allowed to have any social life whatsoever. They're 12 and 14 and are just now allowed to socialize with their friends.There was enough to have the kids taken away even without physical abuse. I could write a book on all the things that went on.
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#19 Old 10-02-2014, 04:25 PM
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Sometimes it pays to glance at the url before bothering to visit sites.
"chocolatecoveredkatie.com" pretty much guarantees its either junk food or porn (hey, this is the internet)
I was disappointed when it turned out to be junk food...
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#20 Old 10-02-2014, 04:27 PM
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Her clingyness was somewhat abusive though, because they weren't allowed to have any social life whatsoever. They're 12 and 14 and are just now allowed to socialize with their friends.
My business partner had to drive his 16-year-old granddaughter home last night. She lives eight houses down from him in a safe, quiet neighborhood. Her older brother wasn't allowed in the front yard by himself until he was 18, so I guess her parents are improving...
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#21 Old 10-03-2014, 09:04 AM
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I do see your point, but I'm not sure that the example you gave really illustrates it well (at least for me). I think a lot has to do with proportions of foods. For example, in the recipe you posted, 1/4 cup maple syrup doesn't sound like a lot to me for one 8 inch cake. The 1/3 cup cocoa butter is a bit much for my taste, but that's because I usually do more low fat baking when I bake (but that's a personal preference - I actually don't like cakes and baked good with too much fat in them so that they end up too "moist" and greasy).

I do agree with you that some recipes do seem to define "healthy" in a way that I wouldn't. For example, a lot of raw dessert recipes call for a lot of ground raw nuts/nut butter and dates (for example, a raw chocolate cake recipe might call for 2 or 3 cups of ground nuts and 1 1/2 cups of mashed dates - I'm just throwing out these amounts) which I would not consider healthy, even though nuts and dates are considered health foods by many. If I were eating an ounce of nuts and a date or two for a snack, that might not be so bad. But in large quantities, I don't consider them health foods.

Djuna
I think part of the problem is that few people can agree on what constitutes 'healthy'. Some people think the only version of healthy is fat-free. Some won't entertain the idea of any kind of sugar. Others are OK with fat and some forms of sugar, but won't touch a refined grain. I'm more in the 'everything in moderation' camp, and my definition of moderation will be different from the next persons.

I wouldn't sit and eat 2 cups of nuts in one sitting, but as you said, it is all about proportions. Let's assume the '2 cup of nuts' cake might serve 6 or 8 as a dessert - that's only about ¼-⅓ cup of nuts per serving. That's not so bad (I see nuts as a healthy food, even in that quantity) and you are at least getting vitamins & minerals that you wouldn't get in the butter/white flour alternative. And it's dessert!! I don't often have dessert, but when I do, it's a free for all - I eat whatever I want and if I can get some vitamins, minerals, protein, fibre etc at the same time, then great. If not and it's all about the refined sugar & grains, well, so be it. It won't kill me.
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#22 Old 10-08-2014, 07:40 AM
 
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I think that you want to say junk food as a healthy food. But, your statement is not acceptable for all the members of this Forum. As junk food contains many of the unhealthy constituents.
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#23 Old 12-09-2014, 08:06 PM
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I agree mark. Junk foods are never healthy rather it causes several complex health issues. There are many foods you think are good but they may not be. You have realize which foods are good and which are bad for a good health. Does anyone know that regular consumption of dark chocolates will reduce the risk of cardiovascular disease. It is true! Eating dark chocolates 5+ times per week lowers the risk of heart disease by 57%. There are many shops like Giddy Yo Yo ( http://www.giddyyoyo.com/chocolate-bars/ ) which provides chocolate bars. So it’s better start eating chocolates rather than having junk foods. Other than that, chocolate has many other health benefits including diabetes prevention, stress reduction etc.
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#24 Old 12-31-2014, 10:17 AM
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If I was looking for a cool Vegan dessert then there is nothing wrong with it, I don't think anyone posting a dessert recipe is thinking that a cheese cake or chocolate dessert is healthy or dietetic food item, or expecting people to eat it for their 3 meals a day entree.

That saying, a vegan diet is focused on eating carbohydrates, not the avoidance of them, as long as you stay low fat then high carbs is our healthy lifestyle, it is the way humans are designed, we desire carbs by nature, Maple syrup is a good carb, so CTFU.

Maple syrup is not only a healthy source of glucose that our cells need, but it is also packed with Vitamins and Minerals and hundreds of other nutrients with some found in no other food source.

'Fear not the glucose', everyone of our billions of cells live on glucose. It is the S.A.D, low carb or paleo meat-heads who have given us the ‘Sugar Fear’, shake that loose...of course refined sugar is not a good thing, nothing over refined is!

But Un-Refined sugars are loaded with phytonutrients, iron, vitamins, and minerals, such as Sucanat.
Cane sugar is simply the juice of the cane, than dried, it is packed with nutrients and a great source of iron…until it is bleached and refined to the point that it is white nothing....
Coconut blossom sugar is virtually dried nectar of coconut blossoms. The coconut blossoms are cut and tapped, the collected drips are then dried down and ground up.
Maple syrup, comes from a maple tree that is tapped and the drips of sap are concentrated and boiled down to a syrup.
Coconut blossom sugar has a low glycemic level of around 35, unrefined cane sugar is 55, compared to empty corn syrup at 95.

Remember in the world of vegan and plant-based living carbs are healthy and keep your metabolism burning hot and your brain functioning well along with all your body's cells, as long as you don't mix them with Fat. An unhealthy vegan food example is the fake meats made with highly refined soy bean concentrate, different processing than tofu, and Fat along with other bad ingredients. Any added Fat to your plant-based high-carb diet will cause all sorts of unnatural affects on your body, such as insulin resistance, a dysfunctional processing of sugar for hours after the Fat intake, inflammation, stiffening of the arterial walls, and more. Added Fat affects the body in a bad way.

When I drink my healthy 12 date/4 banana smoothie every morning, I will occasionally add some un-refined sugar or maple syrup for added sweetness and vitamins and phytonutrients, it is a good thing.

Vegan Nurse Practitioner
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#25 Old 01-06-2015, 03:49 PM
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Point above taken. Substituting maple and other "healthy" things for sugar is a good idea and should be encouraged. I use it in cooking occasionally myself. However, the amount one probably add to a smoothie in the morning doesn't mean one's getting a lot of vitamins and phytonutrients. I entered 1 oz. of maple syrup into a nutrtional data base and the amounts were so small it said zero on pretty much everything except interestingly enough calcium and potassium was 2% of RDA. I suspect the overall phytonutrient content is low as well. It's there, and it's better than white sugar for sure. Promoting it as a health food is a bit misleading because people shouldn't eat huge amounts of of it and the small amounts eaten don't amount to a whole lot compared to what else we should be eating.
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#26 Old 01-06-2015, 05:07 PM
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It's true...not all vegan food is healthy! Most is though
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