Hi - I'm new to this board although I've been vegetarian for many many years. I belong to some London veggie groups. One of the veggie groups also has a lot of vegans belonging which is great. If they arrange a meal, veggies respect them and only have vegan food. My problem is that there seems to be a huge divide between the vegans and veggies. The vegans seem to preach an awful lot and the divide seems bigger between vegans and veggies than between ve*ans and carnivores! It all becomes rather unpleasant at times. Has anyone else come across this?
Speaking only for our local Oklahoma VB group, I can say we all get along very well and there are vegans and vegetarians both. Everybody is respectful of one another and we all have a blast.
The only place I really see friction is on the internet.
I don't belong to any veg*an groups **jealous!!** but I notice it here online. I think the issue might be that vegans tend to think vegetarians are "almost there" and would be easier to convert than an omni! For me, I'm vegan and I'm happy to meet any veg*ans at all! Almost everyone I know is an omni, and I am so happy to be with anyone who doesn't eat meat! Maybe this is also because I don't know any vegans..
To answer your question about the rift between vegans and vegetarians... could it have something to do with ethical vegans not understanding why ethical vegetarians would only go partway towards a cruelty-free diet? Barring any nutritional requirements, why would an ethical vegetarian stop at abstaining from meat but continue to consume dairy or eggs? Perhaps vegans sense that it's often habit and pleasure that prevent the vegetarian from becoming vegan, and this often leads to vegan frustration.
Does this mean that the vegetarian doesn't deserve some credit for "moving in the right direction"? It should not mean that, but it seems silly to me that vegans should never point out to a vegetarian that he/she could move further towards a cruelty-free life. There are, of course, respectful ways and not so respectful ways to point this out.
Whether the vegetarian believes that, in theory, there is nothing wrong with using animals for their milk or eggs as long as they are treated well and are not killed, the reality of present-day agribusiness is that milk and eggs involve much suffering and death.
I can't say for sure, because I'm not a vegan, but I think some vegans may view vegetarians a bit like vegetarians view pescatarians. Like they've not finished what they've started. And like when omnis say they love animals, but then eat meat, maybe vegans think it's like that when we say we care but use shampoo that has been tested on animals, or eat eggs.
To answer your question about the rift between vegans and vegetarians... could it have something to do with ethical vegans not understanding why ethical vegetarians would only go partway towards a cruelty-free diet? Barring any nutritional requirements, why would an ethical vegetarian stop at abstaining from meat but continue to consume dairy or eggs? Perhaps vegans sense that it's often habit and pleasure that prevent the vegetarian from becoming vegan, and this often leads to vegan frustration.
Thanks for all your welcomes! It's good to get different views. War has often broken out on the boards I'm on causing quite a few vegetarians I know just to back off. Quite honestly, I'm not a "step" away from veganism, it's the way I want to live my life. It can get very frustrating.
Thanks for all your welcomes! It's good to get different views. War has often broken out on the boards I'm on causing quite a few vegetarians I know just to back off. Quite honestly, I'm not a "step" away from veganism, it's the way I want to live my life. It can get very frustrating.
I think the reason for one being a veg*n makes the difference in peoples' responses.
If one is a vegetarian for health reasons, that's one thing. If one is a vegetarian for ethical reasons, ethical vegans will question the eggs/dairy, because of the ethical issues with commercial dairy and eggs.
My recommendation is to not court conflict, if that's what you're trying to avoid. I mostly don't know or remember who's vegetarian or vegan on here because most people don't bring it up or if they do they're not defensive about it - it's just matter-of-fact (like, "I'm a vegetarian, what kinds of things can I order at a restaurant?" vs. something that's guaranteed to cause conflict like, "Why are vegans so damn preachy?" etc). If you look for reasons to be offended, and comment on it, and make posts about it, you will probably find and create conflict. Otherwise, mostly vegans and vegetarians can peacefully coexist here
The only potluck that I've hosted so far (we've got a second coming next month) was attended by vegetarians and vegans (and an omni or two) and we had all the food vegan so it was all inclusive. Everyone gushed over how good the food was, but I don't recall anyone lecturing anyone about anything. It was all very friendly and fun.
The only potluck that I've hosted so far (we've got a second coming next month) was attended by vegetarians and vegans (and an omni or two) and we had all the food vegan so it was all inclusive. Everyone gushed over how good the food was, but I don't recall anyone lecturing anyone about anything. It was all very friendly and fun.
Food was offered that was suitable both for vegans and for lacto-ovo-vegetarians. As opposed to an occasion that would exclude lacto-ovo-vegetarians by not offering vegetarian food.
What would you consider being all inclusive? Offering vegetarian food, food that a vegan couldn't eat? How would that be all inclusive? Wouldn't that exclude?
What strikes me is how fanatical vegans can be when I betya most of them grew up eating flesh, maybe they are just angry at themselves and then project that anger towards others.
What strikes me is how fanatical vegans can be when I betya most of them grew up eating flesh, maybe they are just angry at themselves and then project that anger towards others.
maybe, just maybe, the word 'fanatical' is subjective and depends on what ethical or political values the user of that word him/herself has. Calling something fanatical doesn't really convey that much, only that you disagree with someone's approach.
What strikes me is how fanatical vegans can be when I betya most of them grew up eating flesh, maybe they are just angry at themselves and then project that anger towards others.
maybe, just maybe, the word 'fanatical' is subjective and depends on what ethical or political values the user of that word him/herself has. Calling something fanatical doesn't really convey that much, only that you disagree with someone's approach.
another possibility, people have different opinions and there is no right or wrong.
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