Is soy bad for you? - VeggieBoards
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#1 Old 09-06-2007, 04:11 PM
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My daughter came home from soccer practice tonight and asked me if soy was bad for you. she told me one of the girls there told her it was very bad for you. i said no, but there are some soy products that are. i dont know what to say next! i did a quick Google search for "soy is bad" and LOTS of sites came up. how would you answer this if your child asked?
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#2 Old 09-06-2007, 04:12 PM
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I would say for the most part it is bad and not something you should base your diet around, but if you eat a little bit of it here and there, like most things, its ok.



There is always debate about this but Ive read too many terrible things about it to eat it much anymore.
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#3 Old 09-06-2007, 04:28 PM
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Moderation is the key.



Plus, I think you got it right, that some are more troublesome than others. Less processed items are better, for example.

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#4 Old 09-06-2007, 04:31 PM
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Everything in moderation. I would also look long and hard at the sources claiming soy is so terrible. Many (most?) of them will lead back to dairy groups.
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#5 Old 09-06-2007, 07:51 PM
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The soy bean itself is fine but then like so many other things to be marketed it gets the hell processed out of it...and that is probably what the problem is so yea I've been weaning most, not all but most processed forms of it out of my diet and just eating veggie...
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#6 Old 09-06-2007, 07:56 PM
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I'd tell her that like with most things, you have to eat in moderation. Most foods eaten in excess are bad for you, I'm sure if people ate tons of dark leafy greens like they do soy, sugar, etc. we'd discover that they're bad in excess.
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#7 Old 09-06-2007, 07:56 PM
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I have questions about soy, too. Is soy milk bad? What about a cereal like Kashi Go Lean with fiber twigs and soy grahams?
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#8 Old 09-06-2007, 08:17 PM
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You don't want to overdo the isoflavones, that's about it.



I love how the meat industry has done everything they can to convince people to not eat meat.
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#9 Old 09-06-2007, 08:20 PM
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I don't understand the second sentence. Did you mean "not to eat soy"?
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#10 Old 09-06-2007, 08:22 PM
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i drink atleast 2 cups of soy milk a day, and some of those days i have a pretty big serving of tofu in addition. I think I am fine. I stay away from all processed soy stuff, which I think may be that bad part. mmmmm soy. Soy is my friend.
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#11 Old 09-06-2007, 08:28 PM
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Is there any real hardcore clinical evidence that soy is bad for you? Ive heard all the Internet factoids which have been floating around for years, but Ive never seen anything based on legitimate peer-reviewed research. Is there any? Personally, I eat soybeans until theyre coming out of my ears, and I havent noticed any unseemly effects.
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#12 Old 09-06-2007, 08:38 PM
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I recently had a friend confront me saying soy was evil not that long ago. I actually have a thread about it in the General Health forum.



What I uncovered was basically that the sources for most of the anti-soy propaganda is incredible. A doctor trying to sell his book, some bodybuilding websites, and sites dedicated to smearing soy are usually based out of New Zealand... New Zealand is a country whose economy revolves around the exporting of BEEF! Also like someone else said, I imagine some are funded by dairy groups.



And yes, as some of you might have noticed from previous posts... one of my favorite words is "Propaganda"
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#13 Old 09-06-2007, 09:19 PM
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ive never bought the "evil soy" arguement either.

however, besides possible tummy issues, which could be possible w/ ANY food... the only other research that i take as possibly credible, is the effect of soy on breast cancer and people at very high risk.

and i think it is also important to look at the effect on the estrogen/ menopause link...but moreso to see the EFFECT...not neccessarily the DETRIMENTAL effect.

just my opinion.



but like others have said... everything in moderation. (except meat! lol
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#14 Old 09-06-2007, 09:37 PM
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I think soy is just fine in moderation. I like to drink soy milk, in fact, I rely on it as a source of vitamin B-12. I do also make nut milks from time to time, just for variety. And I LOVE tofu! As for vegan alternates to meats, cheeses, etc...I try to buy the non-soy options whenever possible. For instance, I buy vegan rice cheese, Rice Divine vegan ice cream (it's YUM), veggie-type gardenburgers or black bean burgers rather than the soy burger, etc. I do eat soy yogurt because I really like the taste and texture and haven't found a different version as of yet.



I think it could be possible to overdo soy as a vegetarian if you depend too much on processed food, but if most of your meals are centered around veggies, beans, whole grains, and fruit, then a soy product thrown in here and there certainly won't do any harm!

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#15 Old 09-06-2007, 09:47 PM
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I'm highly suspicious of all the "Soy is evil" stuff out there.



Of course, I believe that everything is best in moderation, but I'm addicted to soy lattes, and I haven't grown a third arm yet.
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#16 Old 09-06-2007, 10:12 PM
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When I told my boss that my kid loves soy milk he told me it causes A.D.D. and autism in children.... Hmmm, I will have to look into it further but will probably mix up the soy milk with some rice and nut milks too, which are also tasty.
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#17 Old 09-06-2007, 10:47 PM
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i would be interested to see how much isoflavones or 'evil soy points" are in each soy product.

as someone mentioned earlier, the least processed, the better (ie: edamame is good)



but soy milk isnt very processed right?

and if soy caused ADD... ;how is it that every child who eats crap also has ADD?



there was, coincidentally, a recent article about childrens lack of vit. d (b/c of unhealthy diets, full of fat and sugar) leading to learning difficulties. see if i can find it...
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#18 Old 09-06-2007, 10:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brianetics View Post

When I told my boss that my kid loves soy milk he told me it causes A.D.D. and autism in children.... Hmmm, I will have to look into it further but will probably mix up the soy milk with some rice and nut milks too, which are also tasty.

you boss is confused. There are theories out there linking DAIRY milk to ADD and Autism, not soy milk. I haven't done a lot of research on this, so I don't know if these theories have any scientific backing, but there are a lot of web sites out there describing dairy's impact on ADD and Autism.
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#19 Old 09-06-2007, 11:07 PM
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Originally Posted by starseed13 View Post

I would say for the most part it is bad and not something you should base your diet around...



You could say that to your child if they asked. But you would be wrong, and misinforming your child.



As others here, and other places, have discovered, the "facts" are: - the "anti-soy" hype and supposed "research" is backed BY THE MEAT INDUSTRY! It's propaganda, pure and simple.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Washoe View Post

Is there any real hardcore clinical evidence that soy is bad for you? Ive heard all the Internet factoids which have been floating around for years, but Ive never seen anything based on legitimate peer-reviewed research. Is there any?



My point exactly. I have asked this question many times and never had it answered satisfactorily. Any "study" that I've seen done is flawed by the very fact that they're funded by meat and dairy producers.



And no, soy definitely does NOT cause ADD or autism. There ARE actual, real, legitimate studies proving that milk and dairy can add to it or make the symptoms worse however.
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#20 Old 09-06-2007, 11:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Tofu-N-Sprouts View Post

You could say that to your child if they asked. But you would be wrong, and misinforming your child.



As others here, and other places, have discovered, the "facts" are: - the "anti-soy" hype and supposed "research" is backed BY THE MEAT INDUSTRY! It's propaganda, pure and simple.







My point exactly. I have asked this question many times and never had it answered satisfactorily. Any "study" that I've seen done is flawed by the very fact that they're funded by meat and dairy producers.



And no, soy definitely does NOT cause ADD or autism. There ARE actual, real, legitimate studies proving that milk and dairy can add to it or make the symptoms worse however.



One thing I noticed about a lot of the anti-soy propaganda is that it usually claims soy causes some of the very things soy has been proven to help prevent.... how... creative
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#21 Old 09-06-2007, 11:42 PM
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As someone already said in this thread, the soy bean is fine... it is the way it is produced. People who just blatantly go "soy is bad!" are most likely fervent meat enthusiasts who don't like to hear about veg*ns and have once picked up a word here or there that there indeed exists soy that is bad for you, and base their entire anti-soy moral around that. Sigh... If only the horrible information about meat and dairy would stick with those people...



Read this article if you want a good and clear answer on this; http://www.deliciousorganics.com/Controversies/soy.htm



Having said this, I do not eat too much soy products, I do not really like eating fake meats or tofu, tempeh, etc. in my cooking, I prefer working with fresh fruits, vegetables and legumes, I think this is the healthiest.

I do like occassional soy ice cream or a soy desert though! Rawr
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#22 Old 09-06-2007, 11:44 PM
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I eat tofu about 3 or 4 times a week. Usually I just add a small amount to something like a salad. I don't eat huge hunks. I drink soy milk about 2 or 3 times a week. I dont' have any weird health problems from it. I'd say I eat a pretty good amount of soy products too.



I gotta have my tofu.
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#23 Old 09-07-2007, 12:31 AM
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Originally Posted by missmushroom View Post

i drink atleast 2 cups of soy milk a day, and some of those days i have a pretty big serving of tofu in addition. I think I am fine. I stay away from all processed soy stuff, which I think may be that bad part. mmmmm soy. Soy is my friend.



Hmm...well I hope thats right, but I just wanted to point out that it seems you are quite young {if that is you in your avatar?}, and you dont know what you may be doing to yourself. Its quite possible you could be creating some kinda imbalance down the road. Its my understanding that tofu, soymilk are unfermented soy, and unfermented soy is the bad stuff, not neccessarily just textured vegetable protein.



Im not saying that to be mean or scary or negative, just that we dont know. I mean plenty of people smoke and "feel fine" at the time, til one day things are screwed.



Im really not trying to sound like an anti soy campaign. I just got scared off it after reading so much terrible stuff. I hate it, I never know who to believe. Ive kinda gotten used to not eating it now though.
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#24 Old 09-07-2007, 12:37 AM
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Originally Posted by Tofu-N-Sprouts View Post

You could say that to your child if they asked. But you would be wrong, and misinforming your child.



As others here, and other places, have discovered, the "facts" are: - the "anti-soy" hype and supposed "research" is backed BY THE MEAT INDUSTRY! It's propaganda, pure and simple.









How do you know this? I am not saying you are wrong, I just dont understand how you know FOR SURE. Please explain. Are you saying you have personally researched every single study of soy and proven it to all be crap? Sorry I dont mean to sound confrontational, Im genuinly asking. This issue has driven me crazy. I said the same things as you for so long, but I kept reading study after study and decided it was possible for either side to be right, but I didnt want to take the risk with my health {I have a LOT of health problems Im working on}. Even if it may be ok for you, its not like I HAVE to have it.



Please explain more..? This is driving me crazy..Ive heard so many times that it was the unfermented soy that was bad, as in the plain soybean, tofu, soymilk. But that fermented soy like tempeh was okay because the bad stuff was neutralized. Now people are saying its the processing that makes it bad???
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#25 Old 09-07-2007, 07:27 PM
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Ultimately everyone has to decide for themselves.



For every article and fact I quote, there is a counter-quote out there you could find, I'm sure.



There's a lot of "facts" on the internet. But the supposed "research" that is most readily available is sponsored and conducted by dairy and meat-producing and owned companies and their employees. That's the deciding factor for me.



You said you've read "study after study"... evidently we've read different studies. Yes, I agree there are many thousands of sites promoting the evils of soy - any soy, fermented, raw, processed, etc... Most of those sites are simply copying information from other sites (notice they all use the exact same wording or language?) and the ones where actual research is done? That's where you have to go to the source - WHO did the research? WHO funded it? WHY did they do it? HOW was it done? etc. etc. etc...



Try searching for the "health benefits of red meat". You'll get just as many "researched" articles. Look up "healthy dairy products" or something similar, thousands of hits!!



Far, far more of those type articles than those promoting a vegan diet. Makes ya wonder, huh?
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#26 Old 09-08-2007, 05:08 AM
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I really don't think it's fair to dismiss ALL of the soy studies that have shown some negative effects. Many many many universities have done studies on various aspects of soy..thyroid conditions, menopause, heart disease, early maturation, etc. Check out just a quick sample from a Google search. To say that they are all meat/dairy industry funded is just silly.

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#27 Old 09-08-2007, 03:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Washoe View Post

I don't understand the second sentence. Did you mean "not to eat soy"?



No, I meant that the meat industry tries to spread misinformation so that people will fear soy. Jerks.



At any rate, I just meant that you don't want to eat soy products that are high in isoflavones all the time.
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#28 Old 09-08-2007, 03:39 PM
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Originally Posted by LucidAnne View Post

i would be interested to see how much isoflavones or 'evil soy points" are in each soy product.

as someone mentioned earlier, the least processed, the better (ie: edamame is good)



Dang, I just tossed a mag that listed a bunch of products and how much they contained. From what I remembered it said most products list the amount, and things like gardenburgers, tofu, and other steak/chicken vegan type products were all really low. What contained a lot of isoflavones were products like supplement drinks that had soy in them, a staggering amount from what I recall.
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#29 Old 09-08-2007, 03:45 PM
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If soy is bad for you, I'll be dead in 10 minutes.



*10 minutes later*



*dead*



Really though, there have been many studies and they all show different results. Soy was linked to breast cancer (as was grapefruit), but nothing has been proven. Every day there is a new study about something that disproves the study from the day before. Moderation is the key. Nothing is good in high amounts. Soy does have it's benefits though! I've read over and over that soy milk and beans help your heart.



And yes, I think the meat industry is behind every bad study of veggie food.... damn those people!
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#30 Old 09-08-2007, 03:54 PM
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It's interesting how many "studies" there are about how bad soy is for you in such detail, and somehow it's really hard to find the "studies" about meat and all the antibiotics, hormones and pesticides people are eating. It's just so transparent and annoying. Meat eaters are always so quick to say soy is bad, but it's like hello, do you know how toxic your steak is.
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