What do vegetarians think about what vegans think about them - VeggieBoards
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#1 Old 03-09-2006, 02:50 PM
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For non-vegan vegetarians, how do you perceive vegans to feel about you, and what are your reactions/responses/thoughts about that perception?
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#2 Old 03-09-2006, 03:07 PM
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Personally I don't think they look down on vegetarians at all. If anything alot of vegans probably encourage vegetarians to remain a vegetarian and take small steps towards veganism.
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#3 Old 03-09-2006, 03:09 PM
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I'm a strict vegetarian, trying to become vegan, etc. I know all the reasons why I should be vegan and I'm trying to overcome my own selfish needs and laziness to be vegan. . . . and I usually take the 'vegan side' because I know they are right. And everytime there is an debate on the subject I look at what the 'vegans' say and what the 'vegetarians' say and it's the vegetarians who usually make it a mudslinging contest.



And everything I read by the vegans makes it easier for me to go vegan, so I find them very encouraging.



I spend time with a lot of the 'so called' militant vegans or the vegan police or whatever you want to call it and not once have I felt looked down or anything else negative.
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#4 Old 03-09-2006, 03:09 PM
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When I was still LO vegetarian I used to feel very judged by vegans. I felt hurt that they seemed to feel I was not helping animals, when I thought I was doing an awful lot compared to when I was an omnivore. It was not easy for me to become a vegetarian, with my severely limited diet, and I felt overwhelmed at the prospect of eliminating dairy from my diet.



But as I came to learn about the dairy and egg industries (I honestly had no clue until I came to VB) I came to understand why vegans are so vehemently against consuming those animal products, and I realized that it wasn't ME that they had a problem with, it was my support of those industries. I realized that supporting those industries DOES cause harm, no matter what way I looked at it.



It hurt a lot when I learned about the pain and horror those animals endure, and at first I blamed vegans for being mean to me. But I soon realized that it wasn't anyone else's responsibility to shield me from it and pat me on the back for supporting those industries. I definitely don't think people should go around slagging on LO vegetarians, as it's counterproductive, but I also think that we ALL need to take responsibility for our own feelings. You know, don't shoot the messenger, that sort of thing.



I decided I had to eliminate dairy from my diet (eggs were not much of an issue) and I am thankful for the support of vegans who helped me with my transition. Ironically, my biggest supporter was a former VB poster who others here often accused of being militant.



She never judged me; she judged the anima l abusing industries, and that's the same way I feel now about vegetarians. I don't judge them. But I will never mince words about the horrors of the dairy and egg industries because I do judge those.
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#5 Old 03-09-2006, 03:10 PM
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Is this thread limited to finding out what vegetarians think vegans think of vegetarians, or can it also cover what vegans think about what vegetarians think vegans think of vegetarians?

"and I stand

upon a mountain

made of weak and useless men"

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#6 Old 03-09-2006, 03:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sevenseas View Post

Is this thread limited to finding out what vegetarians think vegans think of vegetarians, or can it also cover what vegans think about what vegetarians think vegans think of vegetarians?



ummmmm...yes?



i might be a little confused. but i think any feelings anyone wants to share should be fine... i can't see why not. anyone?
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#7 Old 03-09-2006, 03:41 PM
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As a recent convert from L/O to vegan I can say I never felt personally judged as a vegetarian. I always thought vegans were the ideal that I wanted to be but for some reason was too scared and selfish to try. Maybe because I looked up to them and didn't feel in competition with them is the reason why I really listened to them talk about dairy and eggs with an open mind.

Alot of the 'militant' vegans around here are the reason I am vegan today!
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#8 Old 03-09-2006, 03:41 PM
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I didn't actually follow what Sevens said . . .
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#9 Old 03-09-2006, 03:43 PM
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Just ignore sevenseas. That's what I do.
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#10 Old 03-09-2006, 03:44 PM
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I meant the perception vegans have of the vegetarian perception of vegans' perception of vegetarians.

"and I stand

upon a mountain

made of weak and useless men"

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#11 Old 03-09-2006, 03:56 PM
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I don't think the opinions vegans hold of me or my eating habits is important; just as I don't think the opinions meat-eaters hold of me or my eating is important. Not an insult; just a fact.
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#12 Old 03-09-2006, 03:56 PM
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I meant the perception vegans have of the vegetarian perception of vegans' perception of vegetarians.



So what vegans think vegetarians think vegans think of them (vegetarians)?



So, like, I could say: "It seems to me that vegetarians feel looked down upon by vegans. My perception is that that probably isn't often the case in the way that vegetarians may perceive it to be. Rather it is often certain products and the practices they represent that are judged. I feel like it's too bad that vegetarians feel as though vegans are judging them personally, rather than criticizing certain consumer habits. Part of the reason I regret this is because the personal comfort levels being tested and defensiveness or upset it causes takes the focus away from the logical reasons vegans criticize the specific inustries, practices and products they do" ? (Uhh...so if can say that, well consider it said).





Or, maybe you're just messing with us to tie our brains into knots, Sevenseas. In which case, I am judging you to be a very very bad person.
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#13 Old 03-09-2006, 04:05 PM
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Originally Posted by lilac wine View Post

Or, maybe you're just messing with us to tie our brains into knots, Sevenseas. In which case, I am judging you to be a very very bad person.





Sevens, messing with us . . nah
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#14 Old 03-09-2006, 04:17 PM
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I feel sad that as humans we are destined to squabble and fight amongst each other even when we all appear to be on the same side.



I feel sad that in a society or community of people that some will assume they are on top and better than others. Those that think they are on top will try to berate the ones they feel are inferior but in reality all they do is show their true colors.



I think I will take a break from this board for awhile. I feel good in my daily life about being a vegetarian until I come to this board. Then I feel like a second class vegizen I have no interest in feeling that way. I have no interest in seeing others that choose to be like me be told that they have others do murdering for them or that I have some kind of latent guilt problem by those who think they wear some form of halo or deserve to be worshiped because they are an all perfect vegan who probably sneaks cheese when no one is looking. At least those that call themselves something other than vegan are honest enough to admit they still consume or use some kind of animal product. I suspect the vegans who sling the most insults are the ones who have the most to hide behind that computer screen and the vegans who are tolerant and let others live in peace the way they want are the strictest. I also find it ironic that those same insult slinging vegans would not want to be stuffed in the militant hate mongering category for simply labeling themselves vegan feel fine about stuffing anyone that happens to call themselves vegetarian into the cruelty monger category.



Vegan does not make you perfect Sorry to burst anyones self loving bubble.
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#15 Old 03-09-2006, 04:24 PM
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Wow, and you call vegans judgemental?
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#16 Old 03-09-2006, 04:24 PM
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Originally Posted by arlina1 View Post

I feel sad that as humans we are destined to squabble and fight amongst each other even when we all appear to be on the same side.



I feel sad that in a society or community of people that some will assume they are on top and better than others. Those that think they are on top will try to berate the ones they feel are inferior but in reality all they do is show their true colors.



I think I will take a break from this board for awhile. I feel good in my daily life about being a vegetarian until I come to this board. Then I feel like a second class vegizen I have no interest in feeling that way. I have no interest in seeing others that choose to be like me be told that they have others do murdering for them or that I have some kind of latent guilt problem by those who think they wear some form of halo or deserve to be worshiped because they are an all perfect vegan who probably sneaks cheese when no one is looking. At least those that call themselves something other than vegan are honest enough to admit they still consume or use some kind of animal product. I suspect the vegans who sling the most insults are the ones who have the most to hide behind that computer screen and the vegans who are tolerant and let others live in peace they way they want are the strictest. I also find it ironic that those same insult slinging vegans would not want to be stuffed in the militant hate mongering category for simply labeling themselves vegan feel fine about stuffing anyone that happens to call themselves vegetarian into the cruelty monger category.



Vegan does not make you perfect Sorry to burst anyones self loving bubble.





Wow. I feel sad that people are so extremely sensitive that they read into things that aren't there.



I find it sad that people can't take the truth when it's told to them and instead respond to facts by calling others militant and hate mongering.



I find it sad that some people assume that others call themselves perfect when no one here in fact has.
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#17 Old 03-09-2006, 04:26 PM
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I'm vegan. For the most part, any vegetarians that I have meant claim that "it is just too hard to be vegan." So for the most part, it seems that some vegetarians aren't willing to take the next step simply because they like the taste of dairy products.



I don't have any problems with vegetarians. I was one myself until I became vegan. All I can say is -- do the best you can and don't feel intimidated by others who seem to be "doing more than you are"
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#18 Old 03-09-2006, 04:47 PM
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Originally Posted by heabrook View Post

I don't have any problems with vegetarians. I was one myself until I became vegan. All I can say is -- do the best you can and don't feel intimidated by others who seem to be "doing more than you are"



You automatically assume and sling the insult with no thought that vegans do more than me because I am a vegetarian. Taking a potshot at a fellow veggie has become so common place and accepted on this board that some people I think don't even realize they do it. The whole point IS assumption. You have no idea what I do in my daily life, what I give in time and money so please don't assume that because someone is vegan that they "do more than me" like just by being vegan it makes them magically better than all us stupid vegetarians and g forbid the unenlightened omni's. They should probably be shot.
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#19 Old 03-09-2006, 04:54 PM
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Uhhh... ??? Arlina, take a chill pill! I didn't assume anything...



You might want to re-read what I said.. I never said vegans do more than vegetarians. I said do the best you can and don't feel intimated by others who seem to be "doing more than you are"

Note the " " meaning it may seem they are doing more than you are, but they aren't, so just do the best you can.



Jeez...
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#20 Old 03-09-2006, 04:55 PM
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Originally Posted by arlina1 View Post

You automatically assume and sling the insult with no thought that vegans do more than me because I am a vegetarian. Taking a potshot at a fellow veggie has become so common place and accepted on this board that some people I think don't even realize they do it. The whole point IS assumption. You have no idea what I do in my daily life, what I give in time and money so please don't assume that because someone is vegan that they "do more than me" like just by being vegan it makes them magically better than all us stupid vegetarians and g forbid the unenlightened omni's. They should probably be shot.



OMG! Arlina, I don't even understand how you can have a problem with heabrook's post:



Quote:
I don't have any problems with vegetarians. I was one myself until I became vegan. All I can say is -- do the best you can and don't feel intimidated by others who seem to be "doing more than you are"





There were no assumptions or finger pointing in that. And - nice going "they should probably be shot". Now I really know you're nuts.
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#21 Old 03-09-2006, 04:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Alfiedog View Post

Wow. I feel sad that people are so extremely sensitive that they read into things that aren't there.



I am not sensitive I am just sick of the digs, shots, slings, and sometimes just outright cruelty that goes on all around this board from vegans to vegetarians. Sorry but it happens. Just because you wear rosy glasses while reading is not my problem. If you don't want vegetarians in your sight then go to another board.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Alfiedog View Post

I find it sad that people can't take the truth when it's told to them and instead respond to facts by calling others militant and hate mongering.



This is barely worth responding to because I never once called anyone militant or a hate monger. Re-read then re-comment. What I DID say was that some vegans who would NOT WANT to be stuffed into the monger catagory have no problem stuffing others there.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Alfiedog View Post

I find it sad that some people assume that others call themselves perfect when no one here in fact has.



Oh really?? No one wears a halo here I guess. Sorry for saying what many are thinking. Are you talking about the whole board or just this topic? If you are talking about the whole board you might want to take that back. As far as this topic no I don't see any angels here.
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#22 Old 03-09-2006, 04:57 PM
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Alfie isn't vegan.
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#23 Old 03-09-2006, 04:58 PM
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Uhhh... ??? Arlina, take a chill pill! I didn't assume anything...



You might want to re-read what I said.. I never said vegans do more than vegetarians. I said do the best you can and don't feel intimated by others who seem to be "doing more than you are"

Note the " " meaning it may seem they are doing more than you are, but they aren't, so just do the best you can.



Jeez...
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#24 Old 03-09-2006, 05:06 PM
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I am not sensitive I am just sick of the digs, shots, slings, and sometimes just outright cruelty that goes on all around this board from vegans to vegetarians. Sorry but it happens. Just because you wear rosy glasses while reading is not my problem. If you don't want vegetarians in your sight then go to another board.



You are being really ultra sensitive. This was a perfectly reasonable conversation until you went basically went off.





Quote:
This is barely worth responding to because I never once called anyone militant or a hate monger. Re-read then re-comment. What I DID say was that some vegans who would NOT WANT to be stuffed into the monger catagory have no problem stuffing others there.



You did imply that there are vegans that are militant and hate mongering.



Quote:
Oh really?? No one wears a halo here I guess. Sorry for saying what many are thinking. Are you talking about the whole board or just this topic? If you are talking about the whole board you might want to take that back. As far as this topic no I don't see any angels here.



You show me one place where someone has said that they are perfect. Just one.
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#25 Old 03-09-2006, 05:09 PM
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Honestly, vegan or vegetarian -- we're just people trying to do what we think is best. Besides, we are all on our own path doing what we believe we should be doing at that given point in time.



Arlina: I suggest you calm down and rethink who is doing the judging -- because it seems that it's only you.
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#26 Old 03-09-2006, 05:14 PM
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It is easy to call someone nuts to dismiss a point they bring up. I never said anything remotely close to thinking vegans "do more than me" so what else could it be but a shot, I will give it a 10 for being subtle though.



I would love to contine this pointless posting but I must go be a bad vegetarian and take my step son to his baseball game where I believe the ball is covered in leather is it not? Feel free to boast in my absence.
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#27 Old 03-09-2006, 05:15 PM
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My take.....



If you're ethical in some way, then it's all good.



If you're a health veg*n, then you're a bloody joke that has its own laughable punch line.
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#28 Old 03-09-2006, 05:15 PM
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Ahhmm.. So you are calling me a liar? that's not the best way to make friends. But after all, you don't seem like you are wanting to make friends.





This is the last time I'll say this, I never directly said that vegans do more than vegetarians. I said don't worry if it "SEEMS" like they "MAY be doing more"

Apparently, the " " just don't mean the same on here as when people do the little gesture in person.
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#29 Old 03-09-2006, 05:21 PM
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(i'm vegan but i'm not going to participate in the debate)



peace people peace



one of the really great things about these boards is the annonymity



it allows people to truly express how they feel in an honest and frank manner

i absolutely love that aspect of online boards



the problem is people get so easily pissed off and offended at seemingly everything.



we should be able to have a discussion like this:



"i think you suck because ..."

"cool, well i think you suck because ..."



people get violently angry when someone even remotely says anything like that, then the personal attacks come, and flames. here's the thing though...there's millions of people in the world right now that think each one of us sucks for some reason or other. i like to hear why people think i suck. the debates can be stimulating, educational, make us examine our own motives a little closer, and in the end, may even make us slightly better people.



so just don't get all hot and bothered over everything



i'd hate to see these boards get moderated (via self-moderation or by mods) so heavily that they turn into a mirror image of many of the fake, shallow, lying-through-our-teeth, beat-around-the-bush, avoid-the-issue interactions we have to participate in in the real world.



so just don't get all hot and bothered over everything
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#30 Old 03-09-2006, 05:44 PM
 
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If you can't discuss the topic with a minimum amount of civility, then don't post here.

The ones I pity are the ones who never stick out their neck for something they believe, never know the taste of moral struggle, and never have the thrill of victory. - Jonathan Kozol
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