Veganism and Wicca? - Page 3 - VeggieBoards
Forum Jump: 
 1Likes
Reply
 
Thread Tools
#61 Old 07-15-2003, 11:59 PM
Veggie Regular
 
wild blackberry's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 431
my problem with it is just its arrogance. although there are certainly people who are attracted to wicca for shallow reasons, they are quickly in and out of it and i don't feel they're anything to worry about. as far as the original ideas behind wicca being twisted, i think that the religion has grown and changed over the years as any is bound to do, and because of the nature of the religion, it is going to vary with among its followers. i consider church of christ members as christian as catholics, even though catholics came first. it just frustrates to see people judging others in such a callous way regardless of the situation.
wild blackberry is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
#62 Old 07-16-2003, 12:03 AM
Veggie Regular
 
Kreeli's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 4,049
sigh. i suppose it's just a difference of opinion, then, wild blackberry. what's great about the 'net is, if you don't like something you see, you can just surf away.
Kreeli is offline  
#63 Old 07-16-2003, 01:38 PM
Veggie Regular
 
Seusomon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 927
Quote:
Originally posted by wild blackberry

my problem with it is just its arrogance. <snip> it just frustrates to see people judging others in such a callous way regardless of the situation.



I agree with you. It's arrogant, mean-spirited, and filled with stereotyping. If the only way someone has to express their opinion or share their information is by relentlessly insulting a whole group of people, they don't impress me, regardless of whether I agree with their opinions or not. We need more religious tolerance in this world, not less, and this site is a step in the wrong direction.



As for the historical tidbits he weaves into his rants, these are all old news - and his treatment of them is not at all thoughtful. There are legitimate reasons for modern Pagans to identify with their pre-Christian antecedents, even in the absence of an unbroken tradition of practice, for example. But there is no serious reflection on these questions at this site. He just sets up a mean stereotype, asserts repeatedly that it describes everyone who might disagree with him, and then piles the scorn and contempt on.



It's juvenile flame-baiting, seems to me.
Seusomon is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
#64 Old 07-16-2003, 02:35 PM
Veggie Regular
 
monkeyandbunny's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,133
Quote:
Originally posted by wild blackberry

i consider church of christ members as christian as catholics, even though catholics came first. it just frustrates to see people judging others in such a callous way regardless of the situation.



Orthodoxy came first then the schism which divided the church into the Church of Constantinople (Eastern Orthodoxy) and the Church of Rome (Roman Catholic)
monkeyandbunny is offline  
#65 Old 07-16-2003, 02:42 PM
Veggie Regular
 
wild blackberry's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 431
I think those are great points, Seusomon.



And regardless of the history of Catholicism, I'm sure you agree that Catholicism came before Church of Christ, hmm?
wild blackberry is offline  
#66 Old 07-16-2003, 07:44 PM
Veggie Regular
 
shewolf's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 2,541
I have read respected sources that say pagan traditions have never fully been wiped out... they were incorporated into Christian rituals thus never fully died out.



Here's an excerpt from something I wrote not long ago...



"In Ireland Christianity and Paganism lived side by side until the arrival of St Patrick in 448, who established Christianity as the official religion. Yet the Normans invaded Ireland sometime in the 1100s because they were Christian only in name, Pagans in fact (Jones and Pennick, 1995: 130). In Ireland, Wales, Scotland and Brittany the old gods were worshipped under the guise of saints, and in Brittany old women kept shrines to teach shamanistic practices to young women until the seventeenth century (Jones and Pennick, 1995: 104-105). In the nineteenth century places were spoken of as shrines of goddesses and gods, and in the twentieth century Pagan observances continued in Celtic countries (Jones and Pennick, 1995: 106-108)."



So there is a very good argument for the continuation of old pagan to modern pagan... but just as all religions evolve so has paganism. What's so wrong with that?
shewolf is offline  
#67 Old 07-16-2003, 07:47 PM
Veggie Regular
 
shewolf's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 2,541
Oh, hang on, there's more.



"In about 785, the Frankish monarch Charlemagne instituted the death penalty for Pagans who refused baptism and conversion (Jones and Pennick, 1995: 127). Yet the Saxons remained stubbornly Pagan. There was intense conflict between Pagans and Christians between 700 and 800 (Jones and Pennick, 1995: 131). In the north, Iceland adopted Christianity as its official religion in 1000 due to a bribe (Jones and Pennick, 1995: 135), and Sweden practiced Paganism openly until 1120 when a Christian Norwegian king declared a crusade against Pagans south of Sweden. The Swedes were the last to adopt official Christianity (Jones and Pennick, 1995: 137)... The period of 950-1350 saw militant monotheism (Christianity and Islam) imposing influence on leaders. However Pagan practices and beliefs continued unnoticed in some areas, and were being incorporated into Christian practices. Islam remained militantly anti-Pagan (Jones and Pennick, 1995: 196). The Protestant Reformation of the early sixteenth century rejected many of the compromises the Church had made with Paganism (Jones and Pennick, 1995: 203), and Protestants attacked many of the old Pagan practices. However the Renaissance saw a revival of Pagan beliefs (Jones and Pennick, 1995: 200). Although the hunting of witches was widespread between 1480 and 1650, only the fringes of Europe saw the Witch-Hunts attacking Pagan magic (Jones and Pennick, 1995: 205). Only women were considered weak and stupid enough to sell their souls in return for no real benefit, which is the reason women were targeted over men (Jones and Pennick, 1995: 205). The Witch-Hunts do not seem to be an attempt to weed out Paganism, rather they focus on devil-worship. Paganism steadily revived during the Age of Reason, and Druidism became known nationally in Britain in 1792 (Jones and Pennick, 1995: 210). Some esoteric movements claim an unbroken continuity, but that is hard to prove or disprove due to the lack of documentation (Jones and Pennick, 1995: 211)."



Can't prove it, can't disprove it... LOL
shewolf is offline  
#68 Old 07-16-2003, 08:42 PM
Newbie
 
GhostUser's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 0
Here's another site on Wicca, from a Wiccan, that offers thoughtful criticism and an honest assessment of Wicca (imo).



http://wicca.timerift.net/index.html



I'm also vegan and Wiccan, and while they go hand in hand for me, most religious or spiritual people do not make the connection. I've had a few other pagans label me extremist and on one occasion tell me that I was going against the natural law and cycle of life by not consuming animal products. I didn't even know where to start with that one . . .
GhostUser is offline  
#69 Old 07-16-2003, 08:58 PM
Veggie Regular
 
shewolf's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 2,541
Olive, that's easy, ask them if mass agriculture is really that natural. If feeding pigs, chickens and cows hormones and antibiotics is natural. If not slaughtering our own food but instead purchasing it in neat little vacuum packs completely removed from the animal and not offering the animal any respect is natural.



Mass agriculture is incredibly unnatural and most pagans are fooling themselves into believing it's okay because we're "meant" to eat meat. The lack of respect shown to animals in our society is NOT okay. Start there.
shewolf is offline  
#70 Old 10-14-2008, 05:39 PM
Newbie
 
justinthehippie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 9
Quote:
Originally Posted by MoonDansyr View Post

"And ye harm none" is the wiccan rede.



This is somewhat correct, but incorrect. It, first of all, is not the complete Wiccan Rede. Second off, that line goes: "An it harm none, do as ye will".



I'm sorry if I come off as rude, I just don't like when people twist my spiritual path and it's tenets into something that it is most definitely NOT.
justinthehippie is offline  
#71 Old 10-14-2008, 05:40 PM
Newbie
 
justinthehippie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 9
Quote:
Originally Posted by olive View Post

...



I'm also vegan and Wiccan, and while they go hand in hand for me, most religious or spiritual people do not make the connection. I've had a few other pagans label me extremist and on one occasion tell me that I was going against the natural law and cycle of life by not consuming animal products. I didn't even know where to start with that one . . .







AMEN. I face the exact same problems.
justinthehippie is offline  
#72 Old 10-14-2008, 06:05 PM
Veggie Regular
 
froggythefrog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 9,260
Holy ancient thread, Batman! It's cool when people find something interesting on these boards.



Welcome, JustinTheHippie.
froggythefrog is offline  
#73 Old 10-15-2008, 06:27 AM
Veggie Regular
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 982
Quote:
Originally Posted by automaton View Post

On the subject on linking vegetarianism with religion:

Last week I was looking at this bible site where they warn their flock against vegetarianism. Quote "Are Vegetarian Diets

Worse Than Terrorists? Yes! History is beginning to show the deadly results." and "Vegetarianism is a religion which is falsely disguised as a health way of eating. True vegetarianism is the worship of animals."



WTF?

After reading it I couldn't decide whether to bang my head on the keyboard or just shake it. I did both.



Yeah, because its downright eViL to care about animals.
earthwhispers is offline  
#74 Old 10-15-2008, 08:51 AM
Veggie Regular
 
Lentil Burger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 857
Quote:
Originally Posted by stellar26 View Post


He told me that his doctor said that real vegans practice 'witchcraft' and are Wiccan.

Nonsense. Everyone knows that Wicca is only for hormonal teenage girls, and therefore if the doctor's statement was true, only hormonal teenage girls could be vegans.



Lentil Burger is offline  
#75 Old 10-15-2008, 09:12 AM
Veggie Regular
 
theatrelife101's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 352
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lentil Burger View Post

Nonsense. Everyone knows that Wicca is only for hormonal teenage girls, and therefore if the doctor's statement was true, only hormonal teenage girls could be vegans.






I hope you were being sarcastic about the "Everyone knows that Wicca is only for hormonal teenage girls"

I know you were sarcastic about the vegan part.





I am a Pagan who closely follows the Wiccan path, but not exactly.

I believe being a vegetarian has become a big part of my spirituality because I believe in respecting Earth and all of its creatures.

Sometimes I believe that very religious people who eat meat are hypocrites.

(and I don't only mean my religion).



but yeah, I believe all Wiccans SHOULD be vegetarian/vegan (not that I would force it on anyone else, its just a personal belief and I would help guide others if asked but never force)

but that doesn't mean all vegetarians/vegans are Wiccan lol
theatrelife101 is offline  
#76 Old 10-15-2008, 09:24 AM
Veggie Regular
 
Lentil Burger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 857
Quote:
Originally Posted by theatrelife101 View Post

I hope you were being sarcastic about the "Everyone knows that Wicca is only for hormonal teenage girls"

Lentil Burger is offline  
#77 Old 10-15-2008, 09:31 AM
Veggie Regular
 
theatrelife101's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 352
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lentil Burger View Post




Just checking lol
theatrelife101 is offline  
#78 Old 10-15-2008, 10:10 AM
Veggie Regular
 
Gita's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Mexas
Posts: 1,610
I was into Wicca several years ago, but became disinterested in religion as a whole. From my view point, I read Wiccans as being vegetarians/ vegans due to the rede, and there are many Wiccan vegetarians. However, there are Wiccans also who see themselves as more of "hunter" types -- they of the "run through the woods naked killing deer with bare teeth kind."



The line kind of blurs because Wiccan's celebrate the birth/death cycle, and in that cycle there is the idea of passing through "death" to become something new, and so eating once living beings is not totally off the mark because then their death contributes to your life and so on. Remember (if you knew) that Wiccans believe that the body is only a container, and that your life is greater than your present life. This also extends to all animals. The deer who is killed still lives at another level, and will be re-born, so whether one kills and eats the deer is immaterial. In the same way, at death, a human being is taken up into the (big thing) and is sent back when and if that is going to happen, to be re-incarnated. The basic problem is that with reincarnation, do you really want to murder and eat an "animal" who may or may not have been your best friend in a past life? Some say it is immaterial, some say it is important.



I've asked high priestesses usually meat eaters what the deal is, and am told that it is up to the personal preference of the individual. This is also based on the rede-- I think it all comes down to whether a person thinks of an animal as a being, or as a walking food supply for his-or-herself.



So it is the same argument as non-Wiccans.
Gita is offline  
#79 Old 10-15-2008, 10:26 AM
Newbie
 
stupidhumanzz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by automaton View Post

aah.. found the link. Read it at your own risk!



http://www.biblelife.org/animal_rights.htm





ot: God, it's like watching a train wreck;I can't stop reading this website!
stupidhumanzz is offline  
#80 Old 10-15-2008, 12:46 PM
Veggie Regular
 
SomebodyElse's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: In a California Ghost Town
Posts: 7,245
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gita View Post

However, there are Wiccans also who see themselves as more of "hunter" types -- they of the "run through the woods naked killing deer with bare teeth kind."



I'd sure like to see that!

www.thesaucyvegan.com
SomebodyElse is offline  
#81 Old 10-16-2008, 04:37 AM
Newbie
 
GhostUser's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 0
Quote:
Originally Posted by stupidhumanzz View Post

ot: God, it's like watching a train wreck;I can't stop reading this website!



That's it! I'm gonna go and read it NOW! LOL
GhostUser is offline  
#82 Old 04-01-2009, 09:29 PM
Newbie
 
earthwriter's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 6
This seems like an old thread, I'm not sure, but I'm taking a chance by posting here a few years after the thread was started. I've taken a serious interest in Wicca and Earth-Based Religions and I agree that the Rede of "ye harm none" includes all walks of life, and that includes 2 and 4 legged. I read 2 wonderful articles online - 1 about the history of Native Americans and vegetarianism, written by Rita Laws, Ph.D. and another article about Pagans and Wiccans and omni diets vs. vegetarian plant-based diets, written by a Wiccan Priest, on a website, called "Starweaver", if I am remembering correctly. It's very similar to ahimsa in the Hindu-based Religions. Ahimsa means "reverence for all life". Compassion is not limited to human beings. Humans must have compassion for all walks of life and eating a light, gentle, peaceful diet is vital to this principle and belief system! I really love these 2 quotes:



“If slaughterhouses had glass walls, everyone would be a vegetarian.” -- Paul McCartney



"As long as there are slaughterhouses, there will be battlefields."

-- Leo Tolstoy
earthwriter is offline  
#83 Old 04-02-2009, 03:25 AM
Newbie
 
Chachi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 5
There are plenty of Hindus, Buddhists, and yes, of course Wiccans who don't eat meat because of their religion, but there's plenty who aren't a member of those three religions that are vegetarians. It doesn't really have anything to do with the religion, I don't believe O.o

Well, unless you are vegetarian because of the whole don't harm rule, but that doesn't mean that all vegetarians are Wiccans or vice versa.
Chachi is offline  
#84 Old 04-30-2009, 11:33 PM
Newbie
 
Birke's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 2
I am pagan and vegan. To be so is a way to protect Nature against *******s men who torture and kill innocent creatures, and also, simply respect animals, who are part of Nature, and then of Mother Earth herself.
Birke is offline  
#85 Old 11-15-2012, 02:53 AM
 
Noth Barnatan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 16

Easy... Another case of the "Normal" disease.

That doctor could have not explained the idea of Veganism, since it's too much out of his mind... Therefor he linked it to the first thing he considered to be "logical assumption" and therefor the Wicca connection.

It's the deepest root problem of humanity- The need for things to follow a pattern, and the Rapping of things to suit their own pattern (The rape is exampled here, as the doctor explained to himself the phenomena by basically raping the idea of veganism to suit something more "familiar" to his terminology base).

Also, This action tends to be loaded with prejudice- I do not know the doctors opinion of Wicca, yet you can be almost certain that he says it with a bad ring onto it... As if "Someone is doing something that for me is completely meaningless, therefor I'll explain it with something I find to know and also to not understand, but I can ridicule them both this way".

 

Humans... Such a massive degeneration and waste of potential!!!

Noth Barnatan is offline  
#86 Old 11-15-2012, 08:20 AM
Veggie Regular
 
vegan cyberpunk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Probably some airport
Posts: 1,280

OFF TOPIC but still related, because every excuse is good for good music

 



To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
https://
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
https://www.autistici.org/en/index.html  https://riseup.net/en

https://pay.reddit.com/r/privacy/wiki/index

vegan cyberpunk is offline  
#87 Old 05-31-2014, 03:27 PM
Veggie Regular
 
peacefulveglady's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Chicagoland IL area
Posts: 2,272
I been researching this and i cannot believe that one link that was shared a decade ago is still up and running , i am shaking my head how awful that person was on that page…
peacefulveglady is offline  
#88 Old 06-01-2014, 11:24 AM
Veggie Regular
 
lavender phase's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 2,644
I know wiccans that sadly eat meat and some like myself who don't .... Reading back through the posts perhaps the OP doctor who had children that were wiccan chose to stop consuming meat for the love of animals and environmental reasons .... It is up to the individual I suppose however; you may be one and not the other or both !

Animals should be loved not eaten !
peacefulveglady likes this.
lavender phase is offline  
#89 Old 06-09-2014, 10:35 PM
Veggie Regular
 
cienerose's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Santa Barbara, Ca
Posts: 337
Quote:
Originally Posted by Loki View Post

I must have to question why a religious organisation is trying to fight vegetarianism. Or promote meat consumption. you'd have thought that like most other hyper-religious groups, they couldn't have cared less, and would have concentrated more on homosexuality, abortionists, the ACLU and other satanic organisations like bloomsbury publishing.
Maybe they own stock in a meat packing company.
cienerose is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the VeggieBoards forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
If you do not want to register, fill this field only and the name will be used as user name for your post.
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in


Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off