Help! My Story [difficulty with veg*nism/gf] - VeggieBoards
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#1 Old 08-09-2005, 04:49 PM
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#2 Old 08-09-2005, 05:38 PM
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I don't know about the U.S., but the U.K.you can buy loads of meat-substitutes, such as Quorn products. You can probably find similar products in America (I wouldn't know, as I've never been there.)



If you try to include lots of pulses and grains in your diet, you could find that they fill you up.



You can buy vegetarian jerky, I don't know where you can purchase that from in the U.S. though... You can also buy vegetarian 'ham' and 'turkey', as well as vegetarian sausages, so there are meat replacers out there!



If you are becoming vegetarian, then you shouldn't really be going fishing, because "fish feel pain".



peace and love amy-jane xx
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#3 Old 08-09-2005, 05:43 PM
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Originally Posted by guitargirl03 View Post

Can I just say, that most meat isn't bad for you, I shouldn't be saying that, but I wanted to clear that up.



If your definition of "bad" means that it won't usually kill you quickly, than I guess you're right.





Anyway, thatoneguy.



I think the fact that you asked this question HERE tells a lot about what you really want.



Do you not eat a lot of soy meats or tofu or whole grains? Those tend to fill me up right good, and they satisfied my cravings when I was transitioning.



By the way, I recommend "Primal Strips" jerky. Mmm!



And about the fishing, you can go to a lake and enjoy yourself without killing fish. I promise I've never been fishing in my life but I have been to lakes several time and enjoyed riding a canoe, playing with the dog, etc.
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#4 Old 08-09-2005, 05:47 PM
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Yeah, I eat the mock meats but around the two month mark it's not enough. Up until the two month mark it works, and after I eat I don't crave meat (until I get hungry again). After two months though I still crave meat even AFTER I get filled up! It's crazy, I really want to be a vegetarian in my mind but my stomach doesn't.



It's been a little over two months and I'm getting all the signs I always do. Now it's really crazy because of the agreement between my fiance' and me.
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#5 Old 08-09-2005, 05:57 PM
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It sounds like a big problem here is that your girlfriend is being selfish. Look at what you said, YOU are interested in being a vegetarian for a variety of reasons. YOU apparently like coming here for advice/support. YOU would like to find a way to make this work. SHE doesn't like you being vegetarian because its an inconvenience to HER family, it makes HER uncomfortable when you ask questions at restaurants, SHE does not like that you're coming here and getting new ideas and learning new things, SHE thinks you should give it up and just go with the status quo. To be quite blunt, she isn't being supportive of your ideas or beliefs, YOU should be the one thats angry at HER not the other way around!! I get nervous when any significant other starts trying to control your life, and from your post, thats what it sounds like. I'm sure she's a great girl and you love her very much, but that doesn't mean that everything she does is always correct.



I think you need to consider what you're comfortable with. Maybe going veg "cold turkey" isn't the way for you. Some people cut out mammals first, then avians, then sea life. You could try that and see if you find better ways of integrating FILLING vegetarian food into your diet without getting too panicky about lack of meat. Vegetable and plant matter does tend to be less calorically dense than meat, so you do need to eat more and more often to get enough nutrition. This is part of that "healthier" thing you were talking about. Its EASIER for your body to process vegetarian food. Meat fills you up because it sits in your body for days. How is that good for you!?



I think you need to think upon the following things:



1. How can I compromise with my girlfriend in a way that factors in *MY* beliefs, needs and desires and not just what is "convenient" for her? (Trust me, you are only going to be unhappy in the long run if you just try to keep things "pleasant")



2. Evaluate your current diet. Figure out how many calories/protein/fats/nutrients etc.. you're taking in in a day. Figure out how the same could be accomplished with a vegetarian diet. Are you already eating enough servings of fruits/veggies in a day?



3. What are your reasons for being vegetarian or omnivore? Do you feel better physically as one or the other? Can that be changed? Do you feel better mentally as one or othe other? Can that be changed?



4. If vegetarian is the right path for YOU (not your girlfriend, not her family, for YOU as a person), then consider weaning yourself onto it. First make sure you're getting enough fruits/veggies in a day, increase it if you're not. Replace your refined carbs with unrefined. Cut out an animal at a time from your diet. Find protein replacements you like while you're not feeling like you're 'depriving' yourself.



5. If you go veg*n, how can the transition be easier on your girlfriend. Reassure her that it has nothing to do with her, you won't love her less because she's not vegetarian, or try to convert her. Research restaurants you can take your girlfriend to. Call ahead about menu items if needs be. Don't ask her family to make exceptions for you, instead ask if you can contribute to the meal. (Learning to cook helps here if you don't know how to already) Find a definition that is comfortable, i.e. "I'm transitioning to a vegetarian diet" or "I'm trying to incorporate more vegetarian meals into my diet" or just abandon the need for a definition at all.

http://megatarian.blogspot.com
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#6 Old 08-09-2005, 06:00 PM
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Originally Posted by Sokara View Post

I think the fact that you asked this question HERE tells a lot about what you really want.

I do eat a lot of fake meat. I love the primal strips! I like all the fake meats to what I crave (except there is no substitute for hens or vienna sausage). The only thing is my stomach knows it's fake. It wants the real thing after two months. Every Thanksgiving I always eat a drumstick and my brother eats the other one. I really like that tradition and it's going to feel weird not doing it this Thanksgiving and Christmas. If I can make it that long I'm going to bring the Tofurky meal that comes with fake turkey and the fixins.



I know it might sound weird to some of the other vegetarians here and especialy the vegans but the primal strips just don't tear like the real thing and it's not savory. I think that's what I miss is savoring.



Wow! That's why I like this forum, it's so helpful!



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Originally Posted by rabid_child View Post


I think you need to think upon the following things:



1. How can I compromise with my girlfriend in a way that factors in *MY* beliefs, needs and desires and not just what is "convenient" for her? (Trust me, you are only going to be unhappy in the long run if you just try to keep things "pleasant")



It will help once I get a job. She pays for everything when we go out, so when I get a job (my first post college job will be in about a month) it will be a lot easier since I can bring my own food over to her dad's house. We don't live together, we still live with our parents.



Quote:
Originally Posted by rabid_child View Post

2. Evaluate your current diet. Figure out how many calories/protein/fats/nutrients etc.. you're taking in a day. Figure out how the same could be accomplished with a vegetarian diet. Are you already eating enough servings of fruits/veggies in a day?



I should probably eat more veggies. I love fruits, and end up eating a lot of bread. I love tofu, bye the way. I'll see what I can do about it food wise.



Quote:
Originally Posted by rabid_child View Post

3. What are your reasons for being vegetarian or omnivore? Do you feel better physically as one or the other? Can that be changed? Do you feel better mentally as one or the other? Can that be changed?



My reasons for being vegetarian is to be healthy. I just see meat as so unhealthy. I know all the facts about vegetarians having lower chloesterol and heart problems. I do feel a little better physical and mentally.



Quote:
Originally Posted by rabid_child View Post

4. If vegetarian is the right path for YOU (not your girlfriend, not her family, for YOU as a person), then consider weaning yourself onto it. First make sure you're getting enough fruits/veggies in a day, increase it if you're not. Replace your refined carbs with unrefined. Cut out an animal at a time from your diet. Find protein replacements you like while you're not feeling like you're 'depriving' yourself.



That's one reason why I finally posted my story because I've been trying to be vegetarian for two years. I either eat all the animals or no animals, I have no mid point. I thought I was weaning myself into it by going on and off the diet over and over again, but that's the problem, I can't just stay on. I am really going to try not to give in this time.



Quote:
Originally Posted by rabid_child View Post

5. If you go veg*n, how can the transition be easier on your girlfriend. Reassure her that it has nothing to do with her, you won't love her less because she's not vegetarian, or try to convert her. Research restaurants you can take your girlfriend to. Call ahead about menu items if needs be. Don't ask her family to make exceptions for you, instead ask if you can contribute to the meal.

Her step mother (who lives at her dad's house) is allergic to soy. She has a lot of allergy problems and is pretty anti-vegetarian about things. When I get a job it will help a lot since I can bring my own stuff.



I just can't wait to get married because it will just be me and her. We won't have to worry about her family, when it comes to eating.



Thanks for the replies, guys!
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#7 Old 08-09-2005, 06:25 PM
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Wow! That's why I like this forum, it's so helpful!



Quote:
Originally Posted by rabid_child View Post


I think you need to think upon the following things:



1. How can I compromise with my girlfriend in a way that factors in *MY* beliefs, needs and desires and not just what is "convenient" for her? (Trust me, you are only going to be unhappy in the long run if you just try to keep things "pleasant")



It will help once I get a job. She pays for everything when we go out, so when I get a job (my first post college job will be in about a month) it will be a lot easier since I can bring my own food over to her dad's house. We don't live together, we still live with our parents.



Quote:
Originally Posted by rabid_child View Post

2. Evaluate your current diet. Figure out how many calories/protein/fats/nutrients etc.. you're taking in a day. Figure out how the same could be accomplished with a vegetarian diet. Are you already eating enough servings of fruits/veggies in a day?



I should probably eat more veggies. I love fruits, and end up eating a lot of bread. I love tofu, bye the way. I'll see what I can do about it food wise.



Quote:
Originally Posted by rabid_child View Post

3. What are your reasons for being vegetarian or omnivore? Do you feel better physically as one or the other? Can that be changed? Do you feel better mentally as one or the other? Can that be changed?



My reasons for being vegetarian is to be healthy. I just see meat as so unhealthy. I know all the facts about vegetarians having lower chloesterol and heart problems. I do feel a little better physical and mentally.



Quote:
Originally Posted by rabid_child View Post

4. If vegetarian is the right path for YOU (not your girlfriend, not her family, for YOU as a person), then consider weaning yourself onto it. First make sure you're getting enough fruits/veggies in a day, increase it if you're not. Replace your refined carbs with unrefined. Cut out an animal at a time from your diet. Find protein replacements you like while you're not feeling like you're 'depriving' yourself.



That's one reason why I finally posted my story because I've been trying to be vegetarian for two years. I either eat all the animals or no animals, I have no mid point. I thought I was weaning myself into it by going on and off the diet over and over again, but that's the problem, I can't just stay on. I am really going to try not to give in this time.



Quote:
Originally Posted by rabid_child View Post

5. If you go veg*n, how can the transition be easier on your girlfriend. Reassure her that it has nothing to do with her, you won't love her less because she's not vegetarian, or try to convert her. Research restaurants you can take your girlfriend to. Call ahead about menu items if needs be. Don't ask her family to make exceptions for you, instead ask if you can contribute to the meal.

Her step mother (who lives at her dad's house) is allergic to soy. She has a lot of allergy problems and is pretty anti-vegetarian about things. When I get a job it will help a lot since I can bring my own stuff.



I just can't wait to get married because it will just be me and her in a house and won't have to worry about her family and can deal with our problems in a personal manner.
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#8 Old 08-09-2005, 07:32 PM
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My husband was a meat eater when I met him. He was like you. Hed do the vegetarian thing for a while, and then backslide. This went on for several years. Then he decided it would be easier to wean himself off of red meat first, then chicken and turkey, and fish last. It took him about 2 years for the meat cravings to completely subside. He was hungry all the time, too. What helped him was eating smaller meals every couple of hours. Taking multivitamins helped him a lot too.



If youre a vegetarian, you shouldnt have much of a problem eating out. I recently cut out dairy and eggs from my diet, so it can be a little tricky. But in my experience, the wait staff has always been accommodating when I want to omit or substitute an item. For example, I love Mexican food, so I usually just ask if I can get a burrito with black or refried beans, veggies, salsa and guacamole. Simple enough



As far as your fiancé is concerned, I dont understand why she is so frustrated that youre backsliding. Its not easy to change your diet overnight. It takes some people longer than others to transition. My husband is proof of this.



Good luck and dont beat yourself up too much. The most important thing is that you do what is right for yourself, not your fiancé. Youre making a great effort.
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#9 Old 08-09-2005, 07:42 PM
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It is totally up to you regarding your diet. If you go back and forth, it's really no else's business but yours.



If you truly want to go veg, you may want to transition, I was Pesca first and am now Vegan. You may want to try to go Pesca first and decide from there, it may make the transition easier for you.



What ever you decide, I am glad you have at least cut down on meat consumption. Good Luck!
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#10 Old 08-09-2005, 08:15 PM
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Maybe you need to just go slowly? Stop eating cow meat. Once you've got a handle on that (give yourself a long time) take away something else. Wait until you get a handle on that.
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#11 Old 08-09-2005, 08:21 PM
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Thanks for the replies!



My fiance' and I just had a nice talk on the phone about stuff, and it turned out to be a pretty good.



I'm going to keep on with it! In the past four months I've only had meat twice. Once on accident - I didn't know they were real chicken nuggets because Kroger had them in the vegetarian section, and I had a turkey sandwich. This whole year I've probably had meat about 8 times, so that's pretty good!



Next week will mark two and a half months with no meat and I'm going to keep on going!



Sunny, that does sound a lot like what I'm going through. "If" I do end up giving in then maybe I could do that! I'm really going to try to make it through this third month and so on without meat.
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#12 Old 08-10-2005, 02:08 AM
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I'm glad to have stumbled upon this thread at the point I did. I'm happy to see that you aren't giving up, Matt. I won't try to improve upon the advice that's been given already regarding food (though I do applaud rabid_child's post) but I would like to give you an alternative in regards to fishing.



If you like fishing, go fishing! Just don't use live bait, or hooks on your line. I have gone fishing in the past a few times with omni friends, and just had a weight and a bobber on my line. It's fun to just cast, and reel in. The fact that nothing is dying or suffering just makes it more fun. And you get to be outdoors, by the lake and hang out with friends.



I just wanted to offer that up, since you said you like to fish.

Best of luck to you.
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#13 Old 08-10-2005, 06:01 AM
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If you like fishing, go fishing! Just don't use live bait, or hooks on your line. I have gone fishing in the past a few times with omni friends, and just had a weight and a bobber on my line. It's fun to just cast, and reel in. The fact that nothing is dying or suffering just makes it more fun. And you get to be outdoors, by the lake and hang out with friends.



That's an interesting idea! The be fair, I usually don't use live bait and the last time I went fishing all day long I didn't catch a single fish and still had fun! I'll think about it!



Thanks!
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#14 Old 08-10-2005, 07:33 AM
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Like Sokara said, canoeing is great fun on a lake. You still get the peaceful time to talk to your friends/family, along with the sights and sounds and smells of the lake. You can look into the water and see the fish. I personally think canoeing is tons of fun.
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#15 Old 08-10-2005, 08:19 AM
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ThatOneGuy:



First of all, let me say that I really admire your persistence. Obviously this means a lot to you, so please follow your heart and don't let other people's opinions influence you.



Also, I wanted to thank you for posting this. I have been veg*n now for a little over one month, and this morning I thought it was over. I was craving anything heavy, protein-like for breakfast. My job has been very stressful lately, so I'm thinking that may be a contributing factor. Like you, I've kinda been back and forth for as long as I can remember. But this time I really, really want to stick to it. For some reason, it's just really important to me right now to say "this is who I am." Anyway, coming here this morning and reading your post and the great responses (thanks, Rabid_Child!) has given me the resolve to keep on going.



Something else that helps me, and may help you too, is that I keep some inspirational quotes pasted to my computer so I can look at them and keep myself pumped up.



Hang in there!
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#16 Old 08-10-2005, 08:32 AM
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I'm sorry to hear you still have meat cravings. I didn't have much of a problem at all with any cravings so I don't really know what to tell you. Try keeping track of your food intake on www.fitday.com and see if you're comming up short on anything. As the previous posters said, make sure you're eating enough beans and grains. Personally, I don't find tofu or faux meats nearly as filling as plain ol' beans. Try drowning your next meat craving in some hearty whole wheat bread and fried beans. Perhaps you are eating too much of your calories in carbs and not getting enough protein and fat to feel satisfied?



As for the problem with your s/o, I think your fiance is the one who is being unreasonable. It shouldn't bother her that you quiz waiters about food. (Try calling ahead in the future.) As far as her family should be concerned, you are veggie for the time being. I don't think you should stop calling yourself veggie just because you have a slip up. It's confusing for them and most veggies have more than a few slip ups, particularly at the begining.
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#17 Old 08-10-2005, 09:05 AM
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If you eat meat you're not a vegetarian, so quit confusing yourself & everyone else. You are like a an addict w/ meat. Have some willpower already & quit going back & forth. Other pp have made some great recommendations but it's time to stop being wishy-washy & just do it already. I believe that if you want something bad enough you can program your brain & get what you want. Reading books or watching some movies may help as well that are geared around you issues..
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#18 Old 08-10-2005, 09:13 AM
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Beyond just getting enough calories, are you eating enough iron rich foods? Eat more leafy greens (kale, collards, chard, Brussels sprouts, broccoli). Add vinegar or tomato sauce or drink OJ with your meal to increase absorbtion. I cook a lot of my food in a cast iron skillet too.



Also, I realize that you are veg for health reasons, and I'm not trying to push A/R A/W at you, but I don't know that I would have been successful in remaining veg*n if it was just for me. It really helps me keep my focus that I'm doing it for the animals.



Re. fishing: I used to fish with my grandpa. I remember being somewhat upset at having to kill the fish, but I enjoyed going because I was spending time with my grandpa. I think it would have been more fun just to canoe around the lake or hike along the stream course with him, really.
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#19 Old 08-10-2005, 01:13 PM
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Hmmmm.... I am thinking about the whole girlfriend thing. I think it's quite possible she's losing patience due to a misperception that you are somehow being flakey. It's kind of like asking someone who's trying to stop smoking, and suddenly gives in and smokes an entire pack, "Well, gee... Are you quitting smoking or not?" Truth is, the person who just smoked the entire pack still wants to quit smoking, and it would be better for that person if his significant other and friends stood behind him all the way. At the same time, even though the smoker may get VERY discouraged, he shouldn't ever say to people around him (especially those who don't understand and think nothing is wrong at all with smoking), "Oh well... I guess I am just going to smoke forever."



Maybe it's time to tell her that you really need her by your side and to support you the entire way through this. It may be slightly inconvenient for her, but it's really about what's going on your plate -- not hers. Tell her that rather than hearing, "Make your mind!" you need her support. Be sure you're looking at her having a 100% attention conversation rather than saying this while you're taking out the trash or something.



I am so proud of you for trying to do this for so long. Take a good look at your diet, though. I am a 235 lb. guy and I feed myself better than I should on a vegan diet.
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#20 Old 08-10-2005, 05:28 PM
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My 2 cents:



Don't fool yourself into thinking that once you get married, it will be "just you and her". Believe me, even when it's just you and her, it won't fully be "just you and her" (uh, maybe someone else who's married can explain this one better than I can.... ). IMO, this is something that needs resolved before either of you take that walk down the aisle or it will bite you in the butt later. Trust me on this one.



As others have said, you need more "heavy fuel". Beans, whole grains, plant-based fats... stuff that feeds well and won't burn off inside of 2 hours. I'm another one that can't sustain on fake meats or tofu, but beans and whole grains sure do hit the spot and hit it quite well. Deep leafy greens are great, too and bellpeppers are a wonderful source of vitamin C as well (the reds have more than the orange ones). For other sources of C, go to nutritiondata.com and run a search. There's also a tool there that can help you track what you eat and see if the nutrients are spot on or lacking.



For the fishing thing, I really like that idea of a "dud hook". Brilliant! A perfect way to be part of the action without being part of the action.



Hang in there, TOG. You've made it this far, I know you can keep going.
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#21 Old 08-10-2005, 05:50 PM
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Originally Posted by 4EverGrounded View Post

My 2 cents:



Don't fool yourself into thinking that once you get married, it will be "just you and her". Believe me, even when it's just you and her, it won't fully be "just you and her" (uh, maybe someone else who's married can explain this one better than I can.... ). IMO, this is something that needs resolved before either of you talk that walk down the aisle or it will bite you in the butt later. Trust me on this one.



Oh I can rant on THAT all day if you'd like, though it's maybe not directly on topic, just let me say.... once you're married... in a way, you've married the whole family.

It will NOT be "just you and her" but "you, her and all the inlaws, outlaws and ex-laws"... (I'm divorced and my ex's folks are still butting into my life - yeah, I love 'em... but still...)



There will always be get-togethers, birthdays, reunions, parties, graduations, endless reasons to celebrate - and those celebrations WILL revolve around food. And usually emotions tend to run high at these things, something that seems like a little thing will get blown WAY WAY out of proportion (i.e. "you didn't eat any of Aunt Mary's secret-recipe-roast beef - you heartless thing, you!!" Yep, that'll happen.)

Whether or not you're thinking about kids - that may figure into the picture at a later date too - will the omni grandparents support your wishes for your children or will they go behind your back and bad-mouth your choices and try and bribe your children to eat meat? Will they berate you endlessly for "depriving" your children of the "fun" of McDonalds? (Don't ask...).



Walking down the aisle is something you need to consider very, very carefully (as I'm sure you have)... with a lot of heart-to-heart discussion between the two of you beforehand - it's SOOO much better to resolve things ahead of time, than to just assume they'll "work out" or you'll some how "convince her" to see things from your point of view...



As 4EverGrounded said, and I promise you is true... unresolved issues WILL ABSOLUTELY come back to bite you in the butt!!!
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#22 Old 08-10-2005, 08:23 PM
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Thanks, guys!

I found something that helps me not to crave meat! I just tasted some without actually eating it! It worked!



I wouldn't know the first thing about canoeing, but it sounds fun! I don't know where or how to even get started with that. We don't have much money, and I live near Indianapolis.
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#23 Old 08-10-2005, 09:27 PM
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Oh jeez Matt you're in a tough situation ... and well the only thing i can tell you is that it would have been easier for you if you more more comassionate..... i know this sounds like i'm absolutely crazy but you can probably train yourself the hard way - by associating eating meat to something bad ... like say have a jicy steak while watching cows being killed and taken apart ...

but i wouldn't expect most people to go that far, but to me it sounds like this kind of thing would work.



- bad advice pro
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#24 Old 08-10-2005, 10:31 PM
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LOL, shock therapy. That could work!
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