PSA: How Soy Turns from a Healthy Bean into Something Pretty Scary - Page 3 - VeggieBoards
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#61 Old 06-30-2005, 09:31 AM
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Originally Posted by LudwigB View Post

The few individuals who acquire prion diseases by eating them do so because a tiny fraction of what is eaten either survives the digestion process or gets directly into the bloodstream (eg., through open sores in the oral cavity or upper GI tract).

I forgot to mention, some scientists think a genetic susceptability may also play a role.
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#62 Old 06-30-2005, 01:56 PM
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Originally Posted by MollyGoat View Post

We talked about this in detail yesterday at my school, and since I know a lot of people on this board eat soy meats and other processed soy frequently, I thought I'd post some of the things I learned. Here is a step by step explanation of how they make some of vegetarians' favorite soy foods.



1. The soybean itself. An organically grown soybean is a wonderful thing, contain many essential amino acids, natural protease inhibitors, and vitamins and minerals. Unfortunately, about 80% of the soybeans grown for commercial use in America are genetically modified. GM soybeans contain more of the typically allergenic compounds than do organic soybeans, so more people react badly to eating GM soybeans. Also, GM soybeans are often sprayed with a great deal of pesticides, because they are modified to be able to grow amidst high levels of chemicals. When you buy soy, BUY ORGANIC.



2. Breaking down the soybean--removing the fat. To make a processed soy product, the fat must be removed. The vast majority of the time, this is done through the application of toxic chemicals, such as hexane and benzene, two known carcinogens. Though it's possible to remove fat from the soybean through less toxic methods, it is usually not done.



3. Breaking down the soybean--removing the carbohydrates. Once the fat has been removed, the carbohydrates and fiber must also be removed. This is usually done in one of three ways: soaking the beans in extremely acidic solutions, soaking the beans in extremely basic solutions (think Drano here), or soaking the beans in alcohol.



We now have what is known as "Soy Protein Isolate" (SPI). A highly allergenic (if not made from organic soy) isolated protein containing dangerous chemical residue. This is now put into protein powder, meal bars like Luna and Clif, veggie burgers and hot dogs like Boca, Yves, Gardenburger, etc., and used in certain soymilks (like 8th Continent.)



4. Extruding the SPI--making TVP. If manufacturers want to make TVP, they will take the newly made SPI and extrude it through a metal form at very high temperatures and pressure. This can cause the proteins to become malformed.



So you guys...please watch out for your health and avoid processed soy protein and products that use it. I am not an anti-soy person; I think whole soybeans and tempeh (and to a lesser extent, tofu) are wonderful, healthful products, but you are potentially causing some serious damage to your health by consuming SPI products. Benzene, hexane and other harsh chemicals are not something you want in your body, and we absorb enough toxins from our environment as it is.



I'd also like to shout-out for Turtle Island Tofurky products, which use NO SPI in any of their foods.









Everything is bad. They're saying now that a chemical used in non-stick cookware causes cancer. What next? Apples?! I think some of this stuff is propoganda from competing companies.
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#63 Old 06-30-2005, 05:03 PM
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Everything is bad. They're saying now that a chemical used in non-stick cookware causes cancer. What next? Apples?! I think some of this stuff is propoganda from competing companies.



Actually, you'll note in my post that a number of things I mentioned are NOT bad. Like whole soyfoods.



And it totally doesn't surprise me that non-stick coating contains carcinogens. I would be a little more surprised if apples were carcinogenic than a synthetic chemical that goes into the air on high heat.
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#64 Old 06-30-2005, 07:51 PM
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Originally Posted by MollyGoat View Post

Actually, you'll note in my post that a number of things I mentioned are NOT bad. Like whole soyfoods.



And it totally doesn't surprise me that non-stick coating contains carcinogens. I would be a little more surprised if apples were carcinogenic than a synthetic chemical that goes into the air on high heat.







I'm just saying it seems like everytime you turn around something is labeled as bad for you.
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#65 Old 06-30-2005, 07:55 PM
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Yeah, I know what you mean! We live in a pretty toxic world right now!
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#66 Old 07-01-2005, 11:22 PM
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i'm still a believe in moderation
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#67 Old 07-02-2005, 07:06 AM
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so now I'm very confused. Is soymilk good or bad? I use either 'alpro soya' or 'so good', are these brands ok? and does it make a difference if it's been heat treated (ie UHT soymilk)?



and tempeh rather than tofu? because it's less processed? but I guess it doesn't have the calcium that some tofu has?
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#68 Old 07-02-2005, 07:26 AM
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Oh man. I haven't posted here in *ages* and the first post I read knocks out about 1/2 my diet.



I must eat the least healthily of any vegan i know.
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#69 Old 07-02-2005, 08:38 AM
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Originally Posted by knglerxt View Post

Everything is bad. They're saying now that a chemical used in non-stick cookware causes cancer. What next? Apples?!



yup, arsenic in the seeds
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#70 Old 07-02-2005, 09:36 AM
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Is soy protein concentrate the same as soy protein isolate?
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#71 Old 07-15-2005, 10:32 PM
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Oh my dear Lord have mercy. Am I ever confused after reading this. It made my poor little head spin.



Bottom line......eating my soy burgers and soy chicken - gonna kill me or not?



It's gotta be better than eating meat, right?!?!
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#72 Old 07-15-2005, 10:49 PM
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hmmmm...it seems everything causes cancer. Ok. I'm cool with that. But I'm SUPERCOOL with the fact that these facts are supposedly not inclusive of the Tofurkey brand, 'cause I just bought some Tofurkey kielbasa today and will hereby spend tomorrow chowing down relentlessly on their spicy, greasy, convincing goodness! yeehaw!
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#73 Old 07-16-2005, 03:01 AM
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I believe "soy protein concentrate" is the same as soy protein isolate.



Quote:
Originally Posted by dylansmom View Post

Oh my dear Lord have mercy. Am I ever confused after reading this. It made my poor little head spin.



Bottom line......eating my soy burgers and soy chicken - gonna kill me or not?



It's gotta be better than eating meat, right?!?!

Honestly, I'm not sure. Ethically speaking, yes. Environmentally speaking, debatable. Healthwise, probably not.



I think a pasture-raised organically-fed chicken is healthier for you than a soy chicken patty, for sure.



As with most things, it's better to stick to whole foods. Processed foods, and that includes meat subs, should not form a major part of anyone's diet.
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#74 Old 07-16-2005, 03:13 AM
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I think that soy products would be safer than organic chickens as I don't think meat factories/machines are very clean/sterile. Although I don't think soy is that safe I like to eat it sometimes. A better choice for protein I think would be almonds/almond milk unless you have a nut allergy/dislike nuts.
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#75 Old 07-16-2005, 03:34 AM
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If any of you visited a modern food processing or packaging plant of foods you eat every day, many of you would say 'ooo gross' and stop eating it.



But then if you study the processes in more detail you'll find that these huge plants are usually cleaner than your kitchen at home and the food is healthier than a lot of things you make yourself.



Its' easy to take segments of a food preperation process out of context to make them seem evil. But when you look at the big picture you'll find it's no big deal.



The process to make TVP is extremely similar to pasta or cereals you eat everyday.
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#76 Old 07-16-2005, 03:42 AM
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Then I want to visit one. Then cakes and cookies and such wouldn't look so yummy.
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#77 Old 07-17-2005, 10:29 PM
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Originally Posted by MollyGoat View Post

Tofu is much more processed then tempeh.



Tempeh: whole soybeans pressed into cakes and fermented.



Tofu: soybeans ground up with water, most of the bean strained out, the resulting mixture boiled and coagulated with a curdling agent.



Tofu has its place, it's not unhealthy, but it is NOT a whole food, and tempeh definitely is.



Hmm Thanks for that info MollyGoat I didn't know that...I'll switch across to tempeh from now on
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#78 Old 07-17-2005, 11:08 PM
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Originally Posted by MrFalafel View Post

The process to make TVP is extremely similar to pasta or cereals you eat everyday.

Um, right, except for the whole soaking the food in benzene thing.



This isn't a matter of cleanliness or sanitation. It's a matter of harcore processing, much of it chemical.



And I don't know what world you're living in where pasta is suddenly healthy again, for that matter. Uh, yeah. White flour becomes a healthful product when it's molded into shapes and dried.
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#79 Old 07-18-2005, 01:46 PM
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After reading this thread, I've decided to keep eating the way I"ve been eating for the past 2 years.
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#80 Old 07-20-2005, 05:30 PM
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I need a quick reference list, goatster. In order from bad to worst for my fridge
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#81 Old 07-20-2005, 05:36 PM
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Woah, i didn't know that! I think i'll inform the govenor about this. (I recently moved to california. )
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#82 Old 01-13-2006, 06:41 PM
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Originally Posted by zoebird View Post






.advocate that if a person is going to consume soy products, that they strive to only consume a portion of what they do consume--35 grams a day or 57 grams a day or 115 grams a day. Of this, they should try to consume soy in the following forms: tofu, miso, or tempeh. These fermented forms are the healthiest versions of soy (and have the benefit of also being a fermented food, which has it's own benefits).

.

sooo many people keep saying tofu is a fermented product. there is such thing as fermented tofu, and even tofu that is produced by fermentation, but they are definatly not the tofu you buy every day, and have never seen them for sale even. the vast VAST majority of tofu is coagulated by chemical salts, and not by adidity generated by fermentation.
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#83 Old 01-13-2006, 06:59 PM
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sooo many people keep saying tofu is a fermented product. there is such thing as fermented tofu, and even tofu that is produced by fermentation, but they are definatly not the tofu you buy every day, and have never seen them for sale even. the vast VAST majority of tofu is coagulated by chemical salts, and not by adidity generated by fermentation.



whoa whoops, totally jumped the gun on that one, i got to page 3 and said "damn tofu isnt damn fermented" then got to page 4 and it had already been adddressed. please disregard. ill read the whole thread next time....



molly goat: you say you talk about this stuff at "school", what school on earth (near portland?!) do you get to talk about food science in conjuction with vegan cooking? (sign me the hell up) later.
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#84 Old 01-13-2006, 08:08 PM
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They have those $100 soymilk makers now. Wish they were cheaper, but basically you add your own organic soybeans, water and it cooks it for 13 minutes. Then they tell you to add some sugar and flavoring if you want (like vanilla). That's it. Refrigerate overnight and you have your own soymilk free of the added chemicals and additives.



I'm thinking about buying one. Some even send you the mold and directions to make tofu too. It's a good idea.
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#85 Old 01-15-2006, 12:41 PM
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Okay...well I avoid soy burgers, veggie dogs and fake meats and such, but what about TVP?? Please don't tell me that's highly processed and unhealthy too!

It's not in what you say, it's in what you do (Oasis)

Feeling bored? Why don't you wander over to my blog sometime. http://thebohemiankitchen.wordpress.com
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#86 Old 01-16-2006, 03:55 PM
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That was covered on page 1. I won't repeat all that was said on that page, but you might want to check it out yourself because it's very good reading.
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#87 Old 01-16-2006, 03:57 PM
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Well shiver me timbers, this is an old thread!



Susie, I went to the Natural Gourmet Cookery School in NYC.
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#88 Old 01-16-2006, 05:13 PM
 
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It's funny that this is revived. I was just thinking yesterday about searching for information on soy protein isolate (which, the more I read, scares me).

The ones I pity are the ones who never stick out their neck for something they believe, never know the taste of moral struggle, and never have the thrill of victory. - Jonathan Kozol
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