''Vegeterians cook/should cook themselves'', the common misconception. Or not? - VeggieBoards
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#1 Old 11-07-2013, 04:45 AM
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The story-

 

I do make dinner myself some days a week, sometimes my partner will do it, but there are those days when we both aren't in the mood to go through so much effort. So before, in my meat-eating days I found a certain canned mushroom soup, that wasn't too hard on the chemical ingredients and actually was very tasty. I can't get those specific shrooms in any fresh/dry/salted variation in this country. After I stopped eating meat, I somehow never thought to check the list of ingredients, I guess it was common sense (or not) to think that why would there be meat in a mushroom-cream soup? I've never seen a single recipe of a mushroom soup featuring meat. So I still occasionally bought it. Yesterday I somehow ended up reading the list of ingredients and much to my shock and surprise, I discovered there was animal fat inside. I know, I should have read all of the labels more careful and I should have known better than to make assumptions about the content. But what's done is done, and we all make those mistakes don't we? I felt horrible about it though.

 

When I mentioned this to my friend, my friends reaction however was ''Well, why did you buy it in the first place, all of the vegetarians always make their own meals!'' (The friend is an omni). Ok, I get it - when people go veggie/vegan it is not only about the animals, it is also a step towards a healthier diet in general, which includes often cooking your healthier meals yourself. Yes, I get it.

 

But did I miss the part where you magically turn into this active energetic person? Who will happily slave away in the kitchen 2-3 times a day while cooking thousands of different meals, from the fresh produce of their local farmers market (which usually is open briefly on Saturday mornings. Sleep.. I really like my sleep)?

Because I still think that often there are times when even the infamous vegetarians would like to order in, eat out, whip up something frozen or canned. Maybe it is just me and I somehow missed the magic transformation. Maybe it is the fact that my country of residence is very heavily meat orientated. But when it comes to down  to the available options asides from cooking there are almost none. The stores are packed with ready-made stuff that includes meat in some form. There are no vegetarian restaurants in my area and all of the ''normal'' ones will always have 1-3 veggie dishes and for about 20 meat dishes. Yes, life is not fair, but that does not make it ok.

 

It feels like every time you do something actually good, the world is out there to make it harder on you, punish you and to hold you back and drag you down with it.

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#2 Old 11-07-2013, 07:20 AM
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Being vegetarian has nothing to do with prepping your own meals, avoiding processed foods, being 'healthy' or thin, or any of the other issues that vegetarianism often gets co-opted by; both by non-vegetarians and some vegetarians.

 

It's not eating meat (flesh fish fowl). That's it. Full stop. You can totally legitimately do whatever you want around that one principle and call yourself vegetarian, no-one else gets to undermine that. 


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#3 Old 11-07-2013, 07:55 AM
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Being vegetarian has nothing to do with prepping your own meals, avoiding processed foods, being 'healthy' or thin, or any of the other issues that vegetarianism often gets co-opted by; both by non-vegetarians and some vegetarians.

 

It's not eating meat (flesh fish fowl). That's it. Full stop. You can totally legitimately do whatever you want around that one principle and call yourself vegetarian, no-one else gets to undermine that. 

Well that's what I meant, this particular friend was under the impression that being a vegetarian also means to be a health freak who jogs to the market at 6 am (not that there is anything wrong with that). She (not the only one) believes that being a vegetarian is ones choice, but one must pay the price and deal with the consequences and in no way that should change the world of meat-eaters (replacing that Sausage NR.123 with something else).

 

So the conversation maybe was not like that literally, but in fact it was.

''I am upset because none of the stores or the restaurants are very vegetarian friendly. So I bought this soup with meat on accident.''

''What?! Why would you even think of buying that! How dare you even buy something with all those harmful chemicals? The Other Vegeterians (you know the real! ones) actually prepare their own meals, you should always make your own food! They would never think to be lazy or unhealthy!''

 

Even though you know it is ridiculous, still makes you feel like you are somehow not how you should be. Like you did not read the Universal Guidebook on how to be legitimate veg, which the know-it-all meat-eater obviously did. :)

 

Unfortunately that at least around here is a very common perception. ''You can go and chew on your carrot all you like, but please do not talk about it, let alone ask us to include your ridiculous food in our menus or store shelves. ''

 

Maybe it is even more so since one of the things this country is famous for is Bratwurst (various sausages). And Schnitzel!

 

P.S. Perhaps I am being too negative and complain too much, but after all isn't that one of the reasons this forum exists? It's more of a rhetorical question. Unfortunately for me, I am surrounded by carnivores and no one really cares about these issues. In fact everyone is downright insensitive and disappointed in my choice. It gets tiresome after a while, that you can not even voice your concerns without being judged/ignored.

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#4 Old 11-07-2013, 08:24 AM
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Maybe you should be asking yourself another question though.  Why did the food containing animal fat taste so damn good?


I know animal fat often is used to carry the taste (and yes, I made the switch for moral reasons mostly, not because I started to hate the taste of the meat), I did not get it for the animal fat of course and wouldn't have eaten it if I noticed. But taste carrier or not, there are other ways to enhance the taste. Using animal fat might be the easy and the cheap way to produce it, and they know the majority won't mind. But it is also inconsiderate to put animal ingredients in 99% percent of the products just because it is easy or almost nobody won't mind.

 

And onions. I won't start talking about onions. They are literally in everything, and once again - the demands and the acceptance of the majority.

 

Of course, there is an existing market and it's business after all. But somehow not many care about the other existing market, which would grow given the chance.

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#5 Old 11-07-2013, 11:38 AM
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I understand this friend is peddling popular misconceptions at you about what being vegetarian "really" means (to her at least) but so far as the official definition is concerned, you're doing it right. 

 

It's tough enough for newb veggies to learn about how to cook, shop and eat in a whole new way (just try reading some of the other threads on here), without having all kinds of other unrealistic expectations dumped on them as well, especially by people close to them.

 

If you decide to get into cooking, then great for you, but it's most certainly not a prerequisite for being veg. Personally I enjoy it (though I do a lot of cooking meals in bulk and freezing for defrosting later!) but not everyone does and not everyone has the time or resources to make what they'd like from scratch all the time.

 

I wouldn't worry about complaining here either (again see other threads) people need to let of steam and feel supported in their journey, it helps, and such 'pastoral care' is a big part of what forms this community.

 

A big challenge for the veg community at large, as you've shown, is dealing with and changing such popular misconceptions. That's going to be an ongoing process. Unfortunately the successful promotion different aspects of the movement can have negative knock-on effects on others. Like for example the promotion of so-called "health veganism" in particular can cause issues for overweight vegans because everyone expects vegans to be thin, it can undermine important AR issues with the focus on diet and human health, or like with your example people assuming that all veggies must eat muesli and home sprouted hummus and raw fruit balls or whatever just because folks have seen some famous veg celebrity promoting that kind of eating on TV.

 

All you can do is focus your attention and efforts on what works for you and keeps you on track. So long as you're not eating meat, you're a vegetarian, don't allow other people's wrong-headed notions divert you from doing what's right for you.

 

Oh, and dive into the community here. It's a fun place to participate in! Get the support you need, let off steam, and have a laugh at daft omnivore's misconceptions about vegetarians while you're at it: 

 

https://www.veggieboards.com/t/138230/stupid-things-omnivores-say-version-6-0/0_10


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#6 Old 11-07-2013, 03:28 PM
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And onions. I won't start talking about onions. They are literally in everything, and once again - the demands and the acceptance of the majority.

 


Could you talk about them? Because I love onions. Is there something wrong with them?

Icken is COMPLETELY right.

Your carnist friend is the Jon Snow of vegetarianism. They know nothing.

Going vegetarian requires you to do absolutely 0 cooking. In my first 6 months of going veg, I spent probably 3 of those months eating exclusively out of packets because I didn't have any other choice. There's a great brand called Easy Bite. They're microwaveable Indian meals. Really yummy and all of them are vegetarian, if not vegan.


Of course, learning how to cook vego meals is loads of fun and often, if I have a really bad day, I like to cook to make myself feel better. Vego cooking can be loads of fun.

 

On other days, I need wine and takeaway because life is hard, that's why.

We're not in this for our health. Of course, striving to be healthy is a great thing for us all to do. If we can show others how healthy vegetarianism can be, then it might make them second guess their 'need' for meat. Also, there's something satisfying about a carnist being surprised by my stamina or strength.

Sorry you've encountered this resistance in your social circle, but you're right. This is TOTALLY the place to be to talk about it.
 

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#7 Old 11-07-2013, 05:19 PM
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A lot of people have the misconception that if someone is a vegetarian it means they're on a diet, and being a health freak. The best option to healthy eating is cooking. I don't know your friend, but that might be why your friend thought you cooked all your own meals.


"We have enslaved the rest of the animal creation, and have treated our distant cousins in fur and feathers so badly that beyond doubt, if they were able to formulate a religion, they would depict the Devil in human form." - William Ralphe Inge

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#8 Old 11-08-2013, 12:36 AM
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A lot of people have the misconception that if someone is a vegetarian it means they're on a diet, and being a health freak. The best option to healthy eating is cooking. I don't know your friend, but that might be why your friend thought you cooked all your own meals.


Well, the friend was simply under the impression that vegetarian=really healthy. I really did not go into vegetarianism for health reasons, I did it for the animals, she knew that, I know I couldn't live with myself harming them anymore and supporting such a cruel industry. I was never much of a meat eater to being with and I knew that one day I will make the switch. As for the health - it was a secondary reason. For me to go around and talk about the health would be kind of hypocritical, I stopped the meat, I use only organic cosmetics and no household chemicals, however I am also a heavy smoker.

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#9 Old 11-08-2013, 12:56 AM
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Could you talk about them? Because I love onions. Is there something wrong with them?

Icken is COMPLETELY right.

Your carnist friend is the Jon Snow of vegetarianism. They know nothing.

Going vegetarian requires you to do absolutely 0 cooking. In my first 6 months of going veg, I spent probably 3 of those months eating exclusively out of packets because I didn't have any other choice. There's a great brand called Easy Bite. They're microwaveable Indian meals. Really yummy and all of them are vegetarian, if not vegan.


Of course, learning how to cook vego meals is loads of fun and often, if I have a really bad day, I like to cook to make myself feel better. Vego cooking can be loads of fun.

 

On other days, I need wine and takeaway because life is hard, that's why.

We're not in this for our health. Of course, striving to be healthy is a great thing for us all to do. If we can show others how healthy vegetarianism can be, then it might make them second guess their 'need' for meat. Also, there's something satisfying about a carnist being surprised by my stamina or strength.

Sorry you've encountered this resistance in your social circle, but you're right. This is TOTALLY the place to be to talk about it.
 


Haha, well, I can talk about them but there is nothing positive I could say! :) I am usually not that picky about food, there are things I like, some i dislike, but unlike most people I really do not have a list of things I hate. For some that list is very long. However, since I was a kid, for some reason I have hated onions, raw, powder, cooked, boiled, any form of onions. I like garlic, leek, wild garlic, I can tolerate even spring onions in small amounts, but there is something about that onion Onion that I find repulsive. (And animal fat. Some relatives often made soup with cubes of fat floating on the surface. Needless to say, the sight, the thought alone could make me sick.)

And I have always been around onion lovers, my family, friends, partners, so often they have tried tricking me by somehow hiding onions in food. I can always tell.

I really do not know why people put onions literally everywhere, they claim that the food tastes better but the only thing it does is making it taste like onions. I actually like the natural taste of food, but I also use a lots of different herbs and experiment with them when I cook. Somehow for most onion-lovers, onions are the one and only ultimate ''herb'' for them. As I live in Germany right now, there is hardly anything I can buy in a store (which does not require preparing) without those evil onions. Sandwiches, vegetables in jars, salads, pretty much everything is full of them. And like it was not bad enough before, now that I am a veggie, I have two things two avoid that are in everything, sometimes together. It's not easy, my one consolation now is knowing that in a few years I will get to move to Canada and the hope my vegetarian onion hater life will be a bit easier there. /eyeroll

 

I am sure we do not have Easy Bite in here, but perhaps there is something similar, need to look into that.

 

Cooking can be fun indeed, I do enjoy it at times a lot. And I think it is safe to say I am even pretty good at it. But I enjoy it also under certain conditions, I have to be in the mood, in no rush and often make a whole ritual out of it, with a glass of wine in my hand for e.g.. That is why I do not cook every day, I try not to make it in a chore. If I feel like I am forced to do it against my will, all the magic is gone and the end result is never as good :)

P.S. I just realized I can only say that because I do not have kid yet. :) I guess I won't be able to keep this up in that case, would not be fair of me to subject them to my not-so healthy diet and eating out/ordering in for 4 people so often could probably get very expensive at times. /sigh

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#10 Old 11-08-2013, 01:23 AM
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I understand this friend is peddling popular misconceptions at you about what being vegetarian "really" means (to her at least) but so far as the official definition is concerned, you're doing it right. 

 

It's tough enough for newb veggies to learn about how to cook, shop and eat in a whole new way (just try reading some of the other threads on here), without having all kinds of other unrealistic expectations dumped on them as well, especially by people close to them.

 

If you decide to get into cooking, then great for you, but it's most certainly not a prerequisite for being veg. Personally I enjoy it (though I do a lot of cooking meals in bulk and freezing for defrosting later!) but not everyone does and not everyone has the time or resources to make what they'd like from scratch all the time.

 

I wouldn't worry about complaining here either (again see other threads) people need to let of steam and feel supported in their journey, it helps, and such 'pastoral care' is a big part of what forms this community.

 

A big challenge for the veg community at large, as you've shown, is dealing with and changing such popular misconceptions. That's going to be an ongoing process. Unfortunately the successful promotion different aspects of the movement can have negative knock-on effects on others. Like for example the promotion of so-called "health veganism" in particular can cause issues for overweight vegans because everyone expects vegans to be thin, it can undermine important AR issues with the focus on diet and human health, or like with your example people assuming that all veggies must eat muesli and home sprouted hummus and raw fruit balls or whatever just because folks have seen some famous veg celebrity promoting that kind of eating on TV.

 

All you can do is focus your attention and efforts on what works for you and keeps you on track. So long as you're not eating meat, you're a vegetarian, don't allow other people's wrong-headed notions divert you from doing what's right for you.

 

Oh, and dive into the community here. It's a fun place to participate in! Get the support you need, let off steam, and have a laugh at daft omnivore's misconceptions about vegetarians while you're at it: 

 

https://www.veggieboards.com/t/138230/stupid-things-omnivores-say-version-6-0/0_10


Thanks for the much needed support, in fact thanks to all of you! :) It is a welcome change, to actually talk to like-minded people.

 

As for the cooking I will just copy the same thing I already said to Tiger Lilly -

Cooking can be fun indeed, I do enjoy it at times a lot. And I think it is safe to say I am even pretty good at it. But I enjoy it also under certain conditions, I have to be in the mood, in no rush and often make a whole ritual out of it, with a glass of wine in my hand for e.g.. That is why I do not cook every day, I try not to make it in a chore. If I feel like I am forced to do it against my will, all the magic is gone and the end result is never as good :)

P.S. I just realized I can only say that because I do not have kid yet. :) I guess I won't be able to keep this up in that case, would not be fair of me to subject them to my not-so healthy diet and eating out/ordering in for 4 people so often could probably get very expensive at times. /sigh

 

I have never been a part of any community, not because I did not want to, but for I have never met any like-minded people, as hard to believe it might sound. No one with same beliefs, opinions, not even with the same taste in movies, art or music. As a result, I have withdrawn myself from the society in general, for a while it worked, but it gets lonely. I have a partner who despite his good traits, do not share my beliefs and a family and friends which do not share my country of residence and most of the beliefs. So I thought that, perhaps, being a part of some community would do me some good.

 

I have an interesting observation, many people in the old Europe do not really consider Americans as very intelligent, however I beg to differ. It is a stupid cliche. Most of the people I can relate to actually come from U.S. and CA. Yes, as in everywhere they, you might be in the minority, but percentually it is a larger minority.

 

And thanks for the link :)

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#11 Old 11-08-2013, 02:14 AM
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Haha, well, I can talk about them but there is nothing positive I could say! :) I am usually not that picky about food, there are things I like, some i dislike, but unlike most people I really do not have a list of things I hate. For some that list is very long. However, since I was a kid, for some reason I have hated onions, raw, powder, cooked, boiled, any form of onions. I like garlic, leek, wild garlic, I can tolerate even spring onions in small amounts, but there is something about that onion Onion that I find repulsive. (And animal fat. Some relatives often made soup with cubes of fat floating on the surface. Needless to say, the sight, the thought alone could make me sick.)

And I have always been around onion lovers, my family, friends, partners, so often they have tried tricking me by somehow hiding onions in food. I can always tell.

I really do not know why people put onions literally everywhere, they claim that the food tastes better but the only thing it does is making it taste like onions. I actually like the natural taste of food, but I also use a lots of different herbs and experiment with them when I cook. Somehow for most onion-lovers, onions are the one and only ultimate ''herb'' for them. As I live in Germany right now, there is hardly anything I can buy in a store (which does not require preparing) without those evil onions. Sandwiches, vegetables in jars, salads, pretty much everything is full of them. And like it was not bad enough before, now that I am a veggie, I have two things two avoid that are in everything, sometimes together. It's not easy, my one consolation now is knowing that in a few years I will get to move to Canada and the hope my vegetarian onion hater life will be a bit easier there. /eyeroll

 

I am sure we do not have Easy Bite in here, but perhaps there is something similar, need to look into that.

 

Cooking can be fun indeed, I do enjoy it at times a lot. And I think it is safe to say I am even pretty good at it. But I enjoy it also under certain conditions, I have to be in the mood, in no rush and often make a whole ritual out of it, with a glass of wine in my hand for e.g.. That is why I do not cook every day, I try not to make it in a chore. If I feel like I am forced to do it against my will, all the magic is gone and the end result is never as good :)

P.S. I just realized I can only say that because I do not have kid yet. :) I guess I won't be able to keep this up in that case, would not be fair of me to subject them to my not-so healthy diet and eating out/ordering in for 4 people so often could probably get very expensive at times. /sigh



Oh, I thought maybe it was a Taoist thing..... (The best vegan restaurants here in Sydney are Taoist, but they don't use garlic or onion). I like onions because it gives me a 'meaty' feeling for some foods, without actually having to eat an animal. :P

I'm the same with cooking. It's always better with wine. On the subject of wine, I usually visit the barnivore site for my wine/alcohol lists. Apparently some alcohols either contain gelatine or get strained through part of a cow/pig/fish. So, you might want to look into that. There's some great vego wines out there these days though!

 

It's nice if you have the option for not having to cook, I say run with it for as long as you can! Some days, I'd love to not cook. On most of those days, my partner is able to take over the kitchen duties....But other days, I just wish there were more options to just go out to eat.....

Good luck with everything!


 

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#12 Old 11-08-2013, 02:22 AM
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Oh, I thought maybe it was a Taoist thing..... (The best vegan restaurants here in Sydney are Taoist, but they don't use garlic or onion). I like onions because it gives me a 'meaty' feeling for some foods, without actually having to eat an animal. :P

I'm the same with cooking. It's always better with wine. On the subject of wine, I usually visit the barnivore site for my wine/alcohol lists. Apparently some alcohols either contain gelatine or get strained through part of a cow/pig/fish. So, you might want to look into that. There's some great vego wines out there these days though!

 

It's nice if you have the option for not having to cook, I say run with it for as long as you can! Some days, I'd love to not cook. On most of those days, my partner is able to take over the kitchen duties....But other days, I just wish there were more options to just go out to eat.....

Good luck with everything!


 


Lucky me, turns out that barnivore site even has a German branch :) Need to look into that. I was not even aware that most wines contained gelatine. I guess I have a long way to go before I eliminate the hidden animal products from my life completely..

 

My partner also often takes over the kitchen duties, however the downside of that is always eating pasta. That's about the only thing he can make (without meat). He refuses to make veggie dishes and I am also afraid to let him! :D

 

And thanks! :)

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#13 Old 11-08-2013, 03:08 PM
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Lucky me, turns out that barnivore site even has a German branch :) Need to look into that. I was not even aware that most wines contained gelatine. I guess I have a long way to go before I eliminate the hidden animal products from my life completely..

 

My partner also often takes over the kitchen duties, however the downside of that is always eating pasta. That's about the only thing he can make (without meat). He refuses to make veggie dishes and I am also afraid to let him! :D

 

And thanks! :)


LOL!


Well, most wines use cows or fish in the processing. Some beers have gelatine. Though, there's definitely more vegan wines out there now. You chose a good time to switch sides :P

It takes a while to do it completely because you just don't realise how many things animals are used in. Sometimes, even sprinkles have gelatine on them. There are food dyes that use cochineal (bugs). But my rule is- Once you find out it's not vego, you stop. But you can't know everything to begin with. My partner is vegetarian too, so when I made the transition I already knew a lot of what I needed to look for in regards to ingredients. (Though, he doesn't drink, so the wine/beer thing came as a bit of a surprise!).







 

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#14 Old 11-11-2013, 12:22 AM
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LOL!


Well, most wines use cows or fish in the processing. Some beers have gelatine. Though, there's definitely more vegan wines out there now. You chose a good time to switch sides :P

It takes a while to do it completely because you just don't realise how many things animals are used in. Sometimes, even sprinkles have gelatine on them. There are food dyes that use cochineal (bugs). But my rule is- Once you find out it's not vego, you stop. But you can't know everything to begin with. My partner is vegetarian too, so when I made the transition I already knew a lot of what I needed to look for in regards to ingredients. (Though, he doesn't drink, so the wine/beer thing came as a bit of a surprise!).







 


I took a look at some of my ''usual'' wines (nothing fancy, meant for the usual day-evening drinking) and discovered that they do not even have such a thing as the list of ingredients. They just say ''Merlot'' or ''X''. That's so strange, how the hell I'm supposed to know if they contain gelatine.. But I guess the vegan ones will clearly state they are vegan.. or`?

 

Sprinkles? Yep, this is gonna take a while. In some utopian world everything containing animal parts would clearly state in big bold letters ''animal parts''. In this world however it often does not say anything at all (like the wines), or lists them as something unpronounceable along the lines of ''xilopasbethineragnanshter'' (just invented that, obviously).

 

My partner also does not drink (except the occasional beer) and he could not care less about wine. His reaction to my announcement that from now on we have to get animal-free wines was something like ''Why would you do that, it is such a waste of money and effort, it's just an innocent side-product and it's not like you actually eat meat''. The joys of living with meat-lovers, huh? :)

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#15 Old 11-11-2013, 02:28 PM
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I took a look at some of my ''usual'' wines (nothing fancy, meant for the usual day-evening drinking) and discovered that they do not even have such a thing as the list of ingredients. They just say ''Merlot'' or ''X''. That's so strange, how the hell I'm supposed to know if they contain gelatine.. But I guess the vegan ones will clearly state they are vegan.. or`?

 

Sprinkles? Yep, this is gonna take a while. In some utopian world everything containing animal parts would clearly state in big bold letters ''animal parts''. In this world however it often does not say anything at all (like the wines), or lists them as something unpronounceable along the lines of ''xilopasbethineragnanshter'' (just invented that, obviously).

 

My partner also does not drink (except the occasional beer) and he could not care less about wine. His reaction to my announcement that from now on we have to get animal-free wines was something like ''Why would you do that, it is such a waste of money and effort, it's just an innocent side-product and it's not like you actually eat meat''. The joys of living with meat-lovers, huh? :)



LOL!

Welcome to Vego World, Population- You and Your Internet! :P Google search is your friend now. You'll use it to find out almost everything about the products you use. Ha ha!

Some wines say they're vegan on the bottle, others have lists on their websites of their vegan selection.

It is a little bit of effort, but the price difference isn't that great. A lot of people seem to think it's expensive, no matter what you're getting, if it's vegan or vegetarian. A lot of people are wrong. No, I can no longer buy a 10 dollar bottle of red. But the 22 dollar bottle of cab-sav that I get is very nice, smooth and doesn't give me a headache, the way the 10 dollar bottle did. So, I call that a win-win :D

And yeah, some people don't get the by-products thing. But I just tell them- "I wouldn't eat pasta if it was strained through a cow gut, I wouldn't eat rice if it had bits of pork in it. I'm not eating anything else with 'bits' of meat in it either". Or, if I want to be diplomatic "I will unknowingly consume animal products anyway, be it someone mixing up the vego stock with the beef stock, or putting cheese with rennet on something that I eat. So, wherever I can knowingly not consume an animal, then I don't"

Tiger Lilly is offline  
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