How not to hate meat-eaters? - VeggieBoards
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#1 Old 03-15-2011, 03:03 PM
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I went vegetarian only a few months ago. I'm glad I finally made that choice and I know it's the right choice and all. But the thing is, I live with meat-eaters. All my friends and family are meat-eaters. I just keep thinking about my old care-free omnivorous days when I didn't know/think about the horrors of factory farms and could enjoy all the meals together with my friends without guilt and most importantly without judging them.

And now... even though I stopped eating meat and my conscience is clear(er), I still care about all the animals in the world. And I know, no matter how many animals I save, many more will still suffer a horrible life and an even more horrible death and I just can't help thinking that my friends and family members are indirectly responsible for that... And they are not my enimies, they are my friends, my loved ones! I don't wanna hate them for their choices... But everytime they eat meat or discuss an especially delicious meat recepe or say: "hey, let's go to McDonalds!", I wanna scream: "people, don't you understand what are you doing? don't you realize, how cruel it is! Don't you care about animals? How can you say you love animals when everyday you eat them?!!". I just feel so separated from them... not like before...

I don't expect that any of them would go vegetarian any time soon. Most of them, are those people who "choose to remain blind' about the horrors of meat industry. Some, men especially, I guess, wouldn't go vegetarian even if they knew. I"m kinda scared to know if there are really any people like this among my friends, because I probably wouldn't be able to be friends with them anymore...

I just don't know how to feel about it now... My friends are good people. They are so kind and tolerant and open-minded. I'm so grateful I have them in my life. You know, there's another thing that alienates me sometimes - I'm gay. And my friends, who are mostly straight, have been nothing but supportive and non-judgemental about it. And sometimes, I think, what if my friends were homophobes? (frankly, i can't imagine how i could be friends with a homophobe, but what if?) What if they were good people except their hate for homosexuality? I could never love anyone who hates a person for their sexual orientation. But that would be their right, their choice, their belief, right? And eating meat is also a choice. Than how can I be friends with people like this?

You know, sometimes, I have a moment of closeness with one of my friends, we talk about personal stuff, and i think to myself: "oh, she's so great, we're so alike, i love her so much, I can trust her anything!" and than I remeber "oh, but she eats meat..." and the feeling of closeness dissapears and I feel alone again.

It's just hard, you know. Makes me feel alone around my own friends... And I want to respect their choices the same way they respect my choice to become vegetarian, but how can I, when the choices they make affect the entire planet and billions of innocent animals? How can I be ok with that?!
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#2 Old 03-15-2011, 03:17 PM
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Unless you want to be very lonely, you really do need to find a way to be ok with meat-eaters.

Seriously, it can be lonely out here. Which is why a place like VB has become important to a lot of us here. At least we can come here and be amongst fellow veg*ns.

But you're right - your feelings for omnis has likely changed. But keep in mind that you're the one who has changed, you're the one who is following a new and different path. Hopefully, some (heck, hopefully all!) of your friends and family will become veg*n at some point, but you can't force it. And you will probably find, over time, that your feelings resolve themselves somewhat. Not that it will ever be ok for those you love to eat meat, but you'll come to accept that you've made a choice that they simply haven't made yet. The very best thing you can do is learn to make some yummy veggie meals and share, and have a great attitude about your new way of life!

It is our choices that show what we truly are far more than our abilities. ~A. Dumbledore
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#3 Old 03-15-2011, 03:18 PM
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You were probably an omni yourself. That is no ethical justification for meat-eating, but it's something that helps you understand how people can be in that mindset.

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#4 Old 03-15-2011, 03:21 PM
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Hate's a strong word and if you feel that, you're in for a long haul like Poppy stated.

Hate the reasons and the machine involved.

The Big Bad.
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#5 Old 03-15-2011, 03:28 PM
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I feel sad when I see most of my family and friends around me eating meat, but a lot of times, people cannot change overnight. Some people just choose not to know about the conditions of factory farming, or simply don't care about animals. I've only been vegetarian for about 7 months, and my immediate family (parents and sister) all still eat meat and I had thought at first they would all be dead set against eating vegetarian. But now, I see whenever we have family dinners, they all eat a whole lot less meat, and sometimes NO meat just because they know I'm vegetarian. Before I became vegetarian, I remember about 80% of the meal would consist of meat (pork, beef, chicken, fish, lobster...), but now when we eat together, there may be one chicken and/or fish dish and everything else is vegetarian. So maybe people are not going to become vegetarian, but I think when family sees you eating vegetarian, they might at least consume less meat...and I guess at least that makes a little bit of difference.

About being gay...you ask what if your friends are good people, but hate homosexuals? Personally, I would have to redefine how good they really are if they hate people just because they are gay or different in any way. You say it would be their right/choice if people choose to hate homosexuals. But it is not the right choice or good choice and I would not accept it just because people think they have a right to their beliefs. If people believe it's ok to attack others because they are of a different ethnic group, color, gender, sexual orientation...society has a duty to reject these beliefs. We should respect the individuals (as fellow humans), but certainly Not these beliefs.
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#6 Old 03-15-2011, 03:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by unovegan View Post

Hate's a strong word and if you feel that, you're in for a long haul

That was even recently confirmed by a study, actually. Hateful people more likely to fall asleep in cars that get towed, by Rasmussen, K. and Veenland, I.
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#7 Old 03-15-2011, 03:29 PM
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I know how that feels; when I first went veg, I wanted to yell at everyone about what they were doing to the world. I still do want to, sometimes. But all that is gonna do is reenforce the stereotype that we're all crazy, forceful, preachy people, and it'll probably lose you some friends along the way. What I chose to do instead was wait it out. Eventually, people started to genuinely ask me about my diet and the reasons behind it. They saw positive changes in me; my health and happiness, how easy I found it to get food, how I genuinely didn't miss non-veg products. Some of them tried vegetarianism, some cut down on their meat intake, some just became a bit more accepting of veg*ns in general. All good things.

I kind of think of it as one of those things that society has to come around to in its own time; hopefully, like racism and homophobia, animal cruelty will go from the 'norm' to something that's looked down upon, and fewer and fewer people will carry it out. We just have to lead by example, and do whatever we feel we can to help the cause. In the meantime, just remember that these people are still your friends and you still love them, no matter what they put in their mouths :P


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#8 Old 03-15-2011, 03:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Sevenseas View Post

That was even recently confirmed by a study, actually. Hateful people more likely to fall asleep in cars that get towed, by Rasmussen, K. and Veenland, I.

hmm. i thought it was:

Hateful people more likely to get kidnapped in cars' trunks that get Towed by Rasmussen, T. and Whitedottir, I.

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#9 Old 03-15-2011, 03:31 PM
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Oh, and on the point of 'what if your friends hated homosexuals';

If they hate you for being what you are (gay, vegetarian, etc), then they aren't real friends. But just because they aren't those things, doesn't mean they can't be your friends. They can be perfectly supportive of you being gay without being gay themselves; same goes for vegetarianism.


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#10 Old 03-15-2011, 03:54 PM
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I went vegetarian only a few months ago.

There's your answer.
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#11 Old 03-15-2011, 04:44 PM
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I do understand what you are talking about. I love my friends, but sometimes they do or say things about meat that just makes me angry and it is hard to believe that my wonderful friends really don't care about the suffering of animals. with time i am learning to deal with it better. one way is to just remember what kind of society we are living in. it is very omni oriented. we all have lived our whole life knowing that eating meat is fine. our parents, doctors, people of authority etc. said that meat is important for health. it would be hard to expect everyone to open their mind and see the reality right now. if we were a few hundreds years from now, where vegetarian movement has moved much farther i could not be friends with them, but since these are the beginnings i should be more tolerant about it.
and yes, i also try not to be too preachy, or show my anger. so that they dont think of us as crazy. i just try to present points in favor of veg*nism from time to time in a not pushy way
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#12 Old 03-15-2011, 06:20 PM
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Trust me, I know how you feel. I've been through this phase a couple of times. It kind of just fixed itself. I'm not sure how, but I know that just because people eat meat it doesn't make them bad people. To be honest, most people don't understand what they're doing. It's so acceptable to eat meat and so hidden how they're treated, they don't stop and think twice about it. I know it's hard to understand, but almost everyone on vb had the same look on things. I hope I helped!

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#13 Old 03-16-2011, 10:40 AM
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You ate meat a few months ago, were you a cruel, selfish, heartless, bad person?

By going vegetarian, you don't suddenly go from being a bad person to a good person. The choices we make reflect who we are, but they do not define who we are. I don't think I'm a better person now than I was before I went vegan/vegetarian, I make better choices, but I'm the same person - I'm not any kinder, softer, more open minded, etc etc etc, I'm just putting those things into action better - in this single instance.

When first becomming aware of animal rights movements, and reading a lot of articles/websites/watching videos/etc - even forums like here - that can be full of very emotive information, you can become quite wrapped up in the whole thing, and let it make you feel sad or angry. Personally I try to distance myself from that, and focus on the philosophy and reason that lead me to where I am, and don't let it become a this huge defining thing in my life - its just a little part of who I am, and a little part of what I believe (but of course, a very important one). Most people believe in most of the same things as I do, so why concentrait on the one (or more likley, few!) thing(s) we disagree on? Why let what they don't agree with me on, define who they are for me?
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#14 Old 03-16-2011, 10:49 AM
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You ate meat a few months ago, were you a cruel, selfish, heartless, bad person?

By going vegetarian, you don't suddenly go from being a bad person to a good person. The choices we make reflect who we are, but they do not define who we are. I don't think I'm a better person now than I was before I went vegan/vegetarian, I make better choices, but I'm the same person - I'm not any kinder, softer, more open minded, etc etc etc, I'm just putting those things into action better - in this single instance.

When first becomming aware of animal rights movements, and reading a lot of articles/websites/watching videos/etc - even forums like here - that can be full of very emotive information, you can become quite wrapped up in the whole thing, and let it make you feel sad or angry. Personally I try to distance myself from that, and focus on the philosophy and reason that lead me to where I am, and don't let it become a this huge defining thing in my life - its just a little part of who I am, and a little part of what I believe (but of course, a very important one). Most people believe in most of the same things as I do, so why concentrait on the one (or more likley, few!) thing(s) we disagree on? Why let what they don't agree with me on, define who they are for me?

This.

Also, stick with it and be the best veg*n you can be by making consistent choices based on your beliefs. You might actually influence someone when you last expect it. Take my mother, for example - I've never tried pushing vegetarianism on anyone, but she surprised me about three weeks ago by deciding to go veg. She's still sticking with it and even if she gives it up at some point, this is more than I would ever have expected. Be the change you want to see in the world.

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#15 Old 03-16-2011, 11:02 AM
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Most people have been conditioned to believe that meat is okay and that isn't their fault, just as it wasn't yours. It's like hating someone for being brainwashed.
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#16 Old 03-16-2011, 05:05 PM
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I agree, it isn't always easy. I kind of hate watching people eat meat, though they often apologize for eating it in front of me (isn't that funny?). I would say your best bet is to be the happiest, healthiest vegetarian you can be. People will see that and will wonder what has changed, then you can tell them you went veg*n. Shortly after I went veg my one of best friends also went veg. I got an email the other day from a friend saying she wants to stop eating meat (she's said it like 5 times, but I keep trying to help. her hearts in the right place). My mother has tried all my vegetarian meal ideas and my boyfriend eats veg*n all the time since we live together.

Just lead by example, and remember you can't make the choice for them and that preaching will only push them away from the idea.

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#17 Old 03-16-2011, 06:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Identity_thief View Post

You ate meat a few months ago, were you a cruel, selfish, heartless, bad person?

By going vegetarian, you don't suddenly go from being a bad person to a good person. The choices we make reflect who we are, but they do not define who we are. I don't think I'm a better person now than I was before I went vegan/vegetarian, I make better choices, but I'm the same person - I'm not any kinder, softer, more open minded, etc etc etc, I'm just putting those things into action better - in this single instance.

When first becomming aware of animal rights movements, and reading a lot of articles/websites/watching videos/etc - even forums like here - that can be full of very emotive information, you can become quite wrapped up in the whole thing, and let it make you feel sad or angry. Personally I try to distance myself from that, and focus on the philosophy and reason that lead me to where I am, and don't let it become a this huge defining thing in my life - its just a little part of who I am, and a little part of what I believe (but of course, a very important one). Most people believe in most of the same things as I do, so why concentrait on the one (or more likley, few!) thing(s) we disagree on? Why let what they don't agree with me on, define who they are for me?

This is really well expressed. Thank you.
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#18 Old 03-17-2011, 12:05 AM
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Thanks again for your womderful replies! They made me feel much, much better!
Yeah, I think I just need a little more time. I just didn't really think about eating meat before and now I sort of got sucked into this new way of thinking and it's hard to think differently. But yeah, you're right. I was an omni myself only a few months ago. It seems like a long time ago though... lol
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#19 Old 06-06-2013, 12:48 PM
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"It's like hating someone for being brainwashed."

 

Good point, and I tend to agree. I remember been attacked on one site for defending a poster for writing that she had non-veg friends. It seems my defense of her made *me* an Enabler and that *that* made me a Murderer. Taking everything to its logical conclusion isn't always logical imho. I figure that, when I feel annoyed/disgusted/angry about non-vegetarianism I need to remember that I used to eat meat too. Some people take longer than others to overcome the 'brainwashing' and others might never get there. One can only teach by example in these cases, I suspect.

 

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#20 Old 06-06-2013, 07:57 PM
 
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Anything and everything you do in life, someone is gonna criticize. Vegetarianism is the perfect example. Like the other poster said, hate is a strong word. Instead, try to be civil with those around. Try talking to your family about important this to you and how you would appreciate if they would support you and on your decision. 

 

I went through the same thing with my family. After discussing this matter with them things are better.

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#21 Old 06-07-2013, 03:40 AM
 
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Should you be judged for being vegetarian and not vegan?

There is no difference between a vegan judging a vegetarian and vegetarian judging an omni. It doesn't help and we shouldn't do it.

I have said it on other threads that personally, at times, I find those following a vegetarian diet more frustrating than omni's because they are no longer brainwashed and are aware of the horrors yet at a level still participate. However, I don't hate them or judge them and never will.

I have been omni, vegetarian & vegan and being judged did not/does not help at all. I adopted the lifestyle because people either lead by example or presented me with the information and then allowed me to
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#22 Old 06-07-2013, 03:41 AM
 
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.... go away and digest it, weigh up both sides of the argument and not put any pressure on me.
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#23 Old 06-07-2013, 09:03 AM
 
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I find your post very interesting because I understand why you feel that way, and I thought I would feel that way too. But since I've stopped eating meat after watching the way animals are being treated I didn't feel the need to judge my family and friends about their meat eating habits. In fact, sometimes I think THEY are the ones that judge me and think I am going too extreme by not eating meat. I think I feel this way because I understand going vegetarian was my decision and I don't expect them to change something they believe its not wrong. My family are big meat eaters and my college roommates are too.  And I also think that in a way meat eaters believe that we vegetarians think we are better than them because we stopped eating meat and that is enough to even cause a bit of tension in a household. For example: when I stayed over at my grandfather's house I had to cook my own dinners and sometimes that felt weird because I felt that they thought I was being a but extreme. I guess I am sensitive to the atmosphere. I think what I want to say is that  I understand why you feel that way, and each person deals with meat eaters differently, but to live a happier live with those around you sometimes it is best to do things for yourself and try not to change others around you because chances are they might resent you for it.

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#24 Old 06-07-2013, 03:07 PM
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 I think I feel this way because I understand going vegetarian was my decision and I don't expect them to change something they believe its not wrong. My family are big meat eaters and my college roommates are too.  And I also think that in a way meat eaters believe that we vegetarians think we are better than them because we stopped eating meat and that is enough to even cause a bit of tension in a household. For example: when I stayed over at my grandfather's house I had to cook my own dinners and sometimes that felt weird because I felt that they thought I was being a but extreme. I guess I am sensitive to the atmosphere. I think what I want to say is that  I understand why you feel that way, and each person deals with meat eaters differently, but to live a happier live with those around you sometimes it is best to do things for yourself and try not to change others around you because chances are they might resent you for it.

Except that the majority of people think animal cruelty is wrong, yet those same people support the cruelty of slaughterhouses. They know but they don't "know". They would think it's wrong.

 

Oh yes. I have tried to convert others in a friendly fashion, and some resent me for it. But you know what? I don't care. I speak up for the animals, and I don't go around acting like I care about animals, but when actually faced with animal cruelty, turn my back to it if it's inconvenient for me. People resent me for making them feel uncomfortable. They should feel uncomfortable as the animals have not even 1 inch of comfort on the dirty slaughter house floors as they soaked in their own excrement. 

 

I used to think like you actually, that I should just be polite and not try to convert everyone, act as if it's just my personal choice....until I released that not speaking up for the animals only keeps them in the dark. Of course, people don't really care if you are vegan if you keep it to yourself....what they don't know or think about can't hurt them right? But it hurts someone else.

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#25 Old 06-08-2013, 01:58 PM
 
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Great post. I think it is awesome how passionate you are.
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#26 Old 06-08-2013, 03:50 PM
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I have said it on other threads that personally, at times, I find those following a vegetarian diet more frustrating than omni's because they are no longer brainwashed and are aware of the horrors yet at a level still participate. However, I don't hate them or judge them and never will.


But some omnies may well be aware of what goes on in the meat(etc) industry. Just because they continue to eat animal products doesn't prove they don't.

And why wouldn't a vegetarian be brain washed? We grow up thinking and being told that eating eggs and dairy is fine, the same with meat(for a lot of people). That's just as much brain washing, and it has to be undone the same as the meat brain washing.

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#27 Old 06-10-2013, 12:00 AM
 
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The vast majority of omni's I speak to have no idea about the meat industry. One person believed that animals lived in fields then is sent to the butcher when they die of old age. Another thought they were euthanised. Yes there will always be those which will ignore it mainly through pressure society.

Vegetarians are more likely to be aware and are about animals and also go away and do the research. When you do this research it obviously comes up with info on veganism and what goes on in the egg and dairy industry.

I know what you mean though because when I was vegetarian I had no idea about the horrors of the dairy industry and needed to be told. As soon as I knew I cut it out. Due to this being my experience I now always talk to vegetarians about it in case they don't know like me. It's not trying to 'convert' them it's trying to inform them on something they may not be aware of. If they don't take it on board that's fine but I still won't be able to wrap my head round it!
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#28 Old 06-10-2013, 02:05 AM
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It is easier for someone who has gone veg or is interested in going veg, to do research these days, if they have access to the internet.

When I went veg back around 1980 it didn't even occur to me to do any research, you just don't eat meat(I only ate it occasionally anyway, as my parents were veg), or the by products, and there wasn't the internet of course.....I had heard some talk of killing baby goats in the process of getting the mother's milk, but I just forced myself to believe that that only applied to goats. There wasn't the casual way one could google stuff now.

I suppose people now days might take a similar approach; just stop eating meat, and that's that.

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#29 Old 06-10-2013, 02:14 AM
 
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Which is why vegetarians shouldn't get annoyed when vegans attempt to inform them in case they weren't already aware.

We both agree that most vegetarians are unaware of the egg and dairy industry which is why the above happens. The fact that *some* vegetarians use 'preachy' vegans as an excuse not to take the simple step of cutting out the additional products is what annoys me. They have empathy for animals and understand the morality of why animal products should not be consumed yet won't give them up much like an omni won't give up meat.

It's just my thoughts and like I said I don't 'hate' anyone because of it, it's frustrating when about 1 in 10 people I know are vegetarian but only 1 in 100 are vegan. To me I would love to see
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#30 Old 06-10-2013, 02:15 AM
 
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11 in 100 being vegan and making it more socially acceptable and increasing the products out there!

Ps did I do the maths right there? I'm awful at numbers!
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