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Poverty Illegal?

post #1 of 17
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Although the U.S. abolished debtors' prisons in the 1830s, more than a third of U.S. states allow the police to haul people in who don't pay all manner of debts, from bills for health care services to credit card and auto loans...

...Under the law, debtors aren't arrested for nonpayment, but rather for failing to respond to court hearings, pay legal fines, or otherwise showing "contempt of court" in connection with a creditor lawsuit.

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-505144_1...btors-prisons/

Disturbing trend.

"There is more wisdom in the song of a bird, than in the speech of a philosopher...." -Oahspe
"....The thing is, you cannot judge a race. Any man who judges by the group is a pea-wit. You take men one at a time." -Buster Kilrain, The Killer Angels -Michael Shaara
" .... " -Harpo Marx

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"There is more wisdom in the song of a bird, than in the speech of a philosopher...." -Oahspe
"....The thing is, you cannot judge a race. Any man who judges by the group is a pea-wit. You take men one at a time." -Buster Kilrain, The Killer Angels -Michael Shaara
" .... " -Harpo Marx

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post #2 of 17
Health care, or the lack of, in the United States really upsets me. Anyone could have a medical emergency that ruins them financially for years or forever. And these hospitals, as well as other medical providers, are ruthless when it comes to getting their money.
post #3 of 17
Picking on the poor is quickly becoming America's favorite pastime.
post #4 of 17
Quote:
Some states also apply "poverty penalties," including late fees, payment plan fees, and interest when people are unable to pay all their debts at once, according to a report by the New York University's Brennan Center for Justice. Alabama charges a 30 percent collection fee, for instance, while Florida allows private debt collectors to add a 40 percent surcharge on the original debt. Some Florida counties also use so-called collection courts, where debtors can be jailed but have no right to a public defender.

Ridiculous.
post #5 of 17
Quote:
Originally Posted by MHKLLVM View Post

Picking on the poor is quickly becoming America's favorite pastime.

Well, on the plus side, it's becoming more and more inclusive.
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post #6 of 17
Quote:
Originally Posted by MHKLLVM View Post

Picking on the poor is quickly becoming America's favorite pastime.

Welfare and food stamps are two benefits among many that many still have. The poor in most other countries have life much more difficult than the poor do in the United States.
post #7 of 17
Quote:
Originally Posted by rainforests1 View Post

Welfare and food stamps are two benefits among many that many still have. The poor in most other countries have life much more difficult than the poor do in the United States.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...y-adjusted_HDI

Social democracies kick ass.
post #8 of 17
Quote:
Originally Posted by MHKLLVM View Post

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...y-adjusted_HDI

Social democracies kick ass.

I'll assume that the fact that the top 10-15 or so countries on this list are for the most part racially-homogenous, low population density and don't share borders with 3rd world countries is just a coincidence and has no bearing on the level of their inequality. But yeah, go social democracy.
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post #9 of 17
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zoe74 View Post

I'll assume that the fact that the top 10-15 or so countries on this list are for the most part racially-homogenous, low population density and don't share borders with 3rd world countries is just a coincidence and has no bearing on the level of their inequality. But yeah, go social democracy.

The Nordic countries in particular invest heavily in education and R&D, and, gasp, actively try to minimize inequality, spending more than a quarter of their GDP on social programs. They also don't lay waste to their commons, like we do. Imagine the uproar here if anyone suggests that we nationalize oil like Norway.

Of course, it's your prerogative if you want to stick your head in the sand and try to wash away the discrepancy with talking points instead of hard data...
post #10 of 17
Quote:
Originally Posted by MHKLLVM View Post

The Nordic countries in particular invest heavily in education and R&D

So does the US, although with education the results aren't very impressive

Quote:
actively try to minimize inequality, spending more than a quarter of their GDP on social programs.

Not sure what you consider to be social programs

Quote:

They also don't lay waste to their commons, like we do. Imagine the uproar here if anyone suggests that we nationalize oil like Norway.

Agreed.
Quote:

Of course, it's your prerogative if you want to stick your head in the sand and try to wash away the discrepancy with talking points instead of hard data...

You are the one who is assuming causation rather than correlation by only looking at one particular talking point (amount of money spent on collective interests) and ignoring other situational parameters
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post #11 of 17
Oh good, then some of these countries that are doing so well can chip in a little more to the NATO budget, as currently the US pays 75% of it, up from 50% in 1989.
post #12 of 17
Perhaps the US could follow their example... I wonder how many social programs one could fund with even half of its military expenditure.
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post #13 of 17
Quote:
Originally Posted by Savvington View Post

Perhaps the US could follow their example... I wonder how many social programs one could fund with even half of its military expenditure.

To an extent I think a lot of the military is a social program. Take otherwise unemployed young males, give them training, employment and a GI bill for when they get out.
post #14 of 17
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Forster View Post

To an extent I think a lot of the military is a social program. Take otherwise unemployed young males, give them training, employment and a GI bill for when they get out.

I'd consider that more anti-social, considering what they're trained to do.

"There is more wisdom in the song of a bird, than in the speech of a philosopher...." -Oahspe
"....The thing is, you cannot judge a race. Any man who judges by the group is a pea-wit. You take men one at a time." -Buster Kilrain, The Killer Angels -Michael Shaara
" .... " -Harpo Marx

Reply

"There is more wisdom in the song of a bird, than in the speech of a philosopher...." -Oahspe
"....The thing is, you cannot judge a race. Any man who judges by the group is a pea-wit. You take men one at a time." -Buster Kilrain, The Killer Angels -Michael Shaara
" .... " -Harpo Marx

Reply
post #15 of 17
Quote:
Originally Posted by MHKLLVM View Post

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...y-adjusted_HDI

Social democracies kick ass.

23rd out of 134 countries. Not too bad. A person can go to their local library and get free Internet access. You can receive books, DVD's, and music CD's for free at your local library. Along with welfare, food stamps, and other benefits, I'd say the poor aren't doing too bad today, at least in this country.

The rich gets benefits from the government, and the middle class has to pay. The poor gets benefits from the government, and the middle class has to pay most of it. I'd say it's much more the middle class that is suffering today rather than the poor.
post #16 of 17
Quote:
Originally Posted by Savvington View Post

Perhaps the US could follow their example... I wonder how many social programs one could fund with even half of its military expenditure.

Since many of the US's overseas military bases are under review, it may turn out to be how many fewer social programs some of the countries at the top of that list can have if they feel the need to replace the role US plays in NATO countries' safety.

ETA Just to clarify, I've been against every war, and every bombing that we don't call a war, since I was a child in the Viet Nam era.: I also think we should bring our troops home from Europe and close the bases.
post #17 of 17
Quote:
Originally Posted by Forster View Post

To an extent I think a lot of the military is a social program. Take otherwise unemployed young males, give them training, employment and a GI bill for when they get out.

Thnx for the invisibility.
Who needs sleep when we've got love?
Who needs keys when we've got clubs?
Who needs please when we've got guns?
Who needs peace when we've gone above?
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Who needs sleep when we've got love?
Who needs keys when we've got clubs?
Who needs please when we've got guns?
Who needs peace when we've gone above?
Reply
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