Dan Savage "blasts" bible - VeggieBoards
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#1 Old 04-30-2012, 06:54 AM
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http://ology.com/post/75122/video-sa...hristian-teens

I agree with him.

And do those teens look bullied or arrogant? The latter, IMO.
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#2 Old 04-30-2012, 07:02 AM
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Gee willikers, someone called some text bull****. I'm sure the text's feelings are now very hurt.

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#3 Old 04-30-2012, 07:47 AM
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Not surprising. Hypocrites can rarely stand to hear their own faults. Of course the individuals who stormed out would find Savage's comments about the Bible more offensive than their own inconsistent picking-and-choosing of which tenets they'll follow.

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#4 Old 04-30-2012, 07:48 AM
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Criticizing the bible is very original and creative.

"Hell exists not to punish sinners, but to ensure that nobody sins in the first place."
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#5 Old 04-30-2012, 07:59 AM
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A lot of students seemed to have left.
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#6 Old 04-30-2012, 09:03 AM
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Criticizing the bible is very original and creative.

Maybe not, but it's very necessary.
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#7 Old 04-30-2012, 10:27 AM
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These sorts of things just perpetuate ignorance. Why not say something that keeps kids in their seats while simultaneously challenging how they approach their sacred texts? But I guess that doesn't sell books.
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#8 Old 04-30-2012, 10:36 AM
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These sorts of things just perpetuate ignorance. Why not say something that keeps kids in their seats while simultaneously challenging how they approach their sacred texts? But I guess that doesn't sell books.

Meh, I don't know, I can't imagine being insulted enough to muster enough faux outrage to get up an leave anything. I'd listen, might disagree, but I'd listen.
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#9 Old 04-30-2012, 01:56 PM
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Maybe not, but it's very necessary.


Bingo.

I make it a point to grill my "moderate Christian" friends. I personally feel that people who call themselves Christian, remain silent while their preacher or families bash gays, but don't share their views themselves are hypocrites and enablers of the lowest and most craven sort. Speak your mind and speak it NOW. If you're part of a group that doesn't share your values, debate and fight. Leave if necessary. To quote Hitchens "The grave will provide plenty of time for silence."

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#10 Old 04-30-2012, 02:48 PM
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Bingo.

I make it a point to grill my "moderate Christian" friends. I personally feel that people who call themselves Christian, remain silent while their preacher or families bash gays, but don't share their views themselves are hypocrites and enablers of the lowest and most craven sort. Speak your mind and speak it NOW. If you're part of a group that doesn't share your values, debate and fight. Leave if necessary. To quote Hitchens "The grave will provide plenty of time for silence."

I don't blame people for not being able to go against an incredible societal pressure.

"Hell exists not to punish sinners, but to ensure that nobody sins in the first place."
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#11 Old 04-30-2012, 02:50 PM
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Minds me of something that greatly amused me ..

Some mud-monkey is said to have once tried to put Gandhi on the spot with a question to the effect of; "what do you think of Jesus?"

Ghandi's reply: “I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.”
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#12 Old 04-30-2012, 02:53 PM
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I dont think there is actually anything wrong with the bible, I think the real problem is people failing to realise that it is a 2000 year old text and that some (or many) of the things in it are going to be ridiculous and not to be taken literally, and possibly were only written as metaphor then.

I also think the problem is people not having the freedom to interpret the bible as they choose and instead having to listen to a human, fallible authority on it.

And also people persecuting others who not interpret the bible like they do. And people using the bible to sanction bigotry.
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#13 Old 04-30-2012, 04:03 PM
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I think he sounded rude. An adult attacking the religion of high school students is inappropriate, although his message of anti-gay bashing is appropriate.

If he attacked the Koran like that, I wonder what the reaction would be.
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#14 Old 04-30-2012, 04:52 PM
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I dont think there is actually anything wrong with the bible, I think the real problem is people failing to realise that it is a 2000 year old text and that some (or many) of the things in it are going to be ridiculous and not to be taken literally, and possibly were only written as metaphor then.

A good chunk of it is older than 2,000 years.
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#15 Old 04-30-2012, 05:06 PM
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Bingo.

I make it a point to grill my "moderate Christian" friends. I personally feel that people who call themselves Christian, remain silent while their preacher or families bash gays, but don't share their views themselves are hypocrites and enablers of the lowest and most craven sort. Speak your mind and speak it NOW. If you're part of a group that doesn't share your values, debate and fight. Leave if necessary. To quote Hitchens "The grave will provide plenty of time for silence."


This is what ultimately led me to leave the Catholic church. I disagreed with so much of its teachings, yet still went to church and silently condoned it.

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#16 Old 04-30-2012, 06:33 PM
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If he attacked the Koran like that, I wonder what the reaction would be.

It wouldn't make sense to "attack" the Qur'an. No one ever uses the Qur'an to defend their anti-gay bigotry; they use the Bible. Further, Christianity is the dominate religion in the United States, in Congress, and the reason 1,138 rights are denied to gay people in this country.
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#17 Old 04-30-2012, 07:47 PM
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It wouldn't make sense to "attack" the Qur'an. No one ever uses the Qur'an to defend their anti-gay bigotry; they use the Bible. Further, Christianity is the dominate religion in the United States, in Congress, and the reason 1,138 rights are denied to gay people in this country.

I've thrown out five replies already. Look, I'm not even Christian, I support all gay rights, I always have. It is ridiculous that anyone has to even have this conversation. But I don't think insulting the main religious text for the dominant religion to a bunch of high schoolers is going to help the cause at all. And then insulting the kids that left! I think my original snarky reply came from just despising his speech and the way he disrespected those students.
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#18 Old 04-30-2012, 07:56 PM
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It wouldn't make sense to "attack" the Qur'an. No one ever uses the Qur'an to defend their anti-gay bigotry; they use the Bible. Further, Christianity is the dominate religion in the United States, in Congress, and the reason 1,138 rights are denied to gay people in this country.

Believe it or not some Muslims do use the Qur'an to justify anti-gay positions, it's just harder because there are no explicitly anti-gay statements in the texts. There are other sources of anti-gay sentiment in Islam, each one shadier and less verifiable than the one before.
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#19 Old 04-30-2012, 08:00 PM
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I've thrown out five replies already. Look, I'm not even Christian, I support all gay rights, I always have. It is ridiculous that anyone has to even have this conversation. But I don't think insulting the main religious text for the dominant religion to a bunch of high schoolers is going to help the cause at all. And then insulting the kids that left! I think my original snarky reply came from just despising his speech and the way he disrespected those students.

Perhaps religion should not be a sacred cow. Yes, Dan Savage could have been far more diplomatic, and I think that would be a better way to change people's beliefs, but that doesn't mean we should tolerate religious bigotry or abuse in any form.
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#20 Old 04-30-2012, 08:16 PM
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Perhaps religion should not be a sacred cow. Yes, Dan Savage could have been far more diplomatic, and I think that would be a better way to change people's beliefs, but that doesn't mean we should tolerate religious bigotry or abuse in any form.

I'm assuming that was a public school, so he should have kept religion out of it anyway.
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#21 Old 04-30-2012, 08:27 PM
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Perhaps religion should not be a sacred cow. Yes, Dan Savage could have been far more diplomatic, and I think that would be a better way to change people's beliefs, but that doesn't mean we should tolerate religious bigotry or abuse in any form.

Religion shouldn't be a sacred cow, but calling parts of the bible bullsh*t is not a pragmatic or intelligent approach to the problem.
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#22 Old 04-30-2012, 09:33 PM
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Every time I see the thread title I imagine the guy shooting the bible with a homemade rocket.

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#23 Old 05-01-2012, 02:51 AM
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=neV3PnOyEN0&feature=g-all-u

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Religion shouldn't be a sacred cow, but calling parts of the bible bullsh*t is not a pragmatic or intelligent approach to the problem.

So you think the Bible is right about slavery?

If you don't think slavery is right, that means it's bullsh*t. By extension the parts of the Bible that condone it are bullsh*t as well, correct?

Tam! RUGH!
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#24 Old 05-01-2012, 04:40 AM
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The guy missed an opportunity to speak against slavery, homophobia, and other wrongs that are bull**** in our society by insulting an audience that otherwise would have been open to his message. Oops.
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#25 Old 05-01-2012, 05:00 AM
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No text in human culture should enjoy the privilege of immunity to being insulted or called bull****. Someone would be entitled to call The Da Vinci Code a piece of **** book, even to an audience of Dan Brown fans. The level of devotion people have to a text, and the high importance they place on that text in their daily practice, does not change the fundamental issue that, as a text and as a cultural artifact, it is open for the public to comment on how they wish.

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#26 Old 05-01-2012, 06:44 AM
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The guy missed an opportunity to speak against slavery, homophobia, and other wrongs that are bull**** in our society by insulting an audience that otherwise would have been open to his message. Oops.

Actually no, I think his method worked perfectly. I gathered most of the students stayed, most of those that left wouldn't have been open to his message anyway. The commotion they caused created a "moment" for those who stayed and I guarantee his message was retained by those open to it.
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#27 Old 05-01-2012, 10:27 AM
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=neV3PnOyEN0&feature=g-all-u



So you think the Bible is right about slavery?

If you don't think slavery is right, that means it's bullsh*t. By extension the parts of the Bible that condone it are bullsh*t as well, correct?

I guess it would depend on your definition of bullsh*t.
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#28 Old 05-01-2012, 02:40 PM
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Believing that the rules of your favorite imaginary friend should trump the Bill of Rights and basic human empathy is bullsh*t on a nearly objective level.

Tam! RUGH!
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#29 Old 05-01-2012, 03:55 PM
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Believing that the rules of your favorite imaginary friend should trump the Bill of Rights and basic human empathy is bullsh*t on a nearly objective level.

Well, arguing that either one trumps the other without substantiating evidence certainly isn't productive at all.
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#30 Old 05-02-2012, 04:35 PM
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Religion shouldn't be a sacred cow, but calling parts of the bible bullsh*t is not a pragmatic or intelligent approach to the problem.

But The Bible got its retaliation in first with Psalm 14 verse 1: The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God.

Not much respect there for atheists.
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