Losing faith... A veg-to-veg pep talk? - VeggieBoards

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#1 Old 11-21-2015, 03:45 AM
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Losing faith... A veg-to-veg pep talk?

So I've been (was?) vegetarian for 3 and a half years, but recently, I've just kind of stopped caring. Not completely, obviously that's why I'm posting this thread... but for the most part.

See, I've never been totally against the principle of eating meat. Even though I didn't eat it, I accept that humans are omnivores and that it's natural to want to eat meat. I just really dislike the factory/farm business - if I could hunt my food in the wild with my own tools and initiative, then I'd have no problem, but that's not really possible... So I abstained.

However where I live it's not that easy to be vegetarian. Tofu, tempah, seitan is really hard to find and quite expensive. There is generally only ONE type of lentil for sale, and it's the one I dislike the most. People here have never even HEARD of halloumi, let alone know where to buy it. If I want to go out for food my choices are chips and falafel, don't get me wrong I love falafel but there's no good falafel around generally, always just cheap take away stuff. For example I went out for dinner 2 months ago and got a vegetarian burger with salad and chips, and the burger itself was just 2 buns filled with tomatoes, grated carrots and some yucky thick sauce of sorts. That's it, no patty of any sorts or even any cheese. I paid €15 for it. It was disheartening to say the least.

So lately I've just kind of not cared about the moral aspect of things. I've tried thinking about it extensively, reading about it, etc, but it's just not really bothering me that much. Yesterday I decided to eat 2 fresh salmon fillets, and today I ate 2 garlic sausages, and I thoroughly enjoyed both.

I'm just kind of sick of lentils, sick of chickpeas, sick of beans, sick of soups, curries, chilis, and pastas... Just bored with it all really. Sick of having to make that much more effort for food I don't feel enthused about anymore. The past few months all I've wanted was roast potatoes and vegetables alongside a big slab of protein that I could fry up - and meat has been the only thing capable of filling in that blank. I'm not as crazy about cooking as I used to be, I still enjoy it, but not to the same extent... I'm happier to do lazy cooking a lot more often now. I don't know, maybe I just need(ed) better, funner recipes?

Thing is I'm not completely happy about it either. Even though the fish and pork was delicious, I still felt kind of weird eating slabs of flesh, and also just turning back on a 3 and a half year long lifestyle choice. Not really anticipating the potential reactions from everybody (especially from a few certain meat fiends who will rub it in...). But, in the end, I just don't care that much anymore. I have genuinely been getting a bit excited thinking of all the new dishes and recipes I can potentially try out.

I'm not really sure what I'm expecting from this thread, maybe some words from people who've been in similar experiences, maybe some recipe ideas that are invigorating, easy and delicious. Maybe I should watch a documentary on factory farming, and remember why I decided to take it up in the first place.

I don't know... help, I guess!?

Last edited by wickedwitch; 11-21-2015 at 03:47 AM.
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#2 Old 11-21-2015, 04:09 AM
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..I'm just kind of sick of lentils, sick of chickpeas, sick of beans, sick of soups, curries, chilis, and pastas... Just bored with it all really. Sick of having to make that much more effort for food I don't feel enthused about anymore...
That sounds really bad, but you already know it.

Put yourself in the animal's position, pig in a factory farm setting - Surrounded by filth, sickness, horror and death. Rammed through the tunnels to violent execution among the death squeals of his/her companions...then cut up into pieces, burnt, and chewed up just to be pooped out.

What a sad life story. I'm certain that pig would have loved to be comfortable enough in life to be "sick" of eating all the yummy, healthy foods you mentioned above.

Time to get over yourself and enjoy the sacrifice you make for the sake of the voiceless and helpless.

You wanted motivation, and that's all I can offer you , I hope the best for you!
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#3 Old 11-21-2015, 06:02 AM
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Thanks. Though I have thought extensively about the animal too, and my relationship to it as food, and I'm just not moved anymore, I don't feel anything. Before I used to have a lot more empathy, I guess I'm a just bit more cynical lately because I'm not in the happiest period of my life... Which might have something to do with it.
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#4 Old 11-21-2015, 06:07 AM
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Try to put things into perspective. To you, pork sausages are a meal. Not even a meal you NEED, just an unnecessary but pleasant taste on your tongue, fleeting and forgettable. To the pig, pork sausages are a lifetime of torture and a brutal death. When you choose to eat meat, you are saying in no uncertain terms that your desire for a nice sensation is more important than someone else's entire existence. That's a pretty massive statement. Do you truly believe it? If you do-- if you really believe you're so important that another sentient creature's suffering and death is justified by your idle food cravings-- then go for it. I have a feeling that you don't believe it, though. I'm willing to bet that you're capable of having more empathy than that.

Besides, the "boring" foods you listed (soups, curries, chili, pasta) are the same foods that meat-eaters eat, too. A whole world of recipes doesn't open up to you just because you eat meat. It's the same exact recipes minus the body parts! I'm not sure what foods you think you'll be eating if you abandon your ethics. If you really want sausages that badly, order some online. There are plenty of online shops which offer a range of vegan foods, and most grocery stores carry meat substitutes as well. Where are you located?
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#5 Old 11-21-2015, 09:00 AM
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Hi wickedwitch,


How are you feeling about other areas of your life? Could your lack of interest in your vegetarian diet be a symptom of overall depression? You might find it useful to make an appointment with a therapist.
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#6 Old 11-21-2015, 11:07 AM
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I'm finding all of this really hard to read. I'm quesy from the thought of what you ate, in such a non emotional manner. Like turning over a dead bird and finding it filled with maggots.

It would help to know where you're from. Sometimes I forget just how unforgiving other parts of the world are to vegetarians.

When I think back to how much I loved certain meat things I've never wanting the meat, just things that have similar flavors, and those come from spices, and textures, and prep

I guess what I'm saying is that I don't even consider meat a human food choice, no more than i thought of eating bugs when I was an omnivore
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#7 Old 11-21-2015, 11:42 AM
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Besides, the "boring" foods you listed (soups, curries, chili, pasta) are the same foods that meat-eaters eat, too. A whole world of recipes doesn't open up to you just because you eat meat.
Well, to me it does. I can think of countless French and Spanish dishes that have a gourmet meat as the centre piece.

I live in France and since you asked David, I've been pretty unhappy the past few months, general life apathy might have something to do with it...

Well I was a little bit taken aback reading these comments, as if I was being confronted, but I guess that's a good thing... I have thought about it more, and tried to imagine myself in the future as a confirmed guilt free meat-eater, and it feels strange to picture that... Like it's not the real me. I don't know, I still find it a little hard to care at the moment despite the fact I'm totally 100% aware that I'm selfishly prioritizing my culinary wants at the cost of a living being. What can I say? I can't FORCE myself to feel emotion

I'm sorry if my senseless decision to dabble in meat eating has offended some, but at the end of the day I guess that's why I'm here, because I feel confused
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#8 Old 11-21-2015, 12:23 PM
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I guarantee that I can find a vegan version of any dish you like. I once started a thread which challenged anyone to find a dish that has never been veganized, and it's a tough assignment. We discovered recipes for vegan haggis, vegan liver and onions, vegan liverwurst. I think one we couldn't find was monkey brains, so I guess you'll be missing out on that!

To be fair, you really can't blame us for reacting with horror. To me, it's as if you'd said that you ate a piece of a dead body you found in a cemetery. That it was a dead pig's body doesn't make it less gruesome in my eyes, and it's difficult for me to understand how anyone-- especially a vegetarian, who has already made the connection-- could look at a piece of meat and think "yum." However, I recognize that it happens all the time. In this case, we're the exceptions.
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#9 Old 11-21-2015, 12:40 PM
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To me, being vegetarian the bare minimum we can do to reduce animal suffering. If animal suffering doesn't mean enough to you for you to want to continue being vegetarian, I'm not sure there's much anyone here can say to motivate you. Motivation has to come from within. Some people do recommend watching Earthlings or another video on factory farming -- depending on your level of sensitivity, I suppose that might help. Do you have any pets? I would urge you to consider whether a pig, cow or chicken is really less of a being than a cat or dog -- why eat one and not the other? I will also add that the meat industry is extremely bad for human rights as well. People who work in slaughterhouses and meat processing have very dangerous and grueling jobs, and are often illegal immigrants whose rights are not well protected.

If you want excitement, you'll have to make it yourself. Do stores near you carry any kind of fake meats? Sausages in particular are pretty easy to get good veggie versions of. Also look into online stores that might ship to you. Otherwise, you can make your own: http://www.theppk.com/2012/01/vegan_sausage/

How about some new cookbooks? Some of my favorite cookbook authors are Isa Chandra Moskowitz and Robin Robertson. Some recipes from Isa can be found here: http://www.theppk.com/recipes/ Try new herbs or spices you've never had. Try your hand at making seitan (a meat substitute made from wheat gluten). Bake bread from scratch. Make a super fancy dessert to share with friends.

Good luck, and I hope you'll find your motivation again!
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#10 Old 11-21-2015, 12:53 PM
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Well, to me it does. I can think of countless French and Spanish dishes that have a gourmet meat as the centre piece.

I live in France and since you asked David, I've been pretty unhappy the past few months, general life apathy might have something to do with it...

Well I was a little bit taken aback reading these comments, as if I was being confronted, but I guess that's a good thing... I have thought about it more, and tried to imagine myself in the future as a confirmed guilt free meat-eater, and it feels strange to picture that... Like it's not the real me. I don't know, I still find it a little hard to care at the moment despite the fact I'm totally 100% aware that I'm selfishly prioritizing my culinary wants at the cost of a living being. What can I say? I can't FORCE myself to feel emotion

I'm sorry if my senseless decision to dabble in meat eating has offended some, but at the end of the day I guess that's why I'm here, because I feel confused
I actually get what you mean because it was first in my teens that I became vegetarian, and after that, kept falling quite like you describe! It wan't until my forties that I quit for good.
Since you realize eating meat doesnt feel right for you--stay away. I know there are many hardships in life, but I think adding meat back to your diet will cause you more grief than aleve any.
We have a few French members here, have you checked out the section on countries?
I don't want to offend you, I'm very glad glad you came here!
Vive la France!
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#11 Old 11-21-2015, 01:55 PM
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I doubt breads a problem!
How are you with soups? dips made of beans and garlic and spices?
Have you ever tried making seitan? I will say if not done properly its not very good.


Heres a nice recipe-- you can leave out the nutritional yeast, and instead of chickpea flour you can sub that amount of mashed/pureed beans. Basically you can sub like things for like, but do remember the oil! It helps develop the gluten. Instead of wrapping in foil I cut slices and let simmer in a pan with enough seasoned broth to cover and a tight lid. I keep a check, and flip when the liquid is about half absorbed, and check till it's pretty much a gravy. I've used french onion soup mix for the broth. Don't know if thats helpful, but searching for French vegan recipes I got inspired!
I'm now wanting a good bean and leek cassolete or rattoiule with butter beans and crusty garlicy bread. Or a bean, mushroom and onion tart with mushroom gravy. Or a veggie pot pie.
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#12 Old 11-21-2015, 02:36 PM
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I'm now wanting a good bean and leek cassolete or rattoiule with butter beans and crusty garlicy bread. Or a bean, mushroom and onion tart with mushroom gravy. Or a veggie pot pie.
When you make it silva save me a plate.

@wickedwitch don't worry chin up!! Maybe you just need some cookbooks to get you excited again. I just recently went through a rut of cooking, but now I am fired up again. Stay veggie your body and conscience wont regret it.
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#13 Old 11-21-2015, 03:54 PM
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I'm making garlic mashed potatoes!
I'd save some for you and wicked if I could!

I get this picture of shopping at French markets with the long baugettes protruding from the basket surrounded by leafy greens, and veggies!
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#14 Old 11-21-2015, 04:03 PM
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This has me so angry all over again that veg options aren't mainstreamed!
I've certainly gone through times of depression, stress, all kinds of anxiety and thought about how I used to get the cheapy frozen dinners to have on hand. Stouffers used to have a couple good options-butternut squash ravioli and veggie potstickers. Actually, if you can find vegetable potstickers frozen they're really good to have on hand. I get them from an Asian grocery and they're filled with cabbage, carrots and tofu. They're good in veg broth or miso soups
I think they're even easy to make with wonton wraps but if you can find them frozen, so much the better for easy
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#15 Old 11-21-2015, 07:10 PM
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I feel bad for you here in Canada and the US it's pretty darn easy to go out and eat veg or to find veggie faux meats and things.
I am a new vegetarian so to me meat is far from gross or horrifying I wish it was. Some days are really hard (yesterday was one of them actually). To help me stay on track u have liked a bunch of vegetarian pages on Facebook that constantly share sad videos and cute animals. That helps. Also allrecipes has lots of great stuff on it you could check them out.
It's tough but you can do it! Don't throw away three years over a couple of bad choices!
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#16 Old 11-22-2015, 05:57 AM
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Another idea -- how about volunteering at an animal shelter, rescue or farm sanctuary?

Also, how about taking a trip somewhere with more veggie options? It looks like there is an active meetup group in Paris: http://www.meetup.com/Paris-Vegan-Group/

Berlin and London are also listed as veggie friendly, although I'm sure there are others: http://www.happycow.net/travel/top_five.html
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#17 Old 11-22-2015, 06:48 AM
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If you are getting bored with your food, I could see why it is harder to stick with vegetarianism. I had a hard time transitioning to veganism because I didn't like what I was eating, even though I had guilt when eating dairy or eggs. Luckily there are vegan versions of almost anything and the substitutes have been getting better. Finding food you like is extremely important to staying vegetarian/vegan, but I rely heavily on the substitutes

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#18 Old 11-22-2015, 09:00 AM
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What can I say? I can't FORCE myself to feel emotion

I'm sorry if my senseless decision to dabble in meat eating has offended some, but at the end of the day I guess that's why I'm here, because I feel confused

Hi wickedwitch,

Feeling a lack of emotion is a symptom of depression. So is a lack of interest in activities that you once enjoyed. I really encourage you to try an appointment with a therapist. Your primary care physician can refer you to one.

Vegetarianism doesn't really require that you feel any emotion, only a sense of responsibility. I feel very little emotion when I think of factory-farmed animals. However, I am rationally aware that their suffering is very real, and I therefore am a vegetarian. If you are 100% aware that eating meat causes suffering, and if you still eat meat, what does this say about your current state of mind? I think that you are personally suffering. Please seek help.
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#19 Old 11-24-2015, 09:12 AM
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Hi wickedwitch,

Feeling a lack of emotion is a symptom of depression. So is a lack of interest in activities that you once enjoyed. I really encourage you to try an appointment with a therapist. Your primary care physician can refer you to one.

Vegetarianism doesn't really require that you feel any emotion, only a sense of responsibility. I feel very little emotion when I think of factory-farmed animals. However, I am rationally aware that their suffering is very real, and I therefore am a vegetarian. If you are 100% aware that eating meat causes suffering, and if you still eat meat, what does this say about your current state of mind? I think that you are personally suffering. Please seek help.
This.
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#20 Old 11-26-2015, 07:23 AM
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Hi wickedwitch,

Feeling a lack of emotion is a symptom of depression. So is a lack of interest in activities that you once enjoyed. I really encourage you to try an appointment with a therapist. Your primary care physician can refer you to one.

Vegetarianism doesn't really require that you feel any emotion, only a sense of responsibility. I feel very little emotion when I think of factory-farmed animals. However, I am rationally aware that their suffering is very real, and I therefore am a vegetarian. If you are 100% aware that eating meat causes suffering, and if you still eat meat, what does this say about your current state of mind? I think that you are personally suffering. Please seek help.
Yes, after some deliberation I've come to terms with the fact I'm probably a bit depressed right now, and it's "spilled" over into my dietary habits. I will see someone in the near future, certainly.

Anyways regardless of my personal well-being at the moment I've decided I most definitely 100% want to stay vegetarian. I feel so stupid, and guilty, for having broken my abstinence. I can't even fathom the thought of being a meat-eater anymore! I think a part of me really wanted to indulge in my comfort foods, which is to say la cuisine française... Anyone know some good, authentic French recipes catered for veggies? Veggie Coq au vin anyone!? All the cookbooks here are just general vegetarian recipes which is good, but I've yet to find a cookbook that is through and through French recipes "translated" into vegetarianism.

Thanks for everyone's replies too. I don't know any other vegetarians so it was nice to have people to confide in who in return helped me snap out of my foolishness... Cheers!
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#21 Old 11-26-2015, 07:58 AM
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Yes, after some deliberation I've come to terms with the fact I'm probably a bit depressed right now, and it's "spilled" over into my dietary habits. I will see someone in the near future, certainly.

Anyways regardless of my personal well-being at the moment I've decided I most definitely 100% want to stay vegetarian. I feel so stupid, and guilty, for having broken my abstinence. I can't even fathom the thought of being a meat-eater anymore! I think a part of me really wanted to indulge in my comfort foods, which is to say la cuisine française... Anyone know some good, authentic French recipes catered for veggies? Veggie Coq au vin anyone!? All the cookbooks here are just general vegetarian recipes which is good, but I've yet to find a cookbook that is through and through French recipes "translated" into vegetarianism.

Thanks for everyone's replies too. I don't know any other vegetarians so it was nice to have people to confide in who in return helped me snap out of my foolishness... Cheers!
Some of these look quite nice!
http://www.mindbodygreen.com/0-20652...-mais-oui.html
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#22 Old 11-27-2015, 01:50 PM
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Despite it only having three stars I think this recipe looks quite nice:

http://mobile.eatingwell.com/recipes/tofu_au_vin.html
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#23 Old 11-27-2015, 03:55 PM
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Despite it only having three stars I think this recipe looks quite nice:

http://mobile.eatingwell.com/recipes/tofu_au_vin.html
Yes that looks nice!
I'm not a wine drinker but I may get a bottle for that. I do always say that, but I've never yet cooked with wine.
those tiny lasagna type noodles are a good sub for egg noodles, or even broken lasagna noodles.
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#24 Old 11-27-2015, 04:27 PM
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I accept that humans are omnivores and that it's natural to want to eat meat.
Actually, that's up for debate. Look at a carnivore's teeth.....sharp, jagged, etc. Ours are flat.....suitable for eating grains, fruits, veggies, etc.

Irregardless of that....you say that you've lost the moral aspect of eating meat. Would you kill & eat your neighbor's dog? It's an animal, just like the chicken that makes chicken wings. It's a disturbing example, but both animals have feelings and pain receptors that work just like ours.

Maybe take a minute to examine WHY you stopped eating meat in the first place. Explore the reasons that caused you to become veg*n, and see if they are still valid.
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All animals should be respected & should have the ability to lead a natural & enjoyable life. This means not eating them, or abusing them in any way.
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#25 Old 11-27-2015, 06:40 PM
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Have you seen the blog Chocolate and Zucchini? http://chocolateandzucchini.com - the author is French and, although she isn't completely vegetarian, most of her recipes are. She has a vegetarian cookbook - the French Market Cookbook. I haven't made many of her recipes, but the photos are always inspiring.

Don't beat yourself up over a few missteps - everyone makes mistakes from time to time. Forgive yourself and move on.
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#26 Old 11-27-2015, 07:24 PM
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This is a huge fall off...you didn't just eat fish, you ate pork. Pork is bad for your health, and pigs are more intelligent than dogs...so maybe you should reflect on that before eating more sausage.

Look, my family is from West Virginia and yes you can easily find tofu, non-dairy milk, non-dairy cheese and veggie burgers, though I agree that your choices of fake meats will be limited, beans, lentils and peas are also quite easy to find ...country people grow up eating beans even if they're omnis, so I'm really wondering where you live...especially since you apparently still eat dairy.

I'm wondering if you have anemia symptoms, which could be addressed with beans, black strap molasses, tofu and greens...I know some lacto or lacto ovo types may get too dependent on cheese, which doesn't supply adequate iron.

Also add nuts and seeds to your diet.

I'm not saying you have it easy if you are in a rural area where smart dogs are hard to come by, but unless you literally live in a food desert with no car, I'm wondering about the honesty of your post in terms of basic veg supplies like beans, pulses and tofu -even non dairy milk- I grew up in a log cabin 30 minutes away from a small city, and I even find your claims a little odd...my mom still lives there and drinks almond-coconut milk. Though I grant you that now that I live in California, I have much more access to a wider variety faux meats.

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#27 Old 11-27-2015, 07:35 PM
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Yes, after some deliberation I've come to terms with the fact I'm probably a bit depressed right now, and it's "spilled" over into my dietary habits. I will see someone in the near future, certainly.

Anyways regardless of my personal well-being at the moment I've decided I most definitely 100% want to stay vegetarian. I feel so stupid, and guilty, for having broken my abstinence. I can't even fathom the thought of being a meat-eater anymore! I think a part of me really wanted to indulge in my comfort foods, which is to say la cuisine française... Anyone know some good, authentic French recipes catered for veggies? Veggie Coq au vin anyone!? All the cookbooks here are just general vegetarian recipes which is good, but I've yet to find a cookbook that is through and through French recipes "translated" into vegetarianism.

Thanks for everyone's replies too. I don't know any other vegetarians so it was nice to have people to confide in who in return helped me snap out of my foolishness... Cheers!

I'm really sorry you are depressed. There are natural ways to lift your mood without resorting to meat, though. You could try taking some natural supplements, eating walnuts and a good dark chocolate, and talking to your doctor about depression.
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#28 Old 11-27-2015, 07:44 PM
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Originally Posted by no whey jose View Post
Try to put things into perspective. To you, pork sausages are a meal. Not even a meal you NEED, just an unnecessary but pleasant taste on your tongue, fleeting and forgettable. To the pig, pork sausages are a lifetime of torture and a brutal death. When you choose to eat meat, you are saying in no uncertain terms that your desire for a nice sensation is more important than someone else's entire existence. That's a pretty massive statement. Do you truly believe it? If you do-- if you really believe you're so important that another sentient creature's suffering and death is justified by your idle food cravings-- then go for it. I have a feeling that you don't believe it, though. I'm willing to bet that you're capable of having more empathy than that.

Besides, the "boring" foods you listed (soups, curries, chili, pasta) are the same foods that meat-eaters eat, too. A whole world of recipes doesn't open up to you just because you eat meat. It's the same exact recipes minus the body parts! I'm not sure what foods you think you'll be eating if you abandon your ethics. If you really want sausages that badly, order some online. There are plenty of online shops which offer a range of vegan foods, and most grocery stores carry meat substitutes as well. Where are you located?
Yeah meat eaters and junk food junkies often have some of the blandest, or most boring diets.

That's why I wondered if she actually has anemia, isn't aware of her options, or something else. It could be clinical depression, but it could just be Anemia or SAD.
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#29 Old 11-27-2015, 07:49 PM
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Originally Posted by wickedwitch View Post
Well, to me it does. I can think of countless French and Spanish dishes that have a gourmet meat as the centre piece.

I live in France and since you asked David, I've been pretty unhappy the past few months, general life apathy might have something to do with it...

Well I was a little bit taken aback reading these comments, as if I was being confronted, but I guess that's a good thing... I have thought about it more, and tried to imagine myself in the future as a confirmed guilt free meat-eater, and it feels strange to picture that... Like it's not the real me. I don't know, I still find it a little hard to care at the moment despite the fact I'm totally 100% aware that I'm selfishly prioritizing my culinary wants at the cost of a living being. What can I say? I can't FORCE myself to feel emotion

I'm sorry if my senseless decision to dabble in meat eating has offended some, but at the end of the day I guess that's why I'm here, because I feel confused

I did not realize that you are in France, which is traditionally a meat heavy cuisine in some regions. ..but the US is similar in terms of steak and bacon. Therefore I don't know what your shopping options are in the outskirts or country side...maybe it would help to take cooking classes or buy vegetarian cook books.

I'm from the south and southern cooking is heavy with chicken fried everything and gravies, but I've learned to make vegetarian gravy, and perhaps you could make a trip like once a month to a place further away and stock up on things hard to find in your neighborhood. ..by putting them in the freezer or pantry.
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#30 Old 11-27-2015, 11:37 PM
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Hi, WickedWitch. It's easy to find a vegan or vegetarian version of a recipe by googling it. You may want to try shopping at online bio/vegetarian stores in France. Un Monde Vegan and Supermarche Vegan are two of them. To meet vegans/vegetarians look for a meetup near you.

A quiche is an easy food to make vegetarian. Potato au gratin and Onion Soup are also easy to find a vegetarian recipe for. A dish that is both vegetarian and vegan is ratatouille or confit byaldi. Most french desserts are also vegetarian.

750g and Vegemiam have many vegetarian recipes, some traditional and some not. Among their traditional recipes are vegetable farcis, souffles, crêpes, tians, gratins, beignets, and tarts.

What part of France are you from if you don't mind me asking? From what I can tell, it's easier to be vegetarian/vegan in Northern France.
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Last edited by strawberrycrepe; 11-27-2015 at 11:46 PM.
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