Problems with my husband ):

[daisy10207]

I just had a horrible conversation with my husband. I broke the news to him that there likely won't be a turkey at thanksgiving this year as most of my family is vegetarin now, as am I (I posted about this earlier in the holiday forum) and he got really upset. The conversation was way too long to put here, but here are some of the worst things he said (and these are not in any way taken out of context, they were stated very plainly):
-I don't give a damn about turkeys. I really don't care if they die.
-We're at the top of the food chain, we're supposed to eat animals.
-We have TEETH! (spoken to me like I don't know humans have teeth)
-yes i think animals should die because I like the way they taste.
-Life is short and I should be able to eat what I want. :confused:
-I don't want to know how my meat got there, ignorance is bliss.
-Fine, if there's no turkey I'll just stop at KFC on the way home. :mad:
He also called me an "extreme hard-core hippie radical", rolled his eyes about fifty times, told me our life wasn't going to be fun anymore, and was generally insulting. I love my husband and he is normally a wonderful man...but I am disgusted right now. I have so little respect for him that I can barely look at him. But he's my husband!! We've been together over five years and he is amazing in many ways, but I am feeling really bummed right now. Any advice?????? (Aside from "divorce him and marry a vegetarian" which I admit has crossed my mind, although it makes me feel horribly guilty) Thank you! Just call me: :sign:

[Hamry]

Although it sounds like your husband has reacted a little childishly I can see why he's upset, which tends to lead to people saying things they don't really mean. I'm guessing he was being quite hurtful because he felt it would improve his chances of getting his own way, though he's possibly completely blow it now :P

My family has always thought that Christmas dinner is the most important thing at Christmas and that Christmas is not Christmas without a turkey. It sounds a little silly to me now but back when I ate meat I probably would have felt the same. People tend to attach memories and emotion to food, especially if it's something they have always had on a special occasion.

My advice is to take some time out and calm down before trying to talk to your husband again. I would approach him and ask to have a proper conversation about thanksgiving so he can give his feelings on the subject and you can explain yours. I would suggest him bringing and preparing a smaller piece of meat he can add to his meal, like a ham or something. I don't know much about thanksgiving because I'm in the UK but do any restaurants do a thanksgiving meal before the actual day? I know some pubs and places round here do a Christmas dinner during December. Maybe suggest you both go for a nice thanksgiving meal where there will be turkey a week or so before and then he can celebrate a vegetarian one with you and your family. If nowhere does that sort of thing then maybe just a nice meal out together before the celebrations?

If he continues to be childish ignore it and calmly tell him you don't want to argue or be petty over the situation. If worst comes to worst tell him that he can have turkey if he prepares, brings and cooks his own. He'd probably look a little bit silly if he goes to all that effort and is the only one eating it. Try to understand why a traditional thanksgiving dinner is important to him though, he probably feels like you're dismissing his feelings. It's also a lot nicer to have some options for the day, rather than being told that meat is completely off the menu and that's the end of it, you know?

Good luck, try not to get too wound up!

[ashlend]

Although it sounds like your husband has reacted a little childishly I can see why he's upset, which tends to lead to people saying things they don't really mean. I'm guessing he was being quite hurtful because he felt it would improve his chances of getting his own way...

My advice is to take some time out and calm down before trying to talk to your husband again. I would approach him and ask to have a proper conversation about thanksgiving so he can give his feelings on the subject and you can explain yours...

If he continues to be childish ignore it and calmly tell him you don't want to argue or be petty over the situation. If worst comes to worst tell him that he can have turkey if he prepares, brings and cooks his own. He'd probably look a little bit silly if he goes to all that effort and is the only one eating it. Try to understand why a traditional thanksgiving dinner is important to him though, he probably feels like you're dismissing his feelings. It's also a lot nicer to have some options for the day, rather than being told that meat is completely off the menu and that's the end of it, you know?

Good luck, try not to get too wound up!


I agree with all of this. If your husband is a good reasonable guy most of the time, which it sounds like he is, I'd be willing to bet he'll come around and understand why this is important to you. Mine FREAKED when I told him I was planning on working towards veganism (I got the "extreme" comment, too) but he's a lot more open to the whole thing now.

I read your post in the holiday forum too. Honestly, if I were in your position I'd probably just let your mom cook a turkey for your husband. If she doesn't mind and he's freaking out about the idea of there not being one... I might step out of the situation and just let her do it for him. I understand where you are coming from though.

[Phil Scafe]

WOW. I definately want for you to know that you are not alone. I have been married for almost 17 years now. The first 3 were cool but then the personal diferences started to become clear. I finally became vegetarian about 3 years ago and eventually vegan. My wife is such a -------- not very nice person about the whole thing. We have 3 teenage daughters together, all of who respect my values. I only hope that someday they will come around. We currently live in NW Florida which is commonly known as the Redneck Riviera. Although we have spectacular beaches here, every day I feel that I am going to lose my mind. The only reason that I have stayed with my wife is to keep the family together until the kids are older. My wife and I have grown so far apart that I cant wait to get a divorce. Yep, I said it. Whenever I try to educate my girls about health, nutrition and where there food comes from, my wife turns into some sort of a demon with long pointy horns. Some day because I know in my heart that I am a good person, I will meet and fall in love with a like minded hippie woman who shares my values. Good luck to you. You should know that I am NOT trying to bring you down. I happened to join veggieboards just within the last week because I have been so down myself and wanted to relate to other people who are living in a similar nightmare to find out how the others are coping. I will keep my chin up for you. Bye now.

[pandora9kry]

Definitely try to make him feel better about it. YOU haven't done anything wrong, and as soon as he feels better about the situation, it will be easier to talk calmly about it. Hopefully you can rationalize with him and avoid any future fights!! Trust me, I feel your pain.

My boyfriend and I had a huge fight last week where he flipped out and told me all this vegan propaganda was working on me, and how he won't cook for me because I've taken all the joy out of it, and how he complimented me on the cream substitute in his coffee because it "tasted better than it had the day before" and he couldn't believe that's what his life had come to.

I told him I was hoping he might be beginning to be proud of me, and he said, "I would never be proud of you for that."

[pandora9kry]

Definitely try to make him feel better about it. YOU haven't done anything wrong, and as soon as he feels better about the situation, it will be easier to talk calmly about it. Hopefully you can rationalize with him and avoid any future fights!! Trust me, I feel your pain.

My boyfriend and I had a huge fight last week where he flipped out and told me all this vegan propaganda was working on me, and how he won't cook for me because I've taken all the joy out of it, and how he complimented me on the cream substitute in his coffee because it "tasted better than it had the day before" and he couldn't believe that's what his life had come to.

I told him I was hoping he might be beginning to be proud of me, and he said, "I would never be proud of you for that."

[New England Vegan]

WOW. I definately want for you to know that you are not alone. I have been married for almost 17 years now. The first 3 were cool but then the personal diferences started to become clear. I finally became vegetarian about 3 years ago and eventually vegan. My wife is such a -------- not very nice person about the whole thing. We have 3 teenage daughters together, all of who respect my values. I only hope that someday they will come around. We currently live in NW Florida which is commonly known as the Redneck Riviera. Although we have spectacular beaches here, every day I feel that I am going to lose my mind. The only reason that I have stayed with my wife is to keep the family together until the kids are older. My wife and I have grown so far apart that I cant wait to get a divorce. Yep, I said it. Whenever I try to educate my girls about health, nutrition and where there food comes from, my wife turns into some sort of a demon with long pointy horns. Some day because I know in my heart that I am a good person, I will meet and fall in love with a like minded hippie woman who shares my values. Good luck to you. You should know that I am NOT trying to bring you down. I happened to join veggieboards just within the last week because I have been so down myself and wanted to relate to other people who are living in a similar nightmare to find out how the others are coping. I will keep my chin up for you. Bye now.

Wow Phil, way to be honest. Seriously. It sucks that your stuck like you feel you are. It's one of the reasons I'm glad my wife and I are never going to have children. When we met 8 years ago she told me she never wants to have kids. I knew I hit the jackpot. We don't want kids for a ton or reasons, but one I suppose is that if it our relationship should decay, we can sort out the bills and walk away. I hope you can find a way out or to make your situation work.

[New England Vegan]

Daisy10207, I'm sorry to hear about your disagreement/argument/fight. It may be a hard thing to put behind you completely because it's a matter of your personal ethics, your principles. I find that I can be very flexible and adaptable but not when I feel one of my principles is violated.
I agree with letting a little time pass, but not much and address the situation again. Point out the obvious that a holiday can still be an enjoyable one with out a dead body laying on the table. It's not the carcass that makes the holiday.

[SomebodyElse]

... here are some of the worst things he said (and these are not in any way taken out of context, they were stated very plainly):
-I don't give a damn about turkeys. I really don't care if they die.
-We're at the top of the food chain, we're supposed to eat animals.
-We have TEETH! (spoken to me like I don't know humans have teeth)
-yes i think animals should die because I like the way they taste.
-Life is short and I should be able to eat what I want. :confused:
-I don't want to know how my meat got there, ignorance is bliss.
-Fine, if there's no turkey I'll just stop at KFC on the way home. :mad:
He also called me an "extreme hard-core hippie radical", rolled his eyes about fifty times, told me our life wasn't going to be fun anymore, and was generally insulting. I love my husband and he is normally a wonderful man...but I am disgusted right now. I have so little respect for him that I can barely look at him. But he's my husband!! We've been together over five years and he is amazing in many ways, but I am feeling really bummed right now.
This looks very harsh and ugly when written down. I think I would write this down on a piece of paper, and maybe add some thoughts about how being spoken to in this way made me feel. And then I would ask him to read it, once you have all calmed down a bit. Don't write anything accusing or confrontational, just write in terms of "when you say something like this, it makes me feel _____". He may not be aware of how hurtful and ugly this really is, or understand how painful it is for you.

I wish you the best. :hug:

[Irizary]

Aw, I'm sorry for you guys who are having these problems with your relationships :( It's crazy to me that these people are freaking out over what amounts to "food" for them, and a particular taste that they like (that could in many cases be well substituted)...while you are acting out of a value to prevent unnecessary suffering. It's a shame that they're not supporting you for trying to better yourself ethically - that's something most mature people would probably want in a partner. They should be proud of you, not denigrating you!

[daisy10207]

Thank you everyone for the support and advice. Things are better today, in fact I think my hubby was feeling guilty because he actually made me some tofu for dinner. I never thought I'd see the day! :rockon:

I'm still upset by the things he said, but I'm going to let a little bit of time pass and maybe try to discuss it again. It seems to go back and forth with us lately..one day he is really supportive and the next day he's mocking me and saying things like 'I don't care if animals die." It's hard to know he doesn't care about something that is so important to me, but I'm hoping it will get better, because he really is a good guy.

Thank you again for the kind words.

[Irizary]

I'm glad he was better today. I hope it works out!

[paisleyjane]

My husband is a meat-eater, and I can tell you RIGHT now that he always will be. He is one of the "but animals taste good!" kind of people.

I try to look at it from his perspective:

I was a meat-eater when we met, dated, and got married. We've been together for 5 years -- and it wasn't until about 1.5 years ago that I made the switch to vegetarian.

I try to imagine how he feels, being that I'm very VERY different that I was 5 years ago. I would even go as far as to say that I'm practically a different person. It must be hard for him to understand, accept, and respect all the changes I have made in my life.... especially because they are not values and beliefs he shares.

I guess I'm lucky. Although my husband will never become a vegetarian, and doesn't really share my beliefs on the topic -- he is kind enough to respect me and my choices.

Other than the great veggie divide, our relationship is awesome. Sometimes it's disappointing to watch him throw some meat on top of a meal I cooked, but, just as he respects my choices I have to respect his.

If your husband wants turkey at Thanksgiving, can he not buy some pre-cooked, or make it himself? Your beliefs shouldn't dictate other people's plates, as you would not like theirs to dictate yours.

The reason our relationship is harmonious is because we let the other live their choices as they choose... and don't judge or banter about who is right and who is wrong. It's not fair.

[Beachbnny]

Thank you everyone for the support and advice. Things are better today, in fact I think my hubby was feeling guilty because he actually made me some tofu for dinner. I never thought I'd see the day! :rockon:

I'm still upset by the things he said, but I'm going to let a little bit of time pass and maybe try to discuss it again. It seems to go back and forth with us lately..one day he is really supportive and the next day he's mocking me and saying things like 'I don't care if animals die." It's hard to know he doesn't care about something that is so important to me, but I'm hoping it will get better, because he really is a good guy.

Thank you again for the kind words.

Gald that things have sort of calmed down a little :) I'm sure your Husband is an amaing man- you did marry him! So I'm sure this is just an issue you'll eventually find balance with.

Here's how I see it, Meat-eaters are challenged by our beliefs just by being around us. Truly, we can do nothing and say nothing and they can still feel on the offensive simple because we exist and it proves that people don't have to eat meat. "Being the vegetarian in the room" can sometimes force people to look at themselves even if we say nothing.

The other side to that coin is that this is about tradition. He likes his Thanksgiving tradition as it is and doesn't want to change it. It's about comfort, family meals together, and memories of previous Holidays. He may feel like you're trying to take that away from him and lovingly telling him that you, in fact, are not may help him feel better.

Give him the patience and love that you want to see in return and eventually he'll come around. :)

[greensgood]

i have had a similar discussion with my bf (of 10 years), he has been honest with me about not 'caring' about how an animal dies etc...so if and when he asks me to make him meat I suggest he "help" me, when i really make him cook it.
cooking a turkey is freaking disgusting...even if you like to eat turkey. I think it is a great way to help someone understand that this was a living animal when they have to take the parts out and clean it, and see the ribs and neck etc...
so i say if he is still being a jerk about no turkey for thanksgiving, have him go out and buy one just for him and see how much he wants it after he has dismembered it.

[Marie]

Your sad smile is upside down.

[mbellek]

This is my first post here, but I was really saddened by your post. I am lucky enough to have a husband who feels the same way I do about animal products, but I have other family members who DON'T understand, and I know how hard that can be. I've been through the Thanksgivings & Christmases where suddenly the vegetarianism that was tolerated with bemused indifference suddenly becomes a personal attack on everyone present.

My first suggestion would be - Is there a family member or friend that you two can have Thanksgiving with? Guessing you probably would've mentioned as much if it were an option.

I might get the :whack: for saying this, but I think that if he still feels so strongly about it, you might want to consider getting him his stupid turkey. I think you can buy them already prepared... I don't say that because I think its okay to suspend your morals when they become inconvenient, but at the same time, marriage is about compromise. He's not asking you to (well, sounds like he didn't ASK you to do anything, lol) to cook him meat every night of the week, or to eat the turkey yourself.

You could possibly hook up with a local church or shelter that is providing a Thanksgiving dinner to the less fortunate & split a turkey with them (the grocery store will saw :spew: a turkey in half for you so you can freeze 1/2 & serve 1/2 - you could take 1/2 to a shelter & prepare 1/2 for him), or take them your leftovers if they can accept those. I've served Thanksgiving dinner at homeless shelters a few times, and sometimes after the guests were all served, the volunteers were invited to make a plate & join them. Perhaps you could do something like that?

[Licence]

Daisy, the thing I find most distressing about your post isn't that your husband may believe these things (he may just have been saying these things to win his point) but that he would tell you this in such a vindictive way, considering you're a vegetarian.

Whether or not he has any feelings for animals, he certainly doesn't appear to have much respect for yours.

[cstadt]

Some people go to a dark place when their food ways are attacked.

My boyfriend used to be exactly like this, but he claims veg now, though he's more like a Buddhist monk that eat's what's offered to him-- veg. until the day someone cooks meat for him without knowledge of his veg-ness. He'd eat it.

All in good time. I wouldn't be too hard on your husband.

[Indieorganicveg]

Talk. To. Him. About. It. Communication is the way to go!

[Kiran]

Daisy,
I'm very sorry to see how your husband reacted to the news you broke. It seems that your decision has touched a deep nerve with him and it may take some time for him to process it all. Instead of taking his hurtful words at face value (and directed at you), perhaps you can see them as someone who feels cornered and scared because they don't want to face up to something.

You are living your values through your diet and in doing so, holding up a mirror to him. He may not be ready to look in that mirror just yet but it sounds like the Thanksgiving decision made him take a hard look.

I recommend reading Carol J. Adams great book Living Among Meat Eaters. Its very helpful in not only in dealing with such situations but in giving you good approaches to working these things out with those you love. I found it very helpful in dealing with my omni wife (who is now very nearly vegetarian) and my carnivore in-laws.

Peace,

Kiran