Opinions (people who need meat for survival)?

[Doktormartini]

Sorry if this has been brought up before, but I am curious! What are your opinions on groups of people that hunt animals for the purpose of using them for their survival? I'm talking about indigenous groups like Eskimos, the Mbuti people, Bushmen...etc. What are your views on this? These groups of people have deep respects for nature and whatever they do they do sustainably (IE: they only hunt what they need for the day or week...they make sure the population of the species is thriving), and from what I gather they respect the wildlife and all that. I'm asking because I know some people who think all killing of animals should be eradicated even in situations like these were certain groups of people have lived this lifestyle for over a million years.

Thanks for your input!

[codemonkey]

Not that I would ever hunt myself but I really don't have as much of a problem with people who hunt for food. I figure if your going to eat meat, you should at least have the balls to hunt it and kill it and clean it yourself. At least those animals live their lives in the wild and weren't kept on a nasty farm and systematically fattened up until they're brutally killed in a factory.

[guinnesshero]

you cant really fault a people for doing what they have to to surive. I wouldnt expect anyone to starve or die from the elements when there was no chice in the matter.If the worst came to pass and civilization collapsed mad max road warrior style"great movie by the way" I would hunt or kill whatever I had to for my familys survival.

[codemonkey]

Most of the people who make the argument that some people hunt to survive have never had to hunt to survive. Most people in the modern world don't have to hunt to survive. Most of us get to live indoors and have year-round access to fruits and vegetables.

[Sevenseas]

These groups of people have deep respects for nature and whatever they do they do sustainably (IE: they only hunt what they need for the day or week...they make sure the population of the species is thriving), and from what I gather they respect the wildlife and all that.How do you know that? Have you actually observed their lifestyle or read detailed reports about it, or are you simply repeating the condescending "noble savage" myth?

[gillibean]

The extremly few who truly need it to survive I have little argument with, those that use that argument rarely (if ever) qualify and are just making up excuses.

[Blobbenstein]

I think that some tribes that need to hunt, may well incorporate their hunting into their religious beliefs, as food, including vegetable matter, is a very important aspect of their lives, but I don't think that that will necessary, always be the case, and in the end, isn't it really irrelevant? If they need to hunt to survive, then they need to hunt, the deer isn't really going to care if the hunter respects it or not. Sustainability is important though.

[northernstars]

My husband's family are Eskimos and live in Barrow. Hunting whales, walruses and such is how they feed themselves. When a whale is killed there is a big celebration and its food is shared with everybody! They also sing and praise God for this bounty and gift they were given! There is also a lot of other foods brought in for this celebration. It is basically a frozen desert up there. I spent some time there on several occasions.

[shineonyou]

I agree with what a few people have already said... People use this argument against vegetarianism when they've never met or had any sort of contact with the groups of people they're talking about, let alone been a situation even remotely similar. Just because a person learned about American Indians respecting the land in a poorly written third grade textbook doesn't mean I'm going to tell them I've changed my mind and why don't we run over to Applebee's and order cheeseburger platters.

Anyway, I don't really have a problem with non-vegetarians in our own society, so I don't know why I'd have a problem with groups of people who's lifestyles and cultures I really have no idea about.

[Doktormartini]

Guinesshero, don't worry civilization will collapse :)

Thanks everyone for the replies. I basically agree with what you all said.

[SomebodyElse]

I'm talking about indigenous groups like Eskimos, the Mbuti people, Bushmen...etc. What are your views on this? These groups of people have deep respects for nature and whatever they do they do sustainably (IE: they only hunt what they need for the day or week...they make sure the population of the species is thriving), and from what I gather they respect the wildlife and all that.
This is not quite correct. The Eskimos in particular are not indigenous to the Arctic. They migrated there from Asia, because as they wiped out the fauna wherever they happened to stay for a while, they had to find more. Which eventually led them over the land bridge from Asia to where they live now, and the only reason they stayed is because they haven't yet managed to wipe out all the animal life there. The indigenous African people you mention don't live sustainably out of intent or respect for "Nature" either. Their population growth is controlled by the food supply, as ours would be if we lived as they do. If any of these people had any real respect for the animals they kill, they wouldn't be killing them, and they wouldn't be living in places where all there is to eat is other animals.

As far as people not being entitled to an opinion if they have no experience of the matter they are forming an opinion about, all I can say is that I am glad we don't all have to be murderers in order to have our opinions of murder taken seriously.

[Huckleberry]

If any of these people had any real respect for the animals they kill, they wouldn't be killing them, and they wouldn't be living in places where all there is to eat is other animals.


:idea:They should move to California and become vegan.

I guess this is their punishment for being hunters.http://www.survival-international.org/tribes/bushmen

These are not the people to be attacking for their meat eating. It is rather those in industrialized societies who could easily eat a vegan diet but instead continue to torture and kill animals to satisfy their taste buds.

[SomebodyElse]

Whose attacking anyone? The thread is asking for opinions. It doesn't make sense to attack anyone, especially if you think they should stop killing animals.

And there was no reason why the Eskimos couldn't have kept walking all the way to Mexico like the rest of the people who came over here from Asia. Or stopped in California instead. Or wandered over to the east coast. Or down to Florida...

Ten thousand years ago they could have done anything they wanted. They chose to stay where the killing was good. It had nothing to do with respect for the animals or sustainability. It still doesn't. If every single human now alive were to decide to adopt the "subsistence lifestyle" of the hunter gatherers our ecosystems would collapse, suggesting that subsistence hunting is actually more of luxury than living as a vegan is so often accused of being.

[Cocoa]

I can speak only for myself when I deside what is right or wrong about my eating.

If the choice for some people is hunt or starve well then they hunt, it would be as wrong for me to judge them based on wanting to live as it would be for me to say wolves or tigers are bad evil creatures because they kill and eat prey.

When it comes down to it humans are just animals also, we do what we need to when it comes to survival.

I'm lucky to have a choice and say no I choose not to eat meat, but i bet if I lived somewhere that I never knew when my next meal was or were it was comming from I would not be so picky.

What disturbs me is how the western world who has enough food and can make the less violent choice still continues to kill.

[nogardsram]

Sorry if this has been brought up before, but I am curious! What are your opinions on groups of people that hunt animals for the purpose of using them for their survival? I'm talking about indigenous groups like Eskimos, the Mbuti people, Bushmen...etc. What are your views on this? These groups of people have deep respects for nature and whatever they do they do sustainably (IE: they only hunt what they need for the day or week...they make sure the population of the species is thriving), and from what I gather they respect the wildlife and all that. I'm asking because I know some people who think all killing of animals should be eradicated even in situations like these were certain groups of people have lived this lifestyle for over a million years.

I don't really think it can be said of any humans, that they have lived a lifestyle for over a million years.

[Blobbenstein]

Ten thousand years ago they could have done anything they wanted. They chose to stay where the killing was good.


ahh, ten thousand years ago, veggie board was a very different place then; I think back then there was still the blue-green option.

I remember an Eskimo joined the board, interested in cutting down his meat consumption, and was immediately flamed, I think he eventually said in his last post "**** the lot of you, I'm staying were the hunting's good"



hmmmm, maybe in another ten thousand years, vegans will look back and say "those vegans , back in the 21st century, could have done anything they wanted, they could have chained themselves to abattoir gates, or gone into supermarkets and poured paint on all the meat, sure they would spend a lot of time in jail, but where was their commitment?!!"

[guinnesshero]

ahh, ten thousand years ago, veggie board was a very different place then; I think back then there was still the blue-green option.

I remember an Eskimo joined the board, interested in cutting down his meat consumption, and was immediately flamed, I think he eventually said in his last post "**** the lot of you, I'm staying were the hunting's good"

hmmmm, maybe in another ten thousand years, vegans will look back and say "those vegans , back in the 21st century, could have done anything they wanted, they could have chained themselves to abattoir gates, or gone into supermarkets and poured paint on all the meat, sure they would spend a lot of time in jail, but where was their commitment?!!"

:wayne::lol:

[froggythefrog]

Indigenous groups living somewhat like they have for the last few thousand years are my last concern, really. If we could just get the US and China to cut way down on meat and fossil fuel consumption, I'll be happy.

[kazyeeqen]

Indigenous groups living somewhat like they have for the last few thousand years are my last concern, really. If we could just get the US and China to cut way down on meat and fossil fuel consumption, I'll be happy.

This is pretty much my response to the people in real life when they ask this question. It is always right up there with "what if you had a farm and raised your own cows/chickens/emu then would you eat them?"

Hunter-gatherer societies (and there are precious few authentic ones left) are really not the most important focus points. I don't think their meat eating is right or justified. Much of it is religious in nature and not vital to their survival anyway.

I also don't buy the "I eat meat but respect animals" bit. I know they may think they do, but they don't show respect to their grandmothers the same way, and there is clearly a double standard.

[Brandon]

Indigenous groups living somewhat like they have for the last few thousand years are my last concern, really. If we could just get the US and China to cut way down on meat and fossil fuel consumption, I'll be happy.

+1

[LetoTheTyrant]

If that's what they need to do then that's what the need to do. That's why we live here.

A lot of them would likely live concious lives in our society since they have been raised that way.

Now, I would choose to not go there or pack in a lot of dried foods, but better off alive than dead right?


If we could just get the US and China to cut way down on meat and fossil fuel consumption...

here here

[Huckleberry]

Whose attacking anyone? The thread is asking for opinions. It doesn't make sense to attack anyone, especially if you think they should stop killing animals.


I meant verbal attacks on their lifestyle.

[gillibean]

Indigenous groups living somewhat like they have for the last few thousand years are my last concern, really. If we could just get the US and China to cut way down on meat and fossil fuel consumption, I'll be happy.

:wayne:

[shineonyou]

ahh, ten thousand years ago, veggie board was a very different place then; I think back then there was still the blue-green option.

I remember an Eskimo joined the board, interested in cutting down his meat consumption, and was immediately flamed, I think he eventually said in his last post "**** the lot of you, I'm staying were the hunting's good"



hmmmm, maybe in another ten thousand years, vegans will look back and say "those vegans , back in the 21st century, could have done anything they wanted, they could have chained themselves to abattoir gates, or gone into supermarkets and poured paint on all the meat, sure they would spend a lot of time in jail, but where was their commitment?!!"

Goodness, I remember that post. Has it already been 10,000 years? Wasn't that eskimo dude like "Some college girl gave me this pro-vegetarian pamphlet, and I only took one because I felt kinda bad that she was just standing there in the arctic cold, but now I'm starting to feel guilty about meat and stuff, and Eva Mendez looked really hot in that PETA anti-fur ad, but I don't know if I really wanna walk across the expanses of the North American continent into an uncertain future. What should I do?"

And we were all like "Do it! Migrate! You're killing innocent Mastodon! You murderer!" But that dude was probably just looking for us to appease him by saying it was alright, we understood, cars hadn't been invented yet, whatever. I hate it when omni's do that.

[Doktormartini]

That's the problem. People think history they say "10,000 years." Humans have lived on this planet for over a million years :)