Kiss My Face describes honey as non-animal

[soilman]

http://www.kissmyfacewebstore.com/detail/KMF+100H+4oz/Olive_and_Honey_Bar_Soaps

I wonder what other products that they say have no animal ingredients, actually have animal ingredients?

I'm very disappointed. I thought I could trust Kiss My Face products.

Tom's of Maine was always careful to indicate that the beeswax or propalis in some of their products, was indeed an animal ingredient.

[*AHIMSA*]

Everyone seems to have different versions of the "truth" these days. :(

[soilman]

Oh dear, at http://www.kissmyface.com//content/new_content/ingredient_glossary.htm#c they are listing carboxymethyl chitosan. Indeed, chitin comes from crustacean (crab and lobster industry product) shells. It does not come from fungi. According to my understanding, the only commercial source of chitin is the crab and lobster industry. They also provide misleading info about lactic acid, saying it is "an acid naturally fermented from milk sugar." Indeed it is, but commercial lactic acid is made by carbohydrate fermentation. Lactic acid is also produced by all mammals, when their muscles contract. And it is true to say that "it is an acid naturally found in animal muscles." But this is simply not ever a source of commercial lactic acid. Water is also "derived from rain." But most water used in commercial products comes from springs and groundwater wells. Rain water is rarely used by industry.

[Kesira]

I don't trust Kiss My Face anymore. I bought the Peaches and Cream moisturizer a long time ago. It said 'no animal ingredients' right on it. Then I was on their website and they had a FAQ thing, and it was about vegan products, and that wasn't included. I e-mailed the company to ask what was unvegan about it, and was told there was cream in it. Nowhere in the ingredients was the word cream, or any variation of it. So if there really WAS cream, why would it say there weren't animal ingredients???

[soilman]

Hmmm. What I have is a bottle of Peaches and Creme moisturizer. Creme, not cream. Nothing that I know to be a dairy product, is listed in the ingredient list. The label says "no animal ingredients." However indeed, I no longer trust them to properly identify dairy products as being animal ingredients.

It does soften the callouses on my feet (and perhaps remove their surface a bit, due to the alpha-hydroxy acids).

[slimlife]

It's really sad news

[danakscully64]

Did you e-mail the company about this? I'll do it if everyone else does it. :) I bought the KMF Peaches and Creme moisturizer and I can't use it because it makes me itch really bad. :( It does smell SOOO good though. Maybe I'll try using it on my feet and hands, see if I have a reaction.

[Kesira]

Their website has completely changed since last time I was on it. I typed 'kiss my face vegan' into google and the first thing that came up was this:

Kiss My Face Natural and Organic Bath, Skin, Body and Home
Kiss My Face uses UPS for all domestic and most international shipping. .... All of our products are Vegan with the exception of: ...
www.kissmyface.com/content/articles/faq/ - 41k - Cached - Similar pages

But when I clicked on it, it took me to their webstore. Same thing happened when I cut and pasted the address.

I can't find a FAQ section anywhere. I e-mailed them again to ask. Maybe I'll get someone who knows. Last time I asked, the e-mail that I got was in a large font and was purple--not very professional looking. They kept avoiding my direct questions like 'what specific ingredient isn't vegan'. I just sent them this:

I read somewhere that our Peaches and Creme moisturizer was not vegan. I can no longer find any information about which products are and are not vegan on your website. Is the Peaches and Creme moisturizer vegan? If not, which ingredient is not vegan? Thanks.

[paganveg]

Their website has completely changed since last time I was on it. I typed 'kiss my face vegan' into google and the first thing that came up was this:

Kiss My Face Natural and Organic Bath, Skin, Body and Home
Kiss My Face uses UPS for all domestic and most international shipping. .... All of our products are Vegan with the exception of: ...
www.kissmyface.com/content/articles/faq/ - 41k - Cached - Similar pages

But when I clicked on it, it took me to their webstore. Same thing happened when I cut and pasted the address.

I can't find a FAQ section anywhere. I e-mailed them again to ask. Maybe I'll get someone who knows. Last time I asked, the e-mail that I got was in a large font and was purple--not very professional looking. They kept avoiding my direct questions like 'what specific ingredient isn't vegan'. I just sent them this:

I read somewhere that our Peaches and Creme moisturizer was not vegan. I can no longer find any information about which products are and are not vegan on your website. Is the Peaches and Creme moisturizer vegan? If not, which ingredient is not vegan? Thanks.


http://www.kissmyface.com/content/articles/faq.pasp#vegan

Here's a lit of their non vegan products from their website. :)

[danakscully64]

The bottle and website condradict each other for the Peaches and Creme. The website says its not vegan, yet the bottle says "This product contains no animal ingredients, no artificial colors and was not tested on animals." :confused:

[SuperChicken]

Oh wth?! I have a bottle of the Peaches & Creme sitting right here on my desk! Says "no animal ingredients", there is absolutely nothing animal derived on the ingredients list. Guess I can cross them off the list of companies to buy from.

[danakscully64]

Yeah, they sound slightly retarded... I think I'm going to have to e-mail them about it.

[hoodedclawjen]

there is more than one peaches and creme moisturiser product, i wanted to mention it just incase not everyone realised.

there is the 8% aha- this one (http://www.kissmyfacewebstore.com/detail/KMF+0300466/Natural_Face_Care_Peaches_and_Creme_AHA_8and#x0025 ;), which seems to be the non-vegan one,
and the 4% aha one- this one (http://www.kissmyfacewebstore.com/detail/KMF+200PC+16oz/Peaches_Crandegrave;me_Moisturizer), which isn't on the 'non vegan list.

it seems like they veiw 'animal ingredients' as meaning 'ingredients derived from an animal' not 'ingredients stolen from an animal'. would be cool if someone could suggest to them that they add this explaination/disclaimer to their product packaging and site, hehehe.

[Kesira]

Got a reply to my message:

Kara,
The reason the peaches and creme moisturizer is not vegan is that we use creme.

Thank you,
Sarah@kissmyface.com

So I replied back with this:

The actual word 'creme' is not listed in the ingredients. Is it called
something else? Also, the container clearly states 'no animal ingredients'.
Creme is an animal product. Why does the package say there are no animal
products?

[hoodedclawjen]

i wanna know what they mean by 'creme'- do they mean cream? creme doesn't appear as an ingredient under the letter 'c' in their ingredients glossary that soilman posted (neither does cream, incidently).

creme with an accent is french for cream, but the words creme and cream don't specifically or solely mean 'dairy cream'... eg: hand cream, cream of wheat, cadburys creme egg.

i just spotted this in their faq too:


There are a few people who feel that we are being deceitful by stating "no animal ingredients". The bee neither dies nor suffers in providing us with its honey, and the bee's by-product quite frankly is not the "animal" we had in mind while making our "no animal ingredients" statement. I don't believe for a moment that every KISS user will agree with my thoughts on the subject, but I do hope they'll enjoy the pleasures of the 98% of our products that do not contain honey.

i spose the fact that they say they're a vegetarian (not vegan) company is suposed to over-ride the vague 'no animal ingredients' stance.

[soilman]

"he bee neither dies nor suffers in providing us with its honey"

Bees do not "provide us" with honey except in a very loose interpretation of the phrase "provide us." People simple take honey. Bees most certainly are killed by people, in the commercial production of honey. Males bees are squashed to extract semen from them, which is used to artificially inseminate queen bees.

[soilman]

Kara,
The reason the peaches and creme moisturizer is not vegan is that we use creme.

Indeed, whoever authored that statement is just being ridiculously stupid. There simply is no such thing as "creme" in the English language. The fact that crème is a word in French, and translates to cream in English, is irrelevant to the use of the word creme in a sentence that is unmistakably in English. In consequence, the whole statement is simply goobledygook. It means nothing. It is like saying I am late for work because I couldn't find the pneumo for my car.

[law]

i was using bathox(from memory) shower gel at a friends house the other day and it also said no animal ingredients or thesting and it wasnt til after that i noticed it was milk and honey!

[soilman]

They are also confusing with with listing Vitamin D3, Chotecalciterol, as an ingredient. The correct spelling seems to cholecalciferol, and it appears to be made from sheep's wool (from lanolin). As opposed to D2, which appears to be made form irradiated fermented carbohydrates.

Here D3 is listed. http://www.drugstore.com/products/prod.asp?pid=46684&catid=50257

Here it isn't. http://www.kissmyfacewebstore.com/detail/KMF+800+OA/Liquid_Moisture_Soaps

[Kesira]

So they never answered my e-mail asking what specific ingredient on the label was the 'creme', and why it says no animal products when they said there really is.

Maybe someone else could e-mail them and ask?

[soilman]

Kesira did you send your email to heather@kissmyface.com? That was the address I found listed, for "ingredient questions." At http://www.kissmyface.com/content/articles/contact/

Their site lists peaches and creme moisturizer as being "out of stock" anyway. Apparently stores still have stock left. But there may be more than one version?

If you want I'll send Heather another message w the same Q.

[soilman]

OK, so it wasn't in stock yesterday, but it is back in stock today, however the ingredient list disappeared form the page. However the page says "As always, our products contain no animal ingredients... and were not tested on animals."

[Kesira]

I just e-mailed Heather. I think last time I just sent it to the link they had for customer service, and the reply was from a Sarah. I wrote this:

I learned the the Peaches and Creme Moisturizer (8% aha) is not vegan, even though the label says there are no animal ingredients in it. I read the label, and none of the ingredients appeared to be of animal origin. Which ingredients are the non-vegan ones? Thanks.


Since it's a holiday, it'll probably be a few days before I get a reply. I will be SO PISSED if she tells me it's not vegan because theres "creme" in it!!